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Southold Town Board of Appeals
MAIN ROAD- STATE ROAD 25 SOUTHOI-C), L.I,, N,Y. 11cj71
TELEPHONE (516) 766-1809
ACTION OF THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS
Appeal No. ~
Application Dated
TO: Stephen R. Angel, Esq.
as Attorney for NORTH
Esseks, Hefter & Angel
108 East Main Street, Box 279
Riverhead, NY 11901
FORK WELDING
[Appellant(s)]
At a Meeting of the Zoning Board of Appeals held on December ]], ]986,
the above appeal was considered, and the action indicated below was taken
on your [ ] Request for Variance Due to Lack of Access to Property
New York Town Law, Section 280-a
[ ] Request
Article
IX] Request
Article
Article
[ ] Request
for Special Exception under the Zoning Ordinance
, Section
for Variancesto the Zoning Ordinance
XI, Section 100-ll9.2(B) and
VI, Section 100-60 per Building Inspector Letter
for Dated January 30, 1986
Application of JOSEPH AND LINDA SCHOENSTEIN for Variances to the
Zoning Ordinance, Articles: (a) VI, Section 100-60 for permission to
expand nonconforming use of welding business in this "B-Light Business"
Zoning District; (b) XI, Section 100-119.2(B) for permission to
construct new building and expand nonconforming welding business use
within 75 feet of wetlands area, at premises located along the south
side of Main Road, Greenport, NY; County Tax Map Parcels No.
1000-53-2-12, 13, 15.1 (15); Lots 172, 173, 174, Peconic Bay
Estates Map No. 658, and Map No. 1124 as Amended.
WHEREAS, public hearings were held on September ll, 1986 and
October 22, 1986 in the Matter of the Application of JOSEPH AND
LINDA SCHOENSTEIN and NORTH FORK WELDING; and
WHEREAS, at said hearing all those who desired to be heard
were heard and their testimony recorded; and
WHEREAS, the board has carefully considered all testimony and
documentation submitted concerning this application; and
WHEREAS, the board members have personally viewed and are
familiar with the premises in question, its present zoning, and
the surrounding areas; and
WHEREAS, the board made the following findings of fact:
1. The premises in question is located along the south side
of the Main Road (State Route 25) at Arshamomaque, in the Hamlet
of Greenport, Town of Southold, and is identified on the Suffolk
County Tax Maps as District lO00, Section 55, Block 2, Lots 12,
13 and 15 (15.1). The combined parcels contain a total area of
approximately 49,800 sq. ft., as more particularly shown on
survey mapped March 29, 1985 by Roderick VanTuyl, P.C.
2. By this application, appellants request Variances from
the Provisions of the Zoning Ordinance, as follows: (a) Article
XI, Section 100-119.2(B) for permission to locate new building
within the required 75-ft. setback from wetlands area, and
(b) Article VI, Section 100-60 to expand the permitted welding
business in a proposed new building as depicted by Site Plan
prepared by Peconic Associates,
(CONTINUED ON PAGE TWO)
DATED: December ll, 1986.
Foz~n ZB4 (rev. 12/81)
Inc., Revised April 24, 1986.
CHAIRMAN, SOUTHOLD TOWN ZONING BOARD
OF APPEALS
Page 2 - Appeal No. 3550
Matter of NORTH FORK WELDING/SCHOENSTEIN
Decision Rendered December ll, 1986
3. The premises in question is in the "B-Light Business"
Zoning District, which extends throughout the whole block from
the west side of Pipes Neck Road (along the south side of the
Main Road) to the east side of Kerwin Boulevard. Opposite the
subject premises to the north side of the Main Road are
properties also zoned "B-Light Business." Premises catty-
cornered to the northwest (Wickham/Melrose) received a
conditional variance to permit a business office for a
marine contractor, with accessory use for storage and repair
of that contractor's own vehicles and own equipment (see
Appeal No. 3222 rendered June 28, 1984 - John Wickham). It
4. As depicted on site plan revised April 24, 1986
prepared by Peconic Associates, Inc., appellants propose the
following: (a) to continue the use of the existing 2,286 sq.
ft. building which is presently set back 25 feet at its closest
point to the front [north] property line, of which 625 sq. ft.
is for the North Fork Welding office and 1,661± sq. ft. weld-
ing shop use; (b) to continue the use of an existing 15' by
21' building (presently as an antique-sales shop) which is
shown to be set back 23 feet at its closest point to the front
[north] property line; (c) proposed new one-story 50' by
90' metal building [4,500 sq. ft. floor area] for welding
work shop use, of which 3,000 sq. ft. is to be for storage
area, eliminating all outside storage and parking of equip-
ment, vehicles and paraphernalia being serviced or repaired.
Apppellants propose to locate the new metal building along
the westerly yard area 50 feet from the north (front)
property line, 15 feet from the existing building, and
not less than 35 feet from the west (side) property line.
The building is shown to overlap the deeded lot line
(between Lots 13 and 15, and Lot 12) approximately 15
feet deep, and is proposed to be set back not closer than
25 feet from the wetland grass area, or "ditch," at the
nearest point.
5. By prior action taken by the Board of Appeals May 3,
1979, under Appeal No. 2541, a use variance was conditionally
granted for the establishment of storage for a portable small-
scale welding business at premises identified on the Suffolk
County Tax Maps during 1979 as District 1000, Section 53, Block
2, Lots 13 and 15, containing a maximum lot area of 26,458 sq.
ft. The April 24, 1979 survey shows that the premises was
improved with a barn structure and accessory garage building
[see Mitchell Pekunka survey prepared by Roderick VanTuyl, P.C.].
The premises during 1979 was zoned "B-Light Business."
Conditions imposed by the Board on May 3, 1979 are: (1) There
shall be no outside storage of equipment or work that is to be
completed by the applicant; (2) If the proposed number of
employees on the premises becomes larger than two, the appli-
cant shall return to the Board of Appeals for a review of this
action; (3) Suffolk County Planning Commission approval.
6. Also by prior action rendered by this Board on June 25,
1986 under Appeal No. 3501, a variance for the same relief
hereunder was denied without prejudice for the reasons stated
therein.
7. Article XI, Section lO0-119.2(B) of the Zoning Code
requires all buildings and structures located on lots adjacent
to tidal water bodies other than the Long Island Sound to be
Page 3 - Appeal No. 3550
Matter of NORTH FORK WELDING/SCHOENSTEIN
Decision Rendered December ll, 1986
set back not less than seventy-five (75) feet from the
ordinary highwater mark of such tidal water body, or not
less than seventy-five feet from the landward edge of the
tidal wetland, whichever is greater.
9. It is noted that the percentage of relief requested
for this requirement is 66%, or 50 feet, which is substantial
in relation to the zoning requirements. It is also noted
for the record, however, that the Southold Town Trustees have
(a) determined the "ditch" area to contain wetland grasses
as defined by Chapter 97 of the Code of the Town of Southold,
and (b) conditionally approved a wetland permit March 27,
1986. This board also determines the nearest wetland grass
area in this project to be within the "ditch" that extends
from the waterways near Pipes Cove, although the N.Y.S.
Department of Environmental Conservation has determined
a further wetland boundary line as regulated by the State
regulations. The nearest wetland area as determined by
the Town is considered in making this determination.
10. It is the opinion of this board that the placement
of a 50' by 70' building, accessory to the existing welding
business, as an alternative and conditionally noted below,
will not change the essential character of the business use
granted under the prior variance, and that such an increase
of building area does not affect its rights to continue the
present use, at the present 26,458± sq. ft. site. No expan-
sion or extension of the welding uses are covered by this
variance, or the previous variance, into the abutting
southerly parcel (Lot 12).
ll. It should be further understood that the grant of
this variance is limited to permit the construction of a
50' by 70' accessory building and requiring the removal of
all outside storage of equipment, vehicles, vehicles parts,
and other paraphernalia, for proper placement within the
building. No dismantled vehicles or related items shall
be permitted in the outside yard areas. It should also be
understood that the grant of this variance does not prevent
or prohibit steps for enforcement of violations as may be
deemed necessary.
In considering this appeal, the board also finds and
determines that by permitting the construction of an
50' by 70' building as conditionally noted below: (a)
the use will not prevent the orderly and reasonable use
of this and surrounding properties; (b) the plight of
the owner is due to unique circumstances and not to the
general conditions in the neighborhood which may reflect
the unreasonableness of the zoning ordinance itself;
(c) that the use thereof will not alter the essential
character of the locality; (d) that the use thereof
is consistent with the prior use variance since there
will be no change; (e) the owner would not deprived
of his rights to construct and continue the permitted
use; (f) the use thereof will not prevent the orderly
and reasonable use of this district or adjacent use
districts; (g) the safety, health, welfare, comfort,
convenience and order of the town will not be adversely
affected; (h) there is no other method feasible for
Page 4 - Appeal No. 3550
Matter of NORTH FORK WELDING/SCHOENSTEIN
Decision Rendered December ll, 1986
appellants to pursue other than a variance; (i) the
hardship is unique; (j) and in view of the manner in
which the hardship arose, the interests of justice will
best be served.
Accordingly, on motion by Mr. Douglass, seconded by
Mr. Goehringer, it was
RESOLVED, to APPROVE the construction of an 50' by
70' building in the Matter of NORTH FORK WELDING under
Appeal No. 3550, SUBJECT TO THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS:
1. The "welding" use must be conducted within the
building at all times;
2. No outside storage;
3. No retail sales of flammable materials (such as
gasoline, oil, etc.);
4. Entrance and exit driveways shall have an unres-
tricted width of not less than 12 feet and not more than
30 feet, and shall be located not less than 10 feet from
any property line, laid out as to avoid the necessity of
any vehicle backing out across any public right-of-way;
5. Vehicle lifts, pits, dismantled or inoperative
vehicles, and all parts and supplies, and similar items
shall be located within a building;
6. All service or repair, except minor servicing
(such as changing of tires) shall be conducted in a building,
7. The storage
bulk for the owner's
ground and not less
other than a street
of any gasoline or flammable oils in
use only must be located fully under-
than 35 feet from any property line
line;
8. Additional or other new buildings (except fences
and screening) require an application for consideration
both the Zoning Board of Appeals and the Planning Board;
to
9. The proposed building:
(a) shall be used primarily for storage purposes;
(b) shall not exceed $0' by 70' in size;
(c)
shall not be set back less than 40 feet from
the front property line, not less than 25 feet
from the west (side) property line, not
closer than 25 feet to the existing welding
business structure, and not closer than 35
feet to the wetlands (ditch) area at its closest
points;
(d) shall not exceed 18 feet in height at eaves and
25 feet at peak [as applied];
Page 5 - Appeal No. 3550
Matter of NORTH FORK WELDING/SCHOENSTEIN
Decision Rendered December ll, 1986
(e)
shall not be located closer than three feet
from the rear property line which abuts the
northerly line along Lot 12.
10. All water must be retained on site (for example, dry
wells);
11.
This variance does not include "welding uses" which
could be expanded or extended onto the adjoining
parcel (Lot 12), but does recognize the "welding use"
upon this 26,458± parcel (described on Page 2, para-
graph 5 hereof), at this time. If the rear (southerly)
lot should become merged as one lot (combined with the
front (northerly parcels), applicant may apply for
reconsideration.
12. No additional commercial uses, except those uses
accessory and incidental to the welding business;
13.
This variance will automatically expire in 18 months
from the date of filing this variance with the Town
Clerk in the event the building has not been constructed.
14. Minimum screening as follows:
(a)
Five-foot wide screening with trees, bushes (or
similar type) five feet off the front property
line at a minimum height of three feet extending
a length from the northeast corner of the existing
welding building to the northwest corner of the
property (except clearances for egress/ingress);
(b) Four-foot stockade fencing may be substituted
for the screening in 14(a) above;
(c) Other screening as recommended by the Planning
Board in its site-plan review.
15.
Final approval of the Site Parking and Screening
Plan by the Planning Board in accordance with Article
XIII and Article VI, Section 100-60 for this proposal;
16.
Referral of this action to the Suffolk County Planning
Commission in accordance with Sections 1323, et seq. of
the Suffolk County Charter.
Vote of the Board: Ayes: Messrs. Goehringer, Douglass,
Doyen and Sawicki. (Member Grigonis was absent due to
illness.) This resolution was unanimously adopted.
lk
GERARD P. GOEHRfNGER, C~iRMAN
December ll, 1986
Town Clerk, Town of
NOTICE OF HEARINGS
NOTICE IS HEREBY G~VEN, pursuant to Section 267 of the Town
Law and the Code of the Town of Southold, the following public
hearings will be held by the SOUTHOLD TOWN BOARD OF APPEALS at
the Southold Town Hall,'Main Road, 'Southold, NY at a Regular
Meeting commencing at~7:30 p.m. on WEDNESDAY, OCTOSER 22, 1986
and as follows:
7:35 p.m. Appeal
BETTANCOURT.
7:40 p.m. Appeal No.
Zoning Ordinance, -Articles
No. 3538 Reconvene Hearing - JEFFREY
3464 - TED DOWD. Variances to the
III, Section 1-O0-31, and XI, Section
100-11-9.2 for permission to locate new si-ngl-e-family dwelling:
('a) with an insufficient frontyard setback, -{b) with an
insufficient sideyard setback, ~(c) with an insufficient rear-
yard-setback, (d) with total-lot coverage in excess of
maximum-permitted 20%, (e) with insufficient setback from
tidal wetlands. Location of Property: 350 Rabbit Lane, East
Marion; County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-31-18-8.
7:45 p.m. Appeal No. 3552
7:50 p.m. Appeal No. 3567
the Zoning Ordinance, Article XI,
to construct addition to dwelling
JOHN SENKO (by G. Strang).
THOMAS WICKHA~. Variance to
Section 100-119.2 for permission
within 75 feet of wetlands.'and
highwater mark along the West~Side of West Creek Avenue~
Cutchogue, NY; County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-103-13-10;:
7:55 p.m, Appeal No. 3563 ~'RITA'F.' GLEDICH. Variances
to the Zoning Ordinance, Articles III, Section 100-31, Bulk
Schedule, and XI, Section 100-119.2, for permission to construct
dpen deck and dwelling addi-tion~ with: (a) total lot coverage
in excess of maximum-permitted 20% of lot area, and (b) an
insufficient setback from tidal wetlands and high~ater mark
along Eugene's Creek, at the East Side of Oak Street, Cutchogue, NY;
County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-136-t-46.
J 8:05 p.m] Appeal No. 3550 - JOSEP~H AN___~_D~IND~A SCHOENSTEI~N.~
./
JVariances to the Zoning Ordinance, Arti'cles: (a) VI, Section
100-60 for permission to expand nonconforming use of welding
business in this "B-Light Business" Zoning District; (b) XI,
xx~x~Section lO0_ll9.2(B) for permission to construct new building~/~.
Page 2 Notice of Hearings
Regular Meeting - October 22, 1986
Southold Town Board of Appeals
2~d expand nonconforming welding business use within 75 feet of ~
// wetlands area, at premises located along the south side of Main ~
Road, Greenport, NY; County Tax Map Parcels No. 1000-53-2-12, 13~ x~
/ 15.1 (15); Lots 172, 173~, t74, Peconic Ba~ Estates Map No~ 658, and j
~.~Map No. 1124 as Amended. - - .~//x
The Board of Appeals will hear at said time and place all
persons or representatives desiring to be heard in each of the
above hearings. Written comments may also be submitted prior to
the conclusion of the subject hearing~ .For more information,
please call 765-1809.
Dated: October 2, 1986. BY ORDER OF THE SOUTHOLD
TOWN BOARD OF APPEALS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CHAIRMAN
Linda Ko. walski, B~ard Secretary
~opies to the following on or about 10/9/86:
Mr. J. Bettanc~ur~, 4t7 West 21st Street, NY, NY lOOll
Mr. T. Dowd, Box 282, Rabbit Lane, East Marion, NY 11939
Mrs. Harriett Moor, 34-20 83rd St., Jackson Heights, NY 11372
Mr. G.A. Strang, Agent for John Seiko,' Box 1412, ~Southol'd, 'NY 11971
Mr. J. Wickham, Agent for Thomas Wickham, M~in Road, Cutchog~e, NY 11935
Mrs. Rita F.~ledich, 83 Algonquin Avenue, Massapequa, NY 11758
S.R. Angel, Esq., for the ~pplicants, Box 279, 108 E. Main St, Riverhead
J.K. McLaughlin, Esq., ~repnesenting opposition), 828 Front St, Greenport
Suffolk Times, Inc.
L.I. Traveler-Watchman, Inc.
Town Clerk Bulletin Board
ZBA Dffic~ Bulletin Board
ZBA Individual Files
ZBA Members
NOTICE OF HEARINGS
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN, pursuant to Section 267 of the
Town Law and the Code of the Town of Southold, the following
public hearings will be held by the 'SOUTHOLD TOWN ~OARD OF
APPEALS at the Southold Town Hall, Main Road, Southold, NY
at a Regular Meeting commencing at 7:30 p.m. on THURSU~Y,
SEPTEMBER 11, ~ 1986, and as follow:
7:35 p.m. Appeal No. 3540 - MARK AND LOR1L~INE LaROSA.
Variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XI, Section 100-
119.2(B) for permission to construct deck addition at rear
of existing dwelling within 75 feet of ordinary highwater
mark along "Horton Creek,"
of A!bo Drive, Laurel, NY;
126-2-12.
located along the north side
County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-
7:40 ~.m. Appeal No. 3541 - RIAL' REALTY CORP. Variances
to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-31, Bulk
Schedule, for approval of insufficient lot width of three
proposed parcels in this pending minor subdivision located
at the northerly end of proposed right-of-way extending from
the north side of Oregon Road, Mattit~ck, NY; County Tax MaD
Parcel No. 1000-95-1-3. Containing 47.0520 acres total.
7:50 p.m. Appeal No. 3533 - ~OHN BREDE~YER.(Recessed
from August 14, 1986). New dwelling with an insufficient
setback from ordinary highwater mark along Orient Harbor.
