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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPB-09/18/1975Southold Town Planning Board SOUTHOLD, L. I., N. Y. 11971 TELEPHONE 765-1313 PLANNING BOARD MEMBERS John Wickham, Chairman Henry Moisa Alfred Grebe Henry Raynor Frank Coyle MINUTES Southold Town Planning Board September 18, 1975 A regular meeting of the Southold Town Planning Board was held September 18, 1975, at 7:30 p.m. at the Town Clerk's Office, Main Road Southold. Present were Vice-Chairman Henry Moisa and members Henry Raynor and Alfred Grebe. Mr. Coyle arrived at 9:00 p.m. Absent was John Wickham, Chairman. 7:30 p.m. Public Hearing on map of minor subdivision of Doebler. Present - Gary Olsen, Esq., Mrs. Doebler and some other interested parties not identified. Mr. Moisa opened the public hearing at 7:30 p.m. with Mr. Raynor reading the Notice of Hearing. NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that pursuant to Section 276 of the Town Law, Public Hearing will be held by the Southold Town Planning Board at the Town Clerk's Office, Main Road, Southold, New York, in said town on the 18th day of September, 1975 on the question of the following: 7:30 p.m. Approval of a minor subdivision of property owned by Errol W. Doebler situated at Southold in the Tow~ of Southold, County of Suffolk and State of New York, bounded and described as follows: BEGINNING at a point on the westerly line of Hobart Road 696.23 feet southerly along said westerly line from the Main Road, said point of beginning being the southeasterly corner of land of Edson; from said point of beginning running along said westerly line of Hobart Road S. 27° 06' 10" E. 146 feet to land of Gates; thence along said land S. 69° 34' W. 50 feet, more or less, to ordinary highwater mark of Town Creek; thence along said highwater mark southerly and then westerly 760 feet, more or less, to land of Joost; thence along said land of Joost seven courses: ~! N. l0° 39' 30" W. 207 feet, more or less; thence (2) N. 49' 30" E. 125.0 feet; thence (3) N. lO° 21' 30" W. 172.35. feet; thence (4) N. 52° 40' W. 29.58 feet; thence (5) N. 4° 59' W. 20,0 feet:.thence (6) northeasterly on a curve to the left, having a ra~us os Planning Boar~ -2- September 18, 1975 36.82 feet, a distance of 49.32 feet; thence (7) N. 8° 25' 50" E. 240.13 feet to said land of Edson; thence along said land N. 84° 21' 50" E. 217.82 feet to the point of beginning. Containing 3-1/2 acres, more or less. Any person desiring to be heard on the above matters should appear at the time and place above specified. Dated: August 19, 1975 BY ORDER OF THE SOUTHOLD TOWN PLANNING BOARD JOHNWICKI-IAM, CHAIRMAN Affidavit of publication was presented from the Suffolk Weekly Times. Mr. Moisa: We also have the same notice as printed in the Long Island Traveler properly notarized. Checking the file, we find things in order and as is customary, we will ask for anyone who wishes to speak against this minor subdivision. Hearing none, I will ask for anybody that is in favor. Gary 01sen, Esq.: I am the attorney for the applicant. I submitted the application back on June 23, 1975 formally although I had appeared on several occasions prior to that. It is a minor subdivision with only three lots; the first has 71,000 square feet, the secoud 42,000 square feet and the third parcel is 41,000 square feet, more or less. All the parcels more than meet the minimum town standards. Due to the fact that the property is located on Town Creek, I submitted an application to the New York State Department of Environmental Conservation and received approval on that. In view of the fact that it complies with all town standards, I request your approval. We would be willing to place a restrictive covenant on lot number one that we will no further subdivide that parcel. We will give the covenant and you can make your approval subject to that. I have discussed the proposal for the 50 foot setback building line with Mr. Doebler and he does not think there is any necessity for the 50 foot setback line. It will make the parcels extremely narrow and we should leave where the houses on lots one and two are located up to the Building Department. Also, anyone that would build on one or two would still need a permit from the New York State DEC. It isn't like a bank on the Sound that caves in. It would very seriously hamper where any structure could be built on the property. With that change and what we have discussed I would respectfully request that you approve it. Shirley Bachrach (representing the League of Women Voters): Is there any intention to dredge or bulkhead? Mr. Olsen: I don't know. Mr. Doebler doesn't have that intention. I don't know what anyone would do in the future. Mr. Raynor: Do you want to amend your map? Planning Boara -3- September 18, 1975 Mr. 01sen: All the maps show the minor subdivision without the setback line. Mr. Moisa: Your final map shows the 50 foot setback line. Mr. Olsen: I am asking that the Board approve it without the 50 foot setback line. Mr. Moisa: What did Mr. Doebler feel the setback should be? Mr. 01sen: He would rather leave it up to the Building Department. I