Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAboutTR-06/29/1995 Albert J. Krupski, President John Holzapfel, Vice President William G. Albertson Martin H. Garrell Peter Wenczel BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES TOWN OF SOUTHOLD Town Hall 53095 Main Road P.O. Box 1179 Southold. New York 11971 Telephone (516) 765-1892 Fax (516) 765-1823 MINUTES JUNE 29, 1995 PRESENT WERE: Albert J. Krupski, Jr, President John Holzapfel, Vice-President William G. Albertson, Trustee Martin Ho Garrell, Trustee Peter Wenczel, Trustee CALL MEETING TO ORDER PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE NEXT TRUSTEE BOARD MEETING: Thursday, July 27, 1995 at 7 pm WORKSESSION: 6:00 ~m TRUSTEE ALBERTSON moved to approve, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES NEXT FIELD INSPECTION: Wednesday, July 19, 1995 at 12 noon TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve, TRUSTEE ~T.RERTSON seconded. ALL AYES APPROVE MINUTES: Approved minutes of May 25th regular meeting: TRUSTEE ALBERTSON moved to approve, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES I. MONTHS¥~iREPORT: Trustees monthly report for May 1995: A check for $7,163.29 was forwarded to the Supervisor's Office for the General FUnd. ;~:~Public Notices are posted on the Town Board for review. III. AMENDMENTS/WAIVERS/CMANGES: 1. RIC~N~kRD MAUTNER requests anAmendment to Permit $4193 to construct a 20' X 35' deck to an existing house. Located 2055 Bayshore Road, Greenport. SCTM ~53-4-12 TRUSTEE GARRELL moved to approve the Amendment, TRUSTEE ALBERTSON seconded. ALL AYES Board of Trustees 2 June 29, 1995 2. PATRICK CALLAHAN requests al~¥ear extension on Permit ~4195 to construct a 3' X 18' elevated catwalk, a 3' X 10' ramp and a 5' X 12' float located approx. 15' from south property line. Located: Easterly side of Deep Hole Drive, approx. 900' south of New Suffolk Ave., New Suffolk. SCTM ~115-17-6.2 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve the 1-year extension, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES 3. Jennifer Gould on behalf of ARNOLD BLAIR requests a Waiver to construct a 6' chain link fence to mark the boundary lines of applicant's property and to post a "no trespassing" sign. Located: Cedar Lane, East Marion. SCTM ~37-7-10.2 TRUSTEE GARRELL moved to approve the Waiver, TRUSTEE ALBERTSON seconded, TRUSTEE KRUPSKI abstained. 4. Samuels and Steelman on behalf of DAVID AIR requests an Amendment to Permit ~4426 to increase the first floor portion of the porch. Located: 2072 Village Lane, Orient. SCTM #24-2-27 TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve the Amendment, TRUSTEE ALBERTSON seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE ALBERTSON moved to go off the regular meeting and go onto the Public Hearing, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES IV. PUBLIC HEARINGS: THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING IN THE MATTER OF THE FOLLOWING APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS UNDER THE WETLANDS ORDINANCE OF THE TOWN OF SOUTHOLD. I HAVE AN AFFIDAVIT OF PUBLICATION FROM THE SUFFOLK TIMES. PERTINENT CORRESPONDENCE MAY BE READ PRIOR TO ASKING FOR COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC. PLEASE KEEP YOUR COMMENTS ORGANIZED AND BRIEF: FIVE (5) MINUTES OR LESS~ IF POSSIBLE :!5 p.m. - In the matter of Costello Marine on behalf of LOUIS . i'BA~ON requests a Wetland Permit to dredge approx. 2700 c.y. 10~15% brick, 20% gravel and 65% sand, to 5' below MLW. Material to be trucked away to approve upland site. Ferry berthing area to be maintained at 7' below AMLW. Located: Robins Island. SCTM ~134-3-5 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of this application? JOHN COSTELLO: I represent Costello Marine Contracting, the agent for Mr. Bacon on this application. The single purpose for this application and the through some experience last winter of rebuilding the dock on Robin's Island, the tides over there run extremely hig~ and extremely low with certain weather conditions.~And to provide a safe access, and this is basically the only access to the Island, will require some dredging in order to be able to securely fasten boats and moor boats in heavy north east winds and north west winds which result in quite low tides. Most of the Board visited the Island one day and saw the circumstances. We learned quite a bit last winter by operating the entire winter over there and it needs some dredging in order to provide this single access to the Island. Any questions that the Board has or the public, I will try to answer them. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Anyone else who would like to speak in favor of the application? Anyone who would like to speak against the application? Does the Board have any questions? MR. ANGELL: CAC recommended approval. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion that we approve the application for dredging. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES 7:27 p.m. In the matter of En-Consultants on behalf of NICK ARONAIDIS requests a Wetland & Coastal Erosion Permits to construct 185 1.f. (plus 2- 15' returns) of stone revetment using 3-5 ton stone on 100-1,000 core, and a 10-50 lb. blanket. Approx. 375 c.y. of clean sand will be trucked in for backfill. A 12' wide area of revetment will be made suitable for a boat launching ramp for owner's private use. Located: 1090 Latham Lane, Orient. SCTM %15-9-1.6 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of. this application? ROB HERMANN: The project is, as we discussed last month during the Assessment phase, and I'm here, as is Tom Samuels, the contractor for the project to answer any questions which might still remain. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak against the application? Does the Board have any questions? TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It's just the positioning of the top of the stone. We were talking about the flag pole there. That's all understood. We had said that that would be where the top of the .... TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We should have measured from the house. On the survey, it says the top of the bank, which I imagine would be the top of the proposed revetment. It says on the survey 55' from the house. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: We just didn't want the revetment to stick out across the beach. ROB: We discussed that last month. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Right, that's all, I just want to make sure it wasn't any new 'ballgame' It was just reiterating what we said last month. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other Board comment or questions? CAC recommends approval. TRUSTEE GARRELL: So the perimeters are exactly what we looked at last month? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: I move the public hearing be closed. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to approve. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES 7:30 p.m. - In the matter of Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of BARBARA DEFINA requests a Wetland & Coastal Erosion Permit to install 40' of dumped rock rip-rap for erosion control. Located: Willow Terrace, Orient. SCTM ~26-2-7.1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? GEORGE COSTELLO: The purpose of this application is, she has a little bit of high ground facing west. Her south neighbor has a wooden bulkhead and little bit bordering his high ground and the last storm we had she lost a little high ground which is American Beach Grass, Rosa Ragosa and other sea shore vegetation and we want to put some dump rock there and small rip rap just to protect the little bit of upland. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else who would like to speak in favor of the application? Is there anyone who would like to speak against the application? CAC recommends approval provided the applicant grades so the toe of the rip rap is buried and planted with beach grass and maintain a ten foot non-turf buffer instead of a lawn behind the rip rap. I'm just looking here for a plan as to ..... TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I looked at this. It's fairly straight forward. Where she's putting the wall is fairly up. It's at an angle and only goes half way across the property and the only concern I have is the same vegetative buffer on 'the other side of it so the lawn doesn't go right down. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: CAC recommended planning beach grass. Which side, the beach side or upland side. MR. ANGELL: The beach side. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there some there? MR. ANGELL: Yes. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: There was all growth in front of it. We just want to replace that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other Board co~m~ents? TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Motion to close. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion we approve said application with the stipulations that there will be a 10' vegetative non-turfed buffer behind landward of the structure and that the toe of the structure be planted with beach grass. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES 7:33 p.m. - In the matter of Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of DORIS COSGROVE requests a Wetland Permit~ to construct a 3' X 40' catwalk, a 3' X 18' ramp, a 6' K 20' float and 2- 2-pile dolphins. Located: Indian Neck Lane, Peconic. SCTM ~86-5-9.4 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? GEORGE COSTELLO: The purpose of this project is just to provide mooring mooring for two boats. One on either side of the float. Fairly shallow water. 3 1/2' above the wetlands. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else here who would like to speak either in favor or against the application? MR. ANGELL: CAC recommended approval. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a comment. I inspected this one and it's about the minimum size structure you can have in that area. It's pretty straight forward. I would recommend approval also. No other comment? TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to approve. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES 7:34 p.m. In the matter of SUSAN NORRIS requests a Wetland Permit to reconstruct an 8' X 70' timber dock and add a 10' extension to it. Located: 2790 New Suffolk Ave., Mattituck. SCTM ~123-9-1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak either in favor or against the application? We gave them a Grandfather on the rock jetties and let them rebuild those. other co~m,ent? Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: So moved. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to approve. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES Any 7:36 p.m. In the matter of Bruce Anderson on behalf of PEGGY HELLER & ANNE WYDEN requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 2,982+/- s.f. single family dwelling (base floor), an 800+/- s.f. attached deck, an 840+/- s.f. attached garage, an 876+/-' gravel driveway, a 318+/- s.f. walkway, well and septic system. Located: south end of Majors Pond Road at its' juncture with Willow Terrace Lane, Orient. SCTM ~26-2-39.1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? BRUCE ANDERSON: As you know we filed for this application on March 29, 1995 to construct a single family dwelling, attached garage, well, septic and related pertinencies. This is a strange lot in respect to items. The first item is while we're here and that wetlands. As you know we have Majors Pond which is located adjacent to the property and to the east tidal wetlands due to shore line of Peconic Bay are not an issue as they are a located south. Subject property behind the jurisdiction of this Board as well as DEC. The second constraint we are operating under the Zoning constraint issue is if~you recall we submitted an original application that sort the balanced the zoning constraints with the wetlands constraints. Essentially what we have here is a lot in an R-80 zone that does not have the minimum area. And also because of the shape we're further constrained with respect to lot depth and front yard set back and rear yard set back. Our original application was to balance the wetland set back with the zoning set back and at the request of this Board we re-located the pro_posed dwelling an additional 10' further from the wetland. -~herefore locating it the same also 10' closer to the road. I'm~here tonight to - represent the project and I also have an amendment to the project. And because this project is also regulated by the DEC we have met with them and what we have arrived at is an alternative plan that essentially shows the house as shown in the most current survey but what we did is extended the limit of clearing. We made that more constrained and provided for a larger natural buffer. This is actually the most current proposal and this is a project will meet with the DEC requirement and I trust since it is more restrictive than what you had already requested. We knew that it would meet'your criterion as well. As you know we have analyzed the upland area and analyzed the wetlands and we have concluded that both systems are marginally value having undergone obvious prior disturbance. We've also analyzed potential impacts and concluded that they are not significant. I'm here to answer any questions you may have. I would like to request that not only that a permit be granted but also because we have been so cooperative and flexible in our design, we will hope that this will support our zoning variance application which we are prepared to make following the issuance of this permit. And I would say that that would be an important thing to do and something that would be in your best interest because if the zoning variance fails, particularly with respect with it's set back to the road, it will force us to come back to this Board with a house that will be closer to the wetlands. ~[f your have any questions I'm here to answer. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor or against this application? MR. FITZGERALD: How far is the set back? Are they both fresh water and .... TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Only fresh water. MR. ANDERSON: Fresh water wetlands is what we're here for. MR. FITZGERALD: What is the set back that you ..... MR. ANDERSON: The house will be 62' from the landward edge of the freshwater wetlands as determined not by the pond shoreline, but by the vegetation that grows around the pond. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The CAC recommends approval with stipulations that they move the house for a 30' set back off the road which will be 75' from the wetlands. Maintain a non-turf buffer 20' from the 10' contour line. Use haybales and silt fencing during construction. Move the cess pool system to the north. MR. ANGELL: We suggested to move the cess pool system to the ~nsr-th-,qo~-~hat they could put the house closer to the road. If ~o~gonn~.o for a variance, you might as well go for a Varl~e just outside the jurisdiction. MR. ANDERSON: I'd like to address that point. It is not a question of when\one goes for a variance if we're going to go for a variance,~hy not move it right up against the road. The Zoning Board of~ppeals operates under a number of criterion. Those criterions include the character of the area. We have looked at the house in the area and we have determined that the average set back between those houses and the road is somewhere between 50 & 60'. What we are applying for is less than that. And that is why we need your help in doing that. If we were to move the house an additional 10' or ~3' to be more accurately the closer it goes, our billage to get that variance would be severely jeopardized. I can tell you that the nature of this development is such that we are building on flat land, we are providing for the control of all run off. We have located that septic system between the existing dwelling and the road for a reason. To relocate the septic system further to the north, we put it essentially upgrading from the path with a swale that leads to the ponds from the northwest. And you will see that is precisely the area where we have provided for the maximum protection beyond this Boards jurisdiction of natural vegetation. So what I'm saying is while it may be convenient to put the septic system further to the north, to push the house closer to the road, in having to do so would be po~tentially greater than where we have placed the septic system here, which is putting it upgrading from the pond. And I don't think that would be in. the interest of this Board and I think it would be contrary to the intent as stated in the wetlands law that we all have live by. Aside from that, as I already mentioned, what would result that would be grossly out of character with the area in what terms of the set backs are prevalent in that area and I think that would make our case with the Zoning Board extremely difficult. I would ask in the strongest way that you would not reject that particular recommendation. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I just wanted to say for the record, the reason we want to be extremely protective of this pond is it's not the most prominent physical or environmental resource in the Town, however, past decisions of activity on this pond by this Board have been extremely restrictive and we don't want to go ahead and act on this lot and forget the precedent that has been set by this Board already. From the survey, this is the last buildable lot on this pond. It's somewhat or infrequently communicates with the Bay. So it's sort of a valuable wildlife area and a valuable freshwater wetland salt water eco-system. That's why we are being over cautious at trying to explore everything we possibly can to see that that the integrity of this pond isn't compromised on the last house. MR. ANDERSON: As I said, with the septic arrangement as it is the septic flow. That affluent, traveling away from the pond, so to move it further to the north would mean that septic affluent would float towards the pond. So that would not be in keeping with this Boards past practice. With respect to the quality of that adjacent area I think we already demonstrated that it that there is prior disturbance as evidence by the reponderance of locust, flat cherry, and early successional field growth that is prevalent throughout most of the site. As well as the phragmites that constitute the wetlands edge in this case. I think the concern that the Board should have in this case, and I would certainly advise the Board, would be one of preventing turfed areas that would send to the wetland edge which is a pond. We have maximized a natural buffer precisely in this location as to minimize the potential for that to occur. So I can find no basis for relocating the house yet further or closer to the road than it is. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What are the current restrictions that...the current C & R's that your restrained within that sub-division? MR. ANDERSON: This is not part of the sub-division. This is a described parcel both single and separate prior enactments of zoning. And what's interesting is, when you look at your zoning code, your zoning code actually varies from other zoning codes that I analyzed in that most zoning codes provide for as-of-right dimensional relief of pre-existing non-conforming parcels. It is a common used phase are 4 tenths rules 'and 3 tenths rules which provide you automatic set back relief from various property lines. And in your code that same relief is provided for our ten zones, our 20 zones, up to R-40, but it is not provided in the R-80 zone. And I suspect the reason for that is when the code was drafted no one would have suspected that a property meeting in an R-80 zone would ever encounter a dimensional~problem. But we encountered it here because this is a lot that is long and narrow. And that is what is forcing us to get a variance. Now, for your information, on the R-80 zone, as I said, it doesn't apply with respect to area, your lot depth is 250' in an R-80 zone, which occurs no where on this property. Your front yard set back for a principal structure is 60' Your rear yard structure is 100'. And if you look at your lots in depth and you look at your dimensional restrictions on this, you'll find that it just cannot comply with zoning. Which is a true practical hardship. Besides that we also have to look at the environment. And that is something the Zoning Board will have to do. And as I've said before, having looked at the environmental impacts, having adjusted the project, having adjusted the clearing lines, having carefully sided the wetlands system, having placed the well upgraded from that septic system so that no impact to drinking water would occur. I think it's actually a very creative and a very protective design for this particular loto TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Does the Board have any questions or comments? TRUSTEE GARRELL: What is the limit of your turf. MR. Anderson: Well it varies. The lawn and .... to be honest with you my client is not a "lawn person". What we're really talking about here is more a flower garden type of situation. MR. ANGELL: Al, if I could, I'd like to suggest as a CAC member to be as restrictive as possible in the permit, as people do sell houses, and the next owner might like a lawn. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh, sure. Is there any comment? Any other comment from the Board? TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to approve the application with a condition that we approve the new survey dated 6/29/95 and turf area be limited to that crayon-like line on the survey (FEMA) that's marked limit of clearing and grOund disturbance, and that any other clearing on the pond side will be treated as a violation, that all water roof run-off be contained in dry wells, that haybales and silt fence we maintained during construction and during the landscaping establishment. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL did not vote. MR. ANDERSON: Can I ask for another motion? That we draft a letter in support of our variance application? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll tell what we'll do. MR. ANDERSON: It's just that if we're not successful we're gonna have to come back to you with something closer to the wetlands and I'd like to avoid that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Since your our passed consultant and in high standing, we'll draft a letter to the ZBA requesting that they keep the house as far landward as possible because of the sensitive nature of the pond. MR. ANDERSON: Fine. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: And if they decide in their in wisdom to grant you a house closer to the road than what is applied for here then we would be happy to amend that permit. I hate to put you through the paces here. MR. ANDERSON: The pond is not really the contention here, it's the playground and the Bay that is directly to the south cf it. The pond is more of a constraint for us. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I know, it's just that we have been so protective of it, the last lot, and we want to be consistent on that. 7:55 p.m. In the matter of Matthew Mc Kiernan on behalf of VIRGINIA CROPPER & CECELIAKEMPLER request a Wetland Pe~,it to construct a single family residence, an 80' timber bulkhead with 2- 12' returns along westerly bank of Petty's Pond, fill approx. 40 c.y. of clean fill, a 3' X 25' catwalk, a 3' X 14' ramp leading to a 4' X 5' float leading to a 6' X 20' float. Located: Arshamomoque Ave., Southold. SCTM ~66-3-9 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I believe there has been a change in the description of this that we have on file which eliminates the bulkhead and the house would be essentially outside of our jurisdiction. And the only thing we would be approving tonight would be catwalk, ramp and float. Is there anyone here who would like to speak either in favor or against this application? Any other comment? MR. ANGELL: CAC recommended approval on the house, we didn't think the bulkhead was necessary but since that's been withdrawn no sense getting involved with that, and we also thought that she-should extend the catwalk landward. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Which we did that, we had them extend it 10' landward. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion that we approve the application that was amended on 6/5/95 which will remove the bulkhead and change the catwalk to 3' X 25'. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES 8:02 p.m. - In the matter of Larry Lisco on behalf of PAUL' C~CIOPPO requests a ~etland Permit to construct a single family dwelling. Located: New Suffolk Ave., New Suffolk. SCTM ~116-3-18.1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor or against this application? CAC recommends approval with conditions that there be no disturbance of a 50' buffer from the wetland line and that haybales and silt fence be used landward of the buffer at the toe of the fill line during construction. This is basically a rerun of old Beale application. The 50' line is basically from the driveway. So we would be approving a no disturbance area on the west side of the driveway. Any other comments? TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Move that the public hearing be closed. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to approve with condition that be no disturbance on the west side of driveway and haybales and silt fence be placed during construction. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES 8:05 p.m. - In the matter of Donald G. Feiler on behalf of AR~{UR AXBERG JR., requests a Wetland Permit to construct a timber bulkhead 2'9" in front of existing bulkhead and tie into neighbors to west. Located: Camp Mineola Road, Mattituck. SCTM ~123-5-34 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak on behalf of Mr. Axberg? DON FIELER: I'm here on behalf of Mr. Axberg. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else here who would like to speak on behalf of Mr. Axberg? Is there anyone here who would like to speak against this application? RICHMOND CORWIN: I'm the property owner east of Mr. Axberg. On Monday I submitted to your office some written comments and drawings expressing my concerns to that I would like to add that the same papers that were submitted to your office were submitted to the office of Young & Young, Mr. Thomas Wolpert professional engineer, for his observation on the same papers. I have copies of his response to that. My property has been in the family for 60+ years. I have quite a bit of back ground as to the history of construction of most of the houses in that particular area. In particular the reason for the high bulkhead which is just to the west of Mr. Axberg's property. That was an undeveloped piece of land until the early '60's. In fact the present owner purchased it in 1960, and developed it in '60~-& '61. Since it was undeveloped the bulkhead had fallen in disrepair. He being a neophite to the area and not understanding anything, just decided to build a wall and keep the water out. In so doing it caused the other properties around him to have lower bulkheads and built a returns. So we had a bulkhead that was 2'2" higher than the surrounding bulkheads. He built a return of about 6' on each side of his property. That has created in each of the major tidal floodings that we've had with the coastal storms and erosion problem for Mr. Axberg. I do have pictures here that also show what that erosion is like on both Mr. Axberg's property as well as Mr. Brendell's property. What Mr. Axberg has expressed to me verbally and not supported in the application as I have reviewed it, is his plan to increase the height of the bulkhead to the same height as his neighbor to the west and build of return to retain the fill that he plans to add to his property. He verbally told me to go view the property two houses to the west of him, Mr. Shidlow's property, to see how it would look. I have pictures of that as well. My concern is up until this point and I have lived in that house, physically in it, much to the chagrin of the fire department through l0 hurricanes. There has never been any water in the house or Mr. Axberg's house. There has never been any serious erosion in front any of our properties along that area where the bulkhead is low. The damage has been primarily behind the bulkheads that have been razed. As I stated the Brendell property was developed in 1961. Subsequent to that time the others to the west raised their bulkheads. This is all pre-DEC and environmental considerations were not in question at that time. It's my concern as expressed in the material submitted to the office. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Let me just read it. (Al read letter) (See letter attached). I think we get the picture. What I'd like to see on the plan, and there's two plans here. MR. CORWIN: He had originally proposed to just move the entire bulkhead out than 2'6 or 9". And I voiced grave concern at that time and took him down the beach at what had happened where that had been allowed, on the Mill's property, He therefore went back and redrew the line to pick up my corner bulkhead and just angle it out to the property. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's something 'that we would have required. We wouldn't have allowed him to put that strange jog out into the Bay like that. We would require him to match up, especially where it's doable here, physically impossible between the two neighbors in a straight line. So you wouldn't have that jog. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Given the problems which you all have in common, you and Brendell, and Axberg. Have you ever gotten together with Fieler or anybody else to discuss a common approach which would take care of every ones needs. MR. CORWIN: No sir, because I only been made .... I don't live here all year round. Most of the people are summer people. I used to be an all year round resident. I now reside in Annapolis Md. The first we even heard about this plan was Easter. The first that I heard about this application was reading in the Suffolk Times. There has been no communication what so ever. Let me add one more thing. The property has been in the family for over 60 years. It lived through a lot of storms. Most of the summer people who come out have never experienced a hurricane. And in some cases, like Mr. Axberg, he has not even seen the damage immediately afterwards. Usually by the time that he comes out a good bit of damage has been already cleaned up. It's been very hard. When I lived here as an all year round resident, I served as Association President for a number of years. To try and explain to these people what happens with the water, the flow of water and how it goes. Last Saturday's as an example we had an Association Meeting. There is one parcel of land that we visited the area to the west that is the Association beach. One resident made a suggestion that we raise some kind of a barricade to keep the water from the Bay from going in the back and flooding his property. If he had ever been there when we had a storm he would know that the majority of the water comes form James Creek in the back before it ever comes over the front. But 'this is the mentality that we've had to live with. My brother-in-law and I are practically the only beacons in the night. In spite of the fact that Mr. Brendell has owned this property for over 30 years, he still doesn't have a clue as to what's happening as far as erosion, the water, the wind and the storms. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well to address the problem of the bulkhead we might be better to take a second look. We didn't notice the height. One of the things that we've been doing throughout the Town as a matter of course, is letting people raise the height of their houses because there has been a lot of flooding throughout the T%own. Many people do it. Without the addition of fill because it's not necessarily necessary in addition it could cause a problem to a neighbor like yourself or maybe the other side. There is no mention of a long retaining wall in his application. Mr. Fieler can you answer that? MR. FIELER: There's nothing in the application. What he's doing as far as this application is concerned is, he also applied to the DEC for a permit for the bulkhead change. Under their guidelines which allows him to raise the bulkhead up and I'm not sure how much filling in on the property he's doing and I'm not sure on this bulkhead that he's talking about on the side lines. I guess he has two choices if he's gonna put a lot of fill in there. One is to taper down to the neighbors property or to put up some bulkheads on the neighbors property. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: One thing that passed our clerical staff is we need an updated survey within a year. And this is the last update here, 1970. The other thing is it says "project plan". It shows 50' from Corwin's property to the end of the proposed return. We were out there on a pretty bad day but it didn't look like 60' feet me. It's 60' between your property and the end of his bulkhead? MR. FIELER: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: So he owns 60' passed where he wants to build a bulkhead? MR. FIELER: No. The property width is 60' TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No, doesn't that show that there's 60' between there? TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It appears as if the edge of his bulkhead and there's 60' to your property line. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It looks like that. MR. FIELER: No. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We're gonna have to table this public hearing because we need more information. We're gonna need an updated survey that's gonna show the placement of the fill and the grade and if there is gonna be a proposed wall which the neighbor has expressed will have the effect of eroding his property during a strong east storm. MR. FIELER: If there is no bulkheaded wall between the property and he installed fill, and even if he had no application for a bulkhead change that could all be done without any prudence. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Just installing the fill? MR. FIELER: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It's still an activity. Any activity within 75' MR. FIELER: Then a previous application would be become a waiver for the changes in the .... TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: To raise the house. But that was not...we didn't grant any approval for fill. So for fill placement we would have to have that put on an updated survey and the survey would also have to show in scale any proposed returns. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Could you keep Mr. Corwin appraised of this so that he gets it crossed off while the planning goes on. MR. FIELER: Well, I'll talk to Mr. Axberg. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to table the public hearing until we get all the information we need to make a decision. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES 8:27 p.m. - In the matter of J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of FIDCO~requests a Wetland Permit to install 2- 10' X 16' floats, 4- 10' X 16' floats, 4- 6' X 18' floats, to replace open pile lost in 12/94 storm, to relocate 2 existing piles and install 4 new spring piles at existing yacht club, as per survey dated April 5, 1995. Located: Crescent Ave., Fishers Island. SCTM ~10-1-9 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here to speak either against or for this application? Any other comment? TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I~ll make a motion to approve the application. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Second. ALL AYES 8:29 p.m. - In the matter of J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of ~ISIS~BARTELS requests a Wetland P~rmit to construct a 4' X 50' fixed dock (elev. over grade of marsh), a 3' X 14' ramp and a 6' X 20' float. Located: Private Rd. ~3, Fishers Island. SCTM ~10-3-10 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak on behalf of or against this application? This Board have any questions. It doesn't seem like 50' is going to give them that great the depth of water. However, that is what they applied for. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It's very shallow. It's about a foot or foot and a half. There's a shallow bank that goes way out to the channel. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But once you get out into the harbor there, I don't know far you could approve anything. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: They know that and that's what they wanted. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion to approve the application. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES 8:30 p.m. - In the matter of EILEEN VILLANI requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 3' X 95' dock, a 3' X 15' ramp to a 6' X 20' float as per drawing dated as received May 18, 1995. Located: Indian Neck Road, Peconic. SCTM ~86-6-10 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak on behalf of or against this application? CAC have any comments? MR. ANGELL: We recommended approval but I really thi~k the scope of the project is a little excessive on the intrusion into the creek and we think we you should require the applicant to shorten the catwalk. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think over the course of time we have requested that and they have shortened it a considerable amount. MR. ANGELL: On the application there was no soundings so we can't really make a recommendation. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I took a look at this. This looks like a tremendous dock. But when you go out there there's no water. There's no water until you get to the end of the dock and the start of the ramp. And then it drops off and it's pure mush. So I had the same reaction, but there's not way the dock could be floating unless they go out that far. Unfortunately it's a big structure across the water. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other comments. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I'll make a motion we approve the application. TRUSTEE HO~ZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES 8:40 p.m. - In the matter of Proper-T Services on behalf of DAVID CICH~%NOWICZ requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 3' X 35' fixed open walkway, a 3' X 16' hinged ramp and a 6' X 20' float with 3- 2-pile dolphins to secure floating dock. Located: 1425 Arshamomoque Ave., Southold. SCTM 966-3-16 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would to speak in favor or against this application? MR. FITZGERALD.: I represent Mr. Cichanowicz if there are any questions. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: This is another one I went wading at. I have a question. Could we shorten this a little bit for two reasons. One, when I was wading there I measured out from those two stakes you put into the ground which is the beginning of the dock. I was there about 4:30 this afternoon. It wasn't quite low tide, but it was approaching. And 35' from those stakes they have 1'2". At 40' from those stakes it drops right off. And then you get into that mush there. At 40' from the stakes I had 2'. At 44' they had 2'2" to the top of the mush. At 48' they had 2'6". In consideration of what we just approved for the neighbor, which is only extends out 35' from MHW. The same situation. If we could come back a few feet and put the inside edge of the floating dock at 40' it would have adequate water on the outside and it would make it more in keeping with what's already been approved. So just looking at the high water mark if we bring ..... MR. FITZGERALD: The high water mark is essentially the back. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: If we come in 10' with that float that's still puts you in plenty of water~ MR. FITZGERALD: I think we have a problem because you will see here and on the survey from the stake to the bank and the high water mark is 17'. I measured from the bank to the iow water mark 15' when it was low water. That's 32'. So that this 35' walkway that is showing extends 3' beyond the low wate~ mark~ When I was wading around in the muck I was not able to find that depth of water at low tide either above the mark or below it or whatever. I think it would be good if it were not compared to the neighbors application because there appeared to be a little bit of uncertainty about who was doing what to whom as far as the dimensions were concerned on the other property. I was here the last time and hear~ how it got to be what it was. And again, I measured this very carefully. Because I know how important it is to you and the other members of the Board. And it is my opinion that this is the minimum that is needed to get somewhat less than 3' of water clear of stuff at the outer edge of the float at low water on whatever date it was. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Well my feeling was that there is no other structures extending out this far in this particular creek. There's no structures extending out at all. There's a bulkhead on one side of the property and a bulkhead further down to the south which I would assume he could probably dredged in front of to provide that kind of depth. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Do the bulkheads extend out further than the dock? TRUSTEE WENCZEL: No. My other concern was I couldn't get to it. There is an off shore not too far there. There is a shoal that was out in the water when I was there. It appeared that along this edge was where the channel was also. MR. FITZGERALD: The shoreward side. I don't know where that is except that...he said the channel was about half way between the shore line and that shoal. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: This is low water and this is extending about~2 feet behind it. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Right. But once you get to 40', 'there's no water until you get to 40'. My proposal was to put the dock, the inside edge of the dock there, so that we come in approx. 10'. (Everyone was talking at once). TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: My feeling is that that is 2' into the creek and that can't protrude that much out. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Are you saying that other come out .... that this is a point? TRUSTEE WENCZEL: No, there are no other docks that extend out into the creek. MR. FITZGERALD: This guy ties up his boat next to his bulkhead. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Any other comments? TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'll make a motion that we approve the application. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Nay TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Abstained. 8:46 p.m. - In the matter of DR. JOHN ALOIA requests a Wetland Permit to rebuild inkind/inplace 14 feet of off-shore end of jetty, rebuild a 3' X 3' access stairway from existing platform to bulkhead, install a 3' X 8; set of access stairs from bulkhead to beach. Located: 8145 Nassau Point Road, Cutchogue. SCTM ~118-4-9 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to comment either in favor or against this application? MR. ANGELL: CAC recommends approval of the rebuild of the access stairway the 3' X 3' and platform to bulkhead and recommends disapproval of the 14' off shore end of jetty as it is not functioning. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: From the picture it looked like it was functioning. I was out there and it was high water. What was submitted in the file looked good. MR. ANGELL: We also recommended that they plant behind the bulkhead and plant beach grass. Any comment by the Board? TRUSTEE GARRELL: Move to close the public hearing. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to approve the application with the condition that the applicant replant behind the bulkhead with American beach grass. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Second. ALL AYES 8:48 p.m. In the matter of ROBERT SIMON requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 23' X 32' garage on westerly portion of property with an access bridge across wetland area approx. 10' wide X 50' long raised 8' above wetland supported by concrete piers on each end. Located: 379 Wood Lane, Peconic. SCTM 386-6-3.1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of this application? MR. SIMON: At last months meeting I a formal presentation and the Board asked me to follow through on several items. I contacted Allan Connell and he gave me a pre-construction plan which the Board has, a close construction plan for the vegetation also further drawings on the abutments with the side wings for the containment area. The serge is a large flat rock which would be approx. 30" on one end and 0" on the other. 2, 3, or 4" inches of blend on top of that with 3/4" stone retained by 12' long 2 X 6 horizontal supported by 6 X 6 CCA. In in addition to that there was a question about fire access. check with the Building Dept. Item 280A of the NYS Building Code requires that access be gained only to the property itself and not to any structure thereon. According to Gary Fish also it doesn't pertain to this case. The roadway has to get the fire dept. to the property. There are instances where someone might have a house in the front and a garage 1/4 mile in the back and whatever gets there, whether its a roadway or nothing or woods, whatever. AlSo Lou Chiarella of the DEC and Diane Sanford spent approx, an hour there and they were very, very favorable about the bridge access. It's actually out of the wetlands and Mr. Chiarella took some measurements and said its actually above the wetland high marsh area. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think you provided us what we asked for. They recommended the following program is to be completed for the work area immediately after construction. 1. The two yards of excavated fill is to be placed on the opposite side of the property. Which opposite I don't know. MR. SIMON: Opposite from wherever you are because you're gonna have some on each side. Opposite from where the work area is. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: 2. To remove the silt fence and straw hay bales. 3. Complete wing walls and fill as per plan. 4. Cover the adjacent area with an erosion control blanket. 5. Plant the area as follows: common red topper quick cover. This was outlined by Allan Connell, Soil & Water Conservation who is also a CAC member. The bridge and garage construction: t~ following is to be completed before construction begins. area of the footings abutment is to be contained in a yew of black mesh silt fence. Silt fence material is to be placed 6" into the ground and staked. Immediately behind the silt fence straw bales are to be placed and staked. All work is to be performed inside this area. And we have a letter received today from Carol Bauman. (Al read letter, see attached). Is there anyone else here who would like to comment either in favor or against this application? FLORENCE KULL: I'm a neighbor of Mr. Simon. I just would like to ask if we could have a set of plans so our professional engineer can look them over for us. And I would also like you to keep this open and not close this until we can look into it further. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: All the information has been available in the office, what would you like to see? MRS. KULL: The plans. The actual plans of the structure. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We don't have plans .... you mean plans what the garage is gonna look like? MRS. KULL: The bridge and all that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We have all that in the file. MRS. KULL: May I have a copy of it please? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes, you can but not in the middle of a public hearing. It's been available for months. The information that Mr. Simon has submitted was received, the last information was received 6/28/95. The information that I just recently read into the .... so it is not unreasonable for Mrs. Kull to not have had time to see that. Is that what you mean, all this stuff I just read? MRS. KULL: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else who would like to speak? FRANK KULL: I would like to know what kind of bridge this is gonna be. Concrete? Throgs Neck Bridge or what, 10' wide? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It's what was read. A 10' X 50' bridge above the wetland. MR. KULL: What is it gonna be made of? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Steel with wood planking. MR. KULL: 10' wide. You gonna be able to take trucks and cars over there. What's gonna protect the oil from the cars from going into the water? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It doesn't say. MR. KULL: And he's going over wetlands, taking cars over? I don't understand that. TRUSTEE GARRELL: People do it with farm equipment all'the time. MR. KULL: Over bridges? Where? TRUSTEE GARRELL: The oil spillage from a vehicle going over that property shouldn't be that much concern. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: How much oil spillage are we talking about? MR. KRULL: It leaks from cars, tractors, whatever. TRUSTEE GARRELL: It's probably worse with your crank case sitting in your driveway close to a wetlands. MR. KULL: But your going practically into the water. This is drink water, Indian Neck, Richmond Creek. TRUSTEE GARRELL: I think the thing we're getting at is that the plans are in and they've modified 'to address a lot of the objections. You'll see the DEC and Soil Conservation has coordinated some of this and we're really doing our best on this one to insure that there is no real risk to the surrounding area. I realize there seem to be bad feelings with neighbors on this and that's unfortunate, but we're just addressing our job as best we can. MR. KULL: I understand that but I have to sit at my desk and look out at a 3 car garage, looking out at creek. De-valueing all the property around the whole place. TRUSTEE GARRELL: The only way you can get around that is to buy the property. We're faced with issues like that in the Town all the time. ~ ~Tom Samuels; Just as a citizen, the Kull's have been friends of mine for 35 and they asked me to look at the years plans. Unfortunately I didn't get a chance to look at them. I just have a couple of questions and I'd like to look at them. What's the loading on the bridge. MR. SIMON: 10,000. 5 ton. MR. SAMUELS: That's a fairly light loading, but if he's gonna post a sign on it for 5 ton and then what that means is 5 tons per axel. In engineering terminology that's what that means. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: How many tons is the Bridge Lane bridge? MR. SAMUELS: It's a 20 ton bridge. Are the plans sealed by a P.E.? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Mr. Simon says yes. Mrs. Kull's request to have someone go over these plans and is .... although I'd hate to hold Mr. Simon up tonight because it's been a long time. Because they have come in so late I don't see how we could deny that request. Because everything just came in. MR. SIMON: The bridge plans and abutment plans were filed for over a month. The only change was the extension of the footings at the bottom and the wings. MR. SAMUELS: The neighbors do have a legitimate concern and have asked me to look at it and if you'll give me a set, I'll look at them and be very happy to comment. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We hate to keep these things from hanging around, could you look at them this evening, we'll table them and then go on to the meeting or do you want 30 days? MR. SAMUELS: It takes a little while to size members and stuff like that. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It's concrete and steel. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm talking about the material that came in yesterday, 'cause the rest of it has been on file for months. I'm talking about what's recently come in. And if you could look at it and you think you need 30 days we wouldn't deny anyone their property review. MR. SAMUELS: I wouldn't need 30 days, but I can't do it 30 minutes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Fine. Any other comment? DAVID NORSHILD: I'm new to the Southold Town and I just have some questions as running how I would go about finding out getting a copy of the DEC report to find out what kind of containment vessels will be made for any type of runoff from the bridge. Public bridges have some kind of containment to keep fluids from going into the wetlands. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The DEC report? MR. NORSHILD: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: From the DEC. MR. NORSHILD: Is that public information? TRUSTEE KRUpSKI: Sure. Any other comment? CAC recommends approval with the stipulations that the applicant use sediment barriers, silt fence, and hay bales during construction. Any driveway surface to be pervious to rain water and all disturbed ground to regraded and planted. Any other comments of the Board? I don't see how we can vote on this though. There has been significant requested information submitted yesterday. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Mr. Simon is a delay gonna be problem with your construction? MR. SIMON: There's somewhat of a problem, I have three empty cars Which is why I want the garage, that they are being stored in Hicksville and I'm afraid I'm gonna loose pieces and parts. Second problem is, I have a quote from the company, Continental Bridge, and it was good for 60 days. And 60 days are up very shortly. It's at the end of the month I believe. I just have to go against something that Mrs. Kull said. She said that nothing in terms of structure of the bridge, nothing has changed. The only additional information that you got was the Van Tuyl drawing and the containment for the silt and the wing wail. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: As far as the construction of the bridge and the loading and all that, that's the Building Dept's. review. That's not our. We don't go into construction standards on docks, decks or houses. But the information that you submitted in the last day is at our request, is material that has to do our review and its relevant. If it wasn't relevant to our review we would really be hemming and hawing. We will again recess the public hearing and we will vote on this next month. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Did Leu Chiarella give you any concept of time line with the DEC? In other words you will still have to wait for their permit. MR. SIMON: He wanted an updated survey and also ...... TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: My point simply is that you don't have the DEC permit yet. so you can't start anyway. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to recess the pubic hearing. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL Second. ALL AYES 9:10 p.m. - In the matter of JOHN H. MULHOLLAND & MICHAEL P. BONTJE request a Wetland Permit to maintenance dredge 400 c.y. to 3' below MLW on Mulholland & Bontje parcels (privately owned bottom), remove 200 c.y. each for 400 yards total, dispose on Mulholland parcel above mean spring high water, (existing landscaped lawn area), add and restore 