7:55 p.m. Appeal NO. 3477 - WILLIAM ~ND EATHERINE HEINS.
(Recessed from August 14, 1986). Insufficient area, width and
depth of two proposed parcels. North Side ~{ain Road, Orient,
NY; i000-19-2-5 and 6.
Page 2 - Notice of Hearings
Regular Meeting of September tl,
Southold Town Board of Appeals
1986
8:00 p.m. Appeal No. 3544 - JAMES F. W~RWICK. Variance to
lift Condition of prior Z.B.A. Appeal No. 1729 rendered March 8,
1973 to allow new construction of a single-family dwelling at
premises located along the south side of Fasbender Avenue, Peconic,
NY; Bailey Park Map filed September 26, 1932, Subdivision Lot %11;
County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-67-6-7.
8:10 p.m. Appeal No. 3534 ROBERT WADDINGTON. Variance to
the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-31, Bulk Schedule,
for permission to construct addition to existing building with
insufficient side and rear yard setbacks, at 13175 Main Road,
Mattituck, NY; County Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-140-03-038. "B-i"
General Business Zoning District.
~) 8:20 p.m. Appeal No. 3550 - JO'_SEPH AND ~IND~ S'CHOENSTE'IN.
Variances to the Zoning Ordinance, Articles: (a) VI, Section
100-60 for permission to expand nonconforming use of welding
business in this "B-Light Business" Zoning District; (b)
XI, Section 100-119.2(B) for permission to construct new building
and expand nonconforming welding business use within 75 feet from
wetlands area, at premises located along the south side of Main
Road, Greenport, NY; County Tax Map Parcels No. 1000-53-2-12, 13
and 15; Lots 172, 173, 174, Peconic Bay Estates Map No. 658, and
Map No. 1124 as Amended. /
8:35 p.m. Appeal No. 3538 -' JEFFREY' BETTANCOURT.
Variance
to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XI, Section 100-119.2(A) for
permission to construct inground swimmingpool with fence enclosure
and gazebo within 100 feet of top of bluff or bank along Long
Island Sound, at premises known as 2410 Grandview Drive, Orient,
NY; Grandview Estates Subdivision Lot %5, ~{ap No. 7083; County
Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-14-02-3.9.
Page 3 - Notice of Hearings
Regular Meeting of September 11, 1986
Southold Town Board of Appeals
8:40 p.m. Appeal No. 3513 - STEPHEN SHILOWITZ. (Recesed
from August 14, 1986)~ Condominium construction within 75 feet
of bulkhead and tidal water. West Side of 6th Street, Greenport,
NY; 1000-49-01-25.1.
The Board of Appeals will hear at said time and place all
persons or representatives desiring to be heard in each of the
above hearings. Written~mments may also be submitted prior to
the conclusion of the subject hearing. For more information,
please call 765-1809.
Dated: August 22, 1986.
BY ORDER OF THE SOUTHOLD
TOWN BOARD OF APPEALS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CRAIRMAN
Linda Kowalski, Board Secretary
ATTENTION NEWSPAPERS: Please publish THURSDAY, AUGUST 2'8,' 1986
and forward two af~fidavits of publication on or before Septem-
ber 2nd to: Board of Appeals, Main Road, Southold, NY 11971.
Copies to the following 8/22/86:
Personal Delivery: Suffolk Times, Inc.
L.I. Traveler-Watchman, Inc.
By Mail 8/22/86:
Mr. and Mrs. Mark LaRosa, Box 431, Southold, NY 11971
Mrs. Sophia Greenfield, as agent for Rial Realty Corp.
P.O. Box 1505, Southold, NY 11971
Rial Realty Corp., 20 Audrey Avenue, Oyster Bay, NY 11771
Anthony BJ Tohill, Esq. as Attorney for Mr. and Mrs. W. Heins
P.O. Box 744, Riverhead, NY 11901
Mr. James Warwick, Box 367, Peconic, NY 11958
Mr. and Mrs. Eugene Kelly, 145 E. 27th St, NY, NY 10016
Mr. Peter C. Walsh, Mill Road, Peconic, NY 11958
Abigail A. Wickham, Esq. as Attorney for Mr. and Mrs. J. Bredemeyer
Box 1424, Main Road, Mattituck, NY 11952
William Moore/Richard Lark, Attorneys, for Mr. Robert Waddington
Box 973, Cutchogue, NY 11935
Richard J. Cron, Esq. for Mr. and Mrs. James Navas
S~ephen R. Angel, Esq. for Mr. and Mrs. J. Schoenstein and'S. Shilowi
Box 279, Riverhead, NY 11901
Swim King Pools, Inc. as agent for Mr. J.
Route 25A, Rocky Point, NY 11778
Mr. J. Bettancourt, 2410 Grandview Drive,
Bettancourt
Orient, NY 11957
Lawrence Storm, Esq. for Cove Circle Association (Re: S. Shilowitz)
33 West Second Street, Box 398, Riverhead, NY 11901
DECISION OF BUILDING ]NSPECTOR
APPEAL NO-.~ ~-~
TO THE ZONING BO,~ OF~APPEALS TOWN OF SOUTHOLD, N. Y.
Esseks, Hefter,'-Uuddy & Angel
(We) .... ~o ~w T .... 'l~ x. 'r¢~,4.~ e ~1,.0.8 E. Main Street. ~
Sct~c~nstein Name .of A.~',~'e~'~,nt ..... Street and Number
...~i.v..f~r.h~.af~ ...... ~.a~ .Y~k... HEREBY APPEAL TO
- Municipality State
THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS FROM THE DECISION OF THE BUILDING INSPECTOR ON
J~a~u~a~r~ ~3~~, 1986 in a letter to the Planning Board of the Town of Southold
WHE~,EBY THE BUILDING INSPECTOR DENIED TO
~..F~..~j~D~...~D~..~p~..~..~.$nda S, Schoenstein
Name of Applicant for vermit
c/o Peqonic Associates~ Inc, One Boo~leg Alley, P,O, Box 672
State
Greenport, NY 11944
of
Street and Number Municipality
PERMIT TO USE
PERMIT FOR OCCUPANCY
Site plan approval for additional building on the property to
expand wel~ing business,
LOCATION OF THE PR~PERTY(.~.~j~)~.~M.a.~.i..n.~.S.~.t.~.G...r.~e..e.~.n.p~.~.r.~.t."~.B.~.L..i~.h..t.~B...u..s.~.i..n.~ss
Street Use District on Zoning Map
13 and 15.1
(
~x)
1
· .S_ .u..f..f...o..1..k.....C..o_u...n..t. 3.....T..a..x.....M...a p_ _N_o.. :.....1..0_0...0. z 53 - 2 - 12,
Map No. Lot No.
2. =ROVISION (S OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE APPEALED (Indicate the Article Section, Sub-
section and Paragraph of the Zoning Ordinance by number. Do not ouote the Ordinance.)
Sections 100-60 and 100-119,2(B)
3 TYPE OF APPEAL Appel is made herewith for
(X ~ A VARIANCE to the Zoning Ordinance or Zoning Map
A VARIANCE due to lack of access (State of New York Towr Law Chap. 62 Cons. Laws
Art 16 Sec. 2804 Subsection 3
have
4. PRE% laOS APPEAL ~, previous appeal ~Chas) (I.a .... ;', been made with respect to this decision
of the Buildin%l~n~sp~ector or with respect to this property.
Such appeaser,s ( ~ request for o special oermit
(X) request for a variance
were
cna ,.,.,a: made in Appeai No..2~5..~.]. .................... Dated .J~.a. zz....3..,....1...9..7...9..,....w..h...i, ch was granted
Appeal No. 3502 Dated June 25, 1986, ~'{'~}~"¥'~'~'~'~ied with-
au= pre]uazc~.
REASON FOR APPEAL
( ) A Variance to Section 2804 Subsection 3
(X) A Variance to the Zoning Ordinance
is requested for the reason that applicants seek expansion of the existing welding
business and necessary, wetlands setbacks for new building,
'~"~:~t~/~inue on other side)
REASON FOR APPEAL Contin'ued
I. STRICT APPLICATION OF THE ORDINANCE would produce procticaldiff[cult[esorunnecesH
sory HARDSHIPbecouse applicants' welding business has expanded substantially
since 1979 when a variance was granted by this Board, Upon information
and belief, the property will not yield a reasonable return if used
or sold for any permitted use, ~specially taking into consideration
the cost of dismantling and removing the existing welding business.
2. The h~rdshipcre~ted is UNIQUEand isnotshared by ali pr~pe~ies a!ike in che immediate
vicinity of this prope~y and in this use districCbec~use the welding business is currently
located on the property by approval of this Board; applicants have
spent substantial sums in reliance on this approval by installing
equipment; the service provided by applicants (including services to
town agencies),are necessary; and no other businesses such as
applicants' are located in this vicinity,
3. The Variance would observe the spirit of the Ordinance and WOULD NOT CHANG- THE
CHARACTER OF THE DISTRICT because the welding shop is already located on
the property. Applicants merely seek an expanSion to accommodate
an increase in business.
STATE OF NEW YORK
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK
ss / / Signature / ~ ...................
Stephen R~ Angel
Sworn to this .....2.1..$..t. ................................ day of....A.~.g~.~ ..................................... ~9 86
Notary Public
/_~_~_~Z =Zz---TOWN OF $OUTHOLD PROPERTY RE(:ORD CARD
OWNER STREET VILLAGE IST. SUB.~/
S W '~PE OF BUILDING
RES. S~S. VL.~// FA~ COMM. CB. MISC. Mkt. Value
~ND IMP. TOTAL · DATE REMARKS
AGE BUILDING CONDITION
N~ NO~L BELOW ABOVE
FA~ Acre Value Per Value
Acre
Tillable 1
J --'
Tillable 2
~lleble 3
Wetland
Swampland FRO~AGE ON WATER
Bmshland FRONTAGE ON ROAD
House Plot DEPTH
BULKH~D
Total DOCK
),~yNER
FORMER OWNER
IMP.
TOWN
VL.
TOTAL
OF SOUTHOLD PROPERTY
STREET VILLAGE
DATE
COMM. CB. mm'TS'CT'.
Mkt. Value
CARD
SUB,
RECORD
ACR. , ,~'~'O
TYPE OF BUILDING
LOT
- '700
NEW NORMAL
FARM Acre
1
Tillable
,Tillable 2
iTillable 3
Woodland
Swampland
Brushland
House Plot
rotaJ~ -..
/o~'o o
~IJI~BI~G CO
BELOW
Value Per
Acre
ABOVE
Value
FRONTAGE ON WATER
FRONTAGE ON ROAD
DEPTH
BULKHEAD
DOCK
TRIM
?xte,sJon : .' ~ "' : Lj~t. WaJJs
.E~ension J Fire Place
] Type Roof
Porch
I~Porch
Breezeway
~arage ~'
z-2 1, ~.g~
Recreation Roan
Dormer
Driveway
Both
Floors
Interior Finish
Heat
Rooms ]st Floor
Rooms 2nd Floo
RES. ~ SEAS.
LAND IMP.
/Do
AGE
NEW
FARM
Tillable
Tillable 2
Filtoble 3
Cgoodland
!iwompland
3rushlond
qouse Plot
NORMAL
Acre
w
TOTAL
/oo ~
FARM
DATE
BUILDING CONDITION
B E LOW
Value Per
Acre
W
TYPE OF BUILDING
COMM. CB. MISC. Mkt. Value
ABOVE
Value
FRONTAGE ON WATER
FRONTAGE ON ROAD
DEPTH
BULKHEAD
4----
DOCK
· i
NOTICE OFHEARINGS
NOTICE IS HEREBY
GIVEN, pursuant t(! Section 267
of the Town Law and the Code ~ff
the Town of Southold, the fidlow-
lng public hearings will be held
by the ~UTHOLD TOWN
BOARD O~' APPEALS at the
Southold Town ttall, Main Road,
Southold, NY at a Regular Meet-
ing commencing at 7:30 p.m. on
WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 22,
'1~ ~md as follows:
7:35 p.m. Appeal No. 3538
Recon~ene H~aring JEF-
FREY BETTANCOURT.
7:40 p.m. Appeal No. 3464
TED DOWD. Variances to the
Zoning Ordinance. Articles IlL
Section 100 31, and XI, Sec(ion
I~.rmitte '~; of lot area, and
,tib~ ,;n wi~t~n~TqatnTthb;,gChkwl~t~emr
raark ahmg Eugene's Creek, at
the East Side of Oak Street,
Cutchogue, NY; County Tax
Map Parcel No. 1000-136-1-46.
8:05 p,m Appeal No, 3550
JOSEPH AND LINDA
8CHOENSTEIN. Variances to
the Zoning Ordimmce, Arlicles;
8'rATE OF NEW YORK )
) SS:
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK )
Carol Sgarlata
of Greenport, in
said County, being duly sworn, says that he/she is
Principal Clerk of THE SUFFOLK TIMES, a Weekly
Newspaper, published at Greenport, in the Town
of Southold, County of Suffolk and State of New
York, and that tha Notice of which the annexed is
a printed copy, has been regularly published in
said Newspaper once each week for ~
weeks successively, commencing on the ~ ~
day of ~- ~ 19
/rCnc~l Clerk
p,-,.,, t. th~, c,m~lu*,,,n of th,~ Sworn to befot~ mathm /
.... ' K DEONAN
I~YORDI'I~OF // //-' /// L N~A '
, , " "': //: ~ A Zl~ ~ RYPUBLIC, S~eofN~York
" ~) ~ ~ ~,~ ' ~ ~ ~un~ No 4849860
OF APPEALS - / /' e m Exp,r~ Februa~9~
~,~ NOTICE OF HEARINGS
~e ~/bWn La~ a~:l the C~
the ~n of ~?ld, the
held by the SOUTHOLD
ARDOF APP~
M~ ~f,~ut~ld, ~ at a
~ ~ ~m~ at
7:30 p.~ ~oa,~ ~NESDAY,
OC~BER ~1~6 ~d as
~nvene H~i~ JE~REY
BEn. COUP.
~D ~. V~ces to the
~ning O~in~ A~icle 111,
~tion 1~31, ~d~, ~ion
1~-119.2 for ~rmission to
i~: (a) ~ ~ ~u~cimt ~n*
t~d s~back, ~) wi~ ~ insuf-
fident s~ ~k, (c) ~th
~ ~sufficimt ~ ~back,
~) with to~ lot ~ge in ~-
cess of m~imum-~ermitt~
back from tidal wefl~. ~a-
tion of ~o~y: ~ ~bbit
Map ~el N~ [~31-18-8.
7:4~ p~. A~ No.
JOHN SENKO (~ G. Str~g).
7:50 p.m.~Ap~ Na 3567-
THOMAS 'WICKHAM.
Vari~ to the ~ning Or-
dinanc~ A~icle XI, ~ion
1~119.2 for ~r~ion w con-
~struct ~addifion to dwelling
cho~ NyLC~nty ~ Map
7=55 p.m. .3563-
RITA ~ L V~nn~
Bulk
Section
st~t
lot
TY OF SUFFOLK
ss:
STATE OF NEW YORK
Patricia Wood, being duly sworn, says that she is the
Editor, of THE LONG ISLAND TRAVELER-WATCHMAN,
a public newspaper printed at Southold, in Suffolk County;
and that the notice of which the annexed is a printed copy,
has been published in said Long Island Traveler-Watchman
once each week for / weeks
successively, commencing on the .......... d~.? ......
day . ,
Sworn to before me this '/~/ ~'
..................... day of
Notary Public
BARBARA FORBES
Notary Pub}it, State of New York
No. 4806846
Qualified in Suffolk County
Commi,~;slon Expires ~'~o,~ ~ r 19 .D.7
(~
tidal v
mark along Engene's C'~,ai
the East Side of O~tk Street,
Cutghngue, Cot/my 'lhx
Map
tO
(a) VI, .1 ~t I~'-
lng use
District; (b) XI, Section
100-t19.2(B) for permis~0n to
constr~ct ngw building and ex.
pand ,oonconforming .welding
business use within 75 feet of
wetlands area. at premises
located along the south side of
Main Road, Greenport, NY;
County Tax Map PareelsNo,
1000-53-2-12, 13, 15.1 05); Lots
172, 173. 174, Pecohic Bay
Estates Map No. 658, and Map
No. 1124 as Amended.
The Board of Appeals will
hear at said time and place all
persons or representatives desir-
ing to be heard in each of the
above hearings. Written com-
ments may also be submitted
prior t6 the conclusion of the
subject hearing. For more infor-
mation, please call 765~1809.
Dated: October 2, 1986.
BY ORDER OF THE
SOUTHOLD TOWN
BOARD OF APPEALS
GERARD P, GOEHRINGER,
CHAIRMAN
Linda Kowalski,
SOUT~0~D TOWN BOARD. OF.IPEAkS
MATTER OF JOSEPH AND LINDA SCHOENSTEIN
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 22, 1986 PUBLIC HEARING
8:09 p.m. Appeal No. 3550 - Public Hearing commenced in the
Matter of JOSEPH AND LINDA SCHOENSTEIN. Variances to: (1)
expand nonconforming use of welding business; (2) to construct
new building and expand nonconforming welding business use
within 75 feet of wetlands. S/s Main Road, Greenport, B-Light
Zone. (Recessed from 9/11)
The Chairman read the legal notice and application for the record.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I have a copy of 2 maps. One of which I
received resently. The latter one first which was received 8/21/86
which is a rather lengthy map to go over for the purpose of the
record. However, it should be pointed out that the existing build-
ing is placed in the same position as the prior hearing. The only
thing that has changed in the elevation. We're talking about a
building of approximately 50 by 90. The most recent or I should
say the date on that one is 4/20/86. The date on the new one is
10/9/86 and the only difference on this one is that we have ele-
vations in the rear of the building of 6, 7, 8 and the other one
we had elevations of 5, 6, and 7 on the similiar topographical
area. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating
this and surrounding properties in the area. Mr. Angel, would you
like to be heard?
