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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB-06/26/1978 P T( Southold, N.Y. 11971 JOHN WlCKHAM, Chairman FRANK S. COYLE HENRY E. RAYNOR, Jr. FREDERICK E. GORDON JAMES WALL TELEPHONE 765- 1938 A regular meeting of the Southold Town Planning Board was held on Monday, June 26, 1978 at 7:30 p.m. at the Town Hall, Main Road, Southold, New York 11971. Present were: Vice Chairman Henry E. Raynor, Jr. Member Frederick E. Gordon Member Frank S. Coyle Member James Wall Mrs. Millicent Gossner, League of Women Voters Mr. Arthur Gossner Mr. Franklin Bear, North Fork Environmental Council Mr. Peter Campbell, The Suffolk Times Mr. Lawrence Tuthill, Town Engineer 9:30 p.m. Absent was: Chairman John Wickham 7:30 p.m. Public Hearing on the question of the approval of the preliminary map of the subdivision to be known as "Bayview Farm" owned by Peter Blank, Jr. and Mary Louise Blank, located at Orient, Town of Southold, New York. William Price, Jr. and Mr. Peter Blank, Jr. appeared. Mr. Raynor read the legal notice of hearing dated June 9, 1978 and presented proof of publication from the Long Island Mattituck Traveler Watchman commencing June 15, 1978 for one week. Mr. Raynor went over the checklist, reviewed the sketch plan submitted to the Planning Board May 18, 1978, covenants and restrictions, letter from the Super- intendent of Highways approving the lay-out of the proposed roads and drainage dated June 26, 1978, letter from the Suffolk County Planning Depmrtment indicating the subject plat is not within their jurisdic- tion, memorandum from Lawrence M. Tuthill, Town Engineer, letter from the Highway Committee indicating the plat appears satisfactory, and all other material in the subject file. Mr. Raynor: As is the procedure of this board, if there is anyone who would like to speak in opposition to this subdivision, the hearing is opened. Hearing none, is there anyone who would like to speak in favor of this subdivision? William Price, Jr., Esq.: I am an attorney at law associated with the firm of Irving L. Price, Jr., Esq., and am the attorney for the applicant. I would like to bring to the board's attention that the applicant has possible changes to the covenants and res- trictions. Specifically, covenant I(a) we are considering amend- ing that from a minimum living area of 1800 square feet to 1600 square feet, which is a little more than double your requirement. Another amendment under covenant XI(h)2(e) in reference to the votes necessary for the dedication of the road and back area to the Town of Southold restricting the vote to two-thirds by the members of the property owners association whose frontline abuts Old Farm Road in the subdivision. We don't think they should have a vote against such dedication. Mr. Raynor: The criteria is based upon assessed valuation. Mr. Coyle: 1.88 acres is adequate, and Mr. Van Tuyl considers per- centage~wise. Mr. Raynor: Hearing no opposition, I declare this hearing closed. SEA BREEZE VILLAGE, Kontokosta Associates condominium units. Mr. Emmanuel Kontokosta appeared. Mr. Kontokosta: I am hear tonight to answer any questions that may arise concerning my application. Mr. Raynor: We have reviewed your site plan, with Local Law #3-1978, which has just recently been adopted; and we have not had an oppor- tunity to go over this project with regard to this law. We have been in contact with the Suffolk County Planning Commission and the Town Attorney regarding setback lines. This brings you up-to-date. Mr. Kontokosta: I have had the opportunity to go down to the Suffolk County Planning Commission, and I have certain information that might be of concern regarding the setback. Mr. Raynor: The Board and I are aware of it. Local Law #3 has just been adopted this year. We want to be sure that we proceed properly. Mr. Coyle: What about the sewer-lines projection by the Village of Greenport? Mr. Kontokosta: Study is being considered by the Suffolk County Health Department. We find that it is quite an expensive project. -3- (Mr. Kontokosta, continued): The decision has not been made. The proposition is still open. We are considering this, and also the cost of going under County Road 27 and certain other factors. Hav- ing to pay certain charges to the Nursing Home because I am under the impression that the sewer lines belong to them. If we had to, we could go either way. Mr. Raynor: We would like you to come back to the Planning Board on the 17th of July. Please contact the secretary for a time. Copies of Local Law #3-1978 were distributed to the board. C.E. ALLEN & PETER KREH. Mr. Allen and Mr. Kreh appeared. Mr. McNulty appeared later in the meeting. Mr. Raynor: We have reviewed the subdivision overlay (composite) maps which your attorney has put together. Have you both gone over these maps with your attorney? Mr. Allen: Yes. Of course. Mr. Raynor: Here is a letter dated January 16, 1978 from the Planning Board secretary to Mr. McNulty explaining January 10, 1978 board meet- ing minutes with reference to an opinion from the Town Attorney about a major subdivision and involvement of a 50-foot common right-of-way and straightening out of the right-of-way. The recommendations of the Suffolk County Health Department as to completing test holes and wells on