HomeMy WebLinkAboutTR-06/30/1994 Albert J. Krupski, President
John Holzapfel, Vice President
William G. Albertson
Martin H. Garrell
Peter Wenczel
BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
Town Hal~
53095 Main Road
P.O. Box 1179
Southold, New York 11971
Telephone (516) 765-1892
Fax (516) 765-1823
PRESENT WERE:
ABSENT WAS:
MINUTES
JUNE 30, 1994
Albert J. Krupski, Jr., President
John Holzapfel, Vice-President
Peter Wenczel, Member
Martin H. Garrell, Member
Jill D~kherty, Clerk
William G. Albertson, Member
Worksession:
CALL MEETING TO ORDER
-P-AEDGE OF ALLEG%ANCE
NEXT TRUSTEE BOARD MEETING: Thursday, July 28, 1994 at 7P.M.
WORKSESSION: 6:00 P.M.
NEXT FIELD INSPECTION: Thurs. July 21, 1994 at 12 noon.
WORKSESSION: 4:00 P.M.
APPROVE MINUTES: April 27, 1994 & May 26, 1994
Board to vote on them at next meeting.
I. MONTHLY REPORT: Trustees monthly report for May 1994: A
check for $4,450.38 was forwarded to the Supervisor's Office for
the General Fund.
It. PUBLIC NOTICES: Public notices are posted on the Town
Clerk's Bulletin Board for review.
III. AMENDMENTS/WAIVERS/CHANGES:
1. En-Consultants on behalf of CLEAVES POINT CLUB AND MARINA
request an amendment to Permit $4224 to modify existing dock
consisting of a fixed ~ier, hinged ramp, floating docks,
floating wave curtain. The existing fixed pier will now have an
overall dimension of 6' X 245' with a 6' X 110' outer "T". Both
fixed sections will have.20' sections of wave baffles on
alternate sides with 10' spacing. The ouser "T" will have (2)
4' X 30~ fixed finger docks with (2) pilings between. A 4' X
Board of Trustees 2 June 30, 1994
14' hinged ramp will extend off the (roughly) mid-section of the
main fixed pier and rest upon a 6' X 100' series of floats, on
the north side of this main float will be (4) 3' X 25' fixed
floats with (3) mooring pilings. On the south side of the main
float will be (4) 3' X 30' finger floats with (3) mooring
pilings. On the east side of the main section of the fixed pier
will be (6) mooring pilings for transient slips. Located 2820
Shipyard Lane, East Marion.
After speaking with the agent and the applicantsr a motion was
made by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI and seconded by TRUSTEE ~OLZAPFEL to
approve subject to receiving revised plans showing only 16 slips
and removing the pilings on the east side of dock. ALL AYES
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: 96 S~DFORD FRIEMANN request an amendment
to permit 94318 to add a 3' X 12' ramp and an 8' X 20' float to
existing dock. Located 1165 Old Harbor Road, New Suffolk.
~117-3-8.4. This matches up with neighboring docks and
structures. A motion was made by TRUSTEE GARRELL and seconded
by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL. AYES: GARRELL, HOLZAPFEL, WENCZEL.
Abstain: KRUPSKI.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Now we will move on to our public hearings.
Trustees spoke with Chris Connors at worksession- asked him
to check into ~'Clivus Multr~n~~' system (composting toilet),
Ruth CoOk has one. Board will review with Health Dept.
~ublic Hearin~will be recessed until next meeting 7/28/94.
----~:46 P.M. In the matter of SCALLOP SEASON: Board to consider
opening the conm~ercial season October t7, 1994 and
non-commercial on October 3, 1994 giving them two weeks prior to
commezcial season. Would anyone here like to speak in favor or
against this proposal?
MRo LENNOX: I would like to ask a question. Why is this being
considered? Did we not have a 30 day period last year?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That is right. Last year we got a request and I
don't know who it was from to extend the non-commercial scallop
season at the beginning of the season to four weeks instead of
the normal two week time. Since time in memorial it has been a
two week period between the private and the commercial to give
people a chance to get a mess of scallops without the commercial
people...
MR. DELISLE: It has always been a month.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It has always been two weeks.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: It has always been two weeks.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Last year it was changed to see how it would
go. Someone had an idea and the board passed it and gave it a
chance. That is why it was changed, we ha~e a letter in the
file from the baymen saying that this was abused by people who
where using it as a semi co~ercial season that people would
take time off of work and go out and take more than theiz limit
and that there where a lot of scallops taken illegally. This
public hearing is here because we want to see what peoples
comments are based on keeping it or changing it back.
Board of Trustees 3 June 30, 1994
MR. LENNOX: As far as I know this is the only brake that the
non-commercial fishermen get in phis world. The only one.
MR. DELISLE: We always had thirt~ days in Hallocks Bay.
TR]~STEE HOLZAPFEL: That is not t~ue.
TRUSTEE KRLPPSKI: With a regutar~hetlfish permit you can still
go out there and harvest throughput the entire season. It
doesn't mean that you only get the two weeks and you can't go
out t~here again.
BRUCE LOUCKA: I am speaking for myself not as a CAC member. I
am oppose to this. YOU mentioned that if there is a problem with
the people that are in there duIing the first two days taking
excess, that is an enforcement ~
thr°ug~ enforcement. The people
half a bushel shouldn't be penal
doings., or peopl~ going in dur~
taking by hand~ Once the dredge
anymore because the water is clc
~USTEE ~OLZAPFEL: What brought
that the commercial people where
period and. harves%ing them and
with two or three relatives
all getting their legal half of
t~gether and getting one or two
me~bers and everything else.
this year because the price was
problem. It wasn't a private
commercial season.
robtem. It should be looked out
that obey the law take their
ired because someone else is
ng those first thirty days
goes in you can't take by hand
uded up. I had to go home.
this about to some extent is
going in during that one mont~h
them. They would go in
a bushel. They where
but they where getting
three bushels with family
became a semi-commercial season
high. That was part of the
it turned out to be a
MR. LENNOX: This is not going t~ help that. They a~e still
going to do that in the two wee~s.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: SOmeone made a~uggestion of limiting to a
bushel a boat. That way you couldn't abuse it. That way people
limit.
code change,
We could ~eco~m~end it.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: That is not are considering tonight.
We are just simply to open the commercial
season. Part of the reason that baymen re.quested that the
~ks after ~h~ non-commercial
~adbeen is beCause one problem
sd up November l which would
ke we had last year, most of of
s up...Changed tape...scatlops
opening 'up at that point the
eting of the baymen that they
product bY opening the season
er 1.
BRUCE LOUCKA: That can be solve~ by opening the mess season in
September.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL¢ You can't do that because now State law says
when scallop season will open. The State season opens the first
Monday in October. The reason ~hat it was changed from the
third the Monday in September was because at that time in
September and early Octobe~ the Scallops are growing rapidly.
They spend most of their energy during the Summer spawning.
they encountered is when it ope~
allow for a thirty day season lJ
Cape Code and MaSsachusetts ope~
on the market. By Southold Town
price was falling. It was the ~
can get a better price for thei~
mid October as opposed to Novem~
Board of Trustees 4 June 30, ].994
Once you ~get to late September they put their energy into
g~owth. So by delaying the season we are able to get a much
better product and we are also able to assure they where
f!nish~ with their spawning cycle before they where harvested.
It wouid counter productive to move the opening the
non-commercial season back. I don't quite u~derstand, not as a
Trustee but as a baymen, why the non-commercial person needs
more then two weeks and why if they need more than that why they
don't s come out when it opens up.
When it is opened up you cannot see the bottom
go through and you can't see the bottom.
What is best for the resource, Pete.
is not a resource question. This is more
a user question.
TRUSTEE ~ARRELL,: Does the harvest increase, decrease? what
impact on'numbers of Scallops?
It has no effect.
It has no effect no matter which way you go?
I don't think so. Not as long as you assume
that the season can open no sooner than the first Monday in
OCtober° It has an effect on what is maybe what is available for
the commercial fishermen.
TRUSTEE GARELL: ItobviOusly has an effect on the public
judging from the strong feelings.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Well, strong feelings from a few
individuals. How man~ Scallops can you eat?