Mit. ANGEL: Yes. Before I introduce the application, I would
point out one addition to that most recent map that you've got.
The one dated 10/9/86. It also shows the New York State title
wetlands inventory boundary. Do you notice that line on there?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Yes I do.
MR. ANGEL: The reason that's important is it appears, based
upon that published boundary line that Peconic Associates has
shown on the plan, that the second portion of the variance ap-
plication may not be necessary.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I see.
MR. ANGEL: It looks like we make the 75 foot setback. You
see what I'm talking about?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Yes.
Mit. ANGEL: I'll draft that deed for you in my presentation.
To begin, we're dealing here with the welding business, North-
fork Welding and it's operated on this property since approxi-
mately 1979. The application before your Board is in fact, an
application for permission to put a new building on the property
or an additional building on the property and the building ~
Page 2 - Octo~ 22, 1986
Public Hearin~bf Joseph and Linda Schoe~ein ~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Mit. ANGEL (continued):
is shown on the site plans that we have submitted. It's approxi-
mately 50 feet by 90 feet and it's (of course) easy to figure out.
It's got about 2,500 square feet of floor area. As you probably
know, the site plan was approved by the Planning Board of the
Town of Southold subject (however) to your review. And I'd like
to introduce in evidence~a letter from the Planning Board dated
5/22/86 reflecting that approval. Now, this application has a
bit of a history before your Board. The welding shop that is
currently on the property, the property is located in B-Light
business district. So that's the way to characterize it, B-Light
business district.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Don't get too use to it though because it's
going to change soon.
MR. ANGEL: I bought my copy today. I paid my 28 dollars. It's
there by virtue of a use variance granted by this Board back in
1979. The use variance that was granted back then contained 2
conditions. Really 3. One was Suffolk County Planning approval
which was obtained. The other 2 operative conditions were that
there shouldn't be no outside storage of equipment or work that
was to be completed by the applicant. And 2: if the proposed
number of employees on the premises becomes larger than 2, the
applicant shall return to the Board of Appeals for a review of
this action. We're back and we're back to confirm that and we're
back to confirm or seek permission to add to the structures on
the property. The structure, of course, would be used in the
welding business operation for both storage and some shop work.
Now, the second application before your Board is much more re-
cent. In the beginning of this year, an application was made
on essentially the same site plan that is before you now. That
was denied by your Board without prejudice to this new applica-
tion. Again, here we are today. The first comment I want to
make is sort of legal in nature and it involves the nature of
the application itself. In the first application this year and
in the application that we filed, we characterized our request
for relief as one for a use variance. And as you people are
aware, a use variance conotes a very strict series of crupes
that we have to sustain. ~ We have to show unnecessary hard-
ship. Unnecessary hardship has certain meaning. The level of
proof is well reflected in your decision denying the applica-
tion without prejudice. We intend to meet the burden of the use
variance proof. We have planned our presentation in that regard.
However, In reviewing the application and in doing some legal
research, I'm not 100% sure that it's proper to characterize this
application as a use variance application. It's something dif-
ferent I think. At the risk of being a little bit academic about
it, I did some research. And under the law, once a use variance
is granted, the use of the property becomes a conforming use.
It becomes a legal use. For example, the best way to look at it
is to distinguish it between a conforming and a nonconforming
use. If you built a restaurant in the residential area pursuant
to a use variance and it burned down and the ordinance provided
that you couldn't reconstruct nonconforming uses, if that res-
Page 3 - Octobe~ , 1986
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. ANGEL (continued):
taurant was there by virtue of a use variance, it could be
constructed even though it was still in a residential zone.
It could be reconstructed. And the courts have so held. It
is a conforming use. On the other hand, if it were a non-
conforming use, if it was there by virtue predating zoning
and the ordinance provided that it couldn't be reconstructed
in the event that of fire, it couldn't be rebuilt. So we have
here a use variance that was granted in 1979 with some condi-
tions. That property, once the use variance was granted, be-
came (in fact) a conforming use subject to the conditions that
you gave in 1979. But nevertheless, a legal conforming use.
The question now before you, at least in this alternative
aspect of my application is, how do you judge an application
like that? Do you judge it on the use variance standard? I
submit you don't because the use has already been changed to
the property. Your Board already changed the use back~inI979.
Do you view it under an area variance standard, practical dif-
ficulties rather than unnecessary hardships? I think that's a
very difficult logical leap to make because we're not seeking
an area variance. The location of the building itself is per-
mitted. The question is can the building be put there on this
piece of property. The Planning Board has given it site plan
approval. And as we see tonight with the location of the wet-
lands line, it doesn't appear that we need any area variances.
Your third alternative and... The third alternative is some-
thing in the nature of perhaps the review that you gave is
special exception. Looking at it, we have an existing use that
has been confirmed by this Board. We're not seeking to change
it. We're seeking to add a building to store things in and do
shop work in. Perhaps your Board should review it in light of
public health, safety and welfare just generally and impose rea-
sonable conditions on the use or on the expansion. Not the use,
on the structure if you deem it necessary. As I said before
though, we are going to present'it. We feel that we can meet
the use variance standard nevertheless and I'm going to present
testimony and evidence to support that argument. It's our po-
sition that we meet the unnecessary hardship standard. We can
show you, through the testimoney of an expert real estate ap-
praiser that the property will not yield a reasonable return
for us for any of the (permitted) current permitted uses under
the zoning ordinance. We can show you and I think it's self
evident, that the plight of the owners, due to unique circum-
stances obviously adhere to the necessity to put the storage
building is due to the expansion of the legal business. It is
unique in that it exists by virtue of a unique use variance in
and of itself. We will also show and I believe it's also self
evident, that it will not alter the essential character of the
neighborhood in that the use is there already. We are not going
to make an alteration. We are not bringing in a different type
of business, a different type of industry, a different type of
use. What we are trying to do is put it under a different roof
or an additional roof. I do, at this time, I think I'd like to
Page 4 - Oct~ 22, 1986
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda
Southold Town Board of Appeals
S~hoenstein
ANGEL (continued):
hand up an additional document. And this is a letter from the
trustees of the Town of Southold reflecting that the wetlands
code has been... Well, it's been approved under the wetlands
code and it's a letter from the trustees to Mr. Wiggin dated
3/28/86. I think that should be part of the file. I also have
(Mr. Chairman) a technical request. I ask that you deem the
file and the previous applications part of this file if that's
ok with you. There were some people who testified at that hear-
ing. I'd like to have that in this record. Now the necessity
for the application is that the business of Northfork Welding
has expanded substantially over the years. We have people here
tonight from various different business and also the applicants
themselves to tell you about the need for this business and it~
expansion. They're bursting at the seams at their site. You
probably all went down there in connection with the prior appli-
cation and are familiar with the site. The purpose of the build-
ing is to bring a lot of the .... It's to make it possible to do
a lot of work indoors. It is difficult to do it in the current
location. For example: I was down there one day last week and a
large trailer from Jernick Moving and Storage was there and it
ripped it's top and they had to cut some aluminum welding on the
top and lhe had to do it on top of the truck under plastic be-
cause they didn't have a structure that they could pull into~to
do the work. It's also going to become evident to you if it isn't
already from the prior one, that Northfork Welding really provides
a service to the community. Expecially the marine community. I
mean it does for for all sorts of governmental entities, private
business. But the marine business is a major portion of this
business. It~ proximity to the docks and to the fishing boats
it works on is quite important. Now, I've also reviewed the
zoning map under the current zone. In fact, I was down here to-
day looking at the map. And I ask you to note (I don't have a
copy of it with me~ but I ask you to note) that there are very
few places in the Town of Southold that have C-1 zoning which
appears to be the only type of zoning that a welding shop would
fit in to. And I say appears to be because welding is in an
enumerated use under your existing ordinance. Nor does the
existing ordinance have the catchall that the Master Plan has
with this type of fabrication type business. Finally, in my
introductory comments, I'd like to point out 2 additional things.
One is that; very close to the property and in fact, across the
street to the west, this Board granted a use variance -- an ap-
plication that was made by Gail Wickam. The contract vendee at
the time was Mellrose and it's a marine contractors yard. It's
an over 3 acre parcel on 25 and on a side street and work has
been done and the yard has already been opened. In addition,
the new Master Plan which I purchased and I looked at the Master
Plan new zoning map itself, indicates that the property, the
Northfork property, the Northfork Welding property will be
placed in the L-I district. And as I read the L-I district, the
zoning uses, the welding operation will be permitted. So we are
Page 5 - Octob~ 1986
Public Hearing for Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. ANGEL (continued):
not seeking to do anything that will be prohibited in the event
your Town Board ultimately deems to do something about that Mas-
ter Plan. The only indication of their intention right now is
favorable to us. They might not do it right away however, and
our need is immediate. Now at this point, I would like to in-
troduce Richard Winters who will testify on the issue of the
value of the property.
MR. ANGEL: If there's opposition, I would like to ask him a couple
questions about his credentials.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Would you like to use the other mike? I
am talking about Mr. Angel.
MR. ANGEL: I'm perfectly happy here if everybody hears me.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Can everybody hear him?
MR. ANGEL: Mr. Winters, what's your occupation?
MR. WINTERS: Mortgage consultant, mortgage broker and real
estate appraiser.
MR. ANG~' ,~ , And as a real estate appraiser, could you tell
me what's your preparation and background~
MR. WINTERS: Background is principally as a mortgage lender at-
tending many of the appraisal seminars, schools. I do hold the
senior residential appraiser designation with the society of real
estate appraisers.
MR. ANGEL: And have you given appraisals in the past?
MR. WINTERS: Yes.
MR. ANGEL: ,And have you given appraisals to various insti-
tutes and governmental entities?
MR. WINTERS: Yes.
MR. ANGEL:
Could you give me a sample of some of them?
MR. WINTERS: We represented we don't represent but
I provided appraisals for a number of lending institutions.
provided testimony for this Board as well as the Southampton
Zoning Board of Appeals as well.
MR. ANGEL: Did there come a time that I asked you to take on a
task in this matter.
MR. WINTERS: Yes.
MR. ANGEL: Can you tell me what I asked you to do?
Page 6- OctoO 22, 1986 ns~e
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Schoe in ~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Mit. WINTERS: You asked me to look at the property, subject
property and arrive at an estimate of fair market value as
currently zoned in B-Light business.
MR. ANGEL :: And did you arrive at an opinion?
MR. WINTERS: I arrived at an opinion.
MR. ANGEL ~: And what was your opinion.
Mit. WINTERS: My opinion is the property now existing in its
current zoning, the fact that there are 2 parcels that I looked
at specifically; tax map lots 13 and 15 which was the road front-
age. As to the land only 25 thousand. Lot number 12 which is a
land locked parcel with no road frontage; approximately 35 thous-
and dollars for land only. However, there are improvements to the
land. Principally a brick and frame structure of vintage years
and questionable condition that would require considerable amount
of renovation if it were to be upgraded and used for the various
permitted uses under the present zoning. My opinion is that if
the property were going to be purchased for a use of the current
zoning, quite probably the building would best be demolished and
a new structure built. Demolition cost, approximately 4 thousand
dollars in a statement from a local contractor which led~ me to a
conclusion of about 30 thousand dollars. Now that's a relatively
shocking number. I was shocked by the number. My research how-
ever, I started by going back to 1984 to the sales within that
tax map section and there were a number of sales that led me to
that finaq conclusion as to land value. There's a parcel ap-
proximately 1 acre in size adjacent to the east of the subject
which was sold in June of '84 for 12 thousand dollars vacant.
There's a parcel one lot removed to the west (and these are all
similiarly zoned incidentally) which was improved by a very small
(I would guess) 6 or 7 hundred square foot single-family residence.
That sold in May of '85 for 62 thousand dollars. Deducting the
estimate and the depreciated cost of the house, that would lead
me to believe that lot (which again is approximately an acre) had
a value at that time, in or around 20 thousand dollars. The same
exposure. There's a piece of property on Kirwin Boulevard. It
doesn't front on 25. I'll grant you that. It's approximately
a quarter of an acre in size, that sold in February of '86 (a
very recent sale) for 7 thousand dollars. That's not an isolated
case. There's another piece almost adjacent to it, sold in April
of '84 for 8 thousand dollars. There's a number of sales in this
price range. And looking at all of them tells me that that
particular area, the Greenport/Southold area on Route 25 with that
zoning is not particularly appealing to commercial industries. I
don't know why. I can only reflect what I see from sales. Higher
numbers of course can be obtained if you want to go up to Route 48
in Southotd. Significantly higher numbers can be found there. But
I view that as a totally different market. Higher numbers can be
found as you get closer into the village of Greenport where you
have sewer and a more active commercial market. Again, I didn't
feel it appropriate to bring those numbers into this general vi-
cinity but to stay with the numbers that I found within the im-
Page 7 - October2, 1986
Public Hearing~of Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. WINTERS:(continued)~
mediate neighborhood where the subject property is located.
MR. ^NGEt: Mr. Winters, could you give me a list if you
have it or tell me what uses of zoning you'd consider.
MR. WINTERS: There's a whole list of them if you'd like me to
recite those.
MR. i.ANGE[: ~. I'd like you to recite those.
MR. WINTERS: You'd like me to recite them. Very well. Under
the B-Light business the various permitted uses~ business pro-
fessional, government offices, banks and financial institutions,
retail stores, restaurants, bake shops for on premise sale at
retail, laundromats and similiar establishments, personal service
stores and shops, marinas for the docking, mooring and accomoda-
tions for noncommercial boats including the sale of fuel and oil
primarily for the use of the boats accomodated in such marina,
boarding and tourist homes, commercial agricultural operations
including keeping and raising animals, building structures and
leases owned and operated by the Town of Southold. There are
other additional special exceptions provided by the Board which
include; 2-family dwellings, places of worship, private schools
and colleges, libraries, charitable institutions, hospitals,
nursing and rest homes, private utilities rights-of-ways, fra-
ternity houses, golf courses, membership clubs, beaches, swim-
ming pools, tennis courts, children's recreational camps, labor
camps, boat docking facilities for noncommerical boats, veter-
narian offices and animal hospitals, cemeteries, stables and
riding academies, funeral homes and undertaking establishments,
wineries, hotells, motels and tourist camps. I did look at those.
The only possible uses that I saw that might provide a higher and
better use than is now existing would be as a professional build-
ing. But as a professional building, one has to consider the cost
of improving that existing brick and frame structure that was
used as (not that many years ago) a potato house. Many many years
ago as a school house. The cost to renovate that up to a stan-
dard that would be acceptable for a doctor, lawyer or whatever
other professional use might come into play. Possibly as a res-
taurant. But even taking a restaurant into consideration with
the sale of (again) similiarly zoned property to the east of the
subject, formerly a tavern, that sold in 1984 at a price of 90
thousand dollars. That was 1.1 acres. It certainly would lend
itself to renovation as a restaurant more than the subject proper-
ty. So I didn't think that was a probable use for this after
renovation. I think the cost would be just too great to convert
it to one of those uses. There are other categories that can be
grouped together and thrown out totally. Boating facilities.
There's no water there. There's swamp land in the back. In-
stitutions; I don't see a banking institution going in. So
those are basically the 2 that I view as having a potential use.
But economically, it just didn't make any sense to me.
Page 8 - Octo~r 22, 1986
Public Hearin~f Joseph and Linda SchoeI~ein .~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. ANGEL: ~ Is your opinion as to!:the market value, a
fair market value of the property (like I said before) are
different after considering all those various specific types
of uses?
MR. WINTERS: No it isn't because I don't believe that a per-
son who is going to create a professional building, would do
it in that spot. I think he'd be more likely to go to a more
active commercial area such as Greenport or in the developing
area on Route 48 in Southold.
MR. ANGEL: I have no further questions at this time.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir.
MR. McLAUGHLIN: Would we be allowed to ask the witnesses ques-
tions?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I would like to finish the entire presenta-
tion if you don't mind, Mr. McLaughlin, and then it is entirely up
to Mr. Winters if he would like to answer the questions. As you
know, the interrogation is usually done through the Board and not
individually. Ok. So if you choose to ask Mr. Winters questions,
we'll ask him if he's going to be around throughout the entire
hearing. Will you be here sir?
MR. WINTERS: I've been retained by Mr. Angel's office.
prefer to confer with him before I agree.
I would
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Are you going to allow him to stay?
MR. ANGEL: I think the question is whether he's going to
answer the questions or whether he's going to have out here.
Do you want me to ask them right now or take a break?
CHAIRMAN: Sure.
MR. ANGEL: I have no objection to him being cross examined by
my opposing counsel. It's up to you whether you'd like to do
it now. He's just finished his testimony. Or whether you'd
like to bring him back for it.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Well basically, is it going to change any
contents in your particular part of the case if we (or the appli-
cation) allow for some sort of questions at this point?
MR. ANGEL: I would prefer to do it now while he's here.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Ok. Would you use this mike sir. Mr.
Winters would you stand over there. Would you direct your
questions through the Board to Mr. Winters please.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Yes. The first question I would like to know
is what he (Mr. Winters) deems the highest and best use of this
property presently.
Page 9 - Octob~ 22, 1986
Public Hearing Joseph and Linda
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Schoens~n
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: These are statements of opinion now. Is
that correct Mr. Winters?
Mit. WINTERS: THa highest and best use I believe of the property
right now as zoned and as improved, would be its present use.
I don't believe it would be economically feasible to improve
its highest and best use.
Mit. MCLAUGHLIN: Do you know what the purchase price was for
this property back in 1979 when the applicants purchased it?
MR. WINTERS: I was lead to believe that it was .... No~ I went
back as far as 1984 and picked up the adjacent piece at 12 thous-
and dollars. I did hot research back to 1979. I felt these num-
bers were ...... 1984 was far enough. In fact, maybe it's too far
back to go.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Did you do any study and out of any such study
did you come to any conclusion as to whether or not the existing
welding business is running at a profit?
