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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2013 J U L 1 2013 TO: Elizabeth Neville, Town Clerk $oui5old Tawn Clerk FROM: Board of Assessment Review RE: REPORT -BOARD OF ASSESSMENT REVIEW -TAX YEAR 2013-14 DATE: July 1, 2013 Attached herewith please find for public filing in your office, complete file covering the public hearing(s) of the Board of Assessment Review, together with changes ordered by this Board to the assessment roll, Assessors' acknowledgement, etc. The duties of the Board of Assessment Review for the grievance period covering the 2013/14 assessment roll are completed. Chairman M'e bcr M n e Member ~ r~. ~ _r.~ Member Form BAR-4 RECEIVED TO: Town Assessor - 8 X13 FROM: Board of Assessment Review Southold Town Clerk RE: ORDER FOR CHANGE IN TENTATIVE ASSESSMENT ROLL DATE: 7/8/2013 The Board of Assessment Review for the Town of Southold, has duly met to hear Complaints or grievances on the tentative town assessment roll for the tax year 2013/14 as prescribed bylaw. The Board, having duly convened, has considered each and every complaint or grievance on the assessments for the tax year indicated, as filed with this Board, as prescribed by law. A majority of the Board has determined that all the changes indicated on the attached page(s) will be made on the assessment roll by the Assessor. Total number of complaints submitted by Assessor 1450 Total number of complaints received on Grievance Day 6 Total number of signed stipulations 48 Total number of correction of errors 62 Total number of complaints reviewed by the Board 1566 Total number of reductions in assessment 19 Total number of withdrawals 2 Total number of dismissals 0 Total number of grievances without a change 1545 NOW, THEREFORE, the Board of Assessment Review hereby orders the Board of Assessors to make all changes in assessments as determined by the Board of Assessment Review on the assessment roll of the Town of Southold, for the tax year 2013/14, in conformance with this order. STATE OF NEW YORK } COUNTY OF SUFFOLK } TOWN OF SOUTHOLD } The undersigned, being duly sworn do severally depose and say that deponents are members of the Board of Assessment Review; that deponents have read the foregoing and know the contents thereof; and the matters set forth are true to the best of the deponent's knowledge. Sworn before me this ~'~7day of June, ~2C113 . ~ ' ~~1~ z~~ Note Pu New York Notary Public No. o ~ U87f3605 Member puellfled in Suffolk Coun - ` .Comm' bn Expires Dec. 8, r Chairman Member ~~~s Member Member RPTSA - 200 - 4/72 BAR-2 -Page 3 of 3 o~~OF SOUj~o Southold Town Hall, 53095 Route 25 Robert I. Scott, Jr., Chairman ~ l0 P.O. Box 1179 Darline J. Duffy, Assessor # Southold, NY I ] 971-0959 Kevin W. Webster, Assessor G Q Fax: (631) 765-1356 ~ ~ Telephone: (631) 765-1937 ~~y00UNi'1 N~ BOARD OF ASSESSORS RECEIVED TOWN OF SOUTHOLD ~Q 20 BOARD OF ASSESSMENT REVIEW Southold Town Clerl~ TOWN OF SOUTHOLD 53095 MAIN ROAD PO BOX 1179 SOUTHOLD NY 11971 TRANSCRIPT OF HEARINGS GRIEVANCE DAY MAY 21, 2013 Chairman Gerard Schultheis declared the meeting in session at 9:00 a.m. Present were: Board of Assessment Review: Gerard Schultheis, Chairman; Jonathan Wiggins, Member; Phyllis Atkinson, Member; Cara Wells, Member; Nicholas Planamento, Member. Board of Assessors: Robert Scott, Jr, Chairman; Darline Duffy; Kevin Webster Grievance Day Tuesday May 21, 2013 Gerard Schultheis: Good Morning it's May 215` and I'd like to call to order this meeting of the Board of Assessment Review for the Town of Southold. First thing I'd like to do is have the Assessors sworn in. Nick Planamento: Good Morning Assessors, Nick Planamento here, I'd like to ask you each to stand up and to state your name and to swear that the presentation that you'll make is the most accurate to your ability. Robert Scott: Robert I Scott Jr., I so swear. Kevin Webster: Kevin W Webster, I so swear. Darline Duffy: Darline J Duffy, I so swear. Nick Planamento: Thank you Hearing #1 Gerard Schultheis: Okay, now first Grievance we have here is for Marjorie Dunn and you're representing Marjorie? Richard Monaghan: Yes, I am. Gerard Schultheis: Okay I have one question for the Assessors before we start. Can I have the RAR? Bob Scott: 1.18 Jonathan Wiggins: 1.18? Thank you Gerard Schultheis: Okay Nick we need to swear in this gentleman. Nick Planamento: Good morning, if you would please stand and announce your name. Richard Monaghan: Richard F Monaghan Nick Planamento: Thank you Mr. Monaghan and do you swear that the information that you are going to present before us is the most accurate to your ability? Richard Monaghan: It is. Nick Planamento: Thank you Gerard Schultheis: Richard you're representing Marjorie Dunn? Richard Monaghan: I am Gerard Schultheis: Okay Cara Wells: Tax Map Number? Jonathan Wiggins: 145.-2-12 (wrong tax map number) Gerard Schultheis: Okay we have the application here. And included with the application is a copy of a appraisal. As of May 8~' 2013. And the appraisal indicates that the value of the house is $525,000. Do you have anything to say while we look at the appraisal? Richard Monaghan: Sure, I think the appraisal reflects several different factors which indicates the mazketability of the house is somewhat limited. For one it's a very small, it's a smaller than normal plot. 100 x 100 There is no room to even put in a swimming pool. The house is what they call and upside down house. Meaning the kitchen is on the second floor. The bedrooms are on the first floor. So I think the appraisal reflects those facts. And the case that the appraisal comes in at 525,000. Couple that with the indication that the prices in Mattituck through 2012 has an anomaly against what's happening in Southold is declining 2"d and 3`d quarter 2012 the prices in Mattituck, the median sale price is declining. So I think that's indicated in the appraisal, shows that the prices in Mattituck are an anomaly against the Town of Southold. Generally what I've seen in Mattituck is prices declining, where as in Cutchogue and Southold and other towns in the Town of Southold the prices rise a little bit, not much, the prices only probably are up 4 or 5%. There is a lot of sales activity, sales activity indicates that I think that buyers think that they have a different opportunity out here. Prices come to reflect that. Cara Wells: Can I ask a question? The lot next to the west says Town of Southold, you describing a 100 x 100 acres that has a park next to it? What is there? Richard Monaghan: It's a, there's a vacant lot next to it. Right behind it there's several different lots. Nick Planamento: If I may interrupt. I'm sorry Gerry I think we have some confusion regarding the actual tax map number. The number that was announced is different from the number that's on the appraisal. Cara Wells: Okay Nick Planamento: Phyllis indicates from the appraisal it's tax map number 123.-5-11. Cara Wells: 123.-5-11 we're certainly on the wrong spot. 2 Nick Planamento: And just to understand is this part of Camp Mineola? Richazd Monaghan: Yes. Which maybe another factor because Camp Mineola was pretty badly damaged. Jonathan Wiggins: So this is a waterfront house? Richazd Monaghan: No, it's not waterfront. Gerard Schultheis: Is there any damage in this house itself? Richazd Monaghan: Well not really, no real damage. The water came up the 5 foot retaining wall that they built specifically with the idea, because based on Irene when the water came up, the same place. I think the water crested at 4'/z feet. Slightly below the retaining wall. The house is slightly raised about 5 feet. Gerard Schultheis: The house was recently raised? Richard Monaghan: No. It was built that way. Gerard Schultheis: Okay What about the retaining wall? Richard Monaghan: The retaining wall was built next to the house. They put in a retaining wall. Caza Wells: And the house was built when? Richard Monaghan: About 4 or 5 years ago. But Irene kind of showed them that they had done the right thing. Gerard Schultheis: Okay. Phyllis do you have any questions on the appraisa]? Jonathan Wiggins: I'm looking here at the property tax cazd 145.