both properties should be adopted. There is a question regarding property. Would you gentlemen please come before the board? (Pause) I see you have established consolidation of Lot #1. As indicated all remaining lots are above 40,000 square feet; there is a 50-foot right-of-way as required. This particular piece of property (refer- ring to lot east of the subject 50-foot right-of-way) is left uunum- bered. There is a question of ownership. Mr. Allen: It is owned by Peconic Sands Inc. It is not owned by me, it is owned by an independent corporation. Some time ago, I trans- ferred ownership to a close relative. Mr. Raynor: You gentlemen have no interest in this piece of property? Mr. Allen: Yes, but it does not involve this. Mr. Raynor: Is there 40,000 square feet? Mr. Allen: Yes, way over. Almost 50,000. Mr. Raynor: Is there a reason it is not included in this subdivision? Mr. Allen: Because I transferred it to a close relative--but my children, well, at the time that you were determined that you were going to include my house lot in the subdivided property. There would be a lot of legal expense. If my previously surveyed lot would have to be included in the subdivision. Mr. Raynor: It is an open piece of property. Wouldn't it be good business to include it in your subdivision? Mr. Allen: There is no need for that now. Mr. Raynor: It is not proper to hold off a piece of property. This appears the case as you have transferred it out. Mr. Kreh: A minor subdivision would take at least four lots. Mr. Allen: I agreed to cut this down to three here. me when you decided to include my original homestead. ed to include -- and I accepted it. You surprised You all elect- Mr. Coyle: The reason we did that was because your name was on the subdivision and anything that is part owner is to be made as such. (Mr. McNulty appears at the meeting.) Mr. McNulty: That parcel belongs to some other entity. A corporation owns that. He owns the other three. Mr. Raynor: He said that he transferred out. Mr. McNulty. I don't know whether it was transferred. It must have been years ago. That was a separate thing. Mr. Raynor: This has always been a separate parcel? That isn't my idea. Outside of resolving this, the map reads Ok. As long as it is in excess of 40,000 square feet, we can include it as it is over the requirement. Mr. Coyle: What it seems is we are not working on a completed map. Mr. Raynor: Counsel has presented map dated December 13, 1976 indicating parcel in question 67,750 square feet. Surveyed by Roderick Van Tuyl, P.C. December 13, 1976. Mr. Gordon: Lot #4 will eliminate any questions. Mr. Allen: Ok. RICHMOND SHORES. No one appeared. The following comments were made: Mr. RaYnOr: We are still awaiting a planting schedule. Howard Young: What is a planting schedule? It should have been --5-- - shown on the map. The Board reviewed the maps and requested a proper planting schedule. On Motion made by Mr. Gordon, seconded by Mr. Wall, it was RESOLVED to approve the cluster subdivision subject to planting schedule approval. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall. PARADISE BY THE SOUND. Frederick J. Ziems,Esq. and Howard Young appeared. The following comments were made: Mr. Raynor: We are waiting as of today for a signed contract from the Village of Greenport. Mr. Ziems: That is on the water? The other things that were missing on the 5th were the recommendations of Larry Tuthill with regard to approving the fire hydrant. Mr. Raynor: Right. If is my understanding that he and the Village of Greenport have discussed this. Mr. Ziems: We signed the contract awhile ago. What about the bond for road improvements? Mr. Raynor: This has not been set. Aga~it is between the Town ~ and Village Engineers. One inch verses~.l/4~inch piping. That's s~/~ outside our area, domestic water flow ah~o on. I cannot give you J~?~ an answer on something we don't know. ~?~ Mr. Ziems: And a fire hydrant? Mr. Raynor: This was included because we spoke to James Monsell, and I cannot speak for the Villagm, of Greenport. We need approval from the Town Engineer~on the preliminary map in order to be sent to the Suffolk County Planning Commission. All we can do is have the Board send him another letter requesting it. Mr. Coyle: you up? Do you know whether the Village of Greenport is holding Mr. Ziems: I don't kngw how that affects this matter at all. The Town Engineer could have come up with a bond schedule. I was under the impression that it was going to be done on the June 5th meeting. Mr. Raynor: We would have to have a final agreement as part of our submission to the County. We will forward a letter about the bond to see if we can expedite it, and in two days or so should have an answer. Mr. Ziems: We have contracted separately with the Village of Green- port. It has no mention of a bond. All we are waiting for is of the Town Engineer. Mr. Raynor: The Planning Board is waiting for the contract. SOUTHOLD GARDENS. Howard Young submitted six prints of preliminary subdivision map as amended to show proposed vertical sand drain between Lots #2 and #3 adjacent to Hill Road West. On Motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Gordon, it was RESOLVED to approve the Minutes of the Planning Board Meeting held June 5, 1978. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall. FISHER ESTATE - minor subdivision drainage problem. No one appeared. Mr. Raynor made the following comments: The Highway Superintendent has inspected same, and they will come to a conclusion in the near future. Soil and Conservation Foundation will forward correspondence regarding this subdivision. On Motion made by Mr. Gordon, seconded bY Mr. Coyle, it was RESOLVED that an informal meeting be held Wednesday, June 28, 1978 at 9:00 a.m., leaving from Brauns' Oyster Co. and thereafter visiting the subdivision sites, with the Planning Board and the Southold Town Highway Committee regarding Oregon View Estates roads and Laurel Country Estates. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Gordon, Wall, Coyle, Raynor. On Motion made by Mr. Gordon, seconded by Mr. Coyle, it was is RESOLVED that the next regular meeting of the Planning Board set for July 17th. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall. BAYVIEW WOODS. Howard Young appeared. The following comments were made: Mr. Raynor: You have not received recommendation by engineer? Howard Young: I have not. Mr. Raynor reviewed Town Engineer Report and surveys. Comments by the Town Engineer were read by Mr. Raynor as follows: That there be a road to the east to the existing town road, North Bayview Road, on either side of the Gagen property to eliminate the superblock. (Compliance is proposed.) 2. That the park and playground has not sufficient usable area and connected to a future playground area. 3. That there is another area nears Lots #30 and #29 more suitable for the recharge basin. As it exists, there seems to have been,at the 8 to l0 foot contour, water in the proposed park and playground area. Another suggestion is Lot #3. Mr. Young: There is adequate lot layout; what is the difference? What is the difference where it is located as long as it meets requirements. Mr. Raynor: Would you send us a letter explaining your reasons for not wanting another recharge basin as Lots #30 or #29 instead of as indicated? Mr. Raynor hands Mr. Young a copy of the Town Engineer Report and Mr. Young acknowledges same. WALTER GATZ Cluster Subdivision. Mr. Walter Gatz and Howard Young appeared. Mr. Raynor and the board members reviewed the file, noting sketch plan approval, letter to Cluster Review Committee which Plan- ning Board has reviewed also. An objection was made by Mr. Raynor regarding southerly side of en- trances. Grading should be revised to give excellent visibility. Planning Board members reviewed old and new sketch plans. Mr. Raynor: The Highway Committee may ask the road be extended to the property line. Mr. Young: Topography is the reason why we did it this way. all the way would be nothing but hazardous to people. Going Mr. Raynor: If you can get a waiver from the Highway Superintendent and Highway Committee, it would be no problem. But it is their usual procedure to go all the way. Mr. Young: How does the Planning Board feel about this? Mr. Raynor: Lines should be shown in case at some future date it is dedicated. Mr. Young: Due to the topography, a road would be a problem. Mr. Raynor: The rest of the right-of-way may be needed in the future for safety for the westerly side of the cluster. The one foot is needed to satisfy. Mr. Young: The one foot of property is being handled by Mr. Lark for its dissolution of Mr. McNulty's clients. Mr. Raynor: Until you have fee title, the Planning Board cannot approve it. Also, park and playground area labeling is required. Mr. Young: That should be resolved soon. Mr. Raynor: Lot #7 -- there are restrictions on access only on this road. No. 7's driveway should come off of right-of-way instead of Soundview Avenue. Mr. Young: We will submit more plans. Mr. Gordon: And for deed settlement. WILLIAM SCHRIEVERCluster Subdivision. Mr. Schriever was present and the following comments were made: Mr. Schriever: I assume that you have received or are aware of the Town Board approving the exchange of property for the sump? Mr. Raynor: Yes. We are waiting, and we haven't received a copy of the resolution before the Board; and I understand that we will be receiving a copy soon and that it has been approved. Mr. Schriever: Now, I would like to get sketch plan approval of the map and the outline I think~Town defined, and the exchanges having been made, and the business zone, upzoning; I don't believe there will be any opposition to that. Certainly every other possi- bility has been explored there, and that was always opposed no matter what I wanted to do. Proposing the widening of the street was rejected, the proposal to zone the other side of the street was rejected, and so forth. So I don't see any other logical step to take to dispose of this area, and I have given you a copy of the application which I propose to make, and as soon as this sketch plan approval is given, we can .... Mr. Raynor: We talked this afternoon, subsequent to the call to the Town Attorney with regard to this property, and it is his recommenda- tion at this point that the Board wait until you get an answer with regard to your upzoning. Mr. Schriever: Do you realise how long that's going to be? I cannot afford that, and I held off this thing, and I originally was going to apply for a variance and was told that they, that they would rush this thing