MR. WINTERS: No. I wasn't retained to review that.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you. That's all the questions that I
have.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir.
MR. ANGEL~ I'd like to call Mr. Schoenstein, Joseph Schoenstein.
He's one of the applicants.
MR. SCHOENSTEIN: I'm Joe Schoenstein, owner of Northfork Welding.
MR. ANGEL~ I prepared a list of some of the customers and also
expenses related to the property.and I'd like you to look at that
list and tell me if it's accurate.
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes it~is.
MR. ANGEL: I'd like to submit this to the Board. It's a sum-
mary and I'm going to have him read the expenses related to the
property° Now~Mr. Schoenstein, one of these sheets is called
expenses related to the property. Is that correct?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes.sir.
MR. ANGEL: Would you please tell me what those expenses are
and were.
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: The purchase price of the property was 20
thousand dollars.
MR. ANGEL: Now which parcel is that?
Page 10 October2, 1986
Public Hearing~ Joseph and Linda Schoeng~in ~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Mit. J. SCHOENSTEIN: That's the main parcel where the welding
shop is now.
MR. ANGEL: That's on 25?
MR. J. SCHEONSTEIN: Yes sir. The purchase of the rear lot
which goes behind Mr. Dobek's house was 3 thousand dollars.
The cleaning and excavating of the rear lot was 2 thousand
dollars. The improvements to the property not including our
own labor for repairs, cement driveway, fence, city water
and a substantial electric service was 17 thousand dollars.
MR. ANGEL: When you say own.labor, does that mean what you
put in yourself? You~ own work? A,d members of your family?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right. Absolutely.
MR. ANGEL: Now in addition, did I ask you to estimate the
cost of relocating your business to another location?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes you did.
MR. ANGEL: And the rest of those items on the sheet refer to
that. Is that correct?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right.
MR. ANGEL: And did you make those estimates for me?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes sir I did.
MR. ANGEL: Can you tell me what they were?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: 5 men to move machinery, stock, steel and
lost revenue for a month would be a minimum24 thousand dollars.
MR. ANGELs What does that refer to?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: You mean the actual moving?
MR. ANGEL: Describe what that item means, moving.
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right. Ail the stock that we have in the
building, outside, the unhooking of the machinery and the un-
believable task of moving some of it. It's extremely time con-
suming just to unload the skill locks alone would be a great
amount of time involved. And of course, taking over all the
stuff that we would need to move. I don't even want to think
about it.
MR. ANGEL: What's the next item?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: The next item would be, well we have the
revenue for 1 month. That includes the men and the lost time.
In other words, we definitely couldn't put 1 or 2 men on moving
and keeping the shop open. That would be absolutely impossible
Page 11 - Octob~22, 1986
Public Hearing ~Joseph and Linda Schoens~fn ~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN (continued):
to try to move while we're open and doing service.
MR. ANGEL: So you have to close down to move.
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right. I would imagine it would take that
month. I have to try to guess at it because of course we have
thought of this as the Board knows, a lot of possibilities--are
trying to buy property in the area and we figure it would take
us approximately (at least) a month to make the complete move.
At least. We have a rigging crew and existing machine off the
site, it would be approximately 12 thousand dollars.
MR. ANGEL: You have to hire people to pick up existing machinery?
Mit. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right. That's right. I have 2 press brakes
and a sheeter. One press brake is outside right now that weighs
56,500 pounds and it cost me 2 thousand dollars at Grumman Air-
craft in Bethpage for two rigging crews to come, the largest on
Long Island, to pick it up and put it on a low bed trailer which
was run by a close friend of mine and he moved that for me out to
my property. But that was just to pick that machine off the floor
so he could back the trailer under it. The first rigging crew
couldn't-handle it. They had to call in a second crew. If it
was in a spot (of course) where we couldn't lift it with this
tremendous crane, it wouldn't have been a problem. It was in-
doors. And of course, I have receipts for all that expense on
moving just that one machine without the other machine that I
have. It's smaller. A little smaller but It still would have
to be... I don't have anything to put it on myself and we have
a couple of machines that are quite heavy. The tractor trailer
truck to move the steel and 1-man a truck between one and 2 weeks,
approximately 4 to 5 thousand dollars. I figure it would take.
Being that the stuff comes down on tractor trailer trucks, I'm
sure it has to go out on tractor trailer trucks at least in its
raw form the way we do work on it or prepare it all. It would
have to be trucked out the same way. Also for us to add pick
up trucks or small flatbeds or even a little boom truck, it would
be just extremely time consuming.
MR. ANGEL: Now, I'm going to ask you a few other questions. What
are the taxes on the property?
MR. J. SCHEONSTEIN: 12,014 dollars and 5 cents a year.
MR. ANGEL: Is that for all the parcels?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: I'm not sure I was able to find that because
m~ secretary wasn't there.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: 12 thousand 147
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes sir. This is at 1984 tax bill. 1985.
I'm sorry.
Page 12 - OctOr 22' 1986 ns~e
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Scheo in
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. ANGEL: Are there any mortgages on the property?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Yes there is a mortgage on the main piece
of property with the welding shop on it of approximately 18
thousand dollars. The mortgage is with my grandparents because
at the time that I purchased it, I didn't really have any credit
with North Fork Bank and Trust or any banks in this area and I
am self-employed. So the purchase of the property is through
my grandparents on a legal mortgage at the interest rate I would
believe in 1979. It was just like a regular mortgage.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: I have no further questions of Mr. Schoenstein.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I have no further questions at this time.
MR. DOBEK: I live next to the welding place and I've known Mr.
Schoenstein since the day he bought the place. We never had as
much as a harsh word between us and we have got along very good.
We never had no fault at all. Well to come right down to it, I
think we need his business (Joe over there) more than Joe needs
the building. For all the work that he does for this community
is unbelievable. The people that he helps. I've seen kids with
bicycles asking Joe to fix them. A young boy pushes a lawn mower
with 3 wheels on it, Joe can fix it. A fisherman coming with his
boat and trailer to fix it. A farmer with some farm machinery to
fix it. -Somebody building a house, Joe has a high beam climber
and all that. I can go on and on. Even the railing for a 75
year old man to hang on to go up on the steps to his house. I
think we need Joe in our community and the building too. Thank
you.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir.
MR. COSTELLO: I'm in the marine contracting business in Green-
port and have been for the last 24 years. I think Mr. Schoen-
stein has definitely got a hardship. All of the businesses in-
cluding myself and any of the business in Southold Town have a
hardship. They got a good kick in the teeth last year with in-
surance. Laborers is an existing crisis in Southold Town. Joe
has got the problem. I do. I believe every business does. Find-
ing a piece of property that is useable in Southold Town to ac-
comodate some of the existing business and any possible expansion
in that business is pitiful. I can't find one in Southold Town
from my business. There is no commercial waterfront property in
Southold Town besides a couple of pieces in Greenport available
for my business and I'm sure Joe is having the same problem.
This particular area, we have a lumber yard. We have an asphalt
plant. A recent dock building company, a fish market. There's
a restaurant and there's an existing welding shop. He does have
a problem. He has a severe hardship. His business is expanding.
One of the reasons it's expanding is because mine is. I need
someone like Joe to fix equipment. I wish I didn't but I do.
There are fishing boats that like to come to this area. Hope-
fully there will be fish. Greenport is trying to promote it.
Southold is trying to promote it. Suffolk County is trying to
promote it. New York State is trying to promote it. We do have
the waterfront. We can accomodate the boats. They need service
~age 13 -Octo 22, 1986
Public Hearin Joseph and Linda
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Schoen~in
MR.i COSTELLO (continued):
and I'm sad to see that there aren't a few of the fishermen
that Mr. Schoenstein and his brother probably got them equipped
and got them fixed and they're out fishing. They're usually
here and when they're here, they're done at that shop. That's
all I have to say. Thank you.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: I'd like to ask him one question. To your
knowledge, who besides Northfork Welding provides this marina
welding service around here in the Town of Southold?
Mit. COSTELLO:~ Well I can say from my experience for the last
201plus years, I would have gotten Paul Blacksmith in Green-
port. I'm sure everybody's familiar with him, to do any of
the emergency repairs or the Greenport Mel Burke.
Mel Burke has since retired and I don't believe Paul can ac-
comodate one tenth of the work that's in the area now. Pre-
sently it's left up to the Schoenstein brothers.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you.
MR. SAMUELS: I own a company called James H. Rambo Inc., a
marine contractor and a company called Rambo Dredging Corp.
which is a hydraulic dredging company. I've known Schoenstein
since they set up shop there. They're a tremendous addition
to Southold Town. As a matter of fact, they're a tremendous
addition to the east end because they are covering clients
greater than or just not in Southold Town. We just about al-
ways have something over there being rebuilt. They built us
a barge in our dredging company. They are constantly rebuild-
ing cutter heads on the hydraulic dredge which is an art form
to do them to get the curves they do is just fantastic. Very
very gifted people. The type of people that are very hard to
find. They're master mechanics. They just don't teach it any
more. They have a tremendous work effort. They've made a great
success out of nothing and it's their ability that led them to
do it. The perception of the productive community in Southold
Town is that we need them. The nearest operator who does simi-
liar work is Eastern Welding in Riverhead which isn't too far
but it's quite a ways and they have similiar labor problems~of
getting the type of people that Joe and Freddy represent. The
kep to that operation is that they're so good at what they do.
In addition, it's the type of business you don't know where else
they'd locate in Southold Town. It would be very very difficult
for them. They are not as close to the water as I'd like to see
them but they're close enough.. They're very innovative that
launching barges and things that it's amazing how they can get
some of the stuff to the water that they do. But they have to,
they need this building. They have to be able to work inside.
You can't do the type of stuff they do in the winter months and
spring essentially when there's a lot of rain and still keep
operating. They've increased their payroll. They have quite a
labor force there now of good people. They're training people.
Page 14 - Octo! 22, 1986
Public Hearing Joseph and Linda Schoens~n
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. SAMUELS (continued):
I can't express enough admiration for what theytve done really
and we definitely need them. We not only need them in Southold,
we need them in Southampton. We bring a lot of stuff out from
Southampton. There's a very good welding shop in Southampton
that's just... That's Loui~'s. What we have found and what's
been created in the east end is that there just isn't any roem
and there seems to be very little public opinion that room be
made so we~have to do with what there is. So this particular
site is a good site for what they are doing. It's not the best
but it's a good one. It would be a great loss to the coLm~Lanity
if they were forced to leave. They are in the position finan-
cially, in my opinion, now to buy a very expensive site. One
of the few heavy industry sites. It would be very difficult.
There's very little of that left. The necessity of them using
this parcel is just part of what the problem is. The problems
are with the businesses in the end of town especially with this
type of fabrication business which is not romantic but boy do
we need it. We just have to have it to keep operating. We do...
We've been fortunate in being low bidder in most of the Suffolk
County dredging projects on the east end. It would be hard put
to keep that dredge going without them in Greenport. We would
be doing a lot of trucking up west at great delays in time.
There are problems up there too.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir.
MR. MIDDLETON: I'm with Harbor Fisheries in Greenport, New York.
Just on a lighter note, I'd like to tell my good freind John Cos-
tello that I have 3 acres of waterfront commercial property if
he's really interested, recently zoned. Getting back to it, I'm
not really privy to exactly what Joe is doing down there all the
time. All I know is that they're a bunch of hard working people.
I'm in the food processing business. We're trying to pull an in-
dustry out of the dulldrums into a modern operation out there as
well as Bob Cooper. As far as getting the people to do the kind
of work on my type of equipment which is predominately stainless
steel is few and far between. Especially out in this area. These
people have cooperated with me on more than one occasion. One in
particular comes to mind. I had 2 engineers here from the State
of Michigan with armor exhausting stainless steel exhausting at
a cost that was exhorbant in the first place. We had tractors.
We are in need of their services as far as rigging. They're the
only people around that had a mobile for the equipment, number
one. It was running. We couldn't weld with the equipment that
we have. I'm barely a half a .... welder myself. And if it wasn't
for people like Joey and particularly Freddy willing to jump in
and do something that they weren't exactly hired for that day.
That is something that will always be appreciated by me and my
crew. I have quite a few people working for me and down time
is obvisously paycheck money and is production time. Recently
Page 15 - Octobt22, 1986 Schoens~t~fn
Public Hearing ~Joseph and Linda a
Southold~own Board of Appeals
MR. MIDDLETON (continued)
not by the owner of the company but R.T. Cooper has purchased a
piece of equipment that was built in the country on the other
side. These fellows were not reluctant at all to climb inside
a fish mill piece of equipment and put in something in excess
of 2 weeks, a lot of hard labor to do this kind of work. I'm
sure that if we went further up the island and tried to find
people to do that kind of work and spend that much time and
dedication, Mr. Cooper would be keeping one hand in the other
pocket at this point in time. As far as the building, I'm not
quite sure. Maybe I'm not privy to some of the information.
But it seems to me that when I come over the bridge and go
past Mill Creek, I see an asphalt yard. As John said, I see a
lumber yard, a lot of the same similiar buildings. I see boats
up on planks. I see a new boating construction yard across the
way. I see people selling baskets. I see a house. I see a
motel. I see ice cream parlors. To me, there doesn't seem to
be a whole lot of consistency in the area number one and period.
Maybe this Master Plan will straighten this out. I don't really
think so. I think it's a good idea. What it seems to me that
these gentlemen are trying to do right now is add a little con-
sistency to the area. They're trying to put some things under-
neath a building where they can work on a year around basis and
maybe clean up the site. Maybe provide services for people who
have to tell them when the show up and it's raining and they say
we can't do the work. So the fishing boats and these men must
stay in and that product never reaches the table. It can be done
on an indoor basis. I think that's entirely up to site plan as
far as how they want to make the outside of the place look. I
dont' see any real inconsistency with putting up a building that
would probably greatly improve the visual effect of the area at
this point in time. Just a few little things. One being em-
ployment. Seems to me at this point in time, that Boards of all
nature whether it be Greenport, Southold, should not be flinching
when a group of young men come in and ask for permission to im-
prove on a basis that's providing employment in this town. If
anything, it seems to me that they should be walking into a con-
ducive atmosphere. One that says; gee you want to give us more
tax money for more buildings and you want to provide more jobs,
well this is what we want. We have wineries. Mr. Swager just
provided us with an in depth report. This is a food based in-
dustry. It has tremendous amount of vats, distillery work, stain-
less steel work. There will be a great need for people with their
expertise in the very short future if not already now. As I said,
I'm not aware of exactly what Joe does. Ail I know is that every
time I try to go see hime, I can't find him. He's either on a
late night call or an early morning call. So the only time I
can get in touch with the man... So it seems to me that this
is a fellow and a family and to me it's an all out family effort
on their part because I always talk to somebody that's related to
them. When I need something done, this seems to be an all out
family effort to provide the services that are always needed. These
men never tell you that they can't do the work. Now that seems to
Page 16 - Oct r 22, 1986 ·
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. MIDDLETON (continued):
me that there's a great effort to keep people working, to train
them as it's already been mentioned. To train people in an in-
dustry out here that we need. What good is affordable housing
if you don't have people out here that are willing to work and
have people that are earning a living to move into that hope-
fully in the near future. It's the Board's scheme of things
that elude me at this point in time. I've just gone through
similiar things myself and hopefully I can fulfill a lot of my
dreams. But it takes cooperation between municipalities and
and the people running businesses. It should not be a confron-
tational thing. You have a group of young men here that are
looking to build a building, looking to pay taxes on it. They
are not asking for any changes in their tax base. They're look-
ing to pay for what they want. They're looking to clean it up.
They're looking for people to work. And I think it behooves the
Board (all Boards) to look on this in such a way that if they
were in such a position. We're not talking about heavy chemi-
cals. We're not talking about major polluters and we're cer-
tainly not taking a useable waterfront that we have to worry
about. I think that's what we need here is a little bit more
cooperation. That's all I have to say.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much.
MR. ANGEL: I have several letters here that I'd just like to
submit as one group from some of the near neighbors. Some closer
than others. You can identify them or read them as you see fit.
Mr. Chairman, I have nothing further to present° I'd like to
have the opportunity within a time period that you suggest to me,
to give you a short synopsis of my presentation in writing and
I'd like to present some of the authorities that are referred to
in the first portion of my presentation regarding the use vari-
ance versus the expansion of an existing use° It's there by
virtue of a use variance.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: When would you like to do that?
MR. ANGEL: I'll do it promptly. I have all the stuff in my
file. I can do it within the next 7 days.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER~ Is there anybody that hasn't spoken in
favor of this application that would like to speak? Yes sir°
MR. THOMPSON: I live down on Bayshore Road which is an exten-
sion of Kirwin. It's called the Peconic Bay area. It's also
supposedly represented by the Peconic Bay Association. We have
an annual meeting and the dues are one dollar. Very few people
join it and when you are presented with the idea that anyone
from the Peconic Bay Association represents all the people down
there, it's a small group of people. One who was elected and a
group gets together and say they represent everyone down there.
No one has been told. No one has even been called. There have
been no mailings on this. The decision was made by them what is
Page 17 - October2, 1986
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. THOM~SON~(continued):
best for us. I live down there. I work in Greenport. My wife
works in Greenporto We have lived here for several years. We
have owned a house for several years. We have no opposition.
We are very much in favor of the building. I would like to see
the property a little more attractive and I think that~machinery
under a building would be one of the best uses of the property.
I think it's wonderful they come out here and start a business
and can be successful. And now in a logical sequence, he wants
to expand and grow. I'm very much in favor of it.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir. Mr. Hargrave.
MR. HARGRAVE: Thank you. I'll keep my comments brief. Basical-
ly they reiterate what's been said by the other users of their
services. The reason I'm hear tonight is that for about the tenth
time this Fall, I've needed immediately something like this. They
had to cut a whole in that welder to hold onto it. These are the
only guys on the east end that can work stainless steel like butter.
There is no darkening of the weld anywhere. They do it immediately.