-2-12. That's Laura ICrom. Is that what we're doing? Richard Monaghan: No, you're doing Marjorie Dunn. Gerard Schultheis: That's the listing. Jonathan Wiggins: Okay Richard Monaghan: I think another distinction of the value with this house, and I think the appraisal was pretty accurate, is the fact that the house diagonally across the street from this particular property, was bought for $449,000. It's on your tax roll, the tentative tax roll, for 550,000. The house has been completely renovated with an in-ground pool, sprinkler system, sod. Added I think two bedrooms. Two or three bedrooms in the house 3 including whatever they did to the inside of the house. And that's the indicated value on the tentative roll. Jonathan Wiggins: This is the house right across the street? Richard Monaghan: Right across the street. Caza Wells: But that's the tentative roll without improvements. Richazd Monaghan: That's the tentative roll, that's right. The house was purchased for 449,000. Cara Wells: Okay, so wasn't it a wreck? If I remember... it was the Howe] house? Homel? Okay Richard Monaghan: But it wasn't a wreck. At all. But it was completely renovated. You're showing it at 550. Gerard Schultheis: Kevin do you have anything, any comments you'd like to make? Kevin Webster: I do, yes. One is that the value of 7400 is what the equalized value is $627,000. This house is 450 feet from the bay. So 450 foot walk down to the bay. I've been in this house when it was constructed, as he said it was built only 4 years ago. So one of the factors we can look at is the replacement cost or cost approach to this home. If you look at the sppraisal, kee~ in mind the value is 627 equalized value. This appraisal, which was done as of May 8` of 2013. Our valuation date is July 1 s` 2012. So it's not a timely appraisal. It was done for tax purposes, for this purpose actually, if you look through it says done for tax purposes, which I assume is this. Their value if we except 90% of the things listed here is $615,700. So that difference in itself is 1.8%. And that's one of the approaches we can use for assessing is the cost approach if you were to replace a brand new house. So 1.8% to me shows that it definitely does not, it is a fair assessment where it is. This property was actually just reduced in small claims for the 11/12 yeaz and settled by the representative at the time which was not Mr. Monaghan. And if you look at the site value here, this appraisal/appraiser has down $85,000 for the value of just the site for a % acre within 450 foot walk of the bay. I'd buy that in a second for $85,000. I think that's grossly low for the estimated value of a vacant lot within 450 feet of the bay. So even if you tack on $10,000 and sold for $95,000 again I would take in an hour. You're up to 625 and the value is 627, so all those facts listed I believe that the value is more then fair. There aze some errors on this appraisal as well and I can go into them in detail if you'd like. One if you look at comp #1 the bathrooms are 2 %z baths and the subject has 3. And the appraiser has made a negative 5000 adjustment. Well when there is a difference in the positive side everybody can confirm and I'll address to Phyllis as well, you would make a positive adjustment there you would not make a negative adjustment. The adjustment that's made for modern average kitchen equipment is a negative $10,000 adjustment. The subject is a brand new house. The house on Marlene Lane is 11 years old, I've been to and inside both of those homes, and again very subjective taking off 4 $10,000 for kitchen equipment. I doubt Ms or Mrs. Fleming, the appraiser has been inside 620 Marlene lane. So I do not agree with that adjustment. $35 a square foot adjustment, I believe is a bit low. I usually see $50 a square foot for that for these kind of size homes. This location on Faye Court compared to Marlene Lane. Mazlene Lane, if you been down Mazlene or Sigsbee, it's an up and down, north south thoroughfare. People are flying up and down there, there going way more then what you can go in this area. And I know Mr. Monaghan lives down there he knows on Camp Mineola people are going slow going down there. Maybe 15 or 20 mph. Up and down Marlene Lane they're flying there going 40 mph or more, 45. Jonathan Wiggins: I think the speed limit is 30. Kevin Webster: What's that? Jonathan Wiggins: Speed limit is 30. Kevin Webster: The speed limit is 3Q that's correct. Cara Wells: But nobody does 30. Kevin Webster: Thank you. Jonathan Wiggins: Well Kevin Webster: So my point is the location is of Bay Court is far superior to Mazlene Lane. And even with those things, that adjusts to 591, again we're talking about 627, if you appraise that home, what I call properly, you going to come in at about $648,000 dollars, which is the amount I adjusted it to. I just did a quick appraisal on this home as well so, I'll stop there with those two points that I made or actually about 20 points, but addressing those properties. I don't think that the property is over assessed at all. And I think that for brand new house that's 2500 square feet, 3 full bathrooms. Within a 450 foot walk of the bay. 2 fireplaces, 2 car garage, central air. Quiet location. I don't feel the assessment of 7400 is out of line. And I think the appraisal is fraught with errors. Richard Monaghan: Excuse me. I don't think the cost approach is the proper approach for this particular piece of property. As far as the traffic on the road. One of the problems that Camp Mineola has been experiencing is because of Sandy there's been a tremendous amount of traffic on the road now. From the point of view of a potential buyer it would be an inhibitor. As I said, it's an upside down house. Most people do not like a kitchen being on the second floor. Doesn't have room for a pool. The house, Kevin keeps on saying that it's a brand new, newly constructed house, it's 4 yeazs old. It's not new. As far as the cost approach... Jonathan Wiggins: How old did you say the house was? Cara Wells: 4 to 5 years. 5 Jonathan Wiggins: 4 to 5 years. Richard Monaghan: 4 to 5 years. She said she didn't use the cost approach, what she did was the market value. She's an experienced broker with Douglas Elliman. I think she knows the market. She's described the value at 525,000 based on, one, the activity in the region activity in Mattituck itself. The prices were declining not going up. The other part of Town of Southold was. I don't agree with Kevin on several of his points. The traffic issue. There's only one way in Camp Mineola and one way out and it's right past this house. So they get all the traffic I live on Camp Mineola and I see the traffic I know what it's like. The comparison to Marlene Lane it's a much longer run from the Route 25 down through Peconic Bay Blvd. So I mean maybe the traffic does travel faster then the existing speed limit. That might be a detriment too. Jonathan Wiggins: Kevin is this like a normal road that it's on? Cara Wells: Doesn't this come in through the marina? Kevin Webster: It's past the entrance to Strong's. It's not through. You go straight instead of making the right to Strong's you go straight. Richard Monaghan: There's no outlet. Jonathan Wiggins: Is there anything going on with the road? That would be less then standard? As compared to Marlene Dr. Which is a regular width road. Richard Monaghan: It's not a regular width road. I had this conversation with the town engineer. It's a private road. It's a privately maintained road. Not in good condition. It was patched, as a matter of fact, yesterday. The town will not... We couldn't dedicate the road to the town, because they wanted 50 feet, plus curve. And that's not going to happen. 1800 hundred feet from Kraus, up to the, at least the bay. It's a private road. Kevin Webster: It's a private location, that's a plus. I don't believe that's a negative. Cara Wells: And can I just say something. Richard Monaghan: It is a negative from the point of view if nobody maintains the road. Cara Wells: If you're trying to sell this property? If you're trying to sell this property? Richard Monaghan: They are trying to sell this property. Cara Wells: You now need the Camp Mineola Association bylaws and proof that the road will be maintained. To finance property. If you have cash it's not an issue. Richard Monaghan: That's in the bylaws? 