through, that it was to do as a zoning application, and I've been trying to please everybody and apparently in doing so I have pleased nobody. Mr. Raynor: As I understand, you have already made application? Mr. Schriever: I have not filed the application. Mr. Raynor: You have not filed the application. Mr. Schriever: I have not filed it. I have been, I could have filed it in January, but I didn't want to, I wanted to have the map defined so that I'd have justification to set the boundaries for the upzoning. And, you know, I don't see that the zoning has any problem at all. Mr. Raynor: Do you want to eliminate for the board the area you want to upzone? Mr. Schriever: It is not clear. If you go to town officials and say, "What is business," they cannot define the business zone ex- cept as scratch marks on the map so that I in making the applica- tion, I think that you would let me here, but I gave a copy to Muriel in my application; and the map, and what I did I called this the business zone. Mr. Raynor: In other words, the existing business comes down to here, inclusive of Lots #7, #8 and #9? Mr. Schriever: Right, but not all of #9, part of it. Mr. Raynor: Part of it. Mr. Schriever: And I said to upzone this piece plus all other property which shall be determined is in the business, it is west of this line behind that lot. Mr. Raynor: Which would include anything up here if they thought that was needed? Mr. Schriever: You see, you've got a little map scale that is so small, if you put a ruler on there then you can say, "Well maybe it's 200 feet back or maybe 300 feet back," You don't know how far it goes this way. So the application says, you know, whatever is there I want to dispose of, and I don't know of any other way to do it. Mr. Raynor: The only thing that our board can do is to go back and discuss it with the Town Attorney. And I don't know if you have any other input. Mr. Schriever: Well, yes, there was one commen~ I think I made the comment before. What I would like to do would be to proceed with the subdivision and, you know, let this problem be resolved simultaneously. This problem with the business. I think that this has been approved for clustering, this has been approved for cluster- ing, you know; I don't believe there are any technical problems except those in the County. Now as I understand it I can't go to the County until I get sketch plan approval. If I don't get that approval, you know, I'm gonna be another year, and I've been five years on this damned thingwalready, and I've just got to get myself out of this. Mr. Raynor: All right, the only thing we can do is to discuss it with him again and see what the Town Attorney's determination may be with regard to thi~ problem; and we will proceed further for you. Mr. Schriever: What I am requesting basically is permission to proceed with the subdivision subject to whatever action is taken here. If, in fact, this is denied, then as far as the subdivision is concerned, these would remain unsalable lots for residential purposes. And that would just be business zoned. It's either that or I'll take you to Court and you know I'll get it out. Mr. Raynor: That would also change the property lines, if that the case. Mr. Schriever: Well that's true, but I mean the property is there, and I own it. I mean, there's no question about whether I have the right to make the application, and it's my understanding they basically agree that this is an acceptable application, and nobody can tell in advance what the action is gonna be, but presumably that would be upzoned. So during the course that this thing is running along, getting the County approvals, getting you know all the other procedures going, this action could be taking place. Mr. Coyle: Have you taken any part of Lots 6, 7 and 8 at all, officially? Mr. Schriever: No. Mr. Raynor: That's a result of the application for a change of zone. Mr. Schriever: I wanted to have the Planning Board basic approval for a layout before I filed the applications. I have to justify the lines that I am setting for the application. Mr.Raynor: On the basis of what you have given us tonight, we will go back and discuss it with the Town Attorney. COUNTRY CLUB ESTATES. Gary Olsen, Esq., Dick Frisbee and Philip Babcock appeared. The board members and Mr. Olsen and Mr. Babcock reviewed the layout. Mr. Olsen: We want to run a split rail fence down Moore's Lane basically and when it gets to the end to put the fence to the other end of the court. Mr. Babcock: We don't want to put these gates on because the road is so wide; it looks useless but across the street they have a white country, horse-type plan and we were thinking to keep with that and then to use a natural rail fence here set back from the road and in back of that place all your trees and all your shrubs along in here. And then hold this back six feet off the edge of the road so you'll have one line going in and coming out. That's basically what heTs showing on this drawing. Mr. Raynor: In that sense, that's what the building inspector has provided. There are two stipulations: (1) he will waive this 8' post fence and may be willing to go along with the excess height. The other stipulation is the front of the fencing, it csnnot become any part of the highway. It must be retained on the private