MR. LENNOX: Sir, would you explain to me how they allow them
season a month early more north of us in
don't understand hOw that hapuens. You
the spawning season. Does in end earlier.
places up north open up October 15th,
some places open up November 1st. I think the Islands and most
of Cape Code opens up November 1st. Up there their spawning
seaSOn runs late~ then ours does because their water temperature
is colder.
TRUSTEE Do I have any other comment? I need a motion to
close thepubliC hearing.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Motion to close.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I make a motion that we set the opening of
the commercial SCallop season at October 17, 1994 and the
non-co~Lm,ercial season October 3, 1994.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. AYES: Wenczel, ~olzapfel,
Krupski. ABSTAIN: Garrell.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 7:56 in the matter of the Town age restriction
of commercial shellfish license. Board to consider lowering the
current age restriction which is now 14 years of age. Anyone
here who would like to speak to that either for or against?
Peter would you like to explain this?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: The baymen once again asked ~or a change in
that restriction. When it comes to getting a New York State
Co~ercial permit there is no age restriction, it has
traditionally been practice that when the Scallop Season is,
this probably applies mostly to Scallop Season, in process the
Board of Trustees 5 J~.zne 30, 1994
people who make their living on the water generally go as a
family. In the creeks now it is five bushels per person or ten
bushels per boat. They would traditionally take either a spouse
or a family member in order to get that ten bushel limit. The
baymen felt that restricting it to 14 years of age was unfair
and wasn't in keeping with what the State regulation where.
Theyasked that that be lowered.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What do you recommend that it be lowered to?
TRUSTEE' WENCZEL: I am not sure what it should be.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: To bad there is not a representative from the
Baymens Association here.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: We had a Shellfish Advisory meeting, it was
diScuSsed at that'. At that meeting there are a half a dozen
baymen, a half a dozen citizens of~ the Town who are not
professional baymen and there are a couple of professional
scientists or members of organizations. It was battered around
back and forth amongst this group and they talked about 12. They
almost called it a Jr. licence. The kids would not be able to
take as much as a cU~m~ercial licence. That they would be able to
take hallo
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Half the limit, half the price for co~m~erciat
licence~
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: The kids can have the experience of going out
A1 was at the meeting too and he brouqht up the
point that ] ng his tractor at ~ or 10. It is part of
ahel ~y~ is~ I brought it up there and I'll
bring it up are parents going to drag there kids out
there just the boat to be capable in qetting another
half of a bushel and is that child abuse, I am using that word
it~ Get the wheel of a tractor, put the kid on
your lap a~d take the steering wheel of the car. The
questions b~comes one of numbers of People and availability of
shellfish~ I think the problem with all the fisheries is that we
seem to be~ g~tting into an area whether it is shellfish or
finfish where we are having to restrict the number of users.
TRUSTEE HOLZ~PFEL: Scallop season is a very different organism~
because, scallops only live two years.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: I ~ow.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I am ~ust trying to say that there is no
stock when you talk about ScalIops. The adults are the ones that
are harvested and they die the second Winter. There is no
pressure. The idea is to get all of them. They are just going
to go to waste. It is a little bit different when you are taking
about resource in that case.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: But it doesn't say commercial scalloping
tiCence, it says co~:~erciat shellfishing license.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Right, but it applies mostly to scallops. I
think we should go with the recommendation of the shellfish
advisory committee. That is the whole point of that committee.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Alright. And those recommer~ations are?
Board of Trustees 6 June 30, 1994
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: From 12 to 14 will be a Jr. license. If the
feeling of the baymen was tO preserve a heritage and a way of
life for the b&~men then it is appropriate to have the children
at a young age be accustom to the way of life as a bala~en. That
is my feeling. It should be appropriate for a kid. When I was
12 I liked to work and earn a buck and I don't think that is
such a bad to learn the value of a dollar at a early age~
think that the baymen...it is almost an incentive to take a
child out there. As one baymen told me privately, if the child
doesn't want to be out there, you will never bring them out
there again. It would make an awful long day for yourself. I
would be in favor of a Jr. licence for the shellfish season. I
don't know if we can brake that off on a commercial level
strictly for the scallop season.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: There are a lot of kids' who like to go
clamming.
TRUSTE~KRUPSKI: That is true. Alright.
MR. LEI~qEX: The clams don't die at the end of two years.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: You think that the 12 year old's are going
to clean it all up.
MR. MARTIn: It puts more pressure on a very valuable and a very
scarce resource we have right now. Nobody knows where the brown
or. the red tide comes from. They can't put there finger on it
and you are just putting that much more pressure on a very
~arce, valuable resource.
USTEE KRUPSKI: If we act on this I suggest that we act on a
one year trial period, if people feel this is abuse, they can
take a look certainly and see who is out on t.he~water~ There is
no hiding the fact. We will have a record in Town Hall as to
the number of Jr. permits issued. So we will know in fact ho~
many permits w~re issued. Is there any record with the State? Do
to tag the clams?
Sure they tag them. What do you mean?
~'KRUPSK!: Do they have a record of who hazvested them?
TRUSTEE wENcZEL: No. The buyer has to maintain the tags and
has a reco~d of who sold what. The individual has to keep a
log~. But the State doesn't keep a track that Joe Smith caught
som~ many clams per year.
TRuBTEEKRUpSKi: So you are saying that the harvester has to
keep the record?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: That is right.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Are they required by law to keep that?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: That is right.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I would move to approve this on 12-14 on a Jr.
licence where they would half the commercial limit and it would
cost half the amount for that commercial limit and we will
review this again next year and see how many Jr. permits where
issued. They are required by laW to keep a record of how much
was taken because the shellfish has to be taggedby the State
and then we will know how much of the resource has been taken
o~t.
MR. MARTIN: And supply that record to you here?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes, absolutely.
Board of Trustees 7 June 30, 1994
MR. ~MARTIN: Will those Jr. Commercial people will they fish
dusting~the co~erciai season only and not prior to or in the
non-commercial season.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: They can take a non-commercial limit at the
non-coam~ercial season.
TRUSTEEKRUPSKI: They are restricted by the c~mmercial season.
MR. DELISLE: What would be the charge for the commercial
licence?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Half the price. They would half the limit and
be charged half the price. What is the charge for a commercial
Shellfish licence?
TRUSTEE'WENCZEL: Plus they would need a State pe£~it. State
permit is 50.00 dollars I think.
T~USTEE KRUPSKI: Peter, do you have any idea on how many people
are interested in this?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: No not really. I don't think that there will
be that many people.
MR. 5~RTIN: You are going to say that a child and a father, the
father having a full commercial licence and child having half,
can drag 7 1/2 bushels in the same boat and drag for that many
more hours?
TRUSTEEWENCZEL: Right. Sir I will tell you, t have been on
the water for over 20 years and when there are plenty of
S~allops m~wife and I would go in the beginning of the season
and we would each get our limit. If I am interested in getting
ten bushels in Town waters I think I would just take my wife
anyhow and it is not going to have an effect one way or the
other. You are still restricted to five bushe~s~per person and
ten per b~at.
TRUSTEE KI~UPSKI: He is taking an adult with him and he will get
ten bushels. If ke takes a child then he only gets 7 1/2.
TRUSTEE'W~'C~ZEL: My ¥~ds are in school dusting the week they
are not going to be out there.
MR. LENNEX: But . .the licences?
TRUSTEE!KRUPSKI: ~ou are restricted by ten bushels per boat.
You are not taking anything additional. You. are actually taking
IeSs if~yo~ take a child.
TRUS~/EE GARRELL: So if you take a child and your wife you
still be..2?
uUSTEE KRUPSKI: Only ten.
STEEDELISLE: What about clams?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there a limit on clams per boat?
ST~WENCZEL~ It is irrelevant. 2.000 clams a day.
STEEKRuPsKI. Does anyone catch 2000 clams a day?
TRUSTEE WENCZ~.: Only in the conditional areas and only on
very rare occasion. It would be hard pressed.
AUDIENCE ME~ER: What did he say.
TRUSTEE KRUP3SKI: He said the limit on clams is 2000 clams a day.