do not think it is a Planning Board issue. Mr. Moisa: Only when there is erosion. We try to protect the future owners from erosion. Mr. Olsen: I have one prospective buyer here. You would like to leave it up to the Building Department? Man: Yes. Mr. Raynor: The reason it was set up was because of several parcels we have run into problems with. County Planning Commission established 100 foot setback from the top of the bluff for erosion purposes on the Sound and 50 foot throughout the bays and creeks. This is the reason for the Board requesting the 50 foot setbacks. Mr. Olsen: It makes the lots so narrow that the house would have to be put close to the front property line. The prospective buyers don't want their houses too far off the bank. You don't get extreme high tides that would push into a bank. Van Tuyl says it has been substantially this was for a hundred years. He felt there was no need for the setback. With the protection that the Building Department is going to give since they have to approve where the house would be located plus the protection that the New York State DEC is going to impose because they will also before they issue a permit have to know where the house is going to be situated. I think those two agencies are more than sufficient. People are paying alot of money for this property and I don't think they should be restricted arbitrarily. Mr. Moisa: The reason we follow this is in the future the Town would not be held responsible because the Planning Board had not looked into the situation where there would be a problem. People come and ask for aid and things of this sort. Mr. Olsen: I can see it in certain areas but I can't see it here. Mr. Moisa: We have two policies which we carry through in the whole town. Plauning Boara -4- September 18, 1975 Mrs. Doebler: In ten years the tide has not come up to the bottom of the bank. It is a very quiet creek, as you know. Mr. Moisa: We will take that under consideration. Is there anyone else that would like to speak in favor of this? Hearing none, I will declare the hearing closed and we will come to a decision at a later date. Motion was made by Mr. Grebe, seconded by Mr. Raynor and carried to approve the minutes of the meetings of August 18 (regular); meeting with the Town Board on the "Olinda" and the meeting at Fishers Island both held on A~gust 20, 1975. Babcock & Rimmler. Gary Olsen, Esq. appeared and renewed request for a public hearing. The Planning Board is waiting for the recommendations of Lawrence Tuthill, Engineer, and Raymond Dean, Superintendent of Highways. Greenfields. Gary 01sen, Esq. appeared. Mr. Olsen asked the Planning Board to accept the bond presented for the roads. It names the record owners as well as other co-principles. An affidavit has been given as to who the record owners are and he feels the bond is more than sufficient. Mr. Olsen has talked to the Town Attorney and if the Planning Board wants the bond changed it should be given to him. Mr. Raynor read the letter from Mr. Tasker about the co-principles and the bond being returned and said we should follow the advice of the Town Attorney. Mr. Olsen will see if he can get the Town Attorney to write a letter saying the bond is sufficient. Macari. Gary Olsen, Esq. appeared. A copy of this map will be sent to the Superintendent of Highways for his recommendations as to where the road comes out of the subdivision because it is a bad stretch of highway. Mr. Olsen requested that the Planning Board review it so by the next meeting some constructive comments can be made. He will send two additional copies of the map. Planning Board -5- September 18, 1975 Laurelwood Estates, Section II. Gary Olsen, Esq. appeared. Mr. Olsen requested a copy of the recommendations of Larry Tuthill, P. E. which are as follows: 1. That catch basins included at Woodside Lane Ext. at junction of Wood Lane. 2. That provisions be made drain water from west side of White Eagle Drive to recharge basins other than valley gutters since this is the main drive. 3. That the standard recharge basin be constructed. 8:00 p.m. - Public Hearing on the final map of the subdiv- ision known as "Soundview Acres at Orient". Mr. Raynor read the notice of hearing. NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that pursuant to Section 276 of the Town Law, Public Hearing will be held by the Southold Tow~ Planning Board at the Town Clerk's Office, Main Road, Southold, New York, in said town on the 18th day of September, 1975 on the question of the following: 8:00 p.m. Approval of the final map of property owned by Carl G. Hornwood known as "Soundview Acres at Orient" consisting of a parcel of land situate, lying and being at Orient in the Town of Southold, Suffolk County, New York, bounded and described as follows: BEGINNING at a point on the easterly line of 01d Main Road, 410.72 feet northerly along said easterly line f.rom the curved northeasterly line of the Main (State) Road, from said point of beginning running along said easterly line of Old Main Road, N. 8° 31' 40" W. 204.50 feet; thence N. 64° 32' 50" W. 125.08 feet to land formerly of Rose, now of N. Pappas; thence along said last