I was without a pump to handle my grapes this Fall and Joey had it
for me the next morning. He had to combine aluminum and stainless
steel. Rolle Brothers have begged me, don't come again. It's so
hard to work with this stuff because if you don't have the tempera-
tures right, it doesn't set on it. They can come to our own proper-
ty site in Cutchogue. They're a tremendous resource for the com-
munity and they do a top notch job, a really top notch professional
job and it's very very impressive; the work they do. They can't
weld a broken heart or fix a crack of dawn but basically they do a
wonderful job. You might also be interested to know that they have
a swear box in the office. No profanity is allowed or they cut off
your tongue. And this is not heavy industry. The last comment that
I would have is that, where else is a use like this going to go? The
other side of the tracks? They're already on the other side of the
tracks. It seems like a good location to me. I certainly can find
them. But they are really a tremendous resource. I think you should
encourage them and speak on behalf of their application. I hope you
can find a way to do that.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir. Anybody else like to speak?
Yes sir.
MR. CLARK~ I work for Northfork Welding. And I can reall attest
first hand about their operating conditions. And another thing
that they did bring across and that is the building we work in
now is on 3 different levels. That's a lot of climbing stairs
all day. And as far as inclement weather, that's pretty rough.
You can't weld outside. So another thing is that the guys that
work there. There's 3 other guys including myself and they've
all .... I've lived here all my life and the guys that work here
are local. One guy came from up the island and he tried to move
in but he couldn't find adequate housing. But anyway, he does
provide work and it is the kind of work that I'd like to see more
Page 18 - Octobel2, 1986
Public Hearing o~oseph and Linda SchoenstE
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. CLARK~(continued):
guys get into and also that basic type of work. It's a good
craft to get into. You can make a decent dollar out of it
which is pretty hard to do around here which I think a lot of
other young people can attest to. And I'd like to see him con-
tinue on. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir. Is there anybody else. Fred,
you want to say something?
MR. F. SCHOENSTEIN: I'd just like to say one thing. That the
letters that Steve had handed up to you, I think are quite im-
portant myself because I went to these people and asked each
one of them individually. And these letters that are there, are
not just a petition. We have one of these too. But in all hones-
ty, the reason this room isn't full tonight with fishermen and
contractors, a lot of other business people is I just didn't want
to have to bother everybody that we work for to try to be here
tonight. And the letters, getting back to that, is just that
those people I went to were directly effected by my business.
Mr. Frank Dobek who is here, spoke. Mrs. Carmella Verona is
Frank Dobek's next door neighbor which her corner of her lot ad-
joins my rear lot. She wrote a nice letter there. She isn't
able to make it tonight because she had a dinner engagement. Mr.
Ciacia, Gus Ciacia, I'm sorry. After Carmella Verona's house is
what my dad just bought. My father and myself just bought a house.
It used to be the Locke house and we're working to try to fix the
house up now. The next house to the left is Mr. Gus Ciacia who
has a boat building shop there and has for many years and he's a
very nice man and I've been through his shop many times. He'has
built small and so on. There's a little notice there from
him and his signature. Also across the street, Ray Ciacia who we
all know, gave me a letter also. And Joe Busch who is on Albert-
son Lane there. People I talked to who are directly effected by
myself. Even Pat Drosso. They've been there. We assumed finan-
cially, a small golf course. I went to the people that I thought
were directly effected by myself. You know we can get signatures
from friends and people all over the place. But really it doesn't
mean that much. It's people that are effected by your business
directly I think that are important here. Thank you very much.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir. Alright. Who would like to
speak in opposition of this application. I'm sorry Fred. Excuse
me Mr. McLoughlin.
Mit. F. SCHOENSTEIN: I'd just like to say that I'm a partner in
the business and some of these people we didn't ask to be here
tonight. They showed up any how and I thank them for coming. I
would just like to express the working conditions. In the winter
time it's grueling. There's no other words for it. It's grueling.
It's pretty hard for a man to ask an employee to go out and crawl
underneath that truck or go out and crawl underneath a trailer or
a piece of equipment that a man absolutely has to have. He needs
it right away,and he's got a broken whatever underneath this piece
of equipment. There's snow on the ground and it's raining out and
Page 19 - October~, 1986 Schoenste~iv
Public Hearing of~'3'oseph and Linda
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. F. SCHOENSTEIN (continued):
you're busy doing something and you have to ask an employee to
go out there and crawl in the mud or the dirt or in the snow
and perform this repair and there's no way we can do it in our
shop because our shop is not big enough. It's something you
think about every day and ev&ry time you say something to one
of your men or employees that you have to go out and do this
today. I just turn my head and shake my head because it's not
right. It's just not right that you have to ask people to do
this and that's what we're doing. It's not that they do it,
we all do it. My brother does it, I do it. Everbody that works
there has to work outside in the winter time. There's only room
in the shop right now for 1 job to be performed at a time. If
you have 2 or 3 jobs that day, 2 or 3 guys go outside and one
man goes in the shop. It's pretty hard working like that. You
all know why we're here and I sure would like to see a building
go up. Thank you.
CHAIRMAIN GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Mr. McLaughlin.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Thank you.~I'm here this evening representing }ir.
and }~s. John Nicolleti. They're adjacent land owners to the
Northfork Welding. A couple of statements made earlier. I think
if you look back at the 1979 application and the variance granted,
you'll find that this was granted on a fairly small scale welding
business. And what you have here, perhaps Mr. Angel is correct.
You've got a conforming use here. But conforming only to the ex-
tent of the prior variance. They certainly did not get a variance
to add on as they saw fit. And in fact what they got was a vari-
ance conditioned on at least two very important things. One: no
outside storage of equipment or work in progress. I don't know how
many members of the Board have been by this place but they_safe.now
that they're coming in to do that. This has been going on (to my
understanding) for years. They've just blantantly flaunted the
conditions that were imposed on them in a prior use variance. Al-
so the other condition is, if there were going to be more than 2
employees at the welding shop, they were supposed to come back in
before this Board and get subsequent approval. Again, they've gone
ahead on their own. Their business has expanded greatly according
to everyone here. That's fine except for the fact that they've
flaunted these conditions. And in order to be able to get a
further use variance for this property, the burden of proof that
they have to show is dollars and cents proof that the property
can not yield a reasonable return under the existing use or any
conforming use under the zoning ordinance. What I think you've
heard tonight through all the testimony is business is so good
there that they need to expand. It's not that they can't maMe a
reasonable return on the property. They're obviously doing quite
well there. And on that basis alone, they have failed to meet
their burden of proof. They can make a reasonable return on the
property as it exists and therefore, a further use variance can
not be legally granted to them. Other things that have happened
at that site that show their disregard for the zoning ordinances
and prior decisions of this Board. An antique shop was opened
Page 20 - Octob~22, 1986
Public Hearing ~Joseph and Linda Scheons~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
Mit. MCLAUGHLIN (continued):
up on that premise without any building permit, c.o. or any
other prior approvals. It was just opened to my understanding.
Additionally, there was an agreement entered into with the
Nicolettis that a fence would be erected between the welding
company and his property. No such fence was ever erected dis-
pite the fact that there was an agreement to do that. I think
what you have to see is a pattern of total disregard for the
zoning ordinances, for decisions of the Board, for agreements.
And now they come in at this point in time after they've al-
ready violated all of those conditions and say; our business
has expanded so greatly, we need to build another building~an
the site. The natural assumption is that maybe their business
is going to continue to improve that greatly and they're gOing
to be back in 5 years from now, 3 years from now after they've
already been having their work in progress outside. Again af-
ter they've greatly expanded their business and they're going
to be looking for the same thing. And what they're doing is
intruding upon a neighborhood that consist to a large degree
around them of small single family homes. I believe that the
Board has another file, a petition that we have sent in con-
taining approximately 44 signatures of neighbors that are op-
posed to this application. I didn't feel it was necessary to
parade in 44 witnesses for you this evening to all say the same
thing. That they're opposed to it. I don't think anyone is
opposed to the idea of a welding shop. I don't think that there
is probably very many if any people he could get to come in to
refute that these people are not a good business. But the fact
of the matter is, that legally they can not be granted this vari-
ance on the proof that they've offered to you this evening.
Another factor is; when they took on this business in 1979, they
knew what they had there. They knew what the use variance was
that they got. They knew what the operation was and they choose
this site despite that. What they have done here is creating
upon themselves a self imposed hardship. They knew from the very
beginning what this site was like and yet they choose to put their
business there. And I think they have to realize that there has
to be some limitations on the expansion of the business into neigh-
borhoods like this. The final point that I would like to make is
that this is not a small expansion. We are talking about a very
very substantial expansion of the existing business, especially
in relation to the existing building. And what you're going to
do is obviously expand their capability to do further work there.
And I just dont believe that upon the information that's been
supplied to this Board tonight and the presentation that's been
made that the applicants have met their burden of proof and that
they've shown that they can not get reasonable return on their
property. Thank you.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you sir. Anybody else like to speak
against the application? Yes.sir.
MR. BANCROFT: I'm a past president twice removed of the Peconic
Bay Estates Property Owners Association which is slightly irrela-
vant because much of what I'm saying is of personal comment. I
went to Stony Brook today and on the way back on 48, I often go
down through Riverhead and come back through on Route 25. What
Page 21 - October 1986
Public Hearing of ,h and Linda Schoenstei~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MR. BANCROFT (continued):
I saw on my way back from Stony Brook about half way do~n Sound
Avenue is what has happened in the Town of Southoldo I have a
sign on my car that says I love Southold Town. I think it has
a wonderful future but it has a very poor future compared to
what it could have if we go on the way we're going° Some time
ago, 12/15 years, Cornell University did a survey of the Town of
Southold. The survey asked 2 questions° One; what was the main
industry, the main money producer of the Town of Southold. The
answer was overwhelmingly tourism. Second question was to ask
those people why they toured in Southold Town. The answer was,
open space. Open spaces are disappearing fast on the two ave-
nues; Route 48 and Route 25 which come into and go out of the
Town of Southold. I personally, and I think a fair majority of
the people in the Peconic Bay Eastates Association have no ob-
jection whatsoever and understand completely the need which has
been testified to here tonight adequately for a welding shop or
a welding business in the Town of Southold. That is not the
point. We have spent most of our time tonight on something that
doesn't have to be proved, the need for a welding shop. The ques-
tion is where. My contention is that is not a place for it. For
example; there are 2 historic sites adjacent (old schoolhouse)
which could be so beautifully turned into a schoolhouse park of
some sort and made into a museum which would encourage this major
business, m~jor industry; tourism in the Town of Southold. It
seems simplistic and I suppose naive on my part to urge along this
line when all of the business people have been urging for this weld-
ing ship. I also recall, I don't know for sure it's been in existence,
that once upon a time town fathers forsaw this very problem° The
need. for an industrial park for such businesses that would be wel-
come and have access to all the property that is needed° I think
that was some where near the dumping area in Cutchogue. I'm not
sure. I'm not sure of the amodnt of space but something well over
100 acres were available. Does anyone know? Is that still availa-
ble?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Under the present zoning of C-1 sir?
MR. BANCROFT: I don't know that.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: There is some substantial acreage around the
dump that's still C-1 to my knowledge.
Mit. BANCROFT: And C-1 is?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Heavy industry.
MR. BANCROFT: That refutes at least in part the idea that there is
no place for such a business. I don't know what the financial ele-
ments of a park on the property are. It probably would be less than
what would be involved in trying to get waterfront property and ac-
cess property in other parts of Route 25. I think it would be too
bad to go ahead with this expansion in that neighborhood. For the
tourists coming and their main reason for coming is open space and
they can't see any open space from the 2 access roads to what end.
Thank you.
Page 22 - October , 1986
· Public Hearing of seph and Linda Schoens~
Southold Town Board of Appeals
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you Mr. Bancroft. Is there anybody
else that would like to speak against the application. Mr. Angel.
MR. ANGEL: I just would request that you grant them the relief
we sought. As I said, I will provide you within 7 days, some
sort of summary of my testimony and some authority for the pro-
position. So that may help
CHAIRM_A_N GOEHRINGER: I don't believe you were present at the last
meeting. But for the record, I had asked Mr. Joseph Schoenstein
what he intended to do with all the paraphanelia that was sitting
out there in the yard at this particular time. And he did tell me
at that time, that he intended to put it in the building. That's
the new proposed building that's before us I assume tonight and was
before us at that particular time also. At that time, there was some
question concerning the antique shop. Are there property c.o.'s.
Are there any violations on any of these buildings at this particular
time?
MR. ANGEL: My understanding is that that antique shop was in ex-
istence at the time of the original application and it always has
been an antique shop. Is that correct?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: That's correct. When I came to the Board to
originally apply for my welding shop variance before I purchased
the property~ we explained to the Board what we wanted to do. We
wanted a welding business and my wife have an antique shop. The
Board said that the welding business is going to require a vari-
ance, a use variance. The antique shop is a conforming business
with the area and there wouldn't be any problem whatsoever. Now
we got our variance for the welding business and also opened up an
antique shop in the building and we were never notified. I under-
stand now after a year of working with the Board, I understand now
that if you took a building like that even though it is business
zoned and you can make it into a store. Even though we asked for
it and you said we had to have a variance for the welding business
and nothing for the antique shop. I understand now why we have to
come to the Board. Yes. But we opened the antique shop 8 years
ago and it's basically a weekend business for my wife and we re-
stored the little building on the side of the property where it
is. We came to the Board about this house when I started this
whole application and they said the first thing I have to do is
close the antique shop. And I said but why. And you said it's
opened for so long now..-.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: This is the '79 application you're referring
to?
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: No. No. I'm sorry. This application. They
told us we would have to close the antique shop. When I went for
the building permit and the application for the expansion of the
welding shop, they said we'd have to close the antique shop. And
I said why. We went around for a little while and they said some-
thing about you don't have a c.o. on it and you don't have a build-
ing permit. Well it turns out that we got Mr. Taska who was our
Page 23 - October2, 1986
Public Hearing of Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Southold Town Zoning Board Of Appeals
MR. J. SCHEONSTEIN (continued):
attorney at the closing on that property and we spoke with him
about it and he tried to rectify things somewhat with the town.
We came down here to get our building permit and a c.o. for that
small building and we found out that the building was erected be-
fore building permits were issued. So that took care of that. The
next thing we found was that we didn't have to have a co. I guess.
It's funny. I get a letter in the mail from the Town of Southold.
And on a little yellow piece of paper it said; antique shop c.o.
not required. That was it. No signature, no nothing. I brought
that down here and I could not find who sent that little piece of
paper. I know that we stepped out of bounds. I can't deny that.
It's perfectly obvious. Is it alright if I try to clear up on
two things quickly? I would just like to say and I really think
it's important, I did agree to erect a fence to go up by the shrub-
bery to the adjoining piece of property that we did not hear about
tonight. I have a small parcel of property on the Main Road to the
west of the welding shop. To the west of the welding shop there's
a small parcel 95 feet on the Main Road. That adjoins Mr. John
Nicolletti's property to the east. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That
adjoins Mr. Nicolletti's property. I did agree to put a hedge or
a shrub or a fence on that boundary if we were able to expand.
That was the agreement. Mr. Clark from Peconic Bay Estates, the
president, came to me and asked me, could you try to calm things
down a little bit. Can you try to work something out with him.
I said yes I would do it. I told John and I think he knows this;
he said something to me recently. I'm going to put a fence up.
And I said John; I had told him in a letter to Mr. Clark (his sig-
nature) that I am going to put up a fence or hedge or whatever Mr.
Nicolletti preferred along that property line. I don't have to do
that but I feel it was only right. That's what the man wants, I'd
like to work with him. The funny thing that upsets me very much
about this whole thing is that I went to John Nicolletti about this
application a year ago and I proposed my first site plan to him and
we did get along quite well before this. And he said to me; I will
help you. I only wish I had a tape recorder because the man sat
there at his kitchen table with his wife present and said I will
help you put the building up with my own two hands. But I want
that piece of property next to you for my buffer zone and I will
say that. That's what the man told me. He wants the piece of
property next to me. And I said John; I don't want to sell that
property but I promise you it's not going to be a welding shop.
It's not going to be a storage facility for steel like it had been
because I didn't own that back lot and I had steel and I had a
container of scrap steel on that property at the time and we did
clean it up. There's a few things there down in the grass right
now but it's just a vacant lot right now and I'm not selling that
lot. Nobody can force me to sell that lot. I would love to buy
his house but I'm sure he doesn't want to sell it. Now I have
done as much as I could. He hollered about the pile of dirt out
front and I moved the pile of dirt and I understand. It didn't
look good but that's where I was made to put it so to speak. Now
I moved it in front of my welding shop. That was fill hopefully
for the new building and we put it too close to wetlands and I
- October~, 1986 Schoenste
Page.24
Publzc Hearing of~'~oseph and Linda
Southold Town Zoning Board of Appeals
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN (continued)
was surmnonsed for it and have to move it away from the wetlands
and away from a stream even though we found out now from the
D.E.C. that the stream is not wetlands. That's what the Build-
ing Department based all my applications on to build; that the
stream was wetlands and I was in all kinds of problems with that
stream.
TAPE ENDED
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: I don't think there's anything else I can
say. Are there any questions at all?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: So to your knowledge, going back to the
original questions, the buildings that exist now on the proper-
ties in question are legal? There are no violations on them at
this particular time. And the only violation is what you admit-
ted to before and that is the violation of the conditions of the
1979 variance which is exceeding the amount of people that you
have working there and the paraphanelia there that's laying out
on the ground at this particular time.
MR. J. SCHOENSTEIN: Right. You asked me about the paraphanelia,
the machinery. There's a lot of machinery. There's no place to
put it. I have to have it for my work. When I started here, it
was neat. A truck, a welder and a set of trenches are there but
I can't help it ghat the people leave me here and that my busi-
ness grew. I hgd no idea I was going to have 5 employees 8 years
ago. I had no idea that was going to happen. And to be all
honest with you, it's taken so long just to try to find out about
a building permit, I don't know how long I would have had to wait
to hire somebody. I didn't know that at the time, but I was wrong
by not coming to you previously to this and ask for an extension
on my amount of people. The pressure on us was extremely heavy.