The 0nl~ time someone gets 2000 cia, s a day is when they open a
conditional area that is closed because of bad water quality and
then they open that area like Arshom~maque Pond or ~attituck
Inlet° Then people go in there° It is a conditional permit
which means if it rains 2/10tbs of an inch it closes down for
a week. So the people can go in there. There is a tramendas
Board of Trustees 8 June 30, 1994
resource there because the water quality is closed most of the
time.
~R. LENNOX: Is there a restriction on the number of people
that can be on a boat for commercial clamming?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I don't think so.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: I gather that most of the young people that
you have interested in this would be doing scalloping most of
the rims?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I would think so.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Again, if we adopt this it would be a one year
trial period. I got a motion on the floor.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Excuse me just to clarify. There is a ...2
or more person occupying the same boat may take not more than
4000 clams in one day for commercial purposes. So it is the
same as with scallops.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: SO if you have a child with you, you can only
take 3000.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second.
TRUSTV~ KRUPSKI: O.K. we have a motion and a second. All in
favor?
AYES: Garrell, Krupski, Wenczel. Ney: Holzapfel
TRUSTEE KRLvPSKI: O.K, so we ha~e a half price, half limit on 12
to 14 and require the licence holder to give us at the end of
t~e year upon permit renewal they will have to provide uswith
the information on how many bushel they harvested.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 8:19 P.M. In the matter of Costello Marine
Cont. on behalf of IRENE MILLER to install accsss~walkway and
stairway beach as follows: 1 4'X 19' walkway, ~2 - 3~ X 20~
horizontal walkways, 4 - 3' X 20' stairways and 1 - 4' X 8' mid
platform. Located 160 Salt Marsh Lane, Peconic.
SCTM ~68-3-10. Is there anyone here who would like to speak
in favor of this.
SUE LONG: On behalf of Costello Marine Contr. I am here to
answer any questions you might have. Simply there is a
beautiful piece of property there and Mrs. 'Miller wants to
provide safe access for her family and her guest to enjoy the
beach below.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Would anyone like to speak against this before
we start making comments? O.K. Bill Albertson took a look at
this.
BRUCE LOUCF~: Do you have our comments on this?
TRUSTEE, KRUPSKI: The comments from' the CAC where to reco. m~end
approval provided the staircase be elevated a minimum of 4'
above grade and that under the stairs is re-vegetated to prevent
erosion. Bill Albertson who is not in this Continent writes:
Picture where provided by the applicants, finding this house was
half the battle, at present the only way to the beach is a long
walk around. Mrs. Miller wishes to be able to access the beach
rom her property. Ske told me if she could have a stairway to
he beach, she wiil be happy. I had no measuring tape, but I
think this stairway is beyond 100 feet from the water.
The only thing I am wondering about is why Mrs. Miller needs a
4' X 8' platform half way down the bluff?
Board of Trustees 9 June 30, 1994
SUE LONG: That platform is somewhat of a safety precaution. Kind
of like a stop midway and catch your breath. And if someone
trips and falls on the way down, that is a little catch haven.
They are installed in all of the stairways that we construct for
our clients.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: 4 X 8'?
SUE LONG: That is what. we propose. I can't tell you off the top
of my head-. Sometimes the DEC reconu~zends 4' X 6' as a minimum.
I haven't gotten any negative response from the DEC regarding
the size of that platform. They did ask for additional photos
because there is a tremendous length of property from the toe of
the bluff out to the water line. The pictures are very
deceiving because it is such large area.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: SO Mrs. Miller might not have a problem with
limiting the platform to 6' long instead of 8'?
SUE LONG: Pro~ably not. I think she would be very happy to have
the staircase there.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other further co~m~ent? Close the hearing.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I make the motion to approve it with the
stipulation that the landing be 4' X 6' and the steps be 4'
elevated and revegetated under them.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
T~USTEE KRUPSKI: 8:24 P.M. in the matter of Costelto Marine
Contr. on behalf of DAN KELLY to replace lower stringer on
b~lkhead, replacewooden sheathing on two jetties~ extend
existing dock facility by installing a 3' X 20'.a!uminum ramp
and a 6' X 24' floating dock secured by two 2 pile dolphins.
Located Village Lane, Orient. ~26-1-20.1.
Anyone here who woUld like to speak against this application?
Anyone here who would like to speak in favor of this application?
SUE LONG: Costello Marine, again. I will answer any questions
that you have. Simply there is a 40' existing dock there now~ a
fixed structure. We would like to add a twenty foot ramp and a
twenty foot float to the end of that. I have been at the site
and the dock to the north of it does extend 52~ past the
existing dock of our client. Even with our extension he (the
neighbor) will still extend 32~ beyond that. We are not asking
for an excessive amount he just wants to get a little more water
~epth there and also repair the bottom stringer on that bulkhead
which is falling off and those jetties are in a bad state and we
want tO fix those up.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. CAC recommends approval without
any conditions.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Is there much of difference in the depth of
the water from where he is now to where he is going out?
SUE LONG: About 2 1/2 to 3 1/2'.
TRUSTP~ HOLZA~FEL: What is it now?
SUE LONG: Approximately 2 1/2'. I would, also like to mention
that the property is on an angle and the Dormen dock is
somewhat on an angle. This dock goes out on an angle and there
is Bredemeyer's house right in the middle of those twe docks.
If he so chooses in the f,at'~re to do anything in between those
Board of Trustees 10 June 30, 1994
two docks, because of the angles to the right of him and the
dock %hat we are working on now there will be ample room for him
do Something there in the future. Thank you.
KR%~SKI: Any other comments?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: It was my feeling when we where dow~ there
that the dock was to long for the area- It is going to extend
beyond what that other dock is now, right?
UUE L~NG: No. It will be 32' shorter then the Dormens dock.
STEE WENCZEL: The Dormens is the big one'with "L'~ on the
end of it.
S~E LONG: Yes. We just constructed a dock south of that, Mr..
Fr~r~chs dock, and his is 100' out, his fixed dock.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: I take it that the lengths of those dock~ in
that area pushing, pushing out to 100' length is necessar~
water depth.
Yes. But a part of him wanting to put a ramp and float
also is for bathing access for his family. As I said the dock
will be 32' shorter after we put the ramp and float on then the
Dormen dock.. It is still shorter than dock to the south that
we constructed. I am sure the float and the ramp will be
during the Winter months. That is a pretty heav~
there.
HOLZAPFEL: There was some concern at that particular
spot is a very highly used area for scalloping. Local people go
out there _and if you are putting that out there you are all of a
sudden building a circle around it that the local people will be
blocked off.
TRUSTEE KRU~SKI: Then why don~t we put a condition on it that it
will be removed by the Scallop season.
SUE LONG: When is scallop season?
Ti~JSTEEKRUPSKI: Lets just say sometime in mid Oct~ner.
SUE LON~: The boating season isn't quite over yet.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: How about November 1st.
SUE LONG: ..~
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It was just a consideration that we had. We
are trying to protect the bottom for everybody. You are asking
to take a square ~ootage from everybody else.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It is not just this area. We are placing a
limit on the length of docks in the bays anyway. Just because
the depth of water isn't a good enough reason to extend a dock.
You could have a~y size boat and you need 5' of water you can go
out 500' in the bay. You got to come up with some sort of
reasonability. I would say if we could put a restriction that
it is out by November 1st.
SUE LONG: O.K. I don't know what my client will say about that.
TP. USTEE KRUPSKI: unless there is some sort o~ special cumpelting
reason that he has to keep it in to November 7th or
something.
SUE LONG: I guess if you put that condition on that, we can
always come back to you with a grievance saying there is a
problem?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other comment? Do I have a motion to close
the hearing?
Board of Trustees 1i June 30, 1994
DAN KELLY: Excuse me. I am the owner of the property. I have
just listened to you a few minutes ago lower the age for
children to scallop~ change the scalloping season and I just
think that that proposal for November 1st may not be fare to
my family either.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Please tell us why. That is fine. I am glad you
are here.
DAN KELLY: I just feel that~ as someone said earlier, with
paying a premium for the waterfront property part of the
intention was to make the most use of access of the waterfront
property. Especially by the family. That is why we wanted to
relocate. I just question the motives for wanting that
restriction. I think that. it is on fair restriction.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Do you see the other side~ In the sense that
the bottom belongs to everybody' in the state and what you are
saying is that you want exclusive use to a certain part of it.