mentioned land, N. 5° 44' 10" W. 1172.83 feet to a monument and land of Morris; thence along said land of Morris the following two courses and distances: (1) S. 89° 10' 00" E. 302 feet to a monument; thence (2) N. 7° 41' 30" W. 399 feet to the ordinary highwater mark of Long Island Sound; running thence along the ordinary highwater mark of Long Island Sound, N. 82° 50' E. 62.94 feet to land of Orient Realty Corporation; running thence along said land of Orient Realty Corporation, S. 13° 12' 10" E. 1848.98 feet; running thence along land of R. Tuthill Estate, S. 87° 22' 20" W. 473.29 feet to the point or place of beginning. Containing 16.368 acres, more or less. Any person desiring to be heard on the above matter should appear at the time and place above specified. Dated: August 19, 1975 BY ORDER OF THE SOUTHOLD TOWN PLANNING BOARD JOHN WICXHAM, CHAIRMAN Planning Board -6- September 18, 1975 Affidavit of publication was presented from the Suffolk Weekly Times duly notarized. Mr. Moisa: Looking over the checklist, the first discussion was held on December 6th of 1973. Preliminary hearing was held on August 5, 1974. We have reports from the Highway Superintendent and the Highway Committee, the latter one being March 13, 1975. Approval of the preliminary map was given on September 16, 1974. Everything seems to be in order. As is customary, we will ask for anyone who wishes to speak in opposition to this subdivision. Hearing none, I will ask for anyone who wants to speak in favor of it. Richard J. Cron, Esq.: I am appearing on behalf of the applicant. In light of the fact that all requirements of this board and all other agencies of the Town have been complied with, we respectfully request that the Board approve the final map of "Soundview Acres at Orient". Mr. Moisa: Does anyone else want to speak? Hearing none, I will declare the hearing closed. Long Pond Estates. Mr. Cron and Mr. Ernest Wilsberg appeared. In view of the fact that all recommendations have been complied with, this map is ready to be presented as a preliminary submission. Greenbriar Acres. Mr. Cron appeared. Mr. Cron requested the recommendations of Larry Tuthill, P.E. and Raymond Dean, Superintendent of Highways, but they have not been received in this office as yet. Orient Point. Mr. Cron and Mr. Ernest Wilsberg appeared. Mr. Cron showed a possible plan to develop this property in a cluster concept. Ben Mendozza. Mr. Mendozza presented a map o~ his property showing a tap street. Mr. Mendozza feels the drainage area is really just an overflow for the catch basins to be installed. He feels it will only drain six or seven lots and doesn't want to put in a recharge basin and fencing as recommended by Lawrence Tuthill, P.E. The Board will discuss this with Mr. Tuthill and see what he says about catch basins. Planning Boar~ -7- September 18, 1975 Greton. Dave Horton, Bill Grebe and Gary Olsen appeared. New profiles dated September 12, 1975 were studied. Mr. Olsen said these were acceptable to Larry Tuthill. Public hearing will be set when final maps are received. Hodo~. Sound Shore Acres at Arshamomaque. Gary Olsen appeared. It was suggested that the roads be named and the following recommendations of Larry Tuthill, P.E. were presented, a copy of which is to be mailed to Mr. 01sen. 1. Recommended that water mains be included. 2. Request that catch basins and leaching basins be included at intersection of Albertson Lane and Road "A". 3. Request that catch basins and piping be included at intersection Albertson Lane and Road "C" to drain water to recharge basin. Col. Ted Dowd. Gary 01sen appeared. The following recommendations of Lawrence Tuthill, P. E. were read and a copy will be forwarded to Mr. 01sen. It is noted that the recharge basin has been eliminated. It is essential that this be included to take care of the increased run-off caused by this subdivision. On motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Coyle, it was RESOLVED to approve the sketch map of the minor subdivision of property owned by Edward Gibbons located at Mattituck, New York, on map dated June 12, 1975. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Raynor, Grebe, Coyle. Simicich. Charles Cuddy appeared. Mr. Cuddy and the Board discussed the recommendations of the County Planning Commission as pertain to this subdivision. They are confusing and it was suggested that Mr. Cuddy contact the Town Attorney for clarification. Schriever. Charles Cuddy, William aud Barbara Schriever appeared. Planning Board -8- September 18, 1975 The small pieces were discussed. Mr. Cuddy said what they had intended to do was restrict these particular pieces by indicating that they were restricted to open space and not any development. He felt if they were conveyed out tomorrow they would be doing exactly the same thing as is being suggested. Mr. Raynor said it was represented that there was enough open space without the odds and ends. Mr. Moisa said Mr. Schriever said he would get rid of these and he thinks it still lies in the minds of the Town Board. Mr. Cuddy said that no matter what they would remain in open space. Mr. Raynor said it was the oponion of the Board to