I didn't think I was going to make it here tonight and I don't
know if my man is still there to do work on Greenport Water Authori-
ty right now piping in a new purifying system down in Southold
and it has to be read by 8 ofclock tomorrow morning. I was noti-
fied about it two days ago. We had to supply all the pipe and all
the work and it's a tremendous job. The pressure is a lot and we
really feel that you know we've looked in other places. We have
really. We have really tried hard. We just... I want to get
back that machinery and stuff. The building is going to house
the machinery and a good majority of our stock. Some stock that
we have that was extremely long and has to be taken and cut up.
That has been kept in that rear yard which is shown on your map
of the site plan as a storage facility. It's fenced in and we
are including some shrubbery on the back of that if our proposal
goes through. I'm not going to start putting in driveways and
make a tremendous expense to myself now if I can not expand. I
will just have to drag the stuff in the back and I don't know
what we can do. We just don't know what to do next.
Page 25 Octobe~ , 1986
Public Hearing seph and Linda Schoenste
Southold Town Board of Appeals
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER:
MR. J.~SCHOENSTEIN:
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER:
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
Mr. Bancroft. Yes sir.
MR. BANCROFT: Under the plans, this area will be zoned how?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Sir I didn't look at the map and I believe...
MR. ANGEL: I have a copy of the map of this section.
is L-I.
MR. BANCROFT: Does that mean light industry?
MR. ANGEL: I think it's meant to mean light industry.
MR. BANCROFT: What does it mean?
MR. ANGEL: I would permit this type of use.
MR. BANCROFT: Well I didn't here it read by Mr. Winters.
MR. ANGEL:- You mean under the Master Plan?
MR. BANCROFT: Well he read a long list.
MR. ANGEL: Well he didn't consult with the Master Plan. The
Master Plan is not in effect yet.
This area
CHAIRMA2~ GOEHRINGER: Light business sir.
Mit. BANCROFT: Light business. I was wondering under what kind
of rationalization we're talking about the business being im-
proved under light business. If you go by there daily as I do,
there's no conceivable way that you could imagine that it was
light industry.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Mr. McLoughlin.
MR. MCLOUGHLIN: I would just ask the Board if
the opportunity to present anything in writing
the next week in opposition.
I could also have
that I wish to in
CHAIRMA2~ GOEHRINGER: Do you want to critique what your :associate
and I said in opposition?
MR. MCLOUGHLIN: No. I don't really want an opportunity to neces-
sarily to respond to whatever he puts in writing. I would be with-
in the same week period, just an opportunity, cases of law that I
feel would be in our favor.
MR. BANCROFT: I wasn't asking about the Master Plan. I wondered
how this area was zoned at the moment.
Page 26 - OctobeW2, 1986
Public Hearing of-Joseph and Linda Schoenste~n
Southold Town Board of Appeals
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Is that alright with you?
MR. ANGEL: Yes. We'll just both submit within that week.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: So there will be no cross referencing
at that particular time.
MR. MCLOUGHLIN: I don't see a necessity for that myself.
MR. ANGEL: If we see the necessity, I guess either one of us
could ask the Board's permission.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Well that's where the problem is as you
know with the closing of the hearing..
MR. ANGEL: Well then I will forget about my right to do that.
I'll submit within 7 days.
You'll do the same Mro McLoughlin.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER:
MR. MCLOUGHLIN: Yes.
CHAIR~IN GOEHRINGER:
If there's no further comment, I'll make a
motion closing the hearing and reserving the decision until later.
Ail in favor - aye.
Nadia Moore
D
LD
Y
Southold, N.Y. 11971
(516) 765-1938
December
23, 1986
Mr. Merlon Wiggon
Peconic Associates,
One Bootleg Alley
P.O. BOx 672
Greenport, NY 11944
Inc.
Re: North Fork Welding
Dear Mr. ~iggon:
The following action was taken by the Southold Town Planning
Board, Monday, December 22, 1986.
RESOLVED that the Southold Town Planning Board approve the
site plan for North Fork Welding for construction of an accessory
building to the existing welding use located at Main Road, Greenport,
site plan dated as revised December 20, 1986; subject to:
1. Certification of the site plan by the Building Department
2. Receipt and review and approval~of:a:!_land~Cap~LD~an>~in~i~ating
the size, type and quantity of landscape material.
Upon receipt of the above, the Chairman may endorse the site
plans.
If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact
our office.
Very truly yours,
BENNETT ORLOWSKI, JR., CHAIRMAN
SOUTHOLD TOWN PLANNING BOARD
cc: ~ilding Department
~Board of Appeals
By Diane M. Schultze, Secretary
APPEALS BOARD
MEMBERS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CHAIRMAN
CHARLES GRIGONIS, JR.
SERGE DOYEN, JR.
ROBERT J. DOUGLASS
JOSEPH H. SAWICKI
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MAIN RDAD- B'rATE; ROAD 2-~ SOUTHOLD, L.I., N.Y. llCJ?l
TELEPHONE (516) 765-1809
December 24, 1986
Stephen R. Angel, Esq.
Esseks, Hefter & Angel
108 East Main Street,
Riverhead, NY ll901
Box 279
Re: Appeal No. 3550 - North Fork Welding (Variances)
Dear Mr. Angel:
Transmitted herewith for your perusal and
a copy of the response from the Suffolk County
of Planning in our referral as required by the
County Charter.
file is
Department
Suffolk
Wishing you and your ~taff "Happy Holidays"!
Yours very truly,
Linda Kowalski
Board Secretary
Enclosure
DEPARTMENT OF PLANNING
Town of Southold
Zoning Board of Appeals
OCOUNTY OF SUFFOLK
PETER F. COHALAN
SUFFOLK COUNTY EXECUTIVE
360-5513
~? t / December 22, 1986
Applicant: North Fork Welding
Mun. File No.: #3550
S.C.P.D. File No.: SD-86-39
Gentlemen:
Pursuant to the requirements of Sections 1323 to 1332 of the Suffolk County
Charter, the above referenced application which has been submitted to the
Suffolk County Planning Commission is considered to be a matter for local deter-
mination. A decision of local determination should not be construed as either
an approval or disapproval.
Cox~ents: Appropriate use, operational, screening and increased building setback
from wetlands (ditch) warrants consideration.
Very truly yours,
Lee E. Koppelman
Director of Planning
GGN:mb
S/s Gerald G. Newman
Chief Planner
APPEALS BOARD
MEMBERS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER. CHAIRMAN
CHARLES GRIGONIS, JR.
SERGE DOYEN, JR.
ROBERT J. DOUGLASS
JOSEPH H. SAWICKI
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MAIN ROAD- STAT£ ROAD 25 SC)UTHE)LD, L.I., N.Y. 119'71
TELEPHONE (516) 765-1809
Pursuant to Article XIII of the Suffolk'County Charter, the
Board of Appeals of the Town of Southold, New York, hereby refers
the following to the Suffolk County Planning Commission:
× Variance from the Zoning Code, Article xI, Section 100-119.2(B) and
Drticle VI, Section 100-60 per Building Insp. Letter Dated 1/30/86
Variance from Determination of Southold Town Building Inspector
Special Exception, Article , Section
Special Permit
Appeal No.: 3550 ARplicant: North Fork Welding
Location of Affected Land: ~/s Main Rd., Greenport, NY
County Tax Map Item No.: 1000- 53-2~12, 13,15.1 (15)
Within 500 feet of:
Town or Village Boundary Line
X Body of Water (Bay, Sound or Estuary)
X State or County Road, Parkway, Highway, Thruway
Boundary of Existing or Proposed County, State or Federally Owned Land
Boundary of Existing or Proposed County, State or Federal Park or
Other Recreation Area
or
Exi.sting or Proposed Right-of Way of Any Stream
Owned by the County or fo~ Which The County Has
Lines,
Within One Mile of a Nuclear Power Plant
Within One Mile of An Airport.
or Drainage
Established
Channel
Channel
COMMENTS: Applicant is requesting permission to expand nonconforming use of
weldinq business in this "B-Liqht B~siness" Zone and permissi o st uct
new building and expand nonconforming welding business use within 75 feet
Copies of Town file and related documents enclosed for your review.
Dated:December 16, 1986
Secretary, Board of Appeals
T LD
Southold, N.Y, 11971
(516) 765-1938
December 15, 1986
Mr. Stephen R. Angel,
Attorney at Law
108 E. Main Street, P.O.Box 279
Riverhead, NY 11901
Re: North Fork Welding / Schoenstein
Dear Mr. Angel:
We are in receipt of the conditional approval from the
Board of Appeals with regard to the above mentioned proposal.
Would please have the site plan amended in accordance
with the conditions in the Board of Appeals determination
and forward six (6) to the Planning Board office. A final
site plan review is required pursuant to Articles XII and
VI, as well as, condition no.15 of the Board of Appeals
approval.
Upon receipt of the amended site plans, we will schedule
this matter on the next available agenda.
If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact
our office.
Very truly yours,
BENNETT ORLOWSKI, JR., CHAIRMAN
SOUTHOLD TOWN PLANNING BOARD
CC: S~enstein
~oard of Appeals
By Diane M. Schultze, Secretary
Southold Town Board of Appeals
MAIN ROAD- ~TATE ROAD ~5 r::nUTHOLD, L.h, N.Y. 11971
TELEPHONE (516) 765-1809
APPEALS BOARD
MEMBERS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CHAIRMAN
CHARLES GRIGONIS, JR.
SERGE DOYEN, .JR.
ROBERT .1. DOUGLASS
JOSEPH H. SAW~CKI
December 12, 1986
-Stephen R. Angel, Esq.
Esseks, Hefter & Angel
108 East Main Street,
Riverhead, NY 11901
Box 279
Re: Appeal No. 3550 - North Fork Welding/Schoenstein (Variances)
Dear Mr. Angel:
Attached hereto is a copy of the official findings and
determination recently rendered and filed this date with the
Office of the Clerk concerning the above matter.
In the event your application has been approved, please
be sure to return to the Building Department for approval of
any new construction, in writing, or other documents as may
be applicable.
If this application involves a pending subdivision or
site plan, please return to the Planning Board for further
processing by their office.
Please do not hesitate to call either our office (765-1809)
or that of the Building Inspector (765-1802) if you have any
questions.
Yours very truly,
GERARD P. GOEHR~NGER
Enclosure CHAIRMAN
Copy of Decision to
Building Department By Linda Kowalski
Planning Board
Suffolk County Planning Commi'ssion
J. Kevin McLaughl~n, Esq.~.
{s
LOT 190 ~
'ES :*lnc.~ :-
)rt~ N.Y. 11944
828 FRONT STREET, P. O, BOX 803
GREENPORT, NY 11944
(516) 477-1016
October 25, 1986
Board of Appeals
Town of Southold
Main Road
Southold, New York
11971
Re: Schoenstein Appeal No. 3550
Gentlemen:
At the public hearing on this matter held on October 22,
1986, I was granted a period of one week within which to submit
written objections to the granting of this variance. The follow-
ing is a summary of my clients' position in this matter.
The history of the applicants before this Board is
extremely enlightening. On May 3, 1979, Joseph Schoenstein
appeared before this Board for permission to conduct a welding
business at the subject premises which are located in a "B"
(light business) zone. At that time, Mr. Schoenstein made the
following representations to the Board:
1. That he operated a portable welding
business.
2. That he desired to purchase the property
and utilize the old building to store weld-
ing supplies so that he could save time
running back and forth to his house.
3. That no noise would be produced to dis-
turb neighbors.
4. That
storage
5. That
as fire
6. That
performed
there would be absolutely no outside
of equipment or work in progress.
he would deal in small items such
escapes, boat products, etc.; and
there would be no large-scale work
at the premises.
In reliance on Mr. Schoenstein's
Board granted a conditional use variance,
conditions:
representations, the
subject to the following
Board of Appeals
-2- October 25, 1986
1. No outside storage of equipment or
work that is to be completed.
2. If the proposed number of employees
on the premises becomes larger than two,
the applicant shall return to this Board
for review of this action; and
3. Suffolk County Planning Board approval.
Since obtaining the conditional use variance in 1979, the
applicants have defaulted on each and every representation made
to the Board and have violated the conditions established by the
Board regarding outside storage and number of permissible em-
ployees. Despite this conduct, the applicants came before this
Board for a further variance on which a public hearing was held
on May 22, 1986. By decision of the Board dated July 1, 1986,
the application for a further variance was denied because the
applicants had failed to present dollars and cents proof that they
could not realize a reasonable return on the property. Addition-
ally, this Board stated that the requested variance was substantial
and that the effect of granting the variance will be circumventing
a change of zone or to establish a zone district completely at odds
with the surrounding neighborhood and zoning code.
On the instant application, the applicants argue that they
should not be held to the standard of proof for a use variance,
but to some lesser unspecified standard. Clearly, as this Board
correctly determined in the prior application which was denied,
the applicants are seeking a further use variance and must be
held to that standard of proof. As stated in Anderson, New York
Zoning Law and Practice Section 23.52 at pages 241 and 242:
Since a board of zoning appeals is with-
out authority to amend the zoning regula-
tions, a variance properly granted is not
an amendment of the regulations but an
authorization to establish a use which is
proscribed by the ordinance. The variance
does not reclassify the land. It vests a
right of use which runs with the land; it
is a right with specific dimensions.
As can be seen from the foregoing, the 1979 conditional
use variance merely granted to the applicants the right to use
the premises for a welding business as specified. It did not
change the zoning on said parcel to industrial, nor did it grant
the right to the applicants to expand the welding business out-
side the designated structure without a further use variance. The
very conditions imposed by the Board in granting the 1979 variance
illustrate this point. "If a variance is approved subject to
conditions, the conditions further circumscribe the right."
(Anderson, Section 23.52 at page 242.)
Board of Appeals
-~- October 25, 1986
Once it has been determined that the applicants must
adhere to the standard of proof for a use variance, the three-
pronged test of Otto v. Steinhilber, 282 NY1, 24 NE 2d 851
(1939), must be met. The applicants must prove that: (1) the
land in question cannot yield a reasonable return if used only for
a purpose allowed in that zone, (2) the plight of the owner is
due to unique circumstances and not to the general conditions of
the neighborhood; and (3) the use to be authorized by the var-
iance will not alter the essential character of the locality.
The applicants proof fails on all three tests. It is
the rule of law in this State that in order to prove that the
property cannot yield a reasonable return, the applicant must
present dollars and cents proof that no permitted use would
yield a reasonable return. See Wheeler v. Elmira, 63 NY 2d 721
(1984) and Romanelli v. Bonvouloir, 102 AD 2d 721 (2d Dept. 1984).
This dollars and cents proof must be shown by substantial evi-
dence. See Victory Boulevard Associates v. New York, 85 AD 2d
725 (2d Dept 1981). The applicants actually proved the exact
opposite. Their welding business is so profitable that they need
to expand. The applicants failed to produce any dollars and
cents proof regarding the profitability of the existing welding
business. However, the unmistakable conclusion to be drawn from
the applicants presentation is that their business is doing
extremely well.
The applicants also fail on the second test. Their
plight, while it may be unique, is due solely to the applicants
self-imposed hardship. The applicants knew, or reasonably should
have known, at the time they purchased the property that it was
located in a "B" zone and that their welding business was sub-
jec-t to the restrictions of the 1979 conditional use variance.
The applicants should not now be heard to complain that their
"portable, small-scale welding business" has expanded into a
full-blown industrial welding enterprise and that, therefore,
they should be allowed to greatly expand.
As set forth in this Board's earlier denial of the appli-
cants further use variance, to grant such a variance would
circumvent the existing zoning ordinance and establish a zone
district completely at odds with the surrounding neighborhood.
Little has changed since that decision of the Board in July,
1986, and, therefore, the applicants proof fails on the third
test as well.
Board of Appeals
-4- October 25, 1986
The applicants proof further establishes a blatant
pattern of disregard for the zoning ordinances and the con-
ditions imposed by this Board. Joseph Schoenstein admitted
that there is substantial outside storage of equipment and work
in progress. He further admitted that there are presently five
employees of the welding business.
The application seeks a new building of approximately
4,500 square feet. The present building contains only about
2915 square feet. The requested expansion therefore exceeds
150% of the existing building. Additionally, the subject
premises currently operates from approximately 7:00-8:00 am
to 9:00-10:00 pm and on weekends. My clients, the Nicolettis,
are subjected to substantial and annoying noise at all hours due
to the existence of this operation. A petition in opposition
signed by in excess of forty neighbors has been filed with this
Board.
Ail of these factors melitate against the granting of
this variance. Particularly, the applicants legal failure of
proof requires that this application be denied. Furthermore,
to grant such a variance to applicants who have consistently
violated the conditions imposed by this Board would send the
wrong message to the community. Clearly, one should not be
allowed to gain by virtue of his disregard for the zoning
ordinances and lawful directions of this Board.
Very truly yours,
JKM:kk
ATTORNEY AT LAW
828 FRONT STREET, P. O. BOX 803
GREENPORT, NY 11944
1516} 477-1016
October 20, 1986
Board of Appeals
Town of Southold
Town Hall
Southold, NY 11971
Re:
Appeal No. 3550
Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
Gentlemen:
I have enclosed a petition signed by approximately
forty-four (44) neighbors of North Fork Welding Co., who strongly
object to the expansion of the prior non-conforming use of these
premises.
Please make this petition a permanent part of
in this appeal.
JKM/lg
Enclosure
the record
WE, the undersigned, members of the Peconic Bay Property
Owner's Association hereby petition the Town of Southold Board of
Appeals to deny Appeal No. 3550 filed by Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
for a variance to greatly expand the existing use variance granted
May 3, 1979, to establish a welding business known as North Fork
Welding Co.