6 Cara Wells: That is a new requirement. Richard Monaghan: From where? Cara Wells: From the state. It's real estate law. Richard Monaghan: But there is... Cara Wells: No, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, it's the banking industry. Richazd Monaghan: The association has jurisdiction over those homes in Camp Mineola. Cara Wells: All I'm saying is if you're borrowing money, you have to have your private association, your private road, they need the bylaws and they need to know who's financing it. That's all I'm saying. Richard Monaghan: So you're not saying they have to maintain the road? Caza Wells: No they don't have to maintain the road, but that's another expense involved in this property. Richazd Monaghan: That's what I'm saying, you can't dedicate the road to the town cause they want 50 feet and currently it's only 25 feet. We tried to, according to town engineer we tried to explore. Caza Wells: You don't want a public road. It's full of the neighborhood. It's full of children. You're road actually keeps... Richard Monaghan: No actually you're wrong, it's not full of children. There are basically no children except for 2. The Rigleys, they have 2 children. They're the only children on the road. There are no other children on the road. Cara Wells: How sad. Okay Jonathan Wiggins: The fact that it is a private road, what would make property more difficult to sell? Cara Wells: No Richazd Monaghan: Although it makes it more difficult to sell if it's not maintained well. And it's subject to the weather. Nick Planamerto: No it would make it more valuable. Cara Wells: It makes it more valuable. 7 Richard Monaghan: Weather is devastating, plus the fact that we have the equipment coming in over the past year and a half. Since Irene. It's just making the road decimated. That's why we tried to call the town to get them to take over the road. Like the engineer said he's had 4 conversations and it's 50 feet the town requires 50 feet. But getting back to the value of the house is a 4 year old house, but as I said it has some very intimating factors. You can't put pool. You can't, it's an upside down house. People don't like that. If you ask the average person going into a house, the kitchen is on the second floor, they don't like that. That inhibits mazket value. If you look at the trend in Mattituck, with respect to sale prices is, the median sale price is going down. The rest of the Town of Southold is going up. I think the appraisal is fair. From the point of view of the seller, in this market. Remember this market, the activity has gone up because people perceive that they can get a deal in Southold. That's what they think, because of the Irene and Sandy situation. They think that they are going to make a very good deal. Sales activity is way up. There's no question about that. The question is what are buyers getting. Most buyers are not getting their asking price. And in this particular case the assessors office says worth 657,000. Gerazd Schultheis: I have a question for you. Was the appraisal done by a licensed appraiser? Richazd Monaghan: Yes. And she's also a broker with Douglas and Elliman. Cara Wells: And she's also a licensed appraiser? Gerard Schultheis: Is the license number indicated on the appraisal? Okay. Nick Planamento: Mr. Monaghan or Kevin I'm now understanding the location. I was confused I thought you were on the east side of what I call Camp Mineola Rd. You're obviously on the west side. I figured this out in conversation. There aze 2 homes that sold recently. One is sited in the appraisal. The second home which is right at the entrance to Camp Mineola also sold. Are you familiar with that transaction? Richard Monaghan: I am Nick Planamento: How are your thoughts? That house I believe also to your point this one may not have room for a pool. I don't know if anyone obtained variance or not. Richard Monaghan: In that particular home. Nick Planamento: I don't recall the name of the seller. It was a Cape Cod home. Richard Monaghan: Brown is the current owner. They bought that house at 449,000 in January of 2012. They completely renovated the house. They put in an in-ground swimming pool with a metal cover. And they completely renovated the inside. 8 Nick Planamento: But that house was built about 1960. Richazd Monaghan: That house was built azound 1960, right, but it's been completely renovated. Inside and out. Nick Planamento: And what would you consider the value of that home? Richard Monaghan: You value it at 550,000. Nick Planamento: I don't have the property card so I can't speak to that. How would you think that a 1960's home that's renovated is worth more then a home that's 4 yeazs old. Richard Monaghan: Because of the renovation. They have an in-ground swimming pool. The put in a lawn and a sprinkler system. Nick Planamento: So you're saying the subject property that your. Richazd Monaghan: The original home had 3 bedrooms on the second floor. Nick Planamento: And an unfinished attic. Richard Monaghan: And an unfinished attic. They completed the attic. Nick Planamento: But that house is probably 12 to 1400 square feet also. It was one floor. Richard Monaghan: But now it's two floors. Caza Wells: With an attic. Richard Monaghan: With two additional bedrooms. Cara Wells: Yes, but if they did this much work it must be. There must be a building permit and it must be on the tax card. It's going to be adjusted soon if it hasn't been adjusted now. Correct? Kevin Webster: If there is a building permit taken out we will review it. Cara Wells: You don't have the property tax card with you? Nick Planamento: And without... And your saying I've not seen the property card I'm just thinking as a neighbor living in a community, that's a property that I'm familiar with. How does that house stand against the subject property? Kevin Webster: I don't know. Nick Planamento: You don't know. 9 Kevin Webster: I don't know. I don't know the tax map number or the address. I can try to value.. I don't know what we're doing with that? If you want to value that home or are we talking about Mr. Dunn's house. Nick Planamento: Well the subject property in my minds eye, although the applicant is indicating it's on a new house, it's relatively new and I' d still classify it as a new house. It's a substantial home and thinking about value in Camp Mineola and the prestige with that address. It just seems to me when you compare older homes that sell for perhaps lesser values. And your admitting or addressing the household in the low to mid 4's prior to renovation. You have a new house. I can't imagine anyone building a quality home for under $200 a square foot. And just as a neighbor here the numbers seem to add up. The appraisal from what I viewed, the land value to Kevin's point, our assessor, is extremely low. I can't think of anyone offering a single lot that has a build ability in the Town of Southold any less then 100, $150,000. And that would be an inferior lot without private deeded beach. And certainly not proximity. So when I think about the neighboring house that sold, that I was aware that they did renovate, it's an old house that's been renovated. Which is far inferior, in my opinion to newly constructed home. And granted there was an existing house that was demolished, but the subject property is, in all practical purposes... There was a house, according to your property card, there was a house standing on the Dunn property prior to the demolition. Richard Monaghan: That was the Dunn house. Nick Planamento: Right. So there was a house there. Richard Monaghan: Well I don't think it was demolished? Nick Planamento: Well I don't know, it said demolition on the property card. So if I'm incorrect. I'm just looking at what's made available to me. But it would seem that the value's your dealing with a new construction which is very different then a renovation. Richard Monaghan: Your right when you say that it was between a demolition and a renovation. The fact still remains, what are people going to pay for a house that's 5 bedrooms and in-ground pool. The house was sold for $449,000. You have it on your tax roll as 550,000 now. So the point is, if that's the value, the Dunn house, which is 4 years, has I think 1 less bedroom. Granted it has, but it's an upside down house. Which is indicated that the market value is and inhibiting factor for anybody selling that house. People don't like, a second floor kitchen. It's not in their psyche when they go to buy a house. Nick Planamento: I can't really comment on that. I don't know the design, I don't know the reason. But again it strikes me again... Richard Monaghan: Well Kevin says he's been in the house. Kevin am I speaking correctly? Is the kitchen upstairs? 