dispose of them or incorporate them back into the map. Mr. Raynor went on to discuss the proposed covenants and restrictions. Mr. Raynor: In the declaration there are two mortgagees and I take it they would also sign these declarations? Mr. Cuddy: Yes, that is no problem. Mr. Raynor: In Section 9 on parcel l, Setback Requirements, the last sentence. Small open portions will have to go to the Board of Appeals and you may not want this in your covenants and restrictions. Section 2, Sales Activities Permitted. Under the town regulations you can only set up one 'for sale' sign per parcel. You can't have a real estate business with sub-agents. Under Section 29, if you do this there is a question os whether you establish a subdivision line which is really getting back to what they are talking about. Mr. Cuddy: I think the intent was to permit even exchanges. Mr. Ray-nor: Appeals. It would be subject to review of the Board of Mr. Cuddy: If we convey out a piece the covenant would remain on it and we would get a piece back and the covenant would remain on the piece that we took back. Mr. Schriever: That deals only with one particular instance. It refers to a certain side of lot l0 to allow this exchange to be made after the development is complete with Mrs. Vail. Mr. Raynor: Section 30 - Open Space Requirement. 'Any development of said premises requiring a building permit shall also be subject to the approval of the Planning Board of the Town of Southold.' This particular section wouldn't come under our jurisdiction. It would be the site plan for the location of the building on the property. Section 31 - Water Supply Permitted. It takes in the entire block which means all the adjoining properties which would normally surpass the water reserves. Mr. Cuddy: That particular paragraph was suggested to us by the Health Department and mandated by the Suffolk County Plauning Board -9- September 18, 1975 Department of Environmental Control. They have made one of the most intensive water studies on this piece of land. That is why we put it in. They are saying if there are problems this would be very helpful to be able to tap in to where they know there is water. They are satisfied that there is water in here. I don't know of any objection to these people going in here to get decent water. Mr. Raynor: The fencing permitted would have to be amended so it would fall within the zoning ordinance. There was a question on the part of the Building Inspector as to the fencing requirements not corresponding to what is in the ordinance. Mr. Cuddy: We tried to put in restrictions that were the best for the development of this property. We believe that the town law is going to supercede any covenants and restrictions that we have and what is Town Law will have to be obeyed. Mr. Raynor: If you got a change of zone on a portion of the property would it obliterate the remainder of the property as far as your restrictions are concerned. It says all or a portion. Mr. Cuddy: What are we going to do about getting some approval for a map. We have been here for awhile. This is essentially the map we have always had and I understand now the Town has taken a position about the lots around the periphery. Where does it leave us? Mr. Moisa: We can't approve it until we get something from the Town Board. Mr. Cuddy: I would like the Planuing Board to give approval subject to what the town is going to do. Could we have a resolution subject to getting the approval of the Town Board? We certainly are going to have to comply with what they have in mind. I would ask this Board to give us some sort of approval so we can march in some direction. Other- wise we could be going back and forth for a long time. We would certainly appreciate your giving some consideration to giving approval with the condition. It is my under- standing that this is basically a Town Board position. Highland Estates. Richard Lark, Esq. appeared. Mr. Lark: This map is in substantial conformance with what was entered into at the time preliminary approval was obtained. I would like to request that final hearing be waived. Mr. Lark has presented all the papers necessary to have a public hearing on the final map. Planning Boara -10- September 18, 1975 Souud Road Estates. Steve Tsontakis appeared. Larry Tuthill, P. E., recommendations under date of May 5, 1975 were read: 1. That drainage area be provided within the sub- division. 2. That Dogwood Lane be straightened so as to provide a safe entrance from the proposed road at Lots Nos. 5 thru 9. 3. That connections be provided to adjacent properties of Kleinschmidt and Murphy. 4. That the park and playground are square rather such au odd shape. 5. That water lines be included. The Planning Board didn't see much merit in a connection to Kleinschmidt but a connecting road should be dropped to the west. Mr. Tsontakis requested a copy of the recommendations. On motion made by Mr. Coyle, seconded by Mr. Grebe, it was RESOLVED to hold a public hearing on the preliminary map of subdivision of property owned by Charles DeVoe aud known as "Beaujolais Acres" located at Orient, New York, map dated May 6, 1975. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Coyle, Grebe, Raynor. Doebler. It was decided to check the legality of decreasing the setback line or leaving it to the discretion of the Building and State DEC before taking any action on this minor subdivision. On motion made by Mr. Grebe, seconded by Mr. Raynor, it was RESOLVED to recommend to the Southold Town Board the bond estimate in the amount of $77,000.00 for the subdiv- isionknown as "Soundview Acres at Orient". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. Planning Boar~ ~ll- September 18, 1975 On motion made by Mr. Grebe, seconded by Mr. Raynor, it was RESOLVED to recommend to the Southold Tow~ Board the bond estimate in the amount of $72,000.00 for the subdiv- ision known as "Eli~ahTs Lane Estates, Section ?". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. On motion made by Mr. Grebe, seconded by Mr. Raynor, it was RESOLVED to recommend to the Southold Town Board the bond estimate in the amount of $35,000.00 for the subdiv- ision known as "Peconic Knolls". Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. On motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Coyle, it was RESOLVED to approve the final map of the subdivision known as "Soundview Acres at Orient" owned by Carl G. Hornwood, subject to receipt of bond by the Southold Town Board, receipt of inspection fee, review of Suffolk County Planning Commission. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. On motion made by Mr. Raynor, seconded by Mr. Coyle, it was RESOLVED to hold a public hearing on the final map of the subdivision known as "Highland Estates" located at Cutchogue, New York. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. On motion made by Mr. Coyle, seconded by Mr. Grebe, it was RESOLVED to hold a public hearing on October 28, 1975 in the matter of the amendment of the Rules and Regulations for the Subdivision of Land as follows: By amending Subdivision B of Section 106-33 of Article III of the Town of Southold Land Subdivision Regulations as follows: Planning Board -127 September 18, 1975 B. Improvements. Streets shall be graded and improved with pavements, curbs and gutters, sidewalks, drainage facilities, water mains, sewers, streetlights and street signs, street trees and fire hydrants and/or firewells. Firewells shall have an eight-inch casing, a ta~enty-foot bronze screen, and shall have a pumping capacity of three hundred fifty gallons per minute. There shall be a depth of water of at least forty feet. There shall be a minimum of one fire hydrant and/or firewell for each thirty dwelling lots shown on the subdivision map. Notwithstanding the foregoing, upon request, the Planning Board, upon written approval of the Superintendent of Highways and the Town Board Highway Committee, may waive, subject to appropriate conditions, such improvements as it considers may be omitted without jeopardy to the public health, safety and general welfare. Pedestrian eastments shall be improved as required by the Planning Board. Such grading and improve- ments shall be approved as to design and specifications by the Town Superintendent of Highways and the Town Board Highway Committee. By amending Paragraph 9 of Subdivision A of Section 106-42 of Article III of the Town of Southold Land Subdiv- ision Regulations as follows: (9) The approximate location and size of all proposed water lines, valves, hydrauts and/or firewells, sewer lines and fire alarm boxes; connections to existing lines or alternate means of water supply or sewage disposal and treatment, as provided in the Public Health Law, profiles of all proposed water and sewer lines. By amending Paragraph 6 of Subdivision A of Section 106-43 of Article IV of the Town of Southold Land Subdivision Regulations as follows: (6) An estimate as to the cost of the required improve- ments, including, but not limited to, streets, curbing, sanitary sewers, storm drain lines, water lines, fire hydrants and/or firewells. By amending Subdivision A of Section 106-43 of Article IV of the Town of Southold Lsnd Subdivision Regulations by adding a new paragraph to be Paragraph (8) to read as follows: (8) If firewells are to be installed, a copy of the proposed agreement to be entered into with the appropriate fire district to convey title to said firewells to the fire district when completed, together with legal access thereto. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. The next meeting of the Southold Town Planning Board will be held October 6, 1975 with the following meeting date October 28, 1975. Planning Board -13- September 18, 1975 On motion made by Mr. Rayuor, seconded by Mr. Grebe, it was RESOLVED to deny approval of the preliminary map of property owned by William Schriever located at Orient based on the fact that the Southold Town Board has not given approval for this piece of property to be developed in the cluster concept. Vote of the Board: Ayes: Moisa, Grebe, Coyle, Raynor. Motion was made by Mr. Coyle, seconded by Mr. Grebe and carried that the meeting be adjourned. Meeting adjourned at 10:30 p.m. Respectfully submitted, Muriel Brush, Secretary Southold Town Planning Board John ~ickham, Chairman