DAN KELLY: I don't find that certain part. to be excessive when
you look at the other existing structures .that are presently in
place.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Would you take the float and ramp out in the
Winter time?
DAN KELLY: I have every intension of it because I was real
impressed with the amount of ice that was there this year. In
fact one of my jetties was destroyed by the ice tkis year.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What is a good date for you?
DAN KELLY: Would December Ist be a problem?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That sounds fine with me. If there is a
resource there, it is still going to be there..._
DAN KELLY: I am not looking to...
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No, that is fine. I am glad you are here for
that.
DAN F~LLY: I would like my children to be able to utilize that
dock for there own pleasure,
TRUSTEE: KRUPSKI: That is fine. Is that o.K.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: No problem at all.
DAN KELLY: Is there a time where putting it back in?
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: When the ice is gone.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to close the hearing.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES,
TRUSTEE HOLZAPF~,L: I make a motion to approve the application
with the stipulation that the dock and ramp is removed by
December 1.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 8:37 P.Mo In the matter of CHARLES BUR~qtAM to
renovate .existing residence on same foot print except for the
southerly end which will be extended 30', as per survey dated
April 22, 19R3. Locate Pine Neck Road, Southold.. ~70-6-19.
Is there anyone here who would like to speak on this application
either in favor or against?
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It is a house that exist now and they are
just going to add a little bit to it. They had originall~asked
for a letter of non-jurisdiction. We said no that it was
slightly within our area and they came back and filled out an
Board of Trustees 12 June 30~ 1994
application and I would suggest that there are no problems as
long as there is the normal haybales, runoff, the normal things
that we do when a new building gets put in is in place.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: CAC reco~m,ends approval. Do I have a motion
to close the hearing?
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Close~
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I will make a motion to approve the
application as is with the normal building.~.Hay bales on the
water side, at the crest of the hill. At the top of the bluff.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSEI: 8:35 P.M. - In the matter of Paul Heffernan
on behalf of THERESA CASAMISINA for a 37' bulkhead that was
built in 1978. Located 1195 Island View Lane, Greenport.
~57-2-19.
Would anyone Like to speak against this application? Would
anyone here like to speak on behalf of this application?
CAC recon~ends approval for the wetland application to obtain
a permit for a 37' bulkhead that was build in 1978. CAC sees
no need for the bulkhead but is concerned for the damage which
could occur. The present bulkhead is ripped out.
TRUSTEE HOLZA~FEL: It is not old enough to be Grandfathered,
but they never got a permit now. They don't want to build
anything, the~ just want to record it on there deed so they can
sell their house?
CLERK: That is! my underst~nding from speaking to Mr. Heffernan.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Being no further comment, I wilt entertain a
motion to clos~ the hearing.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: So moved.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to approve.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
The public hearing on SARA GICALE was not held as the board
received a letter stating that the applicant is withdrawing her
application. SCTM $110-7-17.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 8:37 P.M. - In 'the matter of HAROLD AVENT to
obtain a permit for a single family dwelling as. per map dated
march 28, !994. Located off new Suffolk Ave.~ Mattituck.
BCTM ~115-10-2. Is there anyone here would like to speak in
favor of this application? Is there anyone here who would like
to speak against thisapplication? This is one we have been out
on a couple of timeS. The applicant was supposed to stake the
house. Half of which was in the farm field.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: The critical thing is the b~nk. It is one of
the last pieces of intact banks along the edge of Deep Hole. I
have no problem with it.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We can recommend a buffer zone of say 20' of
turf in front of the house. That will give you 65' of buffer.
That is what I would recommend anyway. 2~' on the east of the
house turfed area, no more than that and the rest Would be
Board of Trustees 13 June 30, 1994
undisturbed buffer zone. Do I have a motion to close the
hearing?
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: So moved°
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I will make the motion to approve the
application based on the east side the house no disturbed areas
beyond 20' and we would like to see gutters and drywells and a
staked row of haybales 20~ from the proposed house.
TRUSTEE HOLZA3FEL: SeCond. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 8:40 P.M. - In the matter of JOHN & MARY KELLY
to construct a 3' X 20' catwalk, a 3' X 12' ramp~ two 4' X 10'
floats and one 6' X 11' docking float to be taken out each
Winter. Located 2900 Beebe Drive, Cutchogue.
SCTM ~10323-15. Would anyone here like to speak in favor of
this application? Would anyone herelike tospeak against this
application? I would reco~u~end approval of this as long as the
floats don't set on the bottom. No further comment from the
Board?
Motion to close the public hearing.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I will make a motion to approve with the
condition that the CAC recommendations be followe~ about
spartina planting above the mean high tide mark and extending
the.ciatwalk back 10 more feet towards the house so that no
traffic would have to take place in the field itself.
TRUSTEE~OLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 8:42 P.M~ - In the matter of ROBERT L. GARBEN
to construct a 3' X 60' floating dock from bulkhead out toward
channel. Located 3575 Wells Ave., 350' east of Oaklawn Ave.,
Southold. SCTM ~70-4-5.
ROBERT ~AR~N: My name is Robert Garben. I have acquired
this hoUse about 7 or 8 years ago and I am an avid sailor and
canoeist. When I have quest at the house and we use the canoe
along the. beach~ Part of the area in front of the staving is
sand ?ast of ~he old dock that Mr. Goldsmith had, it is
SPartlina it is some other kind. There is a be~ch that extends
out towar'd Joe ... q~ite a distance. What I was trying to
~rganize to have is a floating dock just to accommodate people
oardinG canoes or a sunfish and occasionally an outboard
runabout to take my guest to the beach or locally to bay through
the canal. I understand there: is a problem with the permit and
maybe you can inform me and tell me what the real problem is so
maybe we can work it out together.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. Do you have any DEC approval?
ROBERT G~RBEN: There was a dock there years ago. Jim RiCh
remembers when there was a dock there. ~ ~ever saw it.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Some of the concern that th6 Board has was
the concern is the ~act that you are using a floating dock
instead of a catwalk going out over the bottom. That water is
very shallow.
ROBERT GARBEN: The reason why I want a floating dock is due to
the fact that boarding a canoe or sunEish you need a dock about
Board of Trustees 14 June 30~ 1994
a 1' 1 1/2' from the water. For any people that are at least
bit unsteady on their feet they can get in trouble. My wife has
a bad knee and we didn't want have a permit ramp out to the
floating dock because she has to climb down stairs one foot at a
time. She is alright once she is on the boat. To go from the
land to the water craft is a bit fo~ of a problem. As we walk
out from the staving there is about 3 or 4 steps down to the
stand~ The reason I didn't want a ramp is due to the fact that
we might get 2 canoes out and a sunfish and maybe a sailing
dingy when I have company and we line them up on the beach. It
would be more accommodating if we had a small floating dock that
they could instead of getting in the water along the edge they
would have clean feet and get in the boat and proceed from
there. If you walk out 12' from the shoreline you go up to your
waist in mud. That is one of the reasons why I wanted the dock.
I don't need dredging. We have a larger boat that we keep out
at a mooring and we row out to that and leave the dingy there
and go off. But for conditions when we are going to the beach
and we have a picnic or a party and you have say 25 guest and 10
or so want to use the small boats, it would be convenient to
have a small floating dock. When I gave the proposal it said
S~me where are 54 or 64'. The reason I took that figure is
because some of the docks are that far out. It doesn't mean I
have to go that far out. If I can go out 25 or 30' would be
great.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I don't think the DEC would grant a permit for
a Eloat that is going to rest on the bottom.
ROBERT GAB~EN: Would it be alright if put the~f-loat out beyond
the ...and had a gang plank. The gang plank would not be left
there. I would pull it up on the shore line. The reason I don't
want a Permanent gang plank or ramp is that I take the boats
down to the shore line and line them up on the beach, I have to
drag them either over the dock or under the dock. That is not
good for the boats plus it isn't goOd for me. The main reason I
need the dock is that we go down to China if we get about 12'
off the shore.
TRUSTEE .KRUPSKI: We don't have a problem with that. The problem
is the fact that the float was going to laying on 'the bottom.