lots. Mr. Babcock: We told him that when we got the permits. Mr. Gordon: I think that's why they changed the scale to this size. Mr. Babcock: Well, that's why I say when Frank drew this up, Frank Chic, you see, he doesn't know as much about it as, I shouldn't say that, he might have due cognizance in that and that will stay back from the road. Mr. Raynor: All right, as long as it is maintained on the private property. Mr. Gordon: The only other thing you mentioned was the fact that, and I don't know how it came about, you had mentioned about mowing the area of the drain and it was under the opinion that you wanted to grass it. Is that so? Mr. Babcock: We would like the grass from the road. The Board and Mr. Babcock and Mr. Olsen reviewed the vertical sand drain area on the proposed planting plan. Mr. Babcock: Yes, this area will be grass (indicating area outside sand) Something will grow in there. Mr. Gordon: Should be sand (indicating drain area). -12- Mr. Raynor: Stabilized banking with rmgard to the Seil and Water Conservation engineering and providing this will remain sand. Mr. Babcock: Right, but you won't be able to avoid something growing in there and I assume if it should grow, we would cut it down or remove them. That's what we meant. This will all be in grass. Mr. Raynor: Anything designated inside the vertical sand drain and that it will be all sand. Mr. 01sen: Otherwise you approve the drainage as per Young & Young's plans of June l, 1978. Mr. Babcock: You have a stipulation here like, I don't know how it started out with, but all you want to do is have an attractive, most attractive setup here as you can and I think the way to do that is to put all this, as much as you can, in grass. It costs a little dough to do it but it sure looks nice. Mr. Raynor: The only thing that we are concerned about is that this remain sand and the outside be grass. Mr. Babcock: That doesn't make an effect at all. Mr. Raynor: And the one on six grade, you won't find any problem in mowing it. Mr. 01sen: Has anything been sent up to the Suffolk County Planning Commission? I think you gave final approval subject to its going to the Suffolk County Planning Commission. Mr. Raynor: It has not gone out. We are going to take care of that. Do you gentlemen have anything else for us this evening. Mr. Babcock: We would like to say only one thing that I know of and that is with regard to your bond. We've got pretty nearly most of the grading done but an exception of I don't know how far they have gone with this. I hope that the work that has been done will be taken into consideration when your bond has been prepared. Mr. Raynor: He ~s the standard procedure that he follows with regard to it, his inspections, his inspection fees, bonding and so forth. Mr. Frisbee: Did you get a chance to look at the tree plan and would yeu have any thoughts? Mr. Raynor: I did. Mr. Babcock: I know the only one I had I gave it to them. Mr. Raynor: Them, it's in our file. I had a chance to look at it this morning but I'd like to go over a few points. Mr. Babcock: Is there anything you do not want us to do that you can tell us now because we have about eighty trees sitting out, ready to go in and we don't want to hold them too long. -13- Mr. Raynor: Call tomorrow and get an answer. Mr. Babcock: We are not staying with one type of tree deliberately. All of these we plan to keep in back of the fence and the fence back on the private property. They grow well. It is a nice tree. Mr. Bear asked a question about the final approval. Mr. Raynor: No final approval has been given. The engineer has been out inspecting constantly. When he has preliminary approval, he can go ahead and start planning the roads. It is still subject to the engineer's inspection. And we have letters in the file with regard ~ to preliminary approvals. On motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Coyle, it was RESOLVED to grant final approval of the preliminary sand drain as showu on Young & Young grading plan of May 26, 1978, Country Club Estates. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall On motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Wall, it was RESOLVED to approve the site plan with fence for the subdivision known as ,'Country Club Estates". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall On motion made by Mr. Gordon, seconded by Mr. Raynor, it was RESOLVED to request a bond estimate from Lawrence Tuthill for the roads and improvements in the subdivision known as "Country Club Estates". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall On motion made by Mr. Gordon, seconded by Mr. Coyle and Mr. Wall, it was RESOLVED to approve the site plan and tree planting for the subdivision known as "Country Club Estates". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall Mr. Tuthill was at the meeting at this time and was requested to prepare bond estimates for the subdivisions "Paradise-by-the-Sound" and "Country Club Estates". -14- On motion made by Mr. Coyle, seconded by Mr. Wall, it was RESOLVED to adjourn the meeting until the 17th day of July, 1978. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Raynor, Coyle, Gordon, Wall. The meeting was adjourned at 9:45 p.m. Respectfully submitted, Linda F. Kowalski, Secretary Henry E.ORaynor, J~.~ Vice~hairman