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HomeMy WebLinkAboutTR-03/19/2008James F. King, President Jill M. Doherty, Vice-President Peggy A. Dickerson Dave Bergen Bob Ghosio, Jr. ho~apF SOUryo~ #~ l*o* G • ~, ~~~'~OOUM'I ,~~,~ BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES TOWN OF SOUTHOLD BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES TOWN OF SOUTHOLD Minutes Wednesday, March 19, 2008 6:00 PM Present were: James King, President Jill Doherty, Vice President Peggy Dickerson, Trustee Dave Bergen, Trustee Bob Ghosio, Trustee Pat Finnegan, Town Attorney Elizabeth Cantrell, Clerk-Typist CALL MEETING TO ORDER PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE Town Hall 53095 Route 25 P.O. Box 1179 Southold, New York 11971-0959 Telephone (631) 765-1892 Fax (831) 765-6841 RECEIVED ~ FI t-ED 3'~ d5 p. m . JUN 1 9 2008 So~>~Cer71 k NEXT FIELD INSPECTION: Wednesday, April 9, 2008 at 8:00 AM NEXT TRUSTEE MEETING: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 at 6:00 PM WORKSESSION: 5:30 PM 19, 2008. TRUSTEE KING: Good evening, folks, my name is Jim King, I have the pleasure being the chairman of this Board. I would like to introduce everybody that is here. To my far left is Trustee Dave Bergen; next to him is Peggy Dickerson, Trustee; Jill Doherty is our vice-chair; myself; Board of Trustees March 19, 2008 Elizabeth Cantrell is with us tonight, she is filling in for Lauren Standish; Bob Ghosio is our other trustee. And to my far right is Kieran Corcoran, our attorney, he's our legal assistant tonight and; we have Wayne Galante keeping track of what everybody says. Jack McGreevy is here from the CAC. CAC is the Conservation Advisory Council. They go out and do almost the same inspections we do. They give us their input on how they think things should be handheld at the site, different recommendations. With that, we'll get going. The next field inspection, Wednesday, April 9, eight o'clock in the morning. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Motion to approve. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Regular meeting will be April 16 at 6:00; work session at 5:30. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Motion to approve. TRUSTEE KING: Second? TRUSTEE BERGEN: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Motion to approve the minutes of October 3 and November 14. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: I gave them to Liz. There are a few minor typos that I checked off and highlighted and changed in the minutes. They are simple typos. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I had E-mailed some changes, same thing, we probably found the same ones. I found some simple typos also. I E-mailed them to Wayne TRUSTEE KING: Motion to approve those minutes. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: So moved TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) I. MONTHLY REPORTS: TRUSTEE KING: The Trustees monthly report for February, 2008. A check for $5,741.24 was forwarded to the Supervisor's office for the General Fund. II. PUBLIC NOTICES: TRUSTEE KING: Public notices are posted on the Town Clerk's Board of Trustees 3 Mazch 19, 2008 bulletin board for review. III. STATE ENVIRONMENTAL QUALITY REVIEWS: TRUSTEE KING: We have a number of environmental quality reviews. Resolved that the Board of Trustees of the Town of Southold hereby finds that the following applications more fully described in Section VI Public Hearings Section of the Trustee agenda dated Wednesday, March 19, 2008, are classified as Type II Actions pursuant to SEQRA Rules and Regulations and are not subject to further review under SEQRA. We'll list those in the minutes. Daniel Hume -SCTM#83-2-9.1 John Elick - as Trustee -SCTM#95-1-5 Paul & Cheryl Ragusa -SCTM#50-1-6 Robert Meyer -SCTM#6-1-12.1 Stirling Harbor Shipyard at Greenport, Inc. - SCTM#43-3-2 Lloyd Kaplan -SCTM#50-2-3 Ira Nagel -SCTM#104-9-14 William Gaillard -SCTM#9-3-5 Fishers Island Ferry District -Fox Lane Mary Ann Mears -SCTM#116-5-12 Cleaves Point POA -SCTM#35-6-30 Pirate's Cove Marina, Inc. -SCTM#10-3-22 Fishers Island Yacht Club -SCTM#10-1-9 Hay Harbor Club -SCTM#9-3-1 Linda Borden -SCTM#9-9-27.4 Educational and Cultural Fund (Santorini Beachcomber Motel) SCTM#83-2-1,2&17.2 Michael & Heather Gill -SCTM#115-11-9 Lewis Topper -SCTM#123-6-13 Spiro Geroulanos -SCTM#104-9-13 Ann G. Dearborn - SCTM#4-3-1 TRUSTEE KING: Motion to approve that resolution? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: Second? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) IV. RESOLUTIONS -ADMINISTRATIVE PERMITS: TRUSTEE KING: We'll get right into the meat of things, I guess. The following resolutions -- this was left over from the Board of Trustees 4 Mazch 19, 2008 meeting we had last month. The public hearing is closed. We have a resolution prepared for this. This is on behalf of JOHN NICKLES CIO BEIXEDON ESTATE PROPERTY OWNERS ASSOCIATION. I'll read the resolution because the information that is in the first page is in this resolution, so there is no sense in doing it twice. Whereas Suffolk Environmental Consulting on behalf of JOHN NICKLES C/O BEIXEDON ESTATE PROPERTY OWNERS ASSOCIATION applied to Southold Town Trustees for a permit under provisions of Chapter 97, now Chapter 275 of the Southold Town Code, Wetland Ordinance of the Town of Southold, application dated December 5, 2003; whereas said application was referred to the Southold Town CAC for their findings and recommendations; whereas a public hearing was held by the Town Trustees with respect to said application on March 24, 2004, at which time all interested persons were given an opportunity to be heard; and whereas the Board members personally reviewed and familiarized themselves with the premises in question and the surrounding area; and whereas the Board considered all the testimony and documentation submitted concerning this application; and whereas the Board found the structure complied with the standards set forth in Chapter 97, now 275, of the Southold Town Code; and whereas the Board determined that the project as proposed would not affect the health, safety and general welfare of the people of the Town; and whereas on March 24, 2004, the Board of Trustees of the Town of Southold resolved to approve the application of John Nickles care of Beixedon Estate Property Owners Association to remove and replace the existing northern timber bulkhead, timber return replaced inkind/inplace, ten feet plus or minus linear feet. Westerly bulkhead run, replaced inkind/inplace, 254 plus or minus linear feet; replace 42 linear feet inkind/inplace easterly bulkhead run reduced to a single groin and decreased in length by 30 feet to measure 278 plus or minus linear feet in length. Southern timber bulkhead replace inkind/inplace 81 plus or minus linear feet, easterly bulkhead run replaced inkind/inplace 78 linear feet. All work must be done in accordance with approved plans prepared by Suffolk Environmental Consulting last dated April 1, 2004. All remaining debris shall be completely removed from the area to an approved upland area for disposal. Whereas on December 21, 2005, the Board of Trustees granted applicant cone-year extension of the 2004 wetlands permit, and; whereas on or about October 25, 2006, Justice Cohalan of the Supreme Court of the County of Suffolk issued a decision upholding the Board's grant of the permit to applicant. Whereas the applicant failed to secure Board of Trustees March 19, 2008 further extensions of time for the permit granted by the Board, causing such permit to expire and thus necessitating a new application for the previously approved activity. And whereas the applicant is permitted further activity by the Army Corps of Engineers, the New York State DEC and New York State Department of State; and whereas on February 13, 2008, Southold Town CAC resolved to support the present application; whereas on February 26, 2008, the LWRP coordinator recommended that the activity to be found to be a minor action exempt from review under chapter 268 of the Town Code and; whereas on February 27, 2008, a public hearing was held on the application and public comment was taken; and whereas the Board members have conducted additional site visits to the subject property and; whereas the Board has considered the public comments submitted in writing and expressed at the public hearing. Now therefore be it resolved the Board of Trustees of the Town of Southold approved the application of John Nickles c/o Beixedon Estate Property Owners Association to remove and replace the existing northern timber bulkhead, timber return replaced inkind/inplace ten feet plus or minus linear feet; westerly bulkhead run replaced inkind/inplace 254 linear feet, replace 42 linear feet inkind/inplace; easterly bulkhead run reduced to a single groin and decreased in length by 30 feet to measure 278 linear feet in length; southern timber bulkhead replace inkind/inplace 81 plus or minus linear feet; easterly bulkhead replaced inkind/inplace 78 linear feet. All work must be done in accordance with the approved plans prepared by Suffolk Environmental Consulting last dated April 1, 2004. All remaining debris shall be completely removed from the area to an approved upland area for disposal. Be it further resolved aten-foot non-turf buffer is to be maintained along the full length of the bulkheaded area approximately 254 linear feet in length. And the other note I would like to make in this, all this construction is with plastic bulkheading. It's not treated timber bulkheading. It's all vinyl plastic Shore Guard materials. I'll make a motion to approve this resolution. Do I have a second? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE BERGEN: Number iwo, ROGER FLORE requests an Administrative Permit for the existing 6x27' second-story deck and 16x27' deck attached to the existing dwelling, and for the existing 10x16' detached deck. Located: 1555 Fleetwood Road, Cutchogue. I went out and looked at this and what I want to do is, all we Boazd of Trustees Mazch 19, 2008 are addressing in this permit request is just the decking. And I measured it out and I just want to make sure that it's accurately reflected here in the plans. What was listed as a 10x16' deck that cantilevers out over the bank is actually 10'x17'10", and there is two benches at seven foot long by one-and-one-half feet wide. So I have no problem recommending approval of this but I just want to make sure the plans accurately reflect what is there. Sir, are you here -- MR. FLORE: I'm Roger Flore. I just bought the home last month and I was told I had to come down to extend the permit, I take it. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Do you have any objections to amending it so it accurately reflects what is there? MR. FLORE: I think on the plan I had, it was ten -- is that what you said, 10x17'? TRUSTEE BERGEN: The one I had was 10x16. MR. FLORE: This one was submitted a while back. I have a copy here. It's the same one. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I crossed out 16 and put 17'10". Because I measured it out. That way it's -- TRUSTEE DICKERSON: He's saying there is an inaccuracy and he remembered it. That's all. MR. FLORE: Okay, fine. TRUSTEE BERGEN: So what I would do is make a motion to approve this Administrative Permit, if you just submit a new survey, when you have the survey done for the property, for the sale, because this is an old survey. MR. FLORE: It's been done. TRUSTEE BERGEN: A new survey has been done? MR. FLORE: We closed on the property three or four weeks ago. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Okay, because I'm looking at a survey that's in the file here that does not have a date. It was cut off, unfortunately, by the copy machine. May 4, and then we don't have a year here. William and Janet Walsh? MR. FLORE: Yes. Is that the one with the dock on it as well? TRUSTEE BERGEN: This doesn't have a dock on it. That is a plan approved for a dock. This is a survey. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: This one has it accurately. TRUSTEE BERGEN: It's written in 10x16. It's actually -- okay. What we can do is just write it in on this one. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Why don't we get a copy. TRUSTEE BERGEN: It's the same thing. He has the very same thing. Again, his is 10x17 and it's 10x17'10". We are just putting it on the plan so he doesn't have to get a new survey. I make a motion to approve this. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Did we want to put the description of the stairs? Board of Trustees March 19, 2008 MR. FLORE: I'm coming later for that on the dock. I'm on the list again. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Sorry, I thought that was -- thank you. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I think this is, because the other one is a transfer of a permit. This one is just, this is for an Administrative Permit, so I think we should put the stairs in on this so it can all be done on this, and that way we don't have to do anything to the transfer of the permit when we get to that location. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: That's what I thought we were going to do. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Also what we want to do is add the stairs, which I measured out, going down the -- there were two landings there; five foot and five-and-a-half by 4'10" with nine steps between them. The first one and the second, and eight steps to the lower one. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: So the stairs as per the survey? MR. CORCORAN: You can actually do the transfer first. Do the transfer right now then amend it or do the administrative on it. TRUSTEE BERGEN: The transfer is listed as number ten under Applications for Amendments Extensions and Transfers MR. CORCORAN: Because he can't amend somebody else's permit. He has to first have it transferred to him and have whatever changes done to his own permit. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Then I would like to make a motion to table this. MR. CORCORAN: You can do the transfer now, just do it out of order. TRUSTEE KING: Why don't we just do ten now. TRUSTEE BERGEN: That's what I'm saying, we'll table number two now. MR. CORCORAN: You don't need a motion. It's not a public hearing or anything right now. Just handle the transfer then do whatever changes you are going to do with it. TRUSTEE KING: We'll just jump to number ten. TRUSTEE BERGEN: We'll jump to number ten under Roman numeral five, Application for Amendments, Extensions and Transfers. That number ten is to transfer permit #5053 from William Walsh to Roger Flore. Again, I went out and looked at it. Actually what is there is less than what is depicted on the plans. There is less structure there than what is depicted on the plans. So given that, I make a motion to approve this transfer. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE BERGEN: Now, go back to number two under Roman numeral four, the Administrative Permit we were just talking about. Now that it's been transferred into your name, I would make a motion to approve this Administrative Permit with the corrections of the specific size of the deck being 10'x17'10" with two benches on it, 7x1.5' and then what is listed here as 5x27' timber stairs and landings. Board of Trustees March 19, 2008 MR. FLORE: That's the second-story deck. TRUSTEE BERGEN: That's fine. The second story deck is fine. First story deck is fine. Now I've addressed the deck that is cantilevered out over the bluff. Now I'm trying to deal with the stairs going down to the dock. And they were listed as 5x27 and they are actually, the width is 4'10". It's not a big deal. It's only two inches. So with that I'll make a motion to approve this, just with the amendment of the deck to the correct size including the benches. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE BERGEN: And to include the stairs and second-story deck and first-story deck. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Number three, DBV Partners on behalf of ADRIAN SAPOLLNIK requests an Administrative Permit to trim/remove trees and brush from within the wetland buffer area. Located: 225 Lakeside Drive South, Southold. We all looked at this and there was minimal trimming and removal of dead trees, but we did want a 15-foot buffer. I don't know if there is anybody here for this application. But we did want a 15-foot buffer. Did we want to make it conditional on coming in for a permit? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We wanted to add the phragmites to the permit because they trimmed the phragmites as well. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Did we talk about getting a permit for a dock and making it conditionally with this permit or not? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I just think we wanted to notify them and tell them. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Liz, do you know if we notified them of the need for a permit? MS. CANTRELL: Lauren was asked, if she was, I'm sure she did one. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: We'll just make a note they need to be notified they need a permit for the dock. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: It's a dock that has been there for a while. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: So I'll make a motion to approve this Administrative Permit to remove and trim trees and bushes as they have sketched here with also a permit to trim the phragmites to 12 inches, with a 15-foot, non-turt buffer. And that's it. TRUSTEE BERGEN: And trim the phragmites by hand. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: And trim the phragmites by hand. Second? TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) Board of Trustees March 19, 2008 V. APPLICATIONS FOR AMENDMENTS/EXTENSIONSITRANSFERS: TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Number one, FRED FRAGOLA requests an Amendment to Permit #6452 for the existing motorized boat-lift installed within the boat basin. Located: 1145 Gull Pond Lane, Greenport. Mr. Fragola, this has been installed already? MR. FRAGOLA: Fred Fragola. Yes. What I said to you in the first thing, I assembled it, I didn't finalize it, so you could see what it looked like. It's not completed. It's not operational. It's just simply put in place. There is no boat on it, it's never been used. I took pictures when I was out there just in case nobody has, so you could see what it looks like. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes, because we didn't have it on our inspection agenda, so we didn't go out and look at it. MR. FRAGOLA: Okay. TRUSTEE KING: Let's look at the pictures first. I kind of like to see it in place. MR. FRAGOLA: As far as what, Jim? TRUSTEE KING: After it's all done, when you are done with it I would like to take a look at it after the fact. You don't have the capability of picking the boat up now or anything. MR. FRAGOLA: No, it's just a major undertaking. It's really more than I could really eat. More to the point, all I did was assembled it, boomed everything in there and I stopped. I had literally, probably three days of sweat labor to assemble it. It's a lot of adjustments to take place and I'm not prepared to work in the water anymore until it thaws out. 1 drop everything in the water, it seems like. TRUSTEE KING: If we don't do this until next month, will it hold you up? MR. FRAGOLA: No. TRUSTEE KING: Why don't we just put it on for the next field inspection, I'll go out and take a look, all right? MR. FRAGOLA: Sure. If you give me a minute so I can find all the pictures I took. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I'll make a motion to table this to next month so we can take a look at it. TRUSTEE KING: Second. All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE DOHERTY: If you find them, let us know. MR. FRAGOLA: I probably left it in my truck. I have one question to ask the Board before I step out of here. I don't -- bingo. Here we go. I don't plan on putting the boat in for probably other month or two. So I would need a good month before I could get the boat out there. This is some quick shots. (handing photographs.) If you see what I did here, I know it's not the best shots, you'll Board of Trustees 10 Mazch 19, 2008 see temporary, the old wires, all I did was assemble what it looks like. I didn't do more than that. TRUSTEE KING: I didn't expect it to look like that. I don't know why. How big a boat can you pick up with that? MR. FRAGOLA: Weight wise or size? TRUSTEE KING: Both. MR. FRAGOLA: You can lift up about 35,000 pounds and Iguess -- that's agood question. Maybe about 40 feet. I'm guessing. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Wow. MR. FRAGOLA: If you look at it, when you people take the time to go out there, when you look at the elevation points, I know these are poor shots, but it gives you an idea. This is the top of the motors. It's where it sits is the same elevation as my piling is on, so it's not above anything, and the whole thing is essentially so the boat doesn't come out to where it's protruding from above. I just don't have the lift. TRUSTEE KING: So it gets out of the water. MR. FRAGOLA: Essentially. And when foul weather comes around we sink it back in the water. TRUSTEE KING: We'll go out next month. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We can go out April 9. MR. FRAGOLA: I have one other question, Jim. You've spoken to me about the revegetation on the side of the property. I was looking at trying to follow what you indicated. White Pines. I spoke to Chuck Hamilton, he said no. Then I spoke to him a while ago, he said maybe. I'm not doing anything until the Board goes out. They are all White Pines that are there. I'm trying to retain everything that is there. I put everything I was supposed to put in, I looked at it over the winter. It's starting to erode. I'll start revegetating again. I was just curious if you think it's a good idea to put the White Pine in before the season gets on top of us. All right? TRUSTEE KING: Yes. MR. FRAGOLA: Thank you. TRUSTEE KING: Two, three, four and five we can lump together. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: And seven, eight and nine. We can lump all those together. So it's number two, Creative Environmental Design on behalf of DENNIS HICKEY requests an Amendment to Permit #6779 to install a flagpole above the non-disturbance buffer, below the retaining wall. Located: 175 Clearwater Lane, Cutchogue. Number three, Samuels & Steelman Architects on behalf of WALTER GITLIN requests an Amendment to Permit #6224 to construct a new uncovered entry deck and steps on the north side of the house; Board of Trustees 11 March 19, 2008 remove approved steps from south side deck to grade; and install a 7' high fence from house to garage, enclosing garden. Located: 1180 Smith Drive South, Southold. Number four, Patricia Moore on behalf of PERT HINDEN requests an Amendment to Permit #6732 to relocated the pilings on the floating dock as depicted on the plans prepared by Robert H. Fox last dated December 31, 2007. Located: 1255 Woodcliff Drive, Mattituck. Number five, JMO Environmental Consulting Services on behalf of NOL, LLC requests an Amendment to Permit #6432 to demolish the existing single-family dwelling prior to the construction of the new dwelling. Located: Private Road, Fishers Island. Number seven, Suffolk Environmental Consulting on behalf of CJC1 requests an Amendment to Permit #6725 to construct a 80x112' commercial building to contain a 40x80' garage/storage area, 12x80' common area, 42x40' retail or office space and a 42x40' office space. Second-floor to contain a 33x36' apartment and a3,772 unfinished attic space. Proposed structure will be served by one attendant sanitary system and drywells to handle storm water runoff. Construct a parking area with attendant drainage to accommodate atwo-inch rainfall event. Located: 74495 Rt. 25, Greenport. Number eight, ANN MARIE NELSON requests aOne-Year Extension to Permit #6354, as issued on April 19, 2006. Located: 1420 9th Street, Greenport. Number nine, Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of JOSEPH BRITTMAN requests aOne-Year Extension to Permit #6346 as issued on April 19, 2006. Located: 80 Glenn Road, Southold. We looked at them, we had no problem with any of them. They were straightforward amendments or extensions. I'll make a motion to approve them as listed. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Now we'll do number six. Garrett A. Strang, Architect on behalf of SPIRO GEROULANOS requests an Amendment to Permit #684 to remove the existing dock, replace catwalk, dock and floating dock in same location; float to be landward so as to be above high water depth at float. Located: 2130 Broadwaters Road, Cutchogue. Board of Trustees 12 March 19, 2008 I had a question. It's confusing to me. The float to be landward so as to be above high water depth. It doesn't make sense to me. MR. STRANG: That's incorrect. The catwalk is to be brought further landward than it presently is, so it's above the high water mark. Not the float, but the catwalk. TRUSTEE KING: That makes more sense. The catwalk is being extended landward, in other words. MR. STRANG: Correct. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I want to make a comment to the audience. This is not the property we are talking about (indicating) but in the interim of some pictures that either we don't have or there is a fairly big gap between inspection sites, we are going to try to put in some best management or environmentally friendly ideas that people are using. This is the grated catwalk. MR. STRANG: Excuse me. Is that aluminum or plastic? TRUSTEE KING: That's plastic. There is different styles and different types. Some fiberglass. That happens to be plastic. What they are one foot sections; one-foot by four-foot sections. It looks pretty good. I don't think that let's quite as much light through as some of the other ones but still it's much letter than the solid decking. It does let light through so you do get some vegetation growth. In my mind that's better than having it four foot up in the air. Because the light goes through it, it can be lower. The DEC is letting us get down lower. So, esthetically, I think it's much better. MR. STRANG: I think it's a better thing. TRUSTEE KING: We all went out and looked at this. This is a minor action under the LWRP. So it's exempt. I don't think anybody had any problem with this. It's a landward extension. We are going out a little further seaward is it or -- MR. STRANG: Yes, we are going out a little further seaward but we are making sure we are behind the neighboring dock, or no further than the neighboring dock. TRUSTEE KING: I'm just looking at the neighboring dock. I know there is another dock here, I know this is well within, in that pier line. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: It has the soundings here, 2.3 feet. He had only 1.5 where it exists. TRUSTEE KING: CAC recommended approval, to support the application. They want aten-foot, non-turf buffer with non-treated pilings and grated catwalk. They have the grated catwalk. The dock should not inhabit the flat road access in accordance with public trust. These low profile docks, you step right over them. It's not a problem anymore. It's not like it's an obstruction. It's a plus. There is really no turf or anything down there now. I think later on we'll be addressing that whole Board of Trustees 13 March 19, 2008 area in another application, so. I think this is all right. I'll make a motion to approve as submitted. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. STRANG: Thank you, very much. TRUSTEE KING: I'll make a motion to go off the regular meeting and go into our public hearing section. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Before we move on, we should mention the postponements. There are a lot of them. POSTPONEMENTS: Page four, number seven is postponed, Costello Marine on behalf of RICHARD K. JOHNSON 8~ PAMELA MAINO, request a Wetland Permit to construct a 4'10' ramp up to a 4x18' level fixed dock section with a 3x10' seasonal wooden ramp onto a seasonal 5x18' floating dock secured by two 4"x4" posts. Located: 7617 Soundview Avenue, Southold, is postponed. Number nine, CLEAVES POINT POA requests a Wetland Permit to re-sheath sections, totaling up to 32+/-linear feet maximum, of the landward side of existing bulkhead using vinyl, T&G plank sheathing with filter fabric liner, and backfill with 20+/- cubic yards of clean sand from an upland source. Located: 345 Osprey Nest Road, Greenport, has been postponed. Number ten, Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of VARUJAN ARSLANYAN requests a Wetland Permit to install a docking facility consisting of two floats, each 8x20' and secured by four 8" diameter piles, with access by hinged ramp 4x16' secured at its landward end to existing bulkhead. Located: 1280 Sage Blvd., Greenport, has been postponed. Number 11, Suffolk Environmental Consulting on behalf of LLOYD KAPLAN requests a Wetland Permit to construct a swimming pool with a surrounding patio and attendant pool equipment, pool drywell and pool fencing, landscaping, landscape retaining wall and entrance gate. Located: 105 Soundview Avenue, Southold, has been postponed. Number 12, Suffolk Environmental Consulting on behalf of KEVIN Board of Trustees 14 March 19, 2008 GALLAGHER requests a Wetland Permit to construct two stone revetments at the subject parcel to curb areas of substantial erosion. Both revetments will consist of cap stone and toe stone in the 50-100 pound range and will be backfilled with clean upland sand and vegetated with Cape American Beachgrass. Located: 40 Beechwood Lane, Southold, has been postponed. Number 13, Catherine Mesiano on behalf of MICHAEL & HEATHER GILL requests a Wetland Permit to construct asecond-story addition; one-story garage addition; reconstruct existing deck; abandon existing cesspools and install new conforming septic system. Located: 1325 Lupton's Point Road, Mattituck, has been postponed. Number 14, Catherine Mesiano on behalf of LEWIS TOPPER requests a Wetland Permit to demolish the existing 31x49' frame house located 15' north of the existing bulkhead and construct a new 15x60' two-story dwelling 40' north of the bulkhead; relocated and renovate the 18x37' accessory structure presently located 126 feet north of the bulkhead to 154 feet north of the bulkhead; abandon the existing septic system and install a new sanitary system 125 feet from the bulkhead and 125 feet from AHW; install drywells for containment of storm water runoff and create a 10' non-turf buffer. Located: 3605 Camp Mineola Road, Mattituck, has been postponed. Number 15, Ural Talgat on behalf of PAUL AND CHERYL RAGUSA requests a Wetland Permit to install an inground swimming pool and terrace addition. Located: 1600 Hyatt Road, Southold, has been postponed. Number 16, Peconic Associates on behalf of STIRLING HARBOR SHIPYARD AT GREENPORT INC., requests a Wetland Permit to replace in the same location as the existing, approximately 535 linear feet of deteriorated bulkhead, on "D" dock, on "C" dock and on the "work" dock, and remove/replace 1,000 cubic yards of material behind the replace bulkhead; replace 4,100 square feet of fixed dock with 4,300 square feet of floating dock; replace 205 existing pilings in conjunction with the fixed docks with 32 pilings to secure the proposed floating docks. Located: Stirling Harbor, Greenport, has been postponed. Number 17, Jeffrey T. Butler on behalf of DANIEL HUME requests a Wetland Permit to construct beach stairs and related walkways and platforms. Located: 13945 Oregon Road, Cutchogue, has been postponed. Board of Trustees 15 March 19, 2008 Number 18, Jeffrey T. Butler on behalf of JOHN ELICK, AS TRUSTEE, requests a Wetland permit to construct beach stairs and related walkways and platforms. Located: Oregon Road, Cutchogue, has been postponed. Number 19, JOSEPH ZEVITS requests a Wetland Permit to remove pilings and timber from east side of jetty, remove existing wood staving and replace with C-Loc4500 series vinyl sheathing. Timbers of the east side and most seaward timber on the west side will be replaced with new CCA timbers. Existing pilings to be used again and jetty to be bolted with 3/4" bolts. Located: 1375 West Lane, Southold, has been postponed. Number 20, JMO Environmental on behalf of FISHERS ISLAND FERRY DISTRICT requests a Wetland Permit to maintenance dredge an 80x140' channel to -20' ALW. The resultant spoil (+/- 7,800 cubic yards of sand and cobble) will be disposed of an island site upland disposal site. Located: Foot of Fox Lane, Fishers Island. Number 21, Bruce D. Kinlin, Architect on behalf of ANN G. DEARBORN requests a Wetland Permit and Coastal Erosion Permit to connect the two existing dwellings on the property and expand landward of the existing dwellings. Located: Private Road off East End Road, Fishers Island, has been postponed. Number 22, Dock, Inc., on behalf of ROBERT MEYER requests a Wetland Permit to reconstruct 138+/-linear feet of 5.7' wide fixed wood pile and timber pier including ladders and four braced tie-off piles waterward of the high tide line. Located: Crescent Avenue, Fishers Island, has been postponed. Number 23, behalf of WILLIAM GAILLARD requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 6x20' timber and pile supported pier extension and an 8x20' float with associated restraint piles, hinged ramp and one tie-off pile all waterward of the apparent high water line. Located: Bell Hill Avenue, Fishers Island, has been postponed. Number 24, Dock Inc., on behalf of FISHERS ISLAND YACHT CLUB requests a Wetland Permit to replace an existing 6x95' main float with a 6x95' concrete float, construct a 6x30' main float extension, install four new 3x24' finger floats with associated restraint piles, add a 30 square foot pier extension and three braced fender/tie-off piles to an existing fixed pier, all waterward of the apparent high water line. Located: Central Avenue, Board of Trustees 16 March 19, 2008 Fishers Island, has been postponed Number 25, Dock, Inc., on behalf of HAY HARBOR CLUB requests a Wetland Permit to reconstruct and relocate two 16x16' floats with new restraint pilings, and one 14'x16' float, install one new 14x16' float and new 10x42' float with associated restraint pilings. Reconstruct 400 linear feet of fixed wood pile and timber access walkway and pier of variable width, conduct maintenance dredging, 25 cubic yards of sand from the diving area for upland disposal at the beach, on site. Add new restraint pilings to an existing float waterward of the apparent high water line. Located: Fox Avenue, Fishers Island, has been postponed. So it will be a short night and next month I think we'll have a problem. I think it was in October that we had that extra meeting. We may have to do something like that this spring if we get bogged down, because I don't want to be here until one o'clock in the morning and I don't want to hold people up either. So if we have to have a special meeting, we will. COASTAL EROSION AND WETLAND PERMITS: TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Under Coastal Erosion and Wetland Permits, number one, Louis P. Giacalone, Ehasz Giacalone Architects on behalf of EDUCATIONAL AND CULTURAL FUND (Santorini Beachcomber Motel) requests an Administrative Wetland Permit & Coastal Erosion Permit to replace the asphalt shingles on all three buildings (two motel buildings and the restaurant.) Renovate all three buildings (outside and inside) to modernize the complex. Located: 3800 Duck Pond Road, Cutchogue. We were all there. We all looked at it. We have the LWRP coordinator has listed this, has determined this to be a consistent action. CAC resolves to support the permit with the condition that gutters and dnrnrells are installed to contain the roof runoff and the Trustees also want to see the condition that we bring it up to current drainage code. And I also have a note here about repairing the fence, which we can talk about further. Is there anybody here who would like to speak to this? MR. GIACALONE: Good evening, I'm Louis Giacalone, Giacalone Architects, representing the Cultural Educational Fund. There is also a representative of the fund here. As you are aware, they recently purchased the property and we have filed drawings with the Building Department for the purposes of what we are requesting the permit this evening for updating and modernizing those three buildings and also replacing the roof. The reason we are looking to do the roof right away is that Boazd of Trustees 17 Mazch 19, 2008 it's in pretty bad shape and we are trying to avoid having leaks throughout the buildings while they are using the buildings this summer. So we requested a permit so we can get out there and replace that roof and replace the roof shingles immediately. And that's the purpose why we are here. We do understand, because we talked to the Building Department, that we will be and we already had filed, actually, drawings for replacing the gutters and for putting in gutters and leaders and for putting in drywells for the storm water. And the fence, I'm not sure which fence you are referring to. Are you referring to the fence that is on the bulkhead? TRUSTEE KING: Right at the east end of the property is a chainlink fence that is in pretty much disrepair. Right in the corner. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Yes, all the way down the east looks like the chainlink fence was starting to fall apart. MR. GIACALONE: So it's east of the buildings. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Yes. MR. GIACALONE: Okay. The intent is to replace all the fencing along the entire waterfront, both by the buildings and further down, just for the protection of people using the facility and also give them so some security from the people on the beach. But those drawings have not been filed yet but they will be filed. TRUSTEE KING: We can put that in this permit, replace the fencing, put that in now so it's on the permit. MR. GIACALONE: If I may, we are just in the beginning of filing. As you know, we filed initially for just some interior upgrades and just recently, I believe today, actually, filed for the additional modernization including the outside work. We don't anticipate starting construction until September, assuming we get all our permits in place by then. So this is the first phase of it, if you will. So the intent would be to start that work in September so they can use the buildings in the summer and not have construction crews on the site and right after Labor Day they'll basically close up the place and we'll start construction in earnest. And that's when we'll start the fencing, the underground retaining basins for the storm water, et cetera, but at least the roof will have been on between now and September. TRUSTEE KING: This permit is good for two years, then you can, if you run behind, you get two one-year extensions, so. MR. GIACALONE: Running behind is not my client's desire or ours, but we appreciate that. TRUSTEE KING: Well, you get a valid permit for two years and then you can extend it. MR. MCGREEVY: The fence you are okaying on this application, would that be inkind/inplace; it wouldn't extend any further? Board of Trustees 18 March 19, 2008 TRUSTEE KING: I think it's all inplace chainlink fence. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: And it's all up on the property, it's not on the beach. MR. GIACALONE: We may change the style of it. But whatever we decide to do, we'll come back and file with the Building Department and if necessary meet with you to review it. TRUSTEE KING: Sure. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I was just thinking for now this would give you permission to repair the break in the fence for safety reasons and then, you know, at your leisure whenever you wanted to do the total replacement. MR. GIACALONE: That's not a problem, yes. Again, that is something they would want to do anyway just for the purposes of security. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Yes. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Any other comments, questions? (No response.) I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE GHOSIO: I'It make a motion to approve the application of Louis Giacalone on behalf of Educational and Cultural Fund (Santorini Beachcomber Motel) for an Administrative Wetland Permit and Coastal Erosion Permit to replace the asphalt shingles on all three buildings, renovate all three buildings, to modernize the complex with the stipulation that the drainage be brought up to current drainage code and that also included in this permit replacement inkind/inplace of the existing chainlink fence. TRUSTEE KING: Second. All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. GIACALONE: Thank you, very much. TRUSTEE KING: You're welcome. Good night. WETLAND PERMITS: TRUSTEE KING: Under Wetland Permits, number one, Docko Inc., on behalf of LINDA BORDEN requests a Wetland Permit to construct four-foot wide stairs with a 4x4' landing, 20 linear feet of four-foot wide wood pile and timber pier and two five-foot wide stairs from pier to beach and low step along side of pier. Located: Equestrian Avenue, Fishers Island. MR. NIELSON: Good evening, my name is Keith Nielson, President of Docko, Inc., and I prepared the application documents you are reviewing tonight on behalf of Ms. Borden. As you'll recall, this project was originally a slightly larger pier and included a ramp to a floating dock and float Board of Trustees 19 Mazch 19, 2008 restraint piles which were considered not approvable by the DEC and so the application documents you now have revised that original proposal. It is just a straight pier. It runs over the boulder which is located on the shore fronton the property. To the center, almost centered between two small outcrops of Spartina Alterniflora fringe marsh and maintaining the original stair configuration down the bank that we visited last August 8 and looked at together. The project is basically centered on the property to avoid repairing conflicts with adjacent land owners and the application drawings have all been revised as well as the LWRP application. The original application narrative has all valid information except for the deletion of the float and ramp and so I believe that the application documents now accurately reflect the intentions of the Borden's to gain access to the beach and to have a very short pier for launching and retrieving kayaks, canoe and their small boating activity. The stairways maintain access across the shore when the water level is between mean low and mean high in accordance with the LWRP and there is a small side step on the east side of the pier to allow launching and retrieval of the kayak at reasonable tide elevations otherwise the launch and retrieval will be done from the beach using the stairs. The application documents contain all the necessary authorizations and acknowledgments for town rights of access to the property and applicant's compliance with terms of the Local Law Six and also state compliance with the Department of State Coastal Management Policies, and are valid. We do have the return receipts from the Chapaton's (sic) and Anthony's, and a week or iwo ago we sent in the photographs showing the poster posted at the site. TRUSTEE KING: It's been found consistent with LWRP. This is a case where we had issued a permit and in the time it took to get the other permit, the other permits necessary, the permit expired. So this is actually --and it's been modified, so it's kind of a reapplication for a smaller project that was already approved. It's similar to the first one we had previously tonight, but not as complex. But it was a case of a permit expiring and they had to reapply. CAC did not make an inspection so there is no recommendation from them. Was there any thought of using material like that on the platform? MR. NIELSON: Thru-flow grating could be used on the decking instead of the wood and plastic materials. I did reference in the application narrative, the original narrative, that that would be an option and would still be an option. TRUSTEE KING: We have been moving in that direction, you know. I Board of Trustees 20 March 19, 2008 would like to see it used. MR. NIELSON: We can revise the drawings and send them into you with that stipulation, if you would like, along with any other stipulations on materials and so on. TRUSTEE KING: What about the steps going down; keep those wood, just have the lower platform there grated or do you want to make the steps open grate, too? MR. NIELSON: I would concede on the open grating also on the steps. Thru-Flow has now begun manufacturing five-foot long steps. TRUSTEE KING: This is becoming more popular. MR. NIELSON: If you have not walked on it, they have a nice texture on the grating as well, so it's not slick. Some of the plastic materials are slick unless they are textured. But this really is a pretty nice product. It is soft. I don't know if I demonstrated this to you last August, but it's soft. You have to make sure that the stringer intervals are proper. They put holes in the decks where they need the stringers and you have to put them in otherwise it's it flexes when you step on it. TRUSTEE KING: Maybe next time I come to Fishers Island I could find a sample of it. MR. NIELSON: I'm sure we have. Usually I carry one with me. Not tonight. TRUSTEE KING: Any other comments? Jack? MR. MCGREEVY: Jim, if I'm reading the diagram correctly, the new stairs to the beach, is it duplicated on both sides? MR. NIELSON: Yes. MR. MCGREEVY: The purpose of that is? MR. NIELSON: To provide access over the pier in accordance with LWRP to not impede beach access. TRUSTEE KING: I don't think there is a lot of pedestrian traffic along there. It's not really a shoreline that people walk. MR. NIELSON: I would not disagree. And we don't have to -- we can take one of them out if you would like. TRUSTEE KING: It's more structure and it's really not necessary. I know that shoreline. You don't have people walking along there. And with these low profile walkways you can step over and walk across. MR. NIELSON: You can walk across, at the shore end, you can see how low it is. MR. MCGREEVY: The reason I mentioned it, as time goes on that type of construction will be in certain circumstances definitely needed. That's the only reason I mentioned it. TRUSTEE KING: We have been moving in that direction. We made the suggestions on some of the stairways down the bluff to go to the grated. We always have an erosion problem under these stairs because vegetation doesn't grow. Board of Trustees 21 March 19, 2008 MR. MCGREEVY: So I would just say as needed. MR. NIELSON: If I could make one suggestion, it would be my preference to take the stair off on the east side because that's where the rocks are located. The stairs on the other side will require much less land disturbance. TRUSTEE KING: I would be comfortable if you don't have stairs on either side. I'll leave that option up to you. You can remove both or the one set. I just can't see that dock impeding -- TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We can approve it with one side and if you don't build it, that's -- MR. NIELSON: That's the way I'll do it. Fine, thank you. TRUSTEE KING: Being no other comments, I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: I'll make a motion to approve the application. We'll be using open-grate style and instead of two sets of stairs there will be one set of stairs on the dock for access, on the west side. That's optional. You are approved to have it if you want to. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I want to add you are using grated and it's low, it's still consistent with LWRP. TRUSTEE KING: I think it makes it more consistent with the LWRP. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: It's less structure. TRUSTEE KING: I'll make that motion. Second? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Number two, Docko, Inc., on behalf of PIRATE'S COVE MARINA, INC., requests a Wetland Permit to reconstruct straddle hoist piers and facilities at the southwesterly corner of the boat yard. Located: Off Peninsula Road in Inner Harbor, Fishers Island. I think we all looked at that last year, if I remember, when we were out there. MR. NIELSON: Do you have enough pictures? TRUSTEE BERGEN: Yes, for myself. Yes. TRUSTEE KING: So you added -- I see what was done here. On the concrete path is the drainage that we talked about. There's a drywell here. TRUSTEE BERGEN: So the drainage is going into a holding tank. MR. NIELSON: Yes. This is a copy for everybody. TRUSTEE KING: It looks like. Any idea how much water they actually use at the bottom and how often do they have to pump the tank? MR. NIELSON: Bottom wash takes about 70 gallons, 50 to 70 gallons, and this is a 1,250 gallon tank that I think they normally wash two Boazd of Trustees 22 March 19, 2008 or three boats a day and -- do you need another one of these for the record? (Handing). And while up I'm up here, we received one of the mailing slips back from the neighbor on the west. So they could get easily ten, 15, 20 washes, which is, we try to size the tank for about a week's worth of activity there, and at that point the tank would have to be pumped. As you know, Pirate's Cove is trying to meet the clean marina program guidelines and until filtration criteria and water quality standards and testing standards are completed for all of this, we all feel it would be best just to hold the water, have it picked up by Clean Harbors, they can treat it for whatever the industry standard is and when we can zero in on the right things, then we can add filtration to it, if necessary. You'll notice on the drawings 1 have handwritten and drawn in a little blue circle. There will be a valve installed on the wash down pad so that after the washing activity is over, the valve can be closed and that way any rain that falls will just dissipate into the ground around the pad. TRUSTEE KING: Sure. That's good. TRUSTEE KING: Any other comments? (No response.) MR. NIELSON: Do you want me to go through any of my spiel? TRUSTEE KING: No, I don't think it's going to be necessary. MR. NIELSON: My application does include the standard certifications and acknowledgment of Board of Trustees rights and permitee obligations and this pier reconstruction is necessitated by a larger straddle lift that they have purchased and will be on site in about amonth-and-a-half. So. TRUSTEE KING: The boats keep getting bigger. MR. NIELSON: Yes. TRUSTEE KING: Okay, no other comments, I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: I'll make a motion to approve the application as submitted. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. NIELSON: Thank you. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Number three, Garrett Strang, Architect, on behalf of SPIRO GEROULANOS requests a Wetland Permit to install an inground swimming pool, terrace, retaining wall and new lawn area. Board of Trustees 23 March 19, 2008 Located: 2130 Braodwaters Road, Cutchogue. We have all been out there a couple of times. We tabled this from last month to take another look at it. We did have Mark Terry come out with us and we verified the Wetland line of Rob Herman, and we do have updated surveys showing moving the pool back so it's 50 feet away from that Wetland line. The pool has been reduced and it's 50 feet seaward of the wetland line. And I think that was what was discussed out there. LWRP finds it consistent. Are there any other comments? MR. STRANG: Yes, if I may. Garrett Strang, Architect. In the submittal I made this week, I have two plans attached. The first one is actually an regional plan marked up in red indicating where the agreed to Wetland line is and showing what the 50-foot setback would be, on the original submittal, which shows an encroachment, if you will, of a triangular area of about six feet by 34 feet, or about 102 square feet. And I know that the Trustees' regulation is for a minimum 50-foot setback. However, my client asked if I would, on his behalf, revisit this and ask if the Board might consider since that is such a small area that would be encroaching, since it makes for a better installation with respect to the fact that the pool and the terrace are running parallel with the natural slope of the land, if we pull it back as per the amended plan that I also submitted as an attachment, we now run a little bit askew of the natural lay of the land so the retaining wall looks or would look somewhat unusual since it would be going from a low end to a high end as the grade changes, and we felt it might be more visually and naturally appearing if it were to parallel the lay of the land. And given the fact that it's such a small encroachment. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I think the discussion is to maintain the 50 foot. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We are pretty strict on that. MR. STRANG: Okay, we just figured we would ask. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: And that 50 foot in front of that would be a non-disturbance area. MR. STRANG: That's fine. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: You are allowed to maintain that four-foot wide path and we would like to see, once we have the approvals, C&R files are filed. MR. STRANG: So the non-disturbance would be a C&R. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: They'll need a line of hay bales. TRUSTEE KING: We could put a line of hay bales up during construction and if there is any disturbance in that area it can get replanted. I know what you mean. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: That's what I mean, after the fact. Board of Trustees 24 March 19, 2008 TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Are any of these trees coming down? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Those are tacked for the non-disturbance area. MR. STRANG: Those are the trees in the lawn area. TRUSTEE KING: We want to keep any excavation material out of this area. Don't pile it up in, down into that non-disturbance area. MR. STRANG: Oh, no, we wouldn't. Actually, any excavation spoils will be used right in the area of the pool to bring the terrace up to height. TRUSTEE KING: We need the hay bales. We have to give them enough room to work. Everything seaward of the retaining wall is behind the 50 foot buffer. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Eight foot contour line would give them more than enough. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Can we do the nine foot line? TRUSTEE KING: What is this here? TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Was there some trees down in that area directly in front of what is going to be the retaining wall? MR. STRANG: Nothing beyond that. The edge of the retaining wall was nothing befinreen that and the edge of the water that would be disturbed or any trees coming down. The only area where trees are being removed is where the pool and terrace are going and of course this is continuing in the area of the proposed lawn. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: So on the pool side of the property, which is the hay bales at the nine foot contour line and any disturbance in that area should be replanted and become anon-disturbance area after construction. MR. STRANG: Okay. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Now, on the other side, I believe that's what this picture is. And what are the tagged trees? MR. STRANG: The tagged trees are the ones proposed to be removed. Some of them are damaged to begin with. Some of them, it's our opinion that they are a little too close together so we want to thin them out a little bit so they don't choke each other out, and I think there is a minimal number of trees being removed there. TRUSTEE KING: Where are they located as far as -- are they within what is the non-disturbance area? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes. On this picture here can you point out where the wall would be. TRUSTEE KING: Where would the wall go? MR. STRANG: From that picture, that's a good question. The trees were intended to be in the lawn area. The trees that are being removed were intended to be lawn area. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: So this is further back. MR. STRANG: Yes. If you wish to condition that the trees in the Board of Trustees 25 March 19, 2008 non-disturbance area are to remain, I don't think that would be a problem. TRUSTEE KING: So what we want to see is where this retaining wall is basically everything in front of that retaining wall is a non-disturbance area. That's an easy way to do it. MR. STRANG: That's fine. I believe the retaining wall was staked but this picture I think it predates when the staking went in. TRUSTEE KING: So we'll just make that -- the entire area seaward of the wall is anon-disturbance. That simplifies it. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: All right. Any other comments? (No response.) Hearing none, I'll close the public hearing. TRUSTEE KING: Second. All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I'll make a motion to approve the application of Spiro Geroulanos to install inground swimming pool, terrace and retaining wall and new lawn area; a line of hay bales shall be in place approximately at the nine-foot contour during construction and anything seaward of the pool disturbed shall be replanted and anything seaward of the retaining wall across the whole entire property will be anon-disturbance area. Of course with the pool there will be a drywell, and this is based on the plans of Garrett Strang of 1/21/08. Do I have a second? MR. STRANG: Can I interject a moment. The plan was prepared 1/21/08 but it was updated 3/17/08. So that would be the current drawing. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Okay. Sorry. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE KING: Did you put the backwash -- TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes, I said that. Do you have the drywell on here, the backwash? MR. STRANG: I don't. I have no problem adding that on to the drawing and bringing you copies. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Do you want to add it here and initial it and we can stamp it, too. MR. STRANG: Sure. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I'll give you all three of these. MR. STRANG: I'll mark it up and bring it back momentarily. TRUSTEE KING: We have a motion and a second on it. All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. STRANG: Thank you, have a Happy Easter. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Sherman Engineering & Consulting on behalf of CHRISTIAN & HEIDI FOKINE requests a Wetland Permit to remove the Board of Trustees 26 March 19, 2008 existing steps and to construct a 4x51.4" catwalk using transparent plastic oralam grated decking, a 4x12'10" prefabricated metal ramp and a 5x12' floating dock. Located: 2505 Wells Avenue, Southold. Is there anyone here to speak to this application? MR. SHERMAN: Matt Sherman with Sherman Engineering & Consulting. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: We all went out and looked at this and had some concerns, and I believe you have some information for us tonight. MR. SHERMAN: Yes. I spoke with Jill the other day. She explained some of the concerns you had. I put together some new drawings which show a revised shortened dock plan as well as the depth information around the dock and over to the other side of the creek. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: CAC supports the application and actually recommended the grated material which is in the application and we are definitely looking at the one-third. MR. SHERMAN: The new plan, I put a little more information on here on the new plans than we had on the original that was submitted. As you can see, the first page shows that we have basically just gotten away with the landward third to half of the dock and then just kept it on the seaward side. The original design had the intent of keeping foot traffic off of that high marsh area, coming off where the existing steps are and then getting us access over to the water. If the Board and the CAC feels that eliminating that, the addition of the dock, outweighs the harm of the foot traffic across that high marsh area, the owners have no problem doing something along these lines. Also going on a little bit of what Jim had mentioned earlier about one of the other docks, we had kept the height at three feet in order to meet with the DEC requirements. If the town has the ability to work with the DEC better than I do and we can work, drop the height of that down, by all means, we would be more than eager to do so. TRUSTEE KING: We did two catwalks in Halls Creek. It was their recommendation to go down to 18 inches, DEC recommendation. MR. SHERMAN: We would be more than eager to accept that. On the second page of this you can see going across the creek, on the applicant side of the creek, the west side, it's a shallower slope getting down to about the six foot maximum depth at low tide, then it goes up on a little bit less of a gradual on the opposite side of the creek, which puts the actual navigable part of the creek on the far side. So at high tide we are at approximately 100 feet across from side to side. And the dock is going out to 33 feet across. So right at a third of the way across the waterway. At low side the creek is approximately 65 feet wide and we are going out to about ten feet. So at low tide we actually, we are not quite, we are not at that 33% low tide going across. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Is this new drawing workable with the Trustees, Board of Trustees 27 March 19, 2008 that maybe he could go stake it and we'll go look at it again? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I think it's something to be considered. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I just didn't want to have him stake this if we were not going to even consider it. TRUSTEE KING: This was in the same location as the old proposal. MR. SHERMAN: Yes. The reason why that location is chosen is in order to find that two-foot mark and be at most a third of the way across, we tried a couple of different, and we just slowly worked our way over until we got to that point. That's basically what dictated where the dock went. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Just to let you know, it was reviewed inconsistent by LWRP. I'm just trying to see here, even though this, he'll be reviewing this again, we are assuming a new survey. And 1 think we can address some of these with the new application. One of the comments is the width and the length of the dock. Due to the environmental constraints of this location, which is the low water depth, the proposed action may not be suitable in the proposed location. We looked at that other area. Is that not deep enough, the area to the west? MR. SHERMAN: If you come around, going deeper into the creek. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Right. MR. SHERMAN: The problem with that side is it's shallower further out, so the amount of catwalk would have to be drastically increased in order to get thetwo-and-a-half foot of depth. I don't have any detailed sounding information out there, but as we were poking around in the initial phases of this, that's what we were finding. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: What does the Board feel? Do we want to continue pursuing this and have it staked and go out and look again? TRUSTEE BERGEN: I definitely want to see it staked according to these new plans. The question I have for the Board for discussion is; which is better, to have people walking through the high marsh area or a catwalk with, you know, open grate coming down low through that high marsh area to the existing steps. TRUSTEE KING: The way it was, there was no vegetation there at all for that whole stretch. MR. SHERMAN: There is not much out there. It periodically gets flooded. TRUSTEE KING: If we could see it staked, I would like to see a stake on each seaward corner of where the float will be, the outer most point. Give us an idea where the outer most part of the float will be. MR. SHERMAN: Okay. TRUSTEE KING: And just my own thoughts, it would be maybe 18 inches Board of Trustees 28 Mazch 19, 2008 off grade, open grate, and DEC has not been approving anything but 4x4s in the intertidal marsh area, so we try to coordinate with them. 4x4's in the intertidal marsh, when you get out into the water, it's six-inch piles. They are pretty strict on that in the last year or two. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Since this was deemed inconsistent and we are going out and looking at it again, do you have a copy of the LWRP? MR. SHERMAN: No, ma'am, I don't. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I would recommend you get a copy either tonight and/or through the office and look through it. TRUSTEE KING: Did he list some of the policies? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Yes. TRUSTEE KING: He could kind of address each one. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: If you could come into the office. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Do you want to meet us on the next field inspection? MR. SHERMAN: That would be great. Yes. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: So just get a copy from Liz in the office. MR. SHERMAN: Okay. And will this be on your April 9 field inspection? Because I'll have them stake it, I'll start making phone calls tomorrow and get that to happen right away. So should I just contact the office as far as the time. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Just tell them you want to meet us out there and give them your cellphone number. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Get a copy of the LWRP so you can address it and make it more conforming to the policies. I'll make a motion to table. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. SHERMAN: Thank you. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Number five Condon Engineering on behalf of MARY ANN MEARS requests a Wetland Permit to remove existing wood steps; construct an attached wood deck and steps onto an existing one-story, one family dwelling, and install gravel French drain for roof/deck runoff. Located: 1050 Dean Drive, Cutchogue. I went out and looked at this. This actually had been -- a very similar project had been looked at in 2005 by this Board and in fact this Board had approved permit 6268 on December 21, 2005. That is an identical design of the deck. The difference between then and now is this new permit request, since the old one ran out in December, addresses the roof runoff and addresses the drainage code issues with French drains. This was reviewed by the CAC who resolved to support the application under the condition that gutters and drywells were Board of Trustees 29 March 19, 2008 installed in place of the proposed French drain, and it was reviewed under the LWRP and found to be inconsistent because of its distance from the high water mark, where the code calls for 100 foot and this one is 63.7 and; secondly, they wanted to make sure that there was no treated lumber used in the construction. And they are requiring anon-disturbance buffer seaward of the proposed deck to protect the coastal vegetation. Is there anybody here to speak on behalf of this application? MR. CONDON: Yes. John Condon, Condon Engineering. I was retained to reapply for the permit since they let it lapse. TRUSTEE BERGEN: A question for Jack McGreevy. It said, I read into the record, the CAC voted to support this if gutters and drywells were used leading into the French drain. There is a French drain depicted here in the plans, goes all the way around the house, so I was just wondering why the gutters and drywells were asked for by the CAC. MR. MCGREEVY: I think the reason behind it, Dave, was the width of the French drain coming into consideration wouldn't serve the purpose for proper drainage. I'm not positive on that but I think that's the reasoning behind it. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I see here drainage calculations have been provided by the applicant that shows the square footage of the roof and factoring in the amount of runoff that could come off of that in a two-and-a-half inch rainfall, the size of the French drains that are required. So it appears as though, from a engineering perspective, that they have addressed that here; that this French drain, according to their drainage calculations, would meet the drainage code of two-and-a-half inch rain. MR. CONDON: The owner doesn't want to install gutters and leaders either. I tried to convince her of that. TRUSTEE KING: We had a similar situation on Fishers Island where the gentleman didn't want to put gutters and leaders because he thought they were ugly and he devised a French drain around it and actually had that piped into drywells. MR. CONDON: Most of the roof has about atwo-foot overhang so I have intention to put the gravel drain right under the roof line so it drips right into the gravel drain. TRUSTEE BERGEN: As long as it conforms with the code, which it does. Would the applicant be willing to use non-treated wood in the deck? MR. CONDON: Yes, 1 could bring that up, no ACO in that. Yes. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Because I'm trying to address the LWRP inconsistency, and if we use non-treated wood that would address Board of Trustees 30 March 19, 2008 the LWRP inconsistency. MR. CONDON: I could see what else we could use. I think we were intending on using treated lumber at least on the post, at the very minimum. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I notice there is a hay bale line depicted on the plan here. That's good. Would the applicant be willing to, there is an elevation six foot that runs along part of that hay bale line, from that area seaward, which is a vegetated dune area, leave that as anon-disturbance area, is that something the applicant would be willing to do? MR. CONDON: Seaward of elevation six? TRUSTEE BERGEN: Seaward of elevation six. Right now I see on the plans it says listed as vegetated dune area going to the high tide mark. There is a path, I don't know the width of the path, but we would allow afour-foot path through there for access to the beach if we could just leave that as anon-disturbance area. MR. CONDON: I think that's fine. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Are there any other questions from the Board? TRUSTEE KING: Nope. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Anybody else want to make any comments? MR. MCGREEVY: With the French drains, I'm not that familiar with it but don't they fill up very quickly? They have to be maintained on a pretty regular basis so that they function properly; am I correct in stating that? TRUSTEE BERGEN: Again, in the calculations there is also the depth of the French drain is calculated in to handle the two-and-a-half inch rain. And this is a very sandy area, so I think given the calculations that he's listed here, I'm not an engineer, given the calculations that are listed here with the depth and the fact it's in a very sandy area I think it would take a rainfall greater than two-and-a-half inches and our drainage code calls for two-and-a-half inch rainfall that we have to have drainage mitigation done to handle two-and-a-half inch rainfall. MR. MCGREEVY: The construction of French drains, are they also attached to a drywell at one end for gravity feed? MR. CONDON: The way it works, is you have larger stone, the blue stone, and there is voids between the stone and the water will fill up between the voids. MR. MCGREEVY: So that serves the purpose instead of a drywell which it would ordinarily go into. MR. CONDON: Yes TRUSTEE GHOSIO: I have some reservations with that, but, if it's to code, I suppose I don't have anything to say about it. TRUSTEE KING: What don't you like about it. Boazd of Trustees 31 Mazch 19, 2008 TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Well, it's one thing, the French drains have to be pretty big if you are not going to have onsite storage. If there is not going to be any drywells involved, I mean you'll have to have a huge French drain. My whole front yard is essentially a French drain. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Would you like to take a look at the plans? The French drain, pass that down to Bob, and here is another one, you could see the French drain as proposed goes all the way around the perimeter of the house and it's 24 inches wide and 15 inches deep. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: It's like a moat. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Bob, we can always put a stipulation on it we can inspect it in a year and see how it's working. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Or if it's not -- TRUSTEE DOHERTY: If it doesn't work, he'll have to put in drywells. MR. MCGREEVY: Just a consideration, Jim, if it's the esthetics the owner is really concerned about, and our concern is that topography of the land and the drainage toward the water, why not just for an additional small cost put in a catch at the water side of the building at the end of the French drain? If it's esthetics they are concerned about. MR. CONDON: There is a dune in front of the property, too, so the water won't actually make it. There is a dune in front. TRUSTEE BERGEN: On the plans here is the elevation increasing seaward of the structure. TRUSTEE KING: It's almost a hundred feet from the high water mark. Actually, it's 63. TRUSTEE BERGEN: To me, as proposed, would I prefer leaders and gutters to drywells, yes. But this French drain system as proposed according to the drainage calculations will meet code. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: We can stipulate if it doesn't maintain the water on the property then it has to be modified. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I don't know if you heard what was just said. If it turns out this does not maintain the drainage from the house on the property as the code requires, that that would have to be taken care of, it would have to be mediated later. MR. CONDON: Okay. TRUSTEE BERGEN: If there are no other comments I'll make a motion to close this public hearing. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE BERGEN: I'll make a motion to approve the application of Mary Ann Mears for the wetland permit located at 1050 Dean Drive in Cutchogue with the stipulation that there will be non-treated lumber used for the construction of the deck and there will be a non-disturbance area from elevation six feet seaward to the high Board of Trustees 32 March 19, 2008 water mark, of course allowing afour-foot path, and with those modifications we deem it to be consistent under the LWRP. Do I have a second? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Do you want to do a one-year inspection under the drainage code? TRUSTEE BERGEN: Okay, we'll ask for an inspection in one year, in other words in March of 2009, to make sure that this French drain has sufficed the Chapter 236 of the Town Drainage Code. MR. CONDON: Okay. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) MR. CORCORAN: Have you been the to ZBA on this yet? MR. CONDON: Yes. Thank you. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Number six, Patricia Moore on behalf of IRA NAGEL requests a Wetland Permit to construct a swimming pool, patio and planters. Located: 2200 Broadwaters Road, Cutchogue. We have all gone and seen this. LWRP determination is that it is consistent with LWRP. CAC supports the application. Before I go any further, do we want to table this because of the violation? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We can hold a hearing but we can't move on it. MS. MOORE: Honestly, I just got a phone call from Don and he asked if I could accept service, but I couldn't reach my client. He was away. So this is a not my client, this is a friend that is helping out. As soon as he gets back, I don't think there is a problem. I think we'll get this resolved pretty quickly. It was partly administrative, you know, they miscalculated where the wetland lines were. What are you going to do. TRUSTEE KING: I believe when the application was filled out to the Building Department, they checked off no, there was no wetlands within a hundred feet MS. MOORE: Because they miscalculated. He was looking at the high tide line as the wetland line. That's the only answer I could give. TRUSTEE KING: That is still within the 100 feet even if you go out in the water it's 100 feet TRUSTEE BERGEN: There is a 50 foot difference here. You would be well out into the water to get that hundred foot. MS. MOORE: I have no with idea how they came to the conclusion. I got involved way after the project itself. MR. CORCORAN: We don't have to belabor that. The point today, we can open the hearing but there can't be a determination. MS. MOORE: What you can do is shelve the permit and we can resolve it and as soon as it's resolved you can release it. MR. CORCORAN: The Trustees -- Board of Trustees 33 March 19, 2008 TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We can close the hearing and reserve decision. MS. MOORE: So then just let me know. TRUSTEE BERGEN: Why don't we move forward with the public hearing and -- MS. MOORE: That's fine. I think Jim has been at the site. TRUSTEE KING: We all have been. MS. MOORE: Okay. I know when it was being flagged you were out there and David was there, so I think he described the patio area and so on. I think my advice to the client was that these pavers, some of the pavers we actually eliminated so, to make it grass. I don't know if you know that or not. I think Jim was made aware of that. I don't know if you passed that information on. Do you recall? TRUSTEE KING: I talked in the field with this gentleman here. MS. MOORE: The area on the landscape plan, that's the pool and landscape plan that was prepared by Pal Pools and Spa, dated January'08, that drawing shows the area of the patio, the pool and the area that is described as pavers where the table is shown, that would be actually retained as grass, so. You should have this. This there you go. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Just to reiterate, LWRP did find this consistent, determined it was consistent. We all have been out to see it. CAC resolved to support the application with the condition that drywell is installed to contain pool backwash and the bank bluff is stabilized prior to the continuance of the pool installation. The Trustees all went out and we were asking for a restoration plan and that you put a 50-foot non-disturbance buffer. Those are the only comments that we have out in the field. MS. MOORE: Okay. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: What plans did LWRP review, Bob? Do you know? TRUSTEE GHOSIO: LWRP, this is dated March 18, found it consistent. Doesn't say what plans. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: It was yesterday, so they would not have the latest information in. MS. MOORE: Yes, where the wetland line is, I don't think there is a problem with meeting those conditions because as I have measured it, the pool with the five-foot distance between the end of the pool and the planter is close to the area that is at the 50 feet, more or less. (Indicating.) The pool, from my measurement, starts over here where the concrete appears to be here and when you go out, I think it's an 18x36 pool, then there is a five-foot patio area, and then a retaining wall. So it appears to have everything within that 50-foot measurement. I took a 50-foot from this line. Boazd of Trustees 34 Mazch 19, 2008 TRUSTEE KING: It would be nice to have just kind of, from that line to extend on the other property, you know what I mean, to keep everything uniform, same non-disturbance area in the front. It would look nice. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: This 50 feet is what? MS. MOORE: I took it from the wetland. I measured with a ruler from the wetland line, 50 feet. I took that line along so I would know approximately, you know, from the flags. TRUSTEE BERGEN: We have in the field notes we measured to here is 65 feet. So it's approximately 15 feet. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: That was the only issue is the restoration plan. MS. MOORE: The retaining wall is landward of the 50 feet, so what it appears to be. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: What Jim is saying, it would be nice if the retaining walls matched up. MS. MOORE: It's very different. They'll be close. TRUSTEE KING: Looking down, you could make it. MS. MOORE: Plus we have, the retaining walls we have is a planter as well, so we'll have some vegetation also incorporated into it. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Where is the retaining wall, on planting plan? MS. MOORE: Yes. The planters are about 30 inches. So you have the pool five feet for the patio area around the pool and then the planters are 30 inches in width or depth. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Pat, looking at the planting plan, the landscape design, on the left, as I'm looking at the residence on the planting plan, from the seaward side, on the left-hand side, is that a retaining wall going up the whole length? MR. STEWART: Yes. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: What's the reason for that? MS. MOORE: Why don't you come up and get on the record since you are more familiar. MR. STEWART: David Stewart. MS. MOORE: The retaining wall that comes around here, how high, that sounds, just -- because the patio, you can see the elevations go from 25 to 24 and down. MR. STEWART: On the plans, because there is a drop off from the property line to the next door neighbor's property line, so it will start off on the plans, on the side here it says 24-inch stone wall. That's going to be your retaining wall, because there is a height elevation that is different between the two property lines. MS. MOORE: Sorry, we can't hear you here. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: It looks to me like when we were there on the site, what we are looking at was a lot of fill brought in here so it kind of looked like it was a kind of created berm. Board of Trustees 35 March 19, 2008 MS. MOORE: No, there is no fill at all. That's just from the pool. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I just don't see the reason for the retaining wall to go the whole length. MR. STEWART: It's going to end -- can I come up? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Sure. MR. STEWART: According to the calculations, the retaining wall will end right over here. That's where the height elevations is playing out. We have a land surveyor coming there with the measurements and calculations. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: This side is higher. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: It says page three. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: How high will it be? MR. STEWART: 1 believe it will be 24 to 30 inches depending on the height of everything else that is going around. We try to match to the lowest point of the grade of the neighbors. You know what I'm saying? We are trying to blend it all in so it looks very nice. We don't want a big wall. The two friends, two kids are friends next door of both houses and they'll be in each other's pool playing back and forth. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We see a wall on a plan and sometimes when it's built and you go out there and it's high MR. STEWART: It says 24-inch stone wall which won't be stone no more. It will probably railroad ties or whatever you guys recommend. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Okay. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: About the pavers where the patio area is -- MR. STEWART: Around the pool? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: No, the one with the plans. MR. STEWART: That will be grass. We are changing that to grass. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Okay. That's what I was going to ask; how pervious it was. MR. STEWART: Just put on sand. Pavers will be put on sand. TRUSTEE KING: Are those the same plans that you have? MS. MOORE: Yes. MR. STEWART: There is only one copy, one set of plans. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Any other questions or comments from the Board? (No response.) Questions or comments from the audience? (No response.) I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Second. TRUSTEE KING: So we'll do a 50-foot non-disturbance area. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes MS. MOORE: Just keep the path, if you would. TRUSTEE KING: With afour-foot access path. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? Boazd of Trustees 36 Mazch 19, 2008 (ALL AYES.) MS. MOORE: So Ira and I will have a little chat. TRUSTEE BERGEN: So we'll reserve decision. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: I'll make a motion to reserve decision on this until the violation has been taken care of. MS. MOORE: And if the violation -- I'm assuming April 2 or 4. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: April 4 is still open. I talked to Don. He'll try to write it in for that. We'll try to coordinate with them so they get the court dates before our next meeting so we don't hold them off an extra month. MS. MOORE: Good. We have the soil is stockpiled there and it's not a good situation, so. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Hopefully we can take care of it within a month. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Do I have a second? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.). TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Costello Marine on behalf of THOMAS GIESE requests a Wetland Permit to remove the remains of existing wooden dock, cut down 32'+/- of existing bulkhead to grade level, construct a 4x12' walkway onto a 4x34' fixed dock with a 3x20' "L" section decked to 46" wide at offshore end. Located: 5860 Skunk Lane, Cutchogue. LWRP finds this inconsistent and CAC recommends existing bulkhead be removed and the area be cleaned up and revegetated; the shoreline should be left in its natural state. We all went out there again to look at this and is there any comment? MR. COSTELLO: Yes. May name is John Costello. We are the agents for this application for Thomas Giese. And after discussions and finding out that the Board had previous litigation with one of the neighbors, that I did not know at the time, and they eliminated, they would wish to eliminate any floating docks that would protrude out into the harbor. I have redesigned and the discussion is, the description that was just read into the record is basically correct with one minor change. The offshore "L", the 20-foot "L" is only three foot wide but it will be decked to 46 inches. The deck will stick over just so that someone does not fall off. They'll be going around each of the pilings. I recommended cutting the bulkhead off. 1 had a brief discussion with Jill on the job. I would rather not remove the bulkhead in its entirety because of the erosion that would occur to the roadway, possibly, in the future. And that is anon-functional bulkhead, but if cutting it off as low as possible, we can cut it Board of Trustees 37 March 19, 2008 underwater, to allow a depth of water on one side without the intrusion of the fill going back overboard. We are willing to do that. The DEC seems to be in the same vein. They do not want that non-functional bulkhead to be built. The one reason we made the original application was that it's so close to the road, the tide is rising to some degree, I hope it doesn't impact the road, but, you know, I'm not elevating the road and I'm not going to do anything with that. But I think the functionality of using the property, the DEC recommended taking the railway out. I think we would have more impact taking it out. It is certainly usable on two times a year to either put a boat up or put a boat down. It's not a shipyard. It's a residential. You could get the boat out of the water and leave it there. It beats a boat lift. It beats anything else. It's all fixed structures and they do not, none of the structures protrude out past the adjoining piling on the both neighboring docks. What we did is draw a line between the offshore piling and we kept 12 feet within those structures so that the width of a boat tied on the "L" will not protrude out past the piling. So we are 12 foot inboard of any of those pilings. And I have plans, I have photographs, I have whatever the Board would like. TRUSTEE KING: John, any thoughts of cutting down the other bulkheads to look more like a groin; cut them down to grade? MR. COSTELLO: I don't think it serves any purpose but if the owner can afford it, you know, they are not doing any detriment. It's not like they are building a beach. They are not doing, I don't know, but they are still, right now, they are in reasonably functional shape there. TRUSTEE KING: I'm thinking it might help some of the consistency by getting rid of those and naturalize the beach and putting it back in more of a natural condition without those there. MR. COSTELLO: I would not take them out if I were you. I would not suggest taking them out. Because there is a difference on one side of that wall to the other side of the wall, there is probably about 16-inch difference in water depth so, you know, it would erode, it would level off. It serves a minimal purpose. Eventually, I doubt if you would ever get an approval to put it back in, and eventually it would, it would either have to be lowered or taken out or another timber put on. TRUSTEE KING: I would like to see it cut off at grade, myself. Any thoughts of a "T" dock rather than an "L"? MR. COSTELLO: You can't make it a "T" because of the offset of the property line projecting over. I mean, I'm saying 15 off the property line. You know, that is a dictating factor that we tried to -- TRUSTEE KING: That's other issue we have to get into, extending Board of Trustees 38 March 19, 2008 these property lines, because I don't agree with extending it out at that same angle as what is on land. MR. COSTELLO: Well, I want to try to stay off the property line, which -- you know. It's not my design. I would rather have it be closer to the property line, but that would just be the movement of it. I believe Jim is right on that but, it is what it is. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: How do the railroad ties get used it if it's in an "L" shape? MR. COSTELLO: You have to come in high tide and come around it. You can. You are not going to bring a big boat. A 24-foot boat, maybe. Any questions the Board has, address them to me and I'll try to answer them. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: The LWRP report is based on the original application. TRUSTEE KING: They don't have an aerial survey of the whole area. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We have the soundings. TRUSTEE KING: I'm trying to figure out where the channel is. MR. COSTELLO: The channel has to be offshore of that otherwise everybody else is protruding into it. TRUSTEE KING: I'm looking at the direction of the channel is what I'm looking at, John. I'm into this property line issue. I know if you have, say this channel runs like this -- TRUSTEE DICKERSON: The LWRP's main comment it's a sensitive critical environmental area. MR. COSTELLO: It does have some wetlands. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I think the whole area is considered very sensitive. I'm just saying that's what the LWRP's main point is. TRUSTEE BERGEN: I'm familiar with this channel. I've navigated it with my boat. A lot of times it does go straight along. MR. COSTELLO: Yes, I saw you aground there several times. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: That's a way to score points. MR. COSTELLO: So you lose one vote. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: See where the mooring is, all the moorings are on that side, so the channel is pretty much down the center. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Where are you with DEC, John? MR. COSTELLO: DEC just wants the removal of the bulkhead, and we are trying to have it cut off. So far there is no response. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: They are okay with the dock and the "L"? MR. COSTELLO: They have not had a comment on that. But they will not allow the bulkhead to be rebuilt. They want the bulkhead basically removed, and I'll try and persuade them into -- TRUSTEE DICKERSON: So they won't discuss the dock until you have dealt with the bulkhead? MR. COSTELLO: We are in discussion with the DEC but it's not concluded. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Is there any consideration of making the "L" Board of Trustees 39 Mazch 19, 2008 section a little bit shorter; instead of 20 feet, a little shorter? MR. COSTELLO: For what purpose? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Just for less structure. MR. COSTELLO: That's why I tried to narrow it up. I know the intention. TRUSTEE BERGEN: What we are looking at is the depth, in drawing a line between the two adjoining docks, making sure you don't go out further than that and projecting that's where the depth would be (Perusing). MR. COSTELLO: I think the boat lying parallel on the channel is a little better than going outside. Or backing into it. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Is the new one staked? TRUSTEE BERGEN: The outer end was not staked. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I didn't think we saw the stakes in the water. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Do you want to see it staked here and here? TRUSTEE DICKERSON: I think so. That's what I'm saying. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: John, can you have it staked on the outer corners of the "L"? MR. COSTELLO: I could do whatever you would like. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: And maybe meet us out there and we can discuss out there. MR. COSTELLO: Sure. And if you want to keep the discussion open, I'll contact the owner about either removing a portion of those wings or lowering it. Because, you know, the only real degree of deterioration is in the top edge. I mean, you know, if you want it lowered to some degree, 1 certainly would not suggest giving up whatever rights. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: I don't know that you want to cut them down too much because then if they are under water it becomes a hazard. MR. COSTELLO: The wings I would not cut under water, but I would lower them. TRUSTEE DOHERTY: All right, I'll make a motion that we table this so we can re-inspect it and meet Mr. Costello out in the field and see it staked. TRUSTEE DICKERSON: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) TRUSTEE DOHERTY: So on the 9th we'll meet you out there. MR. COSTELLO: Someone will call my office? TRUSTEE DOHERTY: Yes. Is there anyone else that wants to comment? (No response.) MR. COSTELLO: I have a question of Peggy, if it is. If that's the conclusion of the meeting TRUSTEE DOHERTY: We have not made a motion to go off the meeting yet. Board of Trustees 40 March 19, 2008 TRUSTEE KING: I think that's the end of it. I'll make a motion we go off the meeting. TRUSTEE GHOSIO: Second. TRUSTEE KING: All in favor? (ALL AYES.) RECEIVED ` F111.E~ 3~05~^~ JUN 192008 ~Q~~,~, Southold Town Clerk