10 Nick Planamento: Does that take advantage of the site? Does the kitchen have a bay view perhaps? Richazd Monaghan: I think that was the idea but that didn't happen. They actually look out on a vacant lot. Gerard Schultheis: Okay anybody else have any questions? Jonathan Wiggins: Just one question for Mr. Webster. In general are the properties valued in Mattituck going down as apposed to the rest of Southold? Kevin Webster: No. Richard Monaghan: Based on what, Kevin? Kevin Webster: Based on my opinion. Richard Monaghan: Based on your opinion. But Town & Country has a whole thing says the 2"a and 3`d quarter which basically says, sales activity from the median price in Mattituck, It says in both instances to the quazterly and 2"d quarterly and half year report and 3`d quarterly report says the prices declined in Mattituck. Cara Wells: Just remember it's just a report. We don't... Richard Monaghan: No it's an analysis of the sales. I think Town & Country does a pretty accurate assessment of market. They basically said for the 2"d quarter and for the 3`d quarter in Mattituck which is probably a valuation. Median sales prices in Mattituck has gone down. As opposed to Cutchogue, Peconic, Southold they were going up. Frankly I don't understand that. But and I don't know what the psychological impact of being in Mattituck as opposed to Cutchogue. At least in a buyers mind that means something. That's why prices have gone down. Phyllis Atkinson: Excuse me is that just what Town & Country has sold? And that's how they came up with... Richard Monaghan: No it's a complete analysis of all sales. I will be happy to fiunish you with the data. Cara Wells: No that's alright. Gerard Schultheis: Any other questions? Or comments? Kevin Webster: Well I have an appraisal report prepared using two of the three comparables. That this appraiser used. With what I feel are the correct adjustments. 11 Showing the value of this home is a, the assessment is fair. I will be happy to furnish a copy to you and Mr Monaghan. Gerard Schultheis: If you could give us a copy of that Kevin. We could use that in our deliberations. Kevin Webster: I just wanted to point out one other thing on this appraisal. With compazables one and two which I feel their adjusted values aze incorrect. #1 adjusted to 591. #2 adjusted to 541 again. I adjusted those values to 648 and 603. So we have a value adjusted to 541 and 541 and you pick 525. I don't believe this is a fair appraisal of the property. And the cost approach is 615 and you're what I call reaching down to 525. Again with the information that I pointed out about the errors on the appraisal. Gerard Schultheis: Okay well thank you for your time. We will basically review the material and render and decision. Richard Monaghan: Okay thank you appreciate it. Thank you for your time. Hearing #2 Gerard Schultheis: Good morning. Are you Laurie Krom? Laurie Krom: Yes I am. Gerard Schultheis: Could you stand up while we swear you in? Nick Planamento: Good Morning Ms. Krom. If you would mind stating your name and then affirming the information that you are providing is most accurate to your abilities. Laurie Krom: Laurie Krom and yes it is. Gerard Schultheis: Okay we have a (inaudible) abstaining. Phyllis Atkinson: I am abstaining from this one. Gerard Schultheis: And we have an appraisal for the house that was done for the NY Community Bank. As of Oct 26`h 2012. And that was done by Deborah Wilson, which I believe did the Cara Wells: Gerry could we have a tax map number? Gerard Schultheis: 145.-2-12 It just has the one appraisal? Laurie Krcm: Yes. 12 Gerard Schultheis: The house is assessed at $6000 total. Which would show off a price of what? Kevin Webster: 508,000. Gerard Schultheis: Okay and the appraisal indicates that it's worth 405,000. Laurie Krom: Correct Gerard Schultheis: Okay any comments you'd like to make? Laurie Krom: Well I know Mr. Webster came out and visited the house that he feels that it's fair, but the house was renovated back in 1985. Since then there has been no major upkeep of renovation to the house. Where as our neighbor actually on both sides of us have fully renovated their houses. I know Mr. Webster puts a big value on the view. Which it is a nice view. I have to say. There is a vacant lot in front of the house before the water on the bay. And like you said the thing is I don't think it's right because it does need work. And I admit that. It does need to be renovated. It's needs to be brought up to date. Gerard Schultheis: Okay what in your estimation are the deficiencies in the house? Laurie Krom: Kitchen needs work. Really needs to be painted. A lot of stuff needs to be thrown away. There's just too much stuff. That's really the major thing is the kitchen. Gerard Schultheis: Okay anybody have any questions? Cara Wells: And you have an open view to the water to the bay? Laurie Krom: Yes Cara Wells: Any use of the waterfront? Laurie Krom: Yes. Nick Planamento: Just out of curiosity, your lot is #12 on Peconic Bay Blvd. You said there is a vacant lot between you and the bay? Is that lot #19? Laurie Krom: I believe so. Nick Planamento: And is that also owned by you or Laurie Krom: My mother Nick Planamento: It's owned by your mother. And your mother lives in the house with you? 13 Laurie Krom: Yes. Jonathan Wiggins: So am I to understand that you own the house lot #12? And #19 is a vacant lot owned by your family also? Laurie Krom: Yes. Jonathan Wiggins: And that is waterfront on the Peconic bay? Laurie Krom: Yes. Jonathan Wiggins: No house on that property? Laurie Krom: Not right now. No. I believe it is a buildable lot. But as of right now we haven't done that. Gerard Schultheis: Kevin do you have any comments? Kevin Webster: I did visit the property. Myself and Bob Scott. As Laurie said, it has full access right down to the bay. Beautiful spot. Open view. Million dollar view they call it. The appraisal makes no adjustment for these other properties which don't have a view. Wendy Dr does not have a view. Wendy Dr is north of Peconic Bay Blvd and does not have any view. The appraiser is not making any adjustments for a water view there. Laurel Way I believe is down by Laurel Lake. And that house is, I don't have the tax map number, Cara Wells: Is that on the pond? Kevin Webster: I don't know if it's just north of it. There's a house that's just north of the lake. But again it does not have a view of Peconic Bay. And I don't have the tax map number for 6825, I can get it. And see what kind of view it has, but it doesn't it says it has a water view, I don't know about that. I don't believe those are in the same, I know their not. They don't have the same location. They don't have the location that this house does. And the problematic equalized value only $508,000. 