If you want to have a gang plank going out to get over that
inter tidal area and make a 20' gang plank and a 20' float.
ROBERT GARBEN: 20' would be rather large.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Whatever. I think we can work something out.
ROBERT GARBEN: Normally-the tide goes out beyond the grass
area. occasionally with a northwest wind with a moon it will go
out there 25 or 30'. There is no water ~rom the staving out
about 135 to i50' and then it is the dredged channel that goes
out about 7, 71/2'
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Again, we don~t want to approve something for
your your going to have to go to the DEC and they are not going
to approve that. Then you are1 going to have to come back to us
and have to get us to review it and amend our permit to reflect
what the DEC has given. We don't want to get in that situation
where you are bouncing back and forth.
BRUCE LOUCKA: Did you get our reco~endations?
Board of Trustees 15 June 30, 1994
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes.
TRUSTEE EOLZAPFEL: The Council disapproved the way it is because
it sits on the bottom. The Council suggest that the applicant
install a 3' wide catwalk beginning at the top lip of the
bulkhead leading to a 6~ X 20~ floating dock. The new
configuration should not exceed the original 60' intrusion put
into the creek° So in other words they are taking about a
catwalk leading from your bulkhead straight out with a ramp
going to down to a floating dock.
ROBERT GARBEN: Now that is the problem, if I had that catwalk,
Ii might as well not put it in. Then I have to drag the boats
over the dock or under it.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I don't understand why you are dragging the
boats. You don't have to put the catwalk in that location. You
can put it, we usually put it 15' off property lines, so you can
put 15' off the property line. Keep your boats on one side and
your catwalks here. Then you won't have to drag them anywhere.
~OeS that make any sense.
ROBERT GARBEN: Where I launch the boats is usually where there
is no vegetation. I have Rosa Rugosa, Pussy Willow, some
~herries, different natural plants. I don't want to disturb
that. I don't walk on that. I like to preserve that because it
preserves the shore. When a launch the boats I usually bring it.
on a roller or have somebody help me carry' them, then I put it
over 'the staving onto the shoreline and then I launch the boat.
TRUSTEE Fd{UPSKI: I am still not following you. If yo~ just move
~he structure over to the side, it would be out of the way of
moving your boats in and out.
R~BERT GARBEN: You mean put the ramp over to the' west or the
east?
TRUSTEE BiRUPSKI: That is right.
~OBERT GAP~BEN: It could be done. But there is already a stair
case in the middleof the property.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You can use the staircase to access the beach
and just walk to the structure and walk straight out.
TRUSTEE HOLZAP~: The problem is the floats. You might want to
think about in your mind. One 20' float out further so you can
g~t in and out easily.
TRUSTEEKRUPSKI: What is generally done is that you come off the
top of the bulkhead with a fixed dock to whatever length is
deemed necessary, have a ramp down and then your float out
here. You can have this off to the side. You would go right
over the vegetation and it will still grow.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Apply to the DEC and see what they say and
then get back to us.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We will recess this hearing and when you decide
what is the best for you we are ready to go.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Motion to recess.
TRUSTEE WEN'CZEL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI': 8:59 P.M. - In the matter of GA~DENERS BAY
ESTATES to install stairs, a 3' X 25' catwalk, a 3' X 12' ramp,
one 4' X 48' main float, two 3' X 14~ finger floats, one 6' X
~6~ finger float and pilings. ~Located end of Dogwood Lane, East
Board of Trustees 16 June 30, 1994
Marion. $37-4-17. When anyone like to speak against this
application? I just received a letter: Please be advised that
not withstanding by previous objections to the application for a
6. boat float by Gazdiners Bay Home Owners Association
presently pending before the Town Trustees, I hereby no longer
apposed this application. Sincerely~ Warren A. Sambach, Jr,
Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the
application? Does the Board have any questions?
I have a letter in the file from Gardiners Bay Homeowners
Assoc. Dear Sirs, please be advised that on June 4, 1994
Gardiners Bay Estates Homeowners Association, Inc. Board of
Uirectors passed the following resolution in regards to dockaqe
on Dog Wood Lane. One, the Sambach~s will give existing ramp
and catwalk and float to Association. valued at $1,600.00. In
consideration of this donation the Sambach's will have the
right of first refusal for the dockage of' one boat and pay the
annual floating dock and boat fees. Two, it is understood that
no rights of the Association property are given away. Three, if
the Gardiners Bay Estates Homeowners Association Board agrees
to this rec~.,~.endation the SambaCh's will send a letter (which
we have received) to the Southold Town Board. of Trustees stating
no objection to the proposed application to the
which will not take any legal action. Four, if application is
approVed the Association will enter into an a~reement with the
Sambach~s that if the property is ever sold the new owner has
the yearly right of first refusal to dock one boat on one si~e
of the float. Five, if the Town Board of Trustees does not
approve application of a six boat float all o~the previsions of
the above paragraphs apply. Both. Mr. & Mrs. Sambach have
agreed to the above resolution. Yours very truly, Secretary
the Homeowners Association. Any comment?
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Motion to close the hearing.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE HULZAPFEL: Motion to approve the application.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. AYES: Holzapfel, Garrell,
Wenczel. NAY: Krupski.
V. ASSESSMENTS:
1. Land Use Co. on behalf of CARLO DE GAUDENZI to install
a 1~' X 30' "Geoweb" boat ramp. Boat ramp will be planted with
S~artina Alterniflora and Spartina Patens after
installation. Located 3520 Ole Jule Lane, Mattituck. SCTM
~122-4-p/o 26.
Trustee Krupski read letter describing additional planting and
BOard reviewed plans. Board needs to see an overview of the
project.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to grant a Negative Declaration. ALL AYES.
2. Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of RONALD STRITZLER to
construct retaining wall 410' long,t!rpically 6~ above grade,
with returns at each end. Length of returns estimated from
survey to be 12~ at west end and 22' at east end. Actual
Board of Trustees 17 June 30~ 1994
lengths to be determined during construction by intersection of
top of retaining wall with face of bluff° Smooth face of bluff,
in accordance with recommendations of Suffolk County Soil &
Water Conservation ~istrict, to permit re-vegetation and
min~ze further erosion from run-off, use material resulting
from smoothing as backfill retaining wall. Located 3055 Sound
Ave.~ Mattituck. $94-1-14~
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I make a motion that we do a positive
declaration.
TRUSTEE W--ENCZEL: Second~ ALL AYES~
After a discussion with Tom Samuels and James Fitzgerald~ a
motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRETJ. to rescind the positive declaration. Mr. Samuels will
provide the Board with impact statements from projects from the
Southsideo The Board will review this before the next meeting
with regard to this application and Louis Corso application.
3. J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of ROBERT SEVILLE to construct
single family dwelling, second story decking, sanitary system,
gravel driveway, regrade and remove from site approx. 900 c.y.
of material in order~ to excavate for foundation and driveway,
home heating oil tank to be located in basement (sealed) and
~ank shall meet or exceed all requirements of the SCD~.
Install and m~intain a continuous line of staked hay bales on
top of erosion control bank. Located Private Road~ Fishers
Island. SCTM $7-2-8.
A motion was made.by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to grant a negative declaration. ALL.AYES.
4. EN-Consultants Inc., on behalf of NEW SUFFOLK SHIPYARD to
demolish an existing boat storage and replace with a smaller
metal building. New structure will be furt~ber from water than
existing building (56' vs. 33') and will have drywells which
present structure does not have. Remainder of area of old
building will be covered with bluestone to match existing yard.
Area shown on survey as "covered shed~ with "X: will be used for
installation of oUtdoor boat storage racks. Located New Suffolk
Road~ New Suffolk. SCTM $117-5-29.1
A motion, was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL to grant a negative declaration. ALL AYES.