Not only is the existing welding business not in conformity with
the essential character of the neighborhood, but the applicants have
violated the conditions of the previous variance by outside storage of
equipment and work-in-progress and by expanding the number of employ-
ees over the limit of two. We believe that the existing variance
allows the applicants to realize a reasonable return on their property,
and, therefore, a further use variance should not and cannot be granted
A further expansion of the applicant's large-scale industrial welding
facility will undoubtedly have a serious, adverse impact on surround-
ing property values.
Instead of expanding a use already not in conformity with the
surrounding neighborhood, the Board of Appeals should enforce the
conditions for the granting of the previous variance.
NAME ADDRESS DATE
NAME ADDRESS DATE
,~/~:N~ ADDRESS DATE
Southold Town Board o£Appeals
MAIN ROAD- ~)TATE ROAD 25 ~qOUTHOLD, L.I., N.Y. 11971
TELEPHONE (516) 765-1809
APPEALS BOARD
MEMBERS
October 22; 1986
.S.E.Q.R.A.
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CHAIRMAN
CHARLES GRIGONIS, JR.
SERGE DOYEN, JR.
ROBERT J. DOUGLASS
JOSEPH H. SAWICKI NEGATIVE ENVIRONMENTAL DECLARATION
Notice of Determination of Non-Significance
APPEAL NO.: 3550
PROJECT NAME: JOSEPH AND LINDA SCHOENSTEIN
This notice is issued pursuant to Part 617 of the implementing
regulations pertaining to Article 8 of the N.Y.S. Environmental
Quality Review Act of the Environmental Conservation Law and Local
Law #44-4 of the Town of Southold.
This board determines the within project not to have a signifi-
cant adverse effect on the environment for the reasons indicated
below.
Please take further notice that this declaration should not be
considered a determination made for any other department or agency
which may also have an application pending for the same or similar
project.
TYPE OF ACTION: [ Type II ~] Unlisted [ ]
DESCRIPTION OF ACTION: Expand nonconforming use of welding business
and construct new building and expand nonconforming welding business use'
within 75 feet of wetlands
LOCATION OF PROJECT: Town of Southold, County or, suffolk, more
particularly known as: S/s Main Rd., Greenport, Ny
REASON(S) SUPPORTING THIS DETERMINATION:
(1) An Environmental Assessment in the short form has been
submitted which indicates that no significant adverse effects to
the environment are likely to occur should this project be imple-
mented as planned;
(2) No disturbance of land within lO feet of existing drainage
ditch ~and wetlands, whichever is closer).
FOR FURTHER INFORMATION, PLEASE CONTACT: Linda Kowals~i, Secretary,
Southold Town Board of Appeals, Town Hall, Southold, NY 11971; tel. 516-
765-1809 or 1802.
Copies of this notice sent to the applicant or his agent and posted
on the Town Clerk Bulletin Board.
M3~TSOUTHOLD TOWN BOARD OF APP.~ALS
ER OF JOSEPH AND LINDA SCh~ENSTEIN
THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 11, 1986 PUBLIC HEARING
9:10 p.m. Appeal No. 3550 Public Hearing commenced in the
Matter of JOSEPH AND LINDA SCHOENSTEIN. Variances (a) to ex-
pand nonconforming use of welding business, (b) to construct
new building and expand nonconforming welding business use
within 75' of wetlands. S/s Main Road, Greenport, Peconic
Bay Estates. "B-Light" Business Zone.
The Chairman read the legal notice for the rec0rd- (as indicated
on page two).
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I received a letter from the attorney.
Oh, that's right. You're going to speak on his behalf. Go
ahead.
S. ANGEL, ESQ.:The only... I spoke to Linda today and I re-
quested that you adjourn this to your next meeting. The per-
son we hired is an appraiser and can't testify tonight and
may not be able to testify. We may have to get a new appraiser.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: I have a problem with the next hearing,
the next meeting and that is; that we are completely loaded, a
full calender. So we're going to have to recess without date.
I'm going to have to put it on the next hearing after that.
MR. ANGEL : There's just no way it will fit on next meeting?
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: No. But it's been brought to my attention
that with the scheduling, it appears that we were going to be
having two meetings in October anyway. Now, I can read the
proper information into the record at this time and open the
hearing or I can wait until that time and do it. I just want to
poll the audience and see if there's anybody here to speak on
behalf or against the Schoenstein matter.
K. McLAUGHLIN ES~: I'm here representing one of the adjoining
property owners in opposition.
CHAIRMAN GOEHRINGER: Well ok. What I will do then is open the
hearing and just take a brief amount of testimony from you or a
statement from you then we'll recess it without a date.
MR. McLAUGHLIN : I was made aware of the fact that there was
going to be an adjournment of this matter and would prefer to
put forth any evidence that we might have at that time the ap-
plicant puts forth their proof.
Page 2 - Schoenstein hearing
Southold Town Board of Appeals
September ll, 1986 Regular Meeting
SECRETARY: Would that be for the 16th or 23rd of October?
CHAIRMAN: Maybe the 23rd. We'll have to readvertise it any way.
MR. ANGEL: Why don't you open it and then you don't have to
readvertise it.
SECRETARY: Recess it with a date?
MR. ANGEl: Is it not within your policy?
CHAIRMAN: It's in our policy.
MR. ANGEL: Because notice was given. I would prefer that you
open the meeting and then I make my application for the adjourn-
ment.
MR. McLAUGHLIN: I have no objection.
CHAIRMAN: ~ will read~ legaltlme.~ ~ ~ l(Cegalnot read Notice the
read to the public at t,,: jn°t~c,]l
was
application, and I'll at this particular time recess this
hearing until the second meeting in October, and I'll ask
for a second.
MEMBER SAWICKI seconded the motion and the resolution was duly
carried.
CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
(Transcribed from cassette tapes recorded electronically at the
meeting by Linda Kowalski, ZBA Clerk.)
Nadia Moore'
JUDITH T. TERRY
OFFICE OF THE TOWN CLERK
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
August 21,
1986
Town Hall, 53095 Main Road
P.O. Box 728
Southold, New York 11971
TELEPHONE
(516) 765-1801
To: Southold Town Zoning Board of Appeals
From: Judith T. Terry, Southold Town Clerk
Transmitted herewith is Zoning Appeal No. 3550 application of
Joseph and Linda Schownstein with Esseks, Hefter, Cuddy & Angel
as agents. Also included is Notice to Adjacent Property Owners;
letter relative to NYS Tidal Wetlands Land-Use; plans; Short
Environmental Assessment Form; and survey.
Judith T. Terry
Southold Town Clerk
Page 20A/The Suffolk TimeslAugust ~86 ,. -
Legal Notices
NOTICE OF HEARINGS
NOTICE IS HEREBY
GIVEN, pursuant to Section 267
of the Town Law and the Cede oC
the Town of Southold, the follow-
ing public hearings will be held
by the SOUTHOLD TOWN
BOARD OF APPEALS at the
Southold Town Hall, Main Read,
Southold, NY at a Regular Meet-
ing commencing at 7:30 p.m. on
THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER
11, 1986, and as follows:
7:35 p.m. Appeal No. 3540 --
MARK AND LORRAINE
LaROSA. Variance to the Zen-
ing Ordinance, Article XI, Sec-
tion 100-119.2(B) for permission
to construct deck addition at
rear of existing dwelling within
75 feet of ordinary highwater
mark along "Horton Creek," Io-
cated along the north side of
Albe Drive, Laurel, NY; County
Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-126-2-
12.
7:40 p.m. Appeal No. 3541 --
RIAL REALTY CORP. Vari-
ances to the Zoning Ordinance,
Article III, Section 100-31, Bulk
Schedule, for approval of insuffi-
cient lot width of three proposed
parcels in this pending minor
subdivision located at the north-
erly end of proposed right-of-way
extending from the north side of
Oregon Road, Mattituck, NY;
County Tax Map Parcel No.
1000-95-1-3. Containing 47.0520
acres total.
7:50 p.m. Appeal No. 3533 --
JOHN BREDEMEYER. (Re-
cessed from August 14, 1986).
New dwelling with an insuffi-
cient setback from ordinary
highwater mark along Orient
Harbor.
7:55 p.m. Appeal No. 3477 --
WILLIAM AND
KATHERINE HEINS. (Races-
sad from August 14, 1986). In-
sufficient area, width and depth
of two proposed parcels. North
Side Main Read, Orient, NY;
1000-19-2-5 and 6.
8:00 p.m. Appeal No. 3544 -
JAMES F. WARWICK. Vari-
ance to lift Condition of prior
Z.B.A. Appeal No. 1729 re-
ndered March 8, 1973 to allow
new construction Of a single-
family dwelling at premises 1o-
cated along the south side of
Fasbender Avenue, Peconic, NY;
Bailey Park Map filed Sep-
tember 26, 1932, Subdivision
Lot # 11; County Tax Map Parcel
No. 1000-67-6-7.
8:10 p.m. Appeal No. 3534 --
,ROBERT WADDINGTON.
Variance to the Zoning Ordi-
nance, Article IH, Section 100-
31, Bulk Schedule, for permis-
sion to construct addition to
existing building with insuffi-
cient side and rear yard set-
backs, at 13175 Main Read, Mat-
tituck, NY; County Tax Map
Parcel No. 1000-140-03-038. "B-
1" Genera] Business Zoning Dis-
trict.
/~ 8:20 p.m. Appeal No. 3550 --~
JOSEPH AND LINDA~
SCHOENSTEIN. Variances te~
the Zoning Ordinance, Articles:,/
(a) VI, Section 100-60 for per-/
lng use of welding business in ~
this "B-Light Business" Zoning
District; (b) XI, Section 100-
lI~.2(B) for permission to con-
struct new building and expand
nonconform]Kg welding business
use within 75 feet from wetlands
area, at premises located along
the south side of Main Road,
Greenport, NY; County Tax Map
Parcels No. 1000-53-2-12, 13 and
15; Lots 172, 173, 174, Peconic
Bay Estates Map No. 658, and
Map No. 1124 as Amended.
8:35 p.m. Appeal No. 3538 --
JEFFREY BETTANCOURT.
Variance to the Zoning Ordi-
nance, Article XI, Section 100-
119.2(A) for permission to con-
struct inground swimmingpool
with fence enclosure and gazebo
within 100 feet of top of bluff or
bank along Long Island Sound,
at premises known as 2410
Grandview Drive, Orient, NY;
Grandview Estates Subdivision
Lot #5, Map No. 7083; County
Tax Map Parcel No. 1000-14-02-
3.9.
8:40 p.m. Appeal No. 3513 -
STEPHEN SHILOWITZ. iRe-
ceased from August 14, 1986).
Condominium construction
within 75 feet of bulkhead and
tidal water. West Side of 6th
Street, Greenport, NY; 1000-49-
01-25.1.
The Board of Appeals will
hear at said time and place all
persons or representatives desir-
tog to be heard in each of the
above hearings. Written com-
ments may also be submitted
prior to the conclusion of the
subject hearing. For more infer-
mation, please call 765-1809.
Dated: August 22, 1986.
BY ORDER
OF THE SOUTHOLD
TOWN BOARD
OF APPEALS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER,
CHAIRMAN
Linda Kowalski,
Board Secretary
1TA28-5333
STATE OF NEW YORK )
) SS:
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK )
14~ t-Mo~-i no l~rmc]a ¥c'huk of Greenport, in
said County, being duly sworn, says that he/she is
Principal Clerk of THE SUFFOLK TIMES, a Weekly
Newspaper, published at Greenport, in tho Town
of Southold, County of Suffolk and State of New
York, and that the Notice of which the annexed is
a printed copy, has been regularly published in
said Newspaper once each week for 1
weeks successively, commencing on the 2 8
dayof Auau$ l; 19 ~;{
/} ' Prir~ipal Clerk
Sworn to befoAe me this ~
NOTARY PUBLIC, State of New York
~ Suffolk County No. 4849860
Term Expires
ATTORNEY AT LAW
828 FRONT STREET
GREENPORT, NY 11944
PH0:~(516) 477 1016
September 12, 19
Board of Appeals
Southold Town
Main Road
Southold, New York
11971
Gentlemen:
Re: Appeal No. 3550
Joseph and Linda Schoenstein
I appeared on behalf of Mr. and Mrs. John Nicholetti,
adjoining land owners, in opposition to the above-
referenced application for variances on September 11,
1986. At that time, upon motion of the applicant, the
hearing was adjourned without date.
Please advise me as soon as this application has been re-
scheduled.
Thank you for your cooperation.
Yours very truly,
JKN: fae :
WILLIAM HT/ PRICE, ~J~%/
t /
J. Kevin McLaughl£n
/
APPEALS BOARD
MEMBERS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER, CHAIRMAN
CHARLES GRIGONIS, .IR.
SERGE DOYEN, JR.
ROBERT J. DOUGLASS
JOSEPH R, SAWICKI
Southold Town Board of Appeals
~IAIN ROAD- STATE ROAD 2.5 SOUTHOLD, L.I., N.Y. llg?l
TELEPHONE (516) 765 1809
TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN:
Enclosed herewith as confirmation of the time and date
of the public hearing concerning your recent application is
a copy of the Legal Notice as published in the L.I. Traveler-
Watchman, Inc. and Suffolk Weekly Times, Inc.
Someone should appear in your behalf during the public
hearing in the event ti~ere are questioDs from board members
or persons in the audience. Please be assured that your
public hearing will not start before the time allotted in
the Legal Notice.
If you have any questions, please feel free to call
our office, 765-1809.
Yours very ~u~ ~
G'ERARD P. 'GOEHR[NGER J
CHAIRMAN
Enclosure
Linda .Koualski
Secretary and
Board Clerk
NOTICE OF HEARINGS
NOTICE IS HEREBY
GIVEN, pursuant to Section
267 of the Town Law and the
Code of the Town of Southold,
the following public hearings
will be held by the SOUTHOLD
TOWN BOARD OF AP-
PEALS at the Southold Town
Hall, Main Road, Southold,
NY at a Regular Meeting com-
mencing at 7:30 p.m. on
THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER
11, 1986, and as follow:
7:35 p.m. Appeal No.
3540-MARK AND LOR-
RAINE LaROSA. Variance to
the Zoning Ordinance, Article
XI, Section 100-119.2(B) for
permission to construct deck ad-
dition at rear of existing dwell-
ins within 75 feet of ordinary
highwater mark along "Horton
Creek," located 9long the north
side of Albo Drive, Laurel, NY;
County Tax Map Parcel No.
1000-126-2-12.
7:40 p.m. Appeal No.
3541-RIAL REALTY CORP.
Variances to thc Zoning Or-
dinance, Article lit,. Section
100-31. Bulk Schedule, for ap-
proval of insufficient lot width
of three proposed parcels in this
pending minor subdivision
located at thc northerly end of
proposed right-of-way exten-
ding from the north side of
Oregon Road, Mattituck, NY;
County Tax Map Parcel No.
1000-95-1-3. Containing
47.0520 acres total.
7:50 p.m. Appeal No.
3533-JOHN BREDEMEYER.
(Recessed from August 14,
1986). New dwelling with an in-
sufficient setback from ordinary
highwater mark along Orient
Harbor. ~ ~ ,.'
7:.~5 .~.m., .Appeal No..
347%WILLIAI~' ' AND,,
KATHERINE HEINS. (Rece~s/
ed from August 14) 1986.). In-
sufficient area, width and depth
of two proposed parcels. North
side Main Road, Orient, NY;
1000-19-2-5 and 6.
8:00 p.m. Appeal No.
3544-JAMES F, WARWICK.
Variance to lift Condition of
prior Z.B.A. Appeal No. 1729
rendered March 8, 1973 to allow
new construction of a single-
family dwelling at premises
located along the south side of
Fasbender Avenue, Peconic,
NY; Bailey Park Map filed
September 26, 1912, Subdivi-
sion Lot Ne. Il; Cou0ty Tax
Map Parcel No. 1000-67-6-?,
8:10 p.m. Appeal No.
3534-ROBERT WAD-
DINGTON. Variance to the
Zoning Ordinance, Article 111,
Section I00-31, Bulk Schedule,
for permission to construct ad-
dition to existing building with
insufficient side and rear yard
setbacks, at 13175 Main Roadl
Mattituck, NY; County Tax
Map Parcel No..
1000-140-03-038. "B-I"
General Business Zoning
District.
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK
STATE OF NEW YORK
Patricia Wood, being duly sworn, says that she is the
Editor, of THE LONG ISLAND TRAVELER-WATCHMAN,
a public newspaper printed at Southold, in Suffolk County;
and that the notice of which the annexed is a printed copy,
has been published in said Long Island Traveler-Watchman
once each week for '/ weeks
successively, commencing on the
day 915~-.~:,.
Sworn to before me this .......... .......... clay
Notary Public
BARBARA FORBES
Notary Public, State of New York
No. 4806846
t~ualific.d iu Suffolk County
Commission Exp res fd~ ~/ 19 fig
/'08:20 p.m. Appeal
3550-JOSEPH AND LINDA
SCHOENSTEIN. Variances to
the Zoning Ordinance, Articles!
(a) VI, Section 100-60 for per~
mission to expand nonconform-'
ins use of welding business in
this "B-Light Business";
District; (b) XI,
100-119.2(B) for permission to
construct new building and ex.
pand noncor '
business use within 75 feet from
wetlands area, at premises
located along the south side of.
Main Road, Greenport, NY',
County Tax Map Parcels No.
1000-53-2-12, 13 and 15; Lots
172, 173, 174, Peconic Bay
Estates Map No. 658, and Map
No. 1124 as Amended.
8:35 p.m. Appeal
~'~3538-JEFFREY BETTAN:. ~
COURT. Var!ance to tile Zon-
ing Ordinance, Article Xl,~3ec-
tion 100-119.2(A) for permis-
sion to construct inground
swimmingpool with fence
enclosure and gazebo within 100
feet of top of bluff or bank
along Long Island Sound, at
premises known as 2410 Grand-
view Drive, Orient, NY; Grandd
view Estates Subdivision Lot
No. 5, Map No. 7083; County
Tax Map Parcel No.
1000-14.02-3.9.