1700 square foot, 4 bedroom, 2 bath house. Negative $30,000 condition adjustments for instance #1. It's a 67 year old house. This house is 62 and it's a very subjective negative $30,000 condition adjustment. Again I doubt the appraiser was inside 6825 Peconic Bay Blvd. It's a rounded square footage of 1600. But again I would welcome the opportunity to form an appraisal on this. And see, unless you said they do own lot 19. They have the control over that. Without going through any further I will be happy to put something together. Gerard Schultheis: If you could do that appraisal we'd appreciate having that. Kevin Webster: I will mail a copy to Laurie. One thing I did want to mention about the grievance here is that. When you go to page three part three. That's where you want to 14 put in the value I don't know if you want to amend this? You look at the unequal assessment. Because it's not in excessive. So you want to write in on #3 there on part 3 the value 405,000 and then the new requested assessment 4800. And also on part 5 you did not date this, so you want to date it. Laurie Krom: Okay. Here. Okay. Nick Planamento: Ms. Krom one other thing I just noticed. I'm not familiaz with your property. Other then what I'm looking at right now from the appraisal. It would appear that your house that you're living in is a renovated older structure. Perhaps a barn? Or Carriage house? Laurie Krom: It was a barn. Nick Planamento: The comparables that were used are more traditional homes. Would you agree those are fair comps? Shouldn't you use more appropriate unique homes in that comparable analysis perhaps? When I think of other conversions such as this they are really special valuable properties. Laurie Krom: It was a barn that was partially converted in 1965 to be more a summer home. It had 2 bedrooms. The one bath/shower. And then the kitchen, living room area was just one big room. And the rest of it was just left open. And then in 1985 we actually renovated. We added a living room to avoid some of the garage space. And there's a living room and 2 bedrooms and a full bath upstairs. There is still attic space upstairs also. Gerard Schultheis: Okay does anybody else have anything to address or comments? Kevin Webster: Well there is, I just wanted to mention one thing. That in the appraisal there is a picture of the water view. Gerard Schultheis: Okay well thank you very much for coming. We will review all the material and make our decision in our deliberations. Hearing #3: Gerard Schultheis: Good morning. Could you stand up and we'll swear you in and identify yourself. Vito Mundo: Sure, My name is Vito V Mundo I'm general council for the joint industry, the electrical industry for the educational and cultural trust fund. Nick Planamento: Vito thank you. I'm just going to read this and then if you'd affirm. Good Morning. Do you solemnly swear that the information that you are about to give will be given accurately and truthfully to the best of you knowledge? 15 Vito Mundo: I do Nick Planamento: Thank you Vito. Phyllis Atkinson: Could you spell your last name for me please. Vito Mundo: Sure. M-U-N-D-O. Gerard Schultheis: And Vito you have 2 grievances you're representing here? Vito Mundo: Correct. Gerard Schultheis: On your application you did not indicate an estimated market value of the property. Vito Mundo: I believe that our application initially was a tax exemption, because we are a tax exempt entity. Gerard Schultheis: Okay. Vito Mundo: So I didn't, first of al] I don't know I didn't think that really matters. Gerard Schultheis: So you're applying basically for a tax exemption. Vito Mundo: Correct. Gerard Schultheis: Okay. Nick Planamento: For the record I'm going to state the tax map number. It is my understanding that the applicant seeking relief is representing tax map number 1000-83.- 2-17.1 and 17.3. Gerard Schultheis: That's correct from the applications. Okay so you're basically saying that the real property owned by a corporation or association organized or conducted exclusively for religious, charitable, hospital, educational or moral or mental improvement of men, women or children purposes or for 2 or more such purposes in used exclusively for carrying out there upon 1 or more such purposes either by the owning corporation or association or by another such corporation or association as here and after provided shall be exempt from taxation. Vito Mundo: Correct. Gerard Schultheis: Okay we have an application. The New York State Department of Taxation and Finance. Real Property Tax Exemption. You've filed that application with the state? 16 Vito Mundo: Yes, that's section 420? Gerard Schultheis: Pardon me? Vito Mundo: Is that the application number RP420? Gerard Schultheis: RP420 yes. Okay, so why don't you provide us with some history of what the intended use is. Vito Mundo: Sure. First to address the denial letter from the town Assessors office, dated Mazch 5`h 2013. They bring up 2 issues. First issue is that the actual owners of the property E&C Property Holding II Inc and E&C Property Holdings Inc are not corporations organized or conducted exclusively for education purposes or for 2 or more of the enumerated purposes. The property itself, the corporations that own them are holding companies. We have I brought with me today copies of the certificates of incorporation of both showing that both companies are owned 100% owned 100% shazes by the educational and cultural trust fund of the electrical industry. Which is a tax exempt Erica fund. Which provides educational services. If you like I have copies of the certificates of incorporation I could present to you. Gerard Schultheis: We'd appreciate that. Vito Mundo: And also at the same time... Cara Wells: So these aze assets held by a union Erica fund? Vito Mundo: Not a union. It's an Erica fund. Yes, it's a joint management labor fund. Correct. Here is the certificate of incorporation. For E&C Property Holdings. And here is the certificate of incorporation for the E&C Property Holdings II. You'll notice there is an amendment where we filed for tax exemption, they wanted us to amended it to say specifically that the to hold title to of real property on behalf of an Erica fund which fund shall own 100% of the shares of stock issued by E&C Property Holdings Inc. All income collected shall be turned over to the the Erica fund which owns all the shares of stock. So that's why there's an amendment to filing for our IRS tax exemption. They require that. Gerard Schultheis: Okay so you filed for an iRS tax exemption? Cara Wells: For a SO1C3? Vito Mundo: It's under 501 C2 because the underlying owner of the incorporation is already tax exempt. And I have a copy of the tax exemption letter here from the IRS. One of the underlying holder of the corporation is exempt it's goes under SOC2. Here's the tax exempt letter for the E&C Property Holdings. And here's the tar: exemption letter for Pi~perty Holdings II. Cara Wells: But E&C Holdings is not identified as a non profit organization. 17 Vito Mundo: Well, that's my next document. Here is the approval letter from the IRS before E&C Holdings which goes back to 1975. Gerard Schultheis: Is this the extend of your documentation? Vito Mundo: No your honor. No. See what I also have. What I wanted to show was the activities of the Educational and Cultural trust fund actual owner itself. And first I have to present to you is a copy of the educational cultural fund actual trust document. And I would specifically refer you to Cara Wells: Do you have a mission statement? Vito Mundo: The listed purpose of the trust fund page 2. It spells out the trust is created and shall be administered and operate exclusively for the benefit of and the trust fund shall be distributed by the trustee's exclusively in the aid of educational and cultural charitable philanthropic use Without eliminating the forgoing discretion the trustee's will however endeavor to give preferential consideration to educational and cultural charitable philanthropic uses. And purposes maybe related directly or indirectly to the welfare of the employee's of the electrical industry in the state of New York and their families. But that's the trust document itself. What I'd like to also present is a copy, this is our public plan description. From the treasure chest and you'll see specifically on the first page the purpose is to provide grant scholarships to local sons and daughters. To promote the convenient formal education of participating members and spouses. And it lays out in here the different programs and the different scholarship funds. Programs... Cara Wells: Where's your activity stuff for the center itself? Where's you activity plan? Vito Mundo: For the underlying or the property out here? Cara Wells: The property out here. Vito Mundo: Here's a copy of the weekend. We do weekend programs here for our members education. This is this years program. That Dr. Parker is established and runs. And you will see the programs, different groups that come out each weekend. And I gave you copies of each of them for this weekend so far. It shows that we run programs for the membership of local 3. And this year copies that we are running is People before Profit around the world. Dr. Parker is the developer and he teaches the program. Gerard Schultheis: Now these activities. That's the only thing that occurs on this property? Vito Mundo: Yes. Cara Wells: No one goes swimming? No ona walks the beach? 