5o J.M.O. Consultin~ on behalf of ALICE ~IGNEREY to
reconstruct within 1S~ approx. S0' of timber bulkhead and to
backfill structure with approx. 20 c.y. of clean sand which
shall be trucked in from an upland source, and disttbrbed areas
be replanted with Rosa Rugosa 18" on center. Located ~480
Paradise Point Road, Southold. SCTM #81-3'21.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to grant a negative declaration. ALL AYES°
6. Costello Marine Contr. on behalf of L~GIS BACON to
reconstruct existing deteriorated 12' X 285' fixed timber dock,
reconstruct offshore 6' X 64' "L" section with the installation
of a wave curtain to protect docked vessels from north northeast
~Board of Trustees lB June 30, 1994
and northwest winds, reconstruct offshore 32' X 32' filled dock,
replace two 6' X 24' floats and add three additional 6' X 24'
floats with associated mooring' pilings, and install four 7 pile
dolphins to safely berth ferry boat and/or supply barge. Located
Robins Island. SCTM ~134-3-5.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded byTRUSTEE
WENCZEL to grant a negative declaration. ALL AYES.
7. J~M.O. Consulting on behalf of THOMAS W. RUSSELL, JR., to
reconstruct and upgrade an existing rock revetment by installing
a 65' X 18' rock slope. 2 to 4 ton boulder shall be utilized
(4"-6" tailings) and a 1 1/2 to 1 slope will be created.
Disturbed areas will be filled with toam and seeded. Located
Fox Ave.~ Fishers Island. SCTM ~6-1-2.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WE~;CZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to grant a negative declaration. ALL AYES~
8. Eh-Consultants on behalf of LOUIS CORSO requests a permit
to construct a 460 1,f. of armored timber retaining wall as
noted on agenda. Board tabled this assessm~ut along with the
Striztler application in order for the Board to review impact
statements that Tom Samuels will lend the Board.
VI. RESOLUTIONS:
Board to set P'~blic Hearing for the July 28, 1994 regular
meeting for those applications that have received a negative
declaration and the following applications that_ are type II
actions:
a. Jay Dempsey on behalf of WALTER GREEN request permit
to construct a 55' long catwalk, ramp and float to
accommodate dockage of private boat. Proposed construction
is similar in design and size to other docks in area.
Located Pine Neck Road, Southold. SCTM ~70-6-20.
Page 7, 97,
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: En-Consultants on behalf of NEIL MCGOLDRICK
to Grandfather 467' of bulkheads, 78' of jetty and amend G.F.
permit to add a I4~ X 14' float and a 3' X 20' ramp. Located
Private Road, Off New Suffolk Ave., Mattituck..
After a discussion a motion was ma~e by TRUSTEE KRL~SKI and
seconded by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL to grant a Grandfather permit for
467' of bulkheads and 70' of jetty. ALL AYES.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL to deny the amendment and. request a full application
for the float and ramp. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: $8 JoM.O. Comsult~g on behalf of ROBERT
PATTERSON to construct guest rooms, ~errace, walk, deck,
platforms and to install additional drywel! in existing
sanitary system, all construction activity shall take place on
what is now lawn area. All construction activity Shall take
place a minimum of 55' from freshwater wetlands. A continuous
~Board of Trustees 19 June 30, 1994
line of staked hay bales shall be installed prior to and
maintained during all phases of construction activities and an
area of "no disturbance: Shall be maintained. All activity as
per plans prepared by Chandler, Palmer, & King last dated
February 16, 1994. Located Crescent Ave., Fishers Island.
SCTM ~6-1-10.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and Seconded. by TRUSTEE
KRUPSKI to approve this application. ALL.AYES.
Page 2 95
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of KIM K.
CAMPBELL requests an amendment to Permit 94256 to allow
applicant to construct garage~ pool, decking, pool backwash
filter and regrade garage and pool area. Located East Harbor,
Fishers Island.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE GARRELL and seconded by TRUSTEE
~OLZAPFEL to grant amendment with drywells a~d gutters on
garage° ALL AYES.
Page 3~ 912
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: James Thompson on behalf of LOUIS BACON
requests a waiver to install a temporar~ Geo Web gid section
launching ramp 20' X 70' at the end of First Street, New
Suffolk. SCTM ~117-8-20.
A motion-was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to approve waiver. ALL AYES.
Page 7, ~3
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: A. Thompson on behalf of LOUIS M. BACON
requests a permit to replace an existing 880 1.f. 6'
high'chain link ~ new 6' high vinyl coated' chain link
fence, install approx. 80 i.f. 6' high Chain
link fence at of parcel 2 and 13 6X6 CCA treated
pmsts 4' high (above finish grade) along southern boundary of
First Street and Jackson Street, New Suffolk. SCTM ~117-8-20.
A motion was made by'TRUSTEE KRU~SKI and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to grant a G~andfather permit for the fence. ALL AYES.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to grant an amendment to move the fence 3' east and
put planting in front of fence. AI.L AYES~
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUS~
WENCZEL to grant a waiver to install 80 1.f. 6' high fence at
mid Section. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE'KRUPSKI: Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of
ELLEN LANG requests a Grandfather permit to replace
inkind/inplace 3' X 27' catwalk and a 6' X 28' timber dock,
approx. 100' bulkhead which will connect to existing backing
system. Backfill void areas behind bulkhead with clean sand
approx. 15 c.y. Reinforce northerly section of bulkhead with
~Board of Trustees 20 June 30, 1994
two pilings. Located 3055 Wells Ave. r off Oaklawn Ave.~
Southold SCTM ~70-4-11o
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WENCZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZPAFEL to approve subject that the dimensions of bulkhead
and dock are included on survey and a 10' non-turf area behind
bulkhead. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: $6 Costello Marine on behalf of FRANK
CADEDDU requests a Grandfather permit to resheath outside
below stringer approx. 70' of bulkhead and resheath 25~ X
!5' of ramp area, replace two brokenface pilings, back fill
behind bulkhead with approx. 15 c.y. of clean fill. Located
1380 Wiggins Lane, East Marion. SCTM ~35-5-23.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE GARRELL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL approve grandfather. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: ~4 WILLIAM TUITE requests a Grandfather
permit for 100' of bulkhead and approx. 110~ jetty in order to
repair sections inkind/inplace. Located 580 Midway Road~
Southold. Cedar Beach park. SCTM $90-2-6
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded bM TRUSTEE
GARRELL to approve Grandfather subject to a 10' non-turf
area. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: ~5 NANCY GILLIES requests a Grandfather
permit to reconstruct stairs (59' X 36') as per suI~ey. Located
3925 Nassau Point Road, Cutchogue.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI and secor~ded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to approve Grandfather permit. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 99 SOUTHOLD PARK DISTRICT requests permit to
clear property on the east side of the wharf house, Founder's
Landing, Terry Lane of over grown weeds, small trees and beach
grass with heavy machinery. SCTM ~65-1-19.1.
After discussion a motion was made TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and
seconded by TRUSTEE GARRELL to table ~his application for
further review and inspection. ALL AYES.
TRUSTEE KRL~SKI: 910 Jim McMahon on behalf of Southold Town to:
a. to remove the asphalt boat ramp, located on Sandy Beach
Road, Greenport, and replace the asphalt ramp with a
concrete boat ramp.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL to approve request. ALL AYES.
b. to replace 400-' of concrete sidewalks and replace 400'
of chain link fence along Route 25, Greenport. This
project will take place behind a concrete retaining wall,
in an area adjoining a NYSDEC Freshwater Wetland.
SCTM ~34-t-10.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL to approve request. ALL AYES.
VII. MOORINGS:
~Board of Trustees 21 June 30, 1994
1. JoP~u Homans requests a mooring in Richmond Creek for an
18' outboard with a mushroom. Access: Public boat ramp
24 Aaron Avent requests a mooring in Wickham Creek for a
Duck Blind.
3. Edward Caven requests to re-apply for a mooring in
Broadwaters Cove for a 23' outboard-sail boat with a 100lb
mushroom. Access: Mason Drive.
4. Doris Aiello requests a mooring in James Creek for a 13'
outboard with 75 ~h. mushroom. Access: Public.
5. John Bopp, Jr. requests a mooring in Cedar Beach Creek
for a 20' outboard with a 1001b mushroom. Access: Land owner.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
KRUPSKI to approve the above mentioned application~subject to
the approval of the Bay Constable. ALL A~S.
Page 2, 92
ROBERT BANNON (formally Chester Alberts.on) requests an
amendment to Permit 94283 to add 2 piles next to his dock as
shown on drawing. Located Wells Ave., off Oaklawn, Southold.