8:40 p.m. ~ppeal No.
3513.STEPHEN SHILOWITZ.
{Recessed from August 14.
1986). Condominii~m construc~
tion within 75 feet of bulkhead
and tidal water. West Side of
6¢h Street, Greenport, NY;
1000-49-01-25.1..
The Board of Appeals will
hear at said time and place all
persons or representatives desir-
ing to be heard in each of the
above hearings. Written com-
ments may also be submitted
prior to the conclusion of the
subject hearing. For more infor-
mation; please call 765.1809.
Dated: August 22, 1986.
' BY ORDER OF THE
SOUTHOLD TOWN
,BOARD OF APPEALS
GERARD P. GOEHRINGER,
CHAIRMAN
Linda Kowalski,
Board Secretary
I T-8/28/86(6)
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD, NEW YOR9
APPEAL FROM DECISION OF BUILDING INSPECTOR
APPEAL NO. ?]? ~t., ~.ff
DATE ~g~E..~..Z.!~..j.986
TO THE ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS, TOWN OF SOUTHOLD, N. Y.
Esseks, Hefter, Cuddy & Angel
1, (We) ag.~ngs...foa~...Ios.eph..&..Linda...Sof]08 E. Main Street~ '
e ~,~ + · Name of ApDellant ................... ~7~i"~'g'~J"~l'~'~l~'~r .....................
and Nort~ Fork I4eldlng
........ Ri~er.h~ad .............................................~w,.Xo~.k ...... HEREBY APPEAL TO
Municipality' State
IHE ZONING BOARD OF APPEARS FROM THE DECISION OF THE BUILDING INSPECTOR ON
January 30, 1986 in a letter to the Plannin~ Board of the Town of Southold
A 0 In L FC-AT I O P+-F'OR-D E R,~FT--N~z-:~r::v~ :::.: :r: ::': :. '~. ::mr .-9 ~-~ ..................................................
YV!.iEREBY THE B ~ILDING INSPECTOR DENIED TO
Name of Applicant for permff
Street and Numbor Municipality State
( ) PERMIT TO USE Oreenport, NY 11944
( ) PE[~MIT FOR OCCUPANCY
~X) Site p~an epprov~l ~or addit~m~al building on the property to
R~n~ we!gzng P~e~ ..............
Street ~se Dis~[ict on Zoning
Mop ~o Lo~
2 PROVISION (S) OF THE ZOninG ORDIN;,.~CE APPEALED (Indicote Ibc Article Section, Sub
settlor ~nd P~arogmph of fl~e Zonh~g O:dmo~:e hy number Do not quote fi~e O~dinonce.)
Sectioo~ ~00-60 and 100-il~%~B)
3
(X
£"PE OF /\PPEAL Appeal is made he~owith for
A VA,[xiANCE to the Zoning C~rdin.qnce o! Zoning Map
A VARIANCE due t:~ kick of access (~,(,¢ of New York 'Town Law Chap 62 Cons L~w5
Art 10 Sec 280A Stbsection 3
have
4 Pi~E'v'IOUS Al PEAL ~. prewuus appecIS(hos),4-h~m~v'~>-i:)een rnc:~de with respect to this decisior~
ot t}~c ~udcii~,9 Iniizect>r cl ~ith reH c, t to this property.
(X) request {or
c~:d ~uo~ m(Jde ] Apl:, n No ~5~1 Dated May o, 1979. which was granted
Appedl No. 350Z Dar:ed June 25, 1986, wh~ch'w~'~'~0~ed with
~EA)ON FOR APPEAL
) A Vo~hnnce to Section 28CA
(X) A Voric~r~cc to theL~lrllrl~j' '
)
~s requested for d~e reason that applicants seek expansion o[ the ex~stLng welding
business and necessary wetlands setbacks for new building.
· (Continue on other side)
REASON FOR APPEAL
Continued
STRICT /,~PPLICATION OF THE ORDINAN( E ,t~ouhJ p~oduce practical difficulties or unneces
saW HARDSHIPbecouse applicants' welding business has expanded substantially
since 1979 when a variance was granted by this Board. Upon information
and belief, the property will not yield a reasonable return if used
or sold for any permitted use, especially taking into consideration
the cost of dismantling and removing the existing welding business.
2 qk, e hardship created ;s {/NIOUE cu/d f~ ix~t ,,!:~re<i hv ail p,apeNiec olJlce ia the hnn?ftde
xicu:i~x~tthisproperty ondin thisuse district b¢cqu? the welding business is currently
located on the property by approw~l of this Board; applicants have
spent substantial sums in reliance on this approval by installing
equipment; the service provided by applicants (including services to
town agencies) are necessary; and no other businesses such as
applicants' are located in this vicinity.
3 'l~eVur,nr~,,w~uldoN,er~e the spirlt,fft!~eOidu!ol~cc andWOULD ~xOT CHAN~z 'rife
II'I~*.iTEI< OF File [);~[R1CF becc~use the welding shop is already located on
the property. Applicants merely seek an expansion to accormnodate
an increase in business.
Sr.,~qE OF NEW xrORK
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK
SS
St~phe~n R. Angel
:',~,rr, tc this .... .2. J,.$.~ ......................... day of Aklg~!~t ........................ 19 86
BOARD OF APPEALS, TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
In the Matter oT the'l~eti~en of~ ~'~ :
Joseph & Linda S. Schoenstein an.d
to the Board of Appeals of the Town of Southold :
TO: Mr.
Mr.
Mr.
Ms.
Ms.
&Mrs. Mitchell Pekunka
Joseph Mann
and Mrs. William Norton
Carmels L. Borrelli
Marie Ongione
YOU ARE HEREBY GIVEN NOTICE:
NOTICE
TO
ADJACENT
PROPERTY OW/qER
Mr. W. Schonewald
Mr. Frank Dobek
Mr. and Mrs. John Keeffe
County of Suffolk
1. That~it is the intention of the undersigned to petition the Board of Appeals of the Town of Southold
to request a (l~/arJanc~ (Special Exception) (Special Permit) Other) [circle choice]
).
2. That the property which is the subject of the Petition is located adiacent to your property and is des-
cribed as follows: (No~/) Main Road; Gre~nport; Suffolk County Tm× Mm? Nm.
1000-53-2-12, 13 and 15.1
3. That the property which is the subject of such Petition is located in the following zoning district:
B - L~ght Business
4. That by such Petition, the undersigned will request the following relief:
expand existing welding business.
Permission to
5. That the provisions of the Southold Town Zoning Code applicable to the relief sought by the under-
signedare ~rticles VI & XI Section~ 100-60 and 100-119.2(B)
[ ] Section 280-A, New York Town Law for approval of access over right(s)-of-way.
6. That within five days from the date hereof, a written Petition requesting the relief specified above will
be filed in the Southold Town Clerk's Office at Main Road Southold, New York and you ma), then and there
examine the same during regular office hours. (516) ?~5-1809.
7. That before the relief sought may be granted, a public hearing must be held on the matter by the
Board of Appeals; that a notice of such hearing must be published at least five days prior to the date of such
hearing in the Suffolk Times and in the Long Island Traveler-Mattituck Watchman, newspapers published in the
Town of Southold and designated for the publication of such notices; that you or your representative have the
right to appear and be heard at such hearing.
Petition~ ~egr~Y~' fHo~f~{er'oCw~ed~ S Angel,
Owner's'Names: J_oseph & Linda S.
Post Office Address ~cnoe{%st~6'
108 East Main Street
Riverhead, New York 11901
PROOF OF MAILING OF NOTICF
ATTACH CERTIFIED MAIL RECEIPTS
NAME ADDRESS
P
RECE
..... ~L, Et RECEI RECE REC
.~-b~ REC
_3oh
23=
P 107 576 009
JOseph Mann
Rt
Cusseta, Aiabaca
r 1.67
i! :},L
3 '
6852
STATEOFNEWYORK)
COUNTY OF SUFFOLK)
Elizabeth Ann Stotsky , residing at 616 Dolphin Way, Riverhead, NY
, being duly sworn, deposes and says that on the _9'fat day
of A~l~r ,19 86 , deponent mailed a true copy of the Notice set forth on the re-
verse side hereof, directed to each of the above-named persons at the addresses set opposite their respective
names; that the addresses set opposite the names of said persons are the addresses of said persons as shown on
the current assessment roll of the Town of Southold; that said Notices were mailed at the United States Post Of-
riceat R~verhead; New York
~(registered) mail.
Sworn to before me this 21st
day of AU~ ., 19 86
Notary Public
; that said Notices were mailed to each of said persons by
Elizabeth Ann Stotsky ~-
f~41!lt4~
Oualm~ ~ ~ Ommv
Commm~lon ~ Oe~ 31. lg~
(This side does not have to be completed on form transmitted to adjoining
property owners.)
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
OFFICE OF BUILDING INSPECTOR
· P.O. BOX 728
TOWN HALL
$OUTHOLD, N.Y. 11971
TEL. 765-1802
January 30,1986
Planning Board
Town of Southold
Main Road
Southold, N.Y.
11971
Subject:
North Fork Welding--Site plan
dated 11/4/85
Gentlemen:
This site plan does not qualify for certification for the
following reasons:
1.)
Premises is zoned 'B' Light Business. The present use
is not permitted for this zone but was approved under
a use variance granted under Appeal #2541, dated 5/3/79
for limited use. Th~ orooos~d ~ildinq expands on this
,~ ~herefore ~ppli~ant must return to the Board of
Appeals.
2.)
A zoning violation exists in that the garage on the east-
erly side of premeise was converted to an antique shop
with out a building permit or certificate of occupancy,
or any prior approvals from any other department within
the Town of Southold.
3.)
The Southold Town Conservation Advisory Council, by letter
dated January 28,1986, states that premises is adjacent to
a wetlands area. The proposed new building is located
within the required 75'-0" set back from wetlends'. A Var-
iance will be required under Art XI Sec 100-119.2B.
Site plan development should include the antique shop and comply
with regulations Art VI Sec.100-62 for Shopping Centers. This
applies when there are buildings that contain a separate busi-
Ress.
Edward Hindermann
EH:dsm Building Inspector
xc: Zoning Board of Appeals
L TOWN OF ~OU"~OLD
8ou~hold, N.y. 11971
(516) 76~-1938
January 29, 1986
Mr. Merlon Wiggin
President
Peconic Associates,
P.O. Box 672
Greenport, NY 11944
Inc.
Re: Site Plan for
North Fork Welding
Dear Mr. Wiggin:
Please let this Confirm the action taken by the Southo
Town Planning BOard, MOnday, January 27, 1986. id
the Site Plan for North Fork Welding for COnstruction of
. R~SOLVED. that the Southold Town Planning Board fOrward
;u~gT~m~Pf~c~ Main Road, Green-o.
amended January 22, 1986. ~. ~Urvey dated as
· rlcati~- _ P rt to the
The BOard
Department of a~so requests COrrespondence from the
drain lOCated Transportation regarding the Use of th~tare
Within the State right_of_way for drainage.
If you have any questions,
COntact Our office. please don't hesitate to
/
Building Department
Very truly yours,
BENNETT ORLOWsKI, JR., C~AiP~AN
SOUTHOLD TOWN PLANNING BOARD
By Diane M. Schultze, Secretary
FOI~M ~0. S
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
BUILDING DEPARTMENT
TOWN CLERK'S OFFICE
SOUTHOLD, N. Y.
ORDER TO REMEDY VIOLATION
(owner or~outhorized agent of o~w,.~n~er)
PLEASE TAKE NOTICE there exists a violation of:
Zoning Ordinance
Other Applicable Laws, Ordinances'or Regulations ............................................
at premises hereinoft_er described in t~ot ..~..~'~.../~..~.~.~i....~.',,,~,.fcr ~vf~-~......~...-~
(~.~C~Y'O~'~. ~-~c~,.~¢.~ ,,'~.~7~f.,'~'~'..~ (state character of violation)
~z...=?~a~..~..~.~.~..~.~F~.~.~..~.~.~:*~.~.~..~-.- ~...~.. */
~ ~-c ~ c ~.~. . ~ ~z~.. ~ ~ ~ ~ .~. . /.-. . .~ ~. . ~ ~. . ; ~ ~ ~ ~` C~ :~ ~ .~. / c~. ~. . ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~. ?. ~ ~ c ~ ....................
in vio,ation of ~.~...~ ...... i.~...~.a~...--~..V../..¢ ./..~..0.....-..4~ ~ .~.,~
(State section or paragraph of app cab e law, ordinance'or regulation) ..........
YOU ARE THEREFORE DIRECTED AND ORDERED to comply with the law and to remedy the '
conditions above mentioned forthwith on or before the ...... ..~..~'.../~... Z ~ ./.~.....~.. '
day of ...................................................... , 19 ........
The premises to which this ORDER TO REMEDY VIOLATION refers are situated at
~..x'""~C-2....~./J~(..~f2~.~..?.~'~/~C"~Z'r------~/.~.Y...~ounty of Suffolk, New York.
Failure to remedy the conditions aforesaid and to comply with the applicable provisions of Iow
may constitute an offense punishable by fine or imprisonment or both.
....... ::~ -
Building Inspector
The N.Y.S. Environmental QUality Rev ew Act requires sub-
mission of thisa~[orm, and an environmental~eview will be
made by this b~d before any action s tarn.
_SHORT ENVLRON~EN?.LL ASSESSMENT FC}LM
INST~TZC~S~
(a) In ord~r to ·newer the questions in this short gAF is is assumed that the
preparer will use currently ay·liable lnfor~.ation concerning the project ·nd the
!Lkely impacts of the action. It is not expected that additional studiee, research
or other investigations will be undertaken.
(b) If any question has been answered Yes the project may be significant and ·
ccmp!eted Envirommental Assessment Form is necessary.
(c) If all questions have been answered No it is likely that this project is
nc% significant.
(d) Environmental Assesement
1. Will project result in a large physical cbmnge
to the project site or physically alter more
tha~ l0 acree of land7 · , · · . . . .
2. Will there be a major change to any unique or
unusual land for~n found on the site? · ·
3. Will project alter or have a large effect on
an existing body of water? . , , , . , ,
Will project have a potentially large lmpac~ on
~roundwater quality? . , . , . . . , . .
Wi-Il project significantly effect drainage
on adjacent sites? , , , , , , · .
6. Will project affect any threatened or endangered
plant or animal species? . . . . . . . .
7. Will project result in a major adverse effect on
air quality? , , , , , , , , ·
Will project have a mmJor effect on visual char-
acter of the community or scenic views or vistas
known to be important to the commun£ty? . . .
Will project adversely im. pact any site or strict-
ure of historic, pre-historic, or paleontological
importance or any site designated as a critical
envirom~en~al area by a local egoncy? . . .
Yes ~ No
Yes ~ No
Yee .,~>~.. ~o
. Yes ~ No
..... Yes _~ No
Yes ~ No
~ Yes % No
Yes __~ No
10. W41l project have a major effect on exieting or
future recreational opportunitiea9 * * * Yes ~No
11.
Will project result in major traffic problems or
cause a major effect to existing transportation
systems? . , o . o · . . , , ,
12.
Will project regularly cause objectionable odors,
noise, glare, vibration, or electrical dieturb-
ante as a result of the project's operation? .
Will project have any impact on public health or
sa£et¥? · ° , , , , · , , ,
Yes ~, NO
Yes ~ No
Yes X Mo
1S. Will project Affec: the existing community by
directly causing a ~rowth in permanent popu/a-
t!on of more t~an 5 percent Over a one-year
period or have a major negative effect on
character Of the com.~unity Cr neighborhood?. , Yes
15. l~ there publ~/O~ve~ co~ernlng the project? Yes ~ No
PREP~ER'3
August 21, 1986
(Today's Date)
To: Southold Town Board of Appeals
Main Road
Southold, NY 11971
Re:
Appeal Application of North Fork Welding, Linda S. & Joseph
Location of Property: (No~)Main Road, Greenport~UNY=LL°~=~L~
Dear Sirs:
In reference to the New York State Tidal Wetlands Land-Use
Regulations, 6 NYCRR, Part 661, and Article 25 of the New York
State Environmental Conservation Law, please be advised that the
subject property iQ the within appeal application:
(please check one box)
[ ] May be located within 300 feet of tidal wetiands;
however, constructed along the water-lying edge
of this property is a bulkhead in very good
condition and at least 100 feet in length.*
[ ] May b~ 'located within 300 feet of tidal wetlands;
however, constructed along the water-lying edge
of this property is a bulkhead in need of (minor)
(major) repairs, and approximately feet in
length.
[ ]
May be located within 300 feet of tidal wetlands;
however, constructed along the water-lying edge
of this property is a bulkhead less than 100 feet
in length.
May be located within 300 feet of tidal wetlands;
.and there is no bulkhead or concrete wall existing
on the premises.
Is not located within 300 feet of tidal wetlands
to the best of my knowledge.*
[Starred items'(*) indicate your property does
not appear to fall within the jurisdiction of the N.Y.S. D.E.C.]
Sin~ yours,
NOTE: If proposed project falls Oi .t~}in D.E.C. jurisdiction,
approval must be received an.d submitted to our office before
your application can be scheduled for a public hearing.
· ::.~.~.:.':'.' ~'..-.~..- . . ~. -. . :...
P
,AN
£'t-OPF_k' ,~ ,' OF
~,.,L/~ Nc; , a./h,
?
L
407,
NOP._-rk4
LOT t~ LOT 1~,..3 LOT I~'P~ LOT IESI
hJ OT [.. t
~ M A I N STATE
ROAD '
FOR
FO2K WELDING,
NC.
IllIllll IIIll,lJlJ',..- ......
,It
KEY MAP
TYPICAL PAVEMENT SECTION
SECTION A-A" OF 5'WALE
TYPICAL DRIVEWAY SECTION
PECONIC ASSOCIATES Inc. NORTH FORK WELDING
consultants , N.'Y,
O~l lea~lq llhy P,O. Bex 672 Gr~o~, N.Y. 11944
ils - 477-~0