18 Vito Mundo: Oh I'm sure they do on their free time. In the Evening. During the daytime when they have classes their is class. Cara Wells: Ti112:45 on this one. And they don't resume after that. Vito Mundo: Correct. They come in on Friday evening. There's a program Friday evening. There are classes Saturday morning and Saturday afternoon. And then they leave on Sunday morning. Gerazd Schultheis: And there are no activities during the week? Vito Mundo: No there aren't. Phyllis Atkinson: Is there a fee charged to the participants? Vito Mundo: There is not. I've also brought for you a copy of our annual report for the education cultural fund. The actual owner. And you'll see in the back this is last years report, all the classes that we run. Not at this facility specifically, but to show the underlying entity. Cara Wells: All right fine thank you. Vito Mundo: It's main purpose is to run the educational program. Gerard Schultheis: Now the seminar is there related to membership of the Electrical merchants. Vito Mundo: Yes, it says the only ones that attend are members of Local 3. Different groups each weekend. Gerard Schultheis: Okay I'm just looking at some of the titles of these seminars. Vito Mundo: These are, they will all be the same this year. Ezch year because we only run small groups each weekend, so each year it's the same title programs running Saturday for different groups. Each year we have Dr Poshe develop a new program that deals with the whole individual related to the industry in some way. Cara Wells: And what background information do you have on Dr Poshe? Vito Mundo: Poshe? He's a I don't have his resume, I can get it for you. Cara Wells: Thank you would you? Vito Mundo: Yes. He was a professor. Li~~ea in Newschool. He has a PHD. He came on boazd as full time about a year ago. 19 Caza Wells: Okay could we see his CV please? Vito Mundo: Absolutely. And do I just send it in to? Gerard Schultheis: Attention of the Assessors office and we will get it. Okay now I'm having a little difficulty here. I see one of the seminars is Saint George Association motorcycle club. Vito Mundo: What that is, is in Local 3 there are different clubs and organizations. And each weekend it's a different club or organization that comes out. That's just the group. They're all Local 3 members. Saint George started from Staten Island. There are different clubs within Local 3. They are all members of Local 3 that they belong to. And they come out the different groups come out each weekend. Cara Wells: So that's the scheduling concept? Vito Mundo: That's the schedule yes. Gerard Schultheis: You are applying for this exemption currently? Vito Mundo: Yes. Gerard Schultheis: Okay. What has the facility been used for in the past? Vito Mundo: Prior to us purchasing the property a few years ago it was motel. Since we purchased the property, I guess it's 4 or 5 years ago now, we've renovated. So it's all exclusive, this is all we use it for. We do not rent to outside groups. We don't have any other organizations coming there. It's all related to the electrical industry and educational programs. Gerard Schultheis: Okay how is the net previous 4 or 5 years? How has the property been used? Vito Mundo: Since we've owned it, it's always been used the same way. Prior to us owning it there was a motel there that was run down. We purchased and we've renovated. Since we've owned it the last 4 or 5 years now here. We've used it for the same purposes. For the educational program on the weekend. Gerard Schultheis: So basically, what I'm hearing is that you've been doing these seminars etc for the past 4 or 5 years. Vito Mundo: Yes, prior to us purchasing the property we owned property in Southampton called Bayberryland. That we owned since the early 1950's. Which was used for the same purposes. And ended up selliig that property, we downsized and we ended up buying that property he-e. 20 Gerard Schultheis: And did you have a tax exemption on that property? Vito Mundo: I don't know. That is going back before my time. Cara Wells: Would you find out? Vito Mundo: I believe they actually entered into a pilot program on that property. We're not looking to, quite honestly, I don't know if I put my foot in my mouth, we'd like to work out some type of pilot program. We're not looking to be a... Cara Wells: Would you find out what the status was? Vito Mundo: Sure Cara Wells: Thank you. Gerard Schultheis: Do you have any other information to contribute? Vito Mundo: No I will answer questions. Gerard Schultheis: Okay now it's my understanding that the Assessors rejected this application? Okay can you share with us your reasons? Bob Scott: First of all I just want to say that this is an ongoing litigation. It is in certiorari already. So I'm not going to say too much. Cara Wells: Oh okay. Bob Scott: And I'd would prefer our council is here with to respond. I didn't know who was coming so I would ask for reasonable about of time so our certiorari attorney can be here. Because it is a certiorari case. Gerard Schultheis: Okay Bob Scott: And basically we're not denying the value of the property because it was purchased for... Kevin Webster: It was purchased Jan 11 2008 for $12,645,500. And then the other parcel lot 17.1 was purchased Oct 16`h 2009 for $2,925,000. Bob Scott: And there has been considerable improvemen± done to the property to renovate the motel. And the pool section. But that's it, I'm not denying that. That it's sxclusivity of the that would be a question I would prefer be answered by the certiorari attorney. Gerard Schultheis: Does it make sense that we adjourn to appoint when... 21 Bob Scott: Yes, I would suggest that we do that. However I would request that we have the allowable time that we have to get the certiorari attorney here. Our representative. Gerazd Schultheis: Okay well that a reasonable request. What you need to do is find out when he's available and then we can schedule. Okay well why don't we find out when the attorney's are available and we'll make sure that we can accommodate it. Bob Scott: Do you have any idea when you're planning on meeting again? So I can go back now and see if he's available while this gentleman's here? Gerard Schultheis: We haven't discussed it yet, but I'm guessing probably next Tuesday would be the first time that we would meet. Is that okay with everybody. Okay so next meeting would be Tuesday at 9 o'clock in the morning. Vito Mundo: Unfortunately I have trustee meetings that morning, if possible do you know what the next day would be? Typically we try to do a Tuesday and Thursday. Bob Scott: Can I check with our certiorari attorney? If it's possible Thursday would be the 30`n? I will try to see if Scott DeSimone is available on the 30`h. And if I do it, I will do it after 9 o'clock? 9 to 10 o'clock? Gerard Schultheis: Okay Bob Scott: I'll try to set that up right now while you're here and that way we can get it all done. Gerard Schultheis: Okay why don't we adjourn to that point in time. Bob Scott: Just to let you know when I say it's in certiorari already with Flower, Medalie which is not the same firm that he was with. Vito Mundo: On general council I spoke to our outside council the other day because I thought that he should have probably been here. He said that's no problem (inaudible) cell phone (inaudible). I'll be honest I'm a Erisa attorney I'm not a certiorari attorney. Gerard Schultheis: Okay well does it make sense to have the other attorney? Bob Scott: I would kinda think that since he represents the program. They're already in certiorari with that. If our certiorari attorney is here acid their certiorari attorney is there and they think that's the right thing to do we'll set up an appointment with you next Thursday at 9 or 10 o'clock. Gerard Schultheis: Okay great. Okay thank you for coming. 