SCTM $70-4-2.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WENCZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAP~EL to approve the amendment. ALL AYES.
3. J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of WILLI~ EDGETT requests an
amendment to Permit ~416i to-reduce the s~iz~ of the catwalk to
4' X 16~ instead of the approved 4' X 40'. Dock is already
built. Located 2~0 Deep Hole Drive, Mattituck. SCTM 9115-12-3.
A motion was made by the TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by
TRUSTEE GARRELL to approve amendment, subject to correct
drawing showing "L" configured dock. ALL AYES.
4. JOHN BOPP r~ an amendment to the Permit ~3795 to
modify mf the dock and catwalk to 3 !/2' above ground
level. The 4-6" locust stakes will be replaced with 6~ pressure
treated poles. An additional 6'X 16' floating dock 12' away
from current dock will be held by 2 6-8" pressure treated poles~
and a 3~ wide ramp connecting the floating dock. Located 175
Maple Ave., Mattituck. SCTM $88-3-11.5.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WENCZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to approve amendment. ALL AYES.
7. BILL MATASSONI requests a waiver to construct a 10' in
diameter and approx. 15' high gazebo instead of the previously
approved two car garage and apartment. Located Village Lane,
Orient. SCUM 924-2-24.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
KRUPSKI to approve waiver. ALL AYES.
Board of Trustees 22 June 30, 1994
8. MAURICE JE~O requests a waiver to construct two split
rail fences along the northern and southern property lines as
indicated ont he attached map. Owner has problem with people
dumping and wants to clean property up. This Vacant piece of
land is located on Maple Lane, East MariOD. SCTM ~35-5-25.
~ motion was made by TRUSTEE GARRELL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to table this request in order to check for permits on
existing docks. ALL AYES.
9. MARA SLATKIN request a waiver to construct a fence, first
section beginning at the cement monument marked "A" on the
attached survey, extending northward 19.50 feet and ending at a
locust post marked "1" on the attached survey. The second
sectionbeginning 69.78 feet northward of the monument "A" at a
locust post marked "2", then extending northward for 52.50 feet
and ending 3.50 feet south of cement monument "B" at locust post
'~3" on the survey. The third section beginning 1.50 feet north
of cement monument "B" at locust post "4" and extending north
for 9 feet and ending at locust post "5". Located long Creek
Drive, Southold. SCTM $52-8-3.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to approve waiver. ALL AYES~
10. JOHN NEVILLE requests a waiver to construct a gazebo as
shown on survey. Located 2380 Hobart Ave., Southold,
SCTM $64-3-6,
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WENCZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to approve waiver, ALL AYES.
11. Roy Stakey on behalf of CLIFF POLACEK request a waiver
to extend his deck 6~ X 6' as per drawing. Located Dee Drive,
Mattituck. SCTM $114-10-1.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE GARRELL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to table this request as Trustee Garrell feels this
was already built and wants to check Building Department
permits. ALL AYES.
13. DAVID & CLARE AIR requests a waiver to construct a 4'
high wooden picket fence along the southern property line of his
property. Located Village Lane, Orient. SCTM ~24-1-27.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE WENCZEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
HOLZAPFEL to approve waiver. ALL AYES.
14. ANN BERRYMAN request waiver to construct 60' fence on
west property line down to rocks as per survey dated June 3,
1994. Located Youngs Ave., Orient. SCTM $18-2-1.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to table this application as the ,property line is not
clear on the survey. ALL AYES.
M~ETING ADJOURNRD 1t: 45 P.M.
R~spectfully Submitted,
2ECEIVED AND FILED BY
THE SOUTHOLD TOWN CLERK
own Clerk, Town of South61d
AP - OARD MEI~BERS
Gemmd P. Goehringer~ Ch,';r,
Serge Doye~ Jr.
J-~ Di-~{o, Jr.
Robe~ A.
I~-~d C. Wilton
Telephone (516) 765-1809
Carmella Borelli, ESq.
Ongioni & Borelli
218 Front Street
Greenport, NY 11944-0562
SCOTT L. HARRIS
Supervisor
BOARD OF APPEALS
TOVFN OF SOUTHOLD
May 12, 1993
Town Hail, 530951~. Road
P.O. Box 1179
Scuthold, New York 11971
Fax (516) 765-1823
Telephone (516) 765-1800
Re: Gardiners Bay Estates Home Owner Association, Inc.
Appl. No. 4156 - Appeal for Interpretation
Dear Ms. Borrelli:
Please find enclosed a copy of the Board's Action. in the
above matter rendered at our May 11, 1993 Meeting with Findings
and Determination.
Very truly yours,
Copies of Decision to:
Building Department /
Southold Town Trustees/
Mr. Lawrence Matzen
Mr. Warren Sambach, Jr.
Linda Kowalski
APPEALS BOARD NiENIBERS
Gerard P. Goehringer,
Serge Doyen, Jr.
James Dinizio, Jr.
Robert A. Villa
Ric~l C. Wil~n
Telephone (516) 765-1809
DELIBERATIONS/DECISION:
BOARD OF APPEALS
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
Appl. No. 4156:
SCOTT L. HARRIS
Superv/sor
Town Hall, 530951W-in Road
P.O. Box 1179
Southold, New York 11971
Fax (516) 765-1823
Telephone (516) 765-1800
Upon Application of GARDINERS BAY ESTATES CLUB, INC.
(record owner as per Deed at Liber 7671 page 415) - by Lawrence
Matzen,' Chairman of the Marine Committee in behalf of the
GARDiNERS BAY ESTATES HOME OWNER ASSOCIATION, INC.
This is an Appeal based upon the February 10, 1993 Notice
of Disapproval issued by the Building Inspector requesting an
Interpretation of Article III, Section 100-31C(3) of the Zoning
Code which provides for "...docking or mooring facilities for no
more than two (2) boats other than those owned and used by the
owner of the premises for his personal use." Applicant is
proposing to construct new dock areas with. multiple boat
facilities at the community beach of Gardiners Bay Estates.
Location of Property: Part of Private Road known as Dogwood
Lane situated along "Spring Pond," an estuary of Orient
Harbor; also shown on the Map of Gardiners Bay Estates, Section
2, 'filed in the Suffolk County Clerk's Office as Map No. 275,
East Marion, NY; County Tax Map ID Nos. 1000-37-1-part of 23
(private road), and part of 17 (underwater land). (Extensive
testimony was received and the hearing then concluded, pending
deliberations at a later time. l
WHEREAS, Application ~4156 is made under the Zoning
Ordinance of the Town of Southold, Chapter 100, for an
interpretation of Article III, Section 100-31C(3-a) pertaining
to accessory uses in the residential ~one districts;
WHEREAS, said application makes specific reference to
property owned by the Gardiners Bay Estates Club, Inc., now
known as the Gardiners Bay Estates Homeowners AsSociation, Inc.,
which property is underwater land shown as "Spring Pond",
~identified on the Suffolk County Tax Maps as District 1000,
Section 37, Block 1, Lot 17, containing. 6.8+- acres in total
area. Waterfront accessibility is shown in this application to
be.at the end of Dogwood Lane, although other deadend streets
are shown to exist (from the end of Beach Court and Old Orchard
Lane, to the waterway of Spring Pond;
WHEREAS, members of the Board viewed the'.proper~y and are
familiar with the current .zoning designation of ',Low-Density --
R-40 Residential" and the character of this property which is
'~'.~age 2 - Appl. No. 4156
Mattes of Gardiners Bay Estates Association, inc.
Decision Rendered May ;l , 1993
underwater land shown on maps for a preexisting suJ0division
known as Gardiners Bay Estates, Sections I and II;
WHEREAS, after due notice, public hearings were hetdby the
Board of Appeals on February 23, 1993 and April 22, 1993, and
all statements and materials submitted have been made a part of
the permanent record;
WHEREAS, at said hearings all those who desired to be heard
were heard and their testimony recorded; and
WHEREAS, the record and all testimony have been carefully
considered, and the following pertinent facts noted:
1. LOT DESCRIPTION: The subject premises comprises an
area of 6.8+- acres of underwater land referred to as "Spring
Pond" at East Marion, Town of Southold, Suffolk County,
2. ACCESS TO UNDERWATER PARCEL: Accessibility to this
underwater land is shown on the maps submitted under this
application to be at the end of Dogwood Lane, although other
deadend streets are shown to exist at the end of Beach Court and
also at the end of Old Orchard Lane, to Spring Pond.
3. PREEXISTING SUBDIVISION: The property in question is
shown on the Subdivision Maps of Sections I ,and II, Gardiners
Bay Estates at East Marion, filed in the Suffolk County Clerk's
Office on Septembe~ 23, 1927. Sections I'and II' preexist the
enactment of zoning (1957). Approximately 40 years later,
Section Three wa~ filed and approved on February 27, 1968 by the
Southold Town Planning Board for the creation of interior lots
$173 through $188.
4. WATERFRONT LOTS/INTERIOR LOTS: It is noted that 51
lots border direCtly on the waterway Of Spring Pond; the
remaining 50 lots in Sections I and II are interior lots. LOt
No. 16 is shown on the filed map of Section II as "Beach for use
of lot owners." .Also, the Section III Subdivision Map shows 16
additional "interior lots" as approved in 1968; The total
number of lots shown on the Maps of Sections I, Ii and III is
122 (combined waterfront and interior lots).
5. NEW YORK TOWN LAW - TIME FOR APPEAL FROM DECISION OF
ENFORCEMENT' OFFICER. Effective Ju-ly 1; 1992, Town Law was
amended (codified) by adding a new Section 267-a. One of the
amendments included the filing within 60 days of an appeal based
upon the decision, order, requirement, interpretation Of the
Building Inspector. The action of the Building Inspector upon
which this interpretation is requested is dated February 10,
1993, and the appeal was filed with the Clerk on February 11,
1993.
~..Page 3 - Appl. No. 4156
Matter of Gardiners Bay Estates Association, Inc.
Decision Rendered May /! , 1993
6. BASIS OF APPEAL: The action taken by the Building
Inspector, upon which this appeal for an interpretation is made
is dated February 10, 1993, and reads as follows:
"...PLEASE TAKE NOTICE that your application dated
February 10,.1993 for permit to construct dock with
multiple boat facilities at Dogwood Lane, East
Marion ... is returned herewith and disapproved on
the followi,ng grounds: Article III Section 100-31C3,
Property Zoned A and owned by Subdivision Assoc.
Action required by Zoning Board of Appeals to address
proposed use not allowed in Agricultural Zone i.e.
more than two boats not owned by property owner... "
7. USE VARIANCE: It is noted that no record has been
found that makes reference to other relief; and to date, an
application for a use variance has not, filed.
8. OT~R AGENCIES: It is noted that this project is also
contingent upon compliance with other agency permits and/or
finalizing reviews under other applicable statutes now pending,
or previously issued including but not limited to the:
a) N.Y.S. Department of Environmental Conservation;
b) Department of the Army;
c) Town-.Trustees of the Town of Southold;
d) Planning Board of. the Town of Southold, as may be
appropriate.
9. OWNER-CORPORATION: The record owner as shown on the
deed recorded at Liber 7671 page 415 was conveyed on July 7,
1974 by Gardiners Bay Co., Inc. to Ga~diners Bay Estates Club,.
Inc., under the laws of the State of New York. A copy of an
Amended Certificate of Incorporation changing the name of the
corporation to Gardiner's Bay Estates Home Owner Associa-
.tion, Inc. (GBEHOA) has been submitted as partof the record.
GBEHOA is a Not-For-Profit Corporation organized under Section
803. This Not-For-Profit Corporation is a membership
organization which requires,ownership of property in speciic
areas of East Marion, presently at Gardiners Bay, before
becoming-eligible and accepted as a member of the corporation.
%~''.. ~Page. 4 - Appl. No. ~156
Matter of Gardiners Bay Estates Association, Inc.
Decision Rendered May /] , 1993
TOWN CODE DEFINITIONS
10. PERSON OR ASSOCIATION DEFINED: Section 100-13 of the
Zoning Code categorizes association under the definition of
"person," as follows:
...PERSON: Any association, partnership,
corporation, cooperative group, trust or other
entity, as well as an individual ....
tl. OWNER oF LAND DEFINED: Section 100-13 of the Zoning
Code defines owner as a "...person having vested or contingent
interest in the property in question" including a duly
authorized agent, attorney, purchaser, devisee, and fiduciary
having vested or contingent interest in the property in
question. Real property law provides for ownership as being
held individually, jointly, in common, or in corporate or
partnership form. This parcel is in corporate ownership form,
not individually, not jointly, and not in common ownership. The
corporation is the owner. The membership .is not the owner. The
membership is a union forming the shareholders of the corpora-
tion.
12. RECORD OWNERSHIP TO PROPERTY IN QUESTION: The
ownership to the underwater land which is the subject of this
application is in the name of an association-corporation
referred to as the-."Gardiners Bay Estates Home Owner
Association, Inc." A corporation is defined as a "person"
under the Southold Town Code. The code clearly does not provide
for separate individual stockholders or members of a corporation
to be multiple owners of the land. Stockholders of a
corpDration are defined in Black's Law Dictionar~ as holders
shares of stock, sharing proportionately in its net profits or
earnings or in the right to distribute assets on dissolution.
Stockholders also share rights to participate in the general "
management of the company. Stockholders may be one or more
persons or sub'corporations. A corporation may exist with an
unlimited number of shareholders, with more than one
corporation, or with no shareholders.· Ownership of land is
not defined as members of a'corporation, nor is an owner defined
as the number of members in a corporation. Ownership of land is
clearly defined as a person, a corporation, a partnership, a
.trust, or an entity as a single unit.
13. INTENT OF ACCESSORY USE AT t00-31C: It is ~ell-known
to Board Members that the intent of Section 100-31C is'and
always has been to allow an extension of use tb a particular
piece of property, accessory and incidental to the r~sidence on
the lot, for the docking of his own boat, and provided-further
that title to the boat'is in the s~me name as the'owne~ of the
Matter of Gardiners Bay Estates Association Inc.
Decision Rendered May ~ , 1993
property. In addition, accessory uses would be permitted t~
have up to two boats other than those of the owner of the
residential parcel. The Zoning Code does not provide for an
extension of use for interior lots (without direct frontage on a
waterway) in residential s~bdivisions for multiple docking
facilities. The Zoning Code also does not provide for cases
where the owner of the boat is not the same as the owner of the
land at the docking facility and waterfront property.
Interpretations are limited to clarifying and interpreting the
code, not legislating new definitions or new zoning laws.
14. TITLE oF BOAT OWNERSHIP. No information has been
furnished by the applicant to show ownership of the boats
intended for docking or mooring by the applicanu-owner (GBEHOA).
ACCORDINGLY, on motion by Chairman .Goehringer, seconded by
Member Wilton, it was
-RESOLVED, that Section 100-31C[3-a) of the Zoning Code is
hereby clarified for the purposes of interpretation as follows:
1) For the purpose of Section 100-31C(3-a), an owner of a
parcel of land shall be an individual, a partnership,-
corporation, cooperative, or other entity, or a combination Of
the above, as a single unit;
2) That for the docking, mooring or accommodation of
noncommercial boats, only those boats owned and used by the
resident-owner of the land immediately adjacent to the land
which the docking or mooring is to be located, may be allowed as
an accessory for hisown personal use~ provided the waterfront
lot is held in single and separate ownership and is IMPROVED
WITH A PRINCIPAL ONE-FAMILY DWELLING OR OTHER PERMITTED ~
PRINCIPAL USE AS PROVIDED in Section 100~3I and Section ~'
100-30A.2 applicable to the R-40, R-80, ~-200 and A/C Zones to.
which this docking must be accessory to. Additionally, up to
two other boats may be docked or moored which are not in title
to the same landowner;
3) Ail docks and moorSngs are s~bject to reviews by the
Southold Town Trustees in accordance with the rules and
regulations of the Southold Town Code.
Vote of the Board:
and Wilton. (Absent were:
Member Villa.)
lk
Ayes: Messrs. Goehringer, Dinizio
Member Doyen of Fishers Island and
This resolution was duly adopted.
,/~'.I{ARD p. GOEHRINGER, CHA~$~k~N .~ '