22 Gerard Schultheis: It's 1 o'clock May 21s` I would like to take this occasion to close the morning session of the Town of Southold Grievance Day. Thank you. Gerard Schultheis: It's Tuesday May 21 s` I would like to open the evening session of the Grievance Day for the Town of Southold. Hearing #4 Gerard Schultheis: This is 107.-4-2.3 We have an appraisal. The assessed value is 13,400 dollars. Kevin Webster: Did you get your original appraisal back? For the property appraisal? No, okay. Would you like that? Gerard Schultheis: Okay if you would- stand up and tell us your name and we'll swear you in. Robert Rosnack: Robert Rosnack. I live at 4635 Mill Lane Mattituck. The house is in my wife's name. Nick Planamento: Mr. Rosnack. I'm sorry to interrupt before you continue I'm going to read a statement and just ask you to affirm. Good Evening. Do you solemnly swear that the information you about to give will be given accurately and truthfully to the best of knowledge? Robert Rosnack: I do. Nick Planamento: Thank you very much Mr. Rosnack. Gerard Schultheis: Okay. I see you have an appraisal. Is that the basis for of your grievance? Robert Rosnack: Basically yes it is sir. Gerard Schultheis: Okay the appraisal was done as of July 1 s` 2012. Nick Planamento: And Gerry just to affirm that we are on the same page, it's tax map number 1000-107.-4-2.3 it's a 5 acre lot. Jonathan Wiggins: 5 acres, right. Gerard Schultheis: Okay now I see yor.r appraisal says your house is worth $855,000. Robert Rosnack: Yes sir. I do believe its worth less then that. 23 Gerard Schultheis: Your estimate is 755? Robert Rosnack: Yes. Jonathan Wiggins: What do you base that on? Robert Rosnack: Well the houses that it's comparable to are state-of--the-art houses. They all have 2 x 6 construction. Their black top driveways with garages. Finished basements. They have air conditioning. Most of them have beautiful decks and patio's in the back yard. I have none of that sir. Gerard Schultheis: Okay I'm looking at the comparables and the appraiser did adjust for the size of the site, the condition of the house in one case, room count in all cases. The bath in two cases, air conditioning... Robert Rosnack: I'm sorry to interrupt, but I do believe the square footage of the house is wrong. Gerard Schultheis: Your house is not 2914 square feet? Robert Rosnack: That is correct, but the town has it as 3080 square feet. Gerard Schultheis: You have the property record card? Kevin Webster: We have it as 2852? Robert Rosnack: 2852? Kevin Webster: Right from this done in 2001. We have a 1272 times 2, plus 248, plus 60. Looks like we have you assessed at 2852 square feet of living space. Gerard Schultheis: It does look like the appraisal did adjust for things that are different between the houses. Robert Rosnack: Okay Gerard Schultheis: So if you didn't have a porch and the other houses did, there were adjustments made for that. Robert Rosnack: Well I have a porch Ldon't have a patio. I have all grass around my house. I have a gravel driveway. Not blacktop. Cara Wells: It's a very nice neighborhood. 24 Robert Rosnack: It's beautiful and I want to stay there. I want to be able to retire in that house. Jonathan Wiggins: Do you have other comparables on Mill Lane on a 5 acre piece? Robert Rosnack: Well the house that is just to the south of me, which is 4505 Mill Lane has been on the market since 2007. Originally went on the market for 1,350,000. And it hasn't... Cara Wells: It's over priced. Robert Rosnack: Well now it's down to 995. And no offers have been made on this house. It can't be sold. The house that is to the north of me 4765 Mill lane which belongs to Ray and Debbie Gerari. It was sold it two years ago for $999,000. Jonathan Wiggins: They sold that house? Robert Rosnack: But it was astate-of--the-art house. I'm mean it's completely computerized. It has an attached 2 car garage. Black top driveway. He also have a detached 3 car garage with a living space above. He has solar panels. He has a generator. And he has an in-ground pool. Jonathan Wiggins: You don't have a garage right? Robert Rosnack: I have rio garage, no sir. Jonathan Wiggins: Sounds like you're the poor man on the block there. Robert Rosnack: I am the poorest guy on the block. Yes. But we love where we live. Jonathan Wiggins: Sure. It's a beautiful neighborhood. Robert Rosnack: The problem with selling houses where we are, is that real estate show the houses on weekends. And we have that helicopter problem. So it scares everyone away. Nobody wants to live there. Jonathan Wiggins: I wasn't aware of the helicopter problem. Robert Rosnack: The Hamptons helicopter problem. They fly back and forth from the East Hampton airport to Manhattan. And the flight path is directly over my house. Jonathan Wiggins: And they land in Mattituck right? Robert Rosnack: In Mattituck yes. It's a big problem. Jonathan Wiggins: More and more people are taking helicopters these days. 25 Robert Rosnack: Well if you can pay $2800 per trip. Gerard Schultheis: Do you have a pool? Robert Rosnack: I have an above ground pool. Yes, sir. Jonathan Wiggins: Kevin do you tax above ground pools? Kevin Webster: We did. Yes, there was a building permit taken out for this and there is an increase on there of $300 for that. The picture if you had here, it has the lattice work around it and it (inaudible). You'd have to have a building permit for that. Looking at the photo there, not the traditional circular above ground pool. So there was an assessment put on there for that. Robert Rosnack: What the walk way around the pool? You have to have the fence so kids can't get in. Jonathan Wiggins: Wildlife. Gerard Schultheis: Okay so your appraisal is the soul basis of your grievance? Robert Rosnack: Yes, sir. Phyllis Atkinson: May I ask the purpose of the appraisal? What is ordered just for grievance? Robert Rosnack: To see what the market value of the house is. Because I really had no idea. I thought it was lower. But that's what the appraisal came in at. Phyllis Atkinson: In other words it wasn't to transfer from your name to your wife's name to create a trust or anything like that? Robert Rosnack: No Gerard Schultheis: Kevin do you have anything. Kevin Webster: Well I would like to have a day or two to perform an appraisal on this. And provide you with a copy of that. And provide Mr. Rosnack with a copy. Gerard Schultheis: Okay so you' Il work up an appraisal. Of what you think the value is? Kevin Webster: I will. I will mail them a copy as well. As far as comments from the apprasal, well. Since I don't have anything here I'll wait. Gerard Schultheis: Do you have anything else to say? 26 Robert Rosnack: Wel] I just wanted to say that I don't know if it means anything, but I kind of have a hardship. I work 6 days a week. I travel 120 miles a day back and forth to work. I have a health issue, I have rheumatoid arthritis. I need a job that pays health insurance. Very difficult for me. I would really like, my wife and I would like to retire in the house that we're in. We love where we are. We're just looking for a little mercy. Gerard Schultheis: It's unfortunate that you have those problems, but unfortunately they don't... Okay well we will review what you submitted when we do our deliberations and make a decision. Thank you for coming. Robert Rosnack: Thank you. Hearing #5 Nick Planamento: If you don't mind I'm just recognizing the applicant I recognize your name. I think it's probably better if I recuse myself just from the roll here. I've had relationship with them and sort of ongoing with your mom. That's okay I'm a real estate agent in town. But I just realized that house, well I'm assuming you're here on behalf of the property that you purchased in Mattituck. Donna Messina: yes purchased the property like 15 years ago. And then built the house. Nick Planamento: Wait then I'm confusing people then. Is this the property on County Route 48? Donna Messina: No Nick Planamento: Okay I'm confusing people. I'm so sorry. Kevin Webster: It's north of Trimbles. Donna Messina: Evergreen Lane. Actually on Everygreen. Nick Planamento: You're Connie's daughter. Donna Messina: Yes Nick Planamento: Sorry Gerard Schultheis: Do you want me to swear them in? Nick Planamento: I'm waiting for Gerry to speak. I':n not going to recuse myself. We don't have any dealings for the record. Or any r°lationship, although in a small town people do recognize one another. 27 Donna Messina: True Nick Planamento: I'm going to ask you to state your name as property owner. And I will also read this brief statement just to ask you to affirm to it. Good evening. Do you solemnly swear that the information you are about to give will be given accurately and truthfully to the best of your knowledge? Donna Messina: Yes I do. Nick Planamento: Wonderful, and would you share your name? Donna Messina: Donna Messina Green. Nick Planamento: Thank you Donna. Gerard Schultheis: Okay could you briefly tell us what your basis of grieving is? Donna Messina: I haven't been able to pay my taxes for a few yeazs. We're in azreazs. We have 2009 paid and we will be paying 2010 tomorrow. I'm trying to catch up. I haven't lived... I lost my business in 2009. I wanna say, I was trying to figure it out. There was a lot of It was a family business. A lot of things went on that I believe I didn't legally booted out, but it was with my mother so I didn't take any legal action. We lost everything. This is Frank He's been my partner for 18 yeazs. We ran a local business. A whole sale nursery in Cutchogue. Which I worked at... I'm 44, been a resident of the Town of Southold since I'm 11. I took over that business from my stepfather. And ran it for 20 yeazs until this happened. It really, was unexpected and left me with basically crippled to pursue or take care of any financial obligations. And things have changed now we just moved back into the area. The property is sitting there unfinished. Pretty much vacant. Except we store some personal belongings there. And we're hoping to finish, catch up on the taxes, and finish the property, to either live there or to sell it. If we sell it unfinished as is we would take more of a loss because, you know, people think they stopped the project. I haven't even gotten the tax bills. I called today to change the address the old address and I'm just hoping the assessment maybe could be reduced a little bit might be easier (inaudible) on taxes. Phyllis Atkinson: Is there a house on the property? Donna Messina: Yes. There is, it's unfinished. We started the construction 2005. Then part of the problems with my business and with my family. With money and I had taken a mortgage and used some of the money with... squandered or I don't know how to say it. Phyllis Atkinson: Is your house livable? Donna Messina: Not yet, but I had spoken to Mr. Verity in the building department last year. About the possibility of fi>rishing a portion of the house. At the time I had a ticket for being in the house with the lights on, I didn't appear on the ticket, and there was a 28 wan•ant saying Mr. Verity had to speak to the town attorney to get permission for me to go forward with anything. I had to take care of that warrant. Which I did. And then we renewed the building permit. And that was about a year ago, but we didn't do anything. We were out of the area. And we were really just concentrating on getting the taxes taken care of. There's no CO, but it's to the point of, it can be insulated and sheet rocked. Phyllis Atkinson: So there's no heat, no water, no electric? Frank: There no heat, there's no electric, there's no water. There are no walls. Donna Messina: No we have a well. There's nothing hooked up. It sits on 5 acres. There's a covenant on the land. There's 4 pazcels there. My business runs parallel to it. We're selling the business we have it up for sale. Environmentals. Jonathan Wiggins: Tax map number? Gerard Schultheis: 108.-3-8.6. So the basis of your request for basically reducing your assessment is that you can't pay the taxes. Donna Messina: Well not just that I think that it had gone up, but it was vacant land and the prices were, I think like 4500, 5000. Before we started the construction. So we put the house up on it and the taxes went up. The idea is when you start building a house you finish it. But because of the unexpected things that happened we weren't able to finish it and had to abandon the project. Really I don't think it was done legally, but because of the position I was put into I couldn't do anything to rectify the situation. Without bringing my mother to court. I think was kind of unreasonable. I'm going to paying the taxes and all the interest. And I haven't seen the assessment. I thought I should take advantage of this to try to get anything off of the assessment. It's not going to be livable. And I have limited income. Gerard Schultheis: I guess my question was the reason that you're appealing your assessment is that you can't afford to pay the taxes? Donna Messina: I can afford to catch up on taxes, but the past few years have been hard. I can't afford to pay the taxes this year. Cara Wells: So are you living in an unfinished house? Donna Messina: No I lived on the property my mothers property which is kind of across the... Cara Wells: I know. Donna Messina: And I'm living in the cottage with my mom and my children reside there as well. 29 Gerazd Schultheis: Kevin have you looked at the material? Kevin Webster: Yes, I have. Gerard Schultheis: I'm not aware of a way of reducing assessment for inability to pay. There's some reference to assessors manual. Kevin Webster: Well there is an exemption that can be applied for by Mazch 1S1 of every year. I would be happy to except an application for that coming up. I would be based on 2013 income that they have for disability exemption. But it has to be for the residence of the owner. So if they did live in it as of next Mazch 15` 2014 taxable status date. If they could finish it up with Mr. Verity. Then live in it they would definitely qualify for that exemption. It doesn't mean they have to live in it right now, but the deadline is March 151 so that passed for this year. Gerard Schultheis: So they have to wait till March of next year? Kevin Webster; Before March 15` 14 they could apply for a disability exemption. As long as they are living in the home. It would be based on the 2013 income. Cara Wells: What's the current tax on this property? Kevin Webster: Well the current assessed value is 6700. I don't have the tax bill in front of me. Tax rate, I don't have the book. Phyllis Atkinson: I don't see on the card where it says 6700. Kevin Webster: It does, on the front it says 6700. And the, just another thing I wanted to add that as far as the assessment goes, the 6700 equates a taxable value of $568,000 and there estimate of value on number 7 is $650,000. So as far as that goes the assessment is in fair range. But again we'd be happy to help them with a disability exemption between January 15` and March 151 next year based on the 2013 income. Donna Messina: Well I had gotten offers of like 500 which I would knock the house down and just sell the property. Gerard Schultheis: Well from, I guess the criteria ,that is used, there isn't a basis for us to offer to do anything with the assessment. The only opportunity you have to do something is to apply for this exemption. Which you have to wait for next March. Donna Messina: Okay well I will try to do that Hopefully things will improve. A13 right thank you. Cara Wells: Thank you for coming. 30 Gerard Schultheis: Okay it's 9 o'clock in the evening and I'd like to close this session of the Board of Assessment review for Southold Town. Submitted by: Catherine A Kreshon 7/1/2013 RECEIVED ~ 8; Q'o l4'Lu JUL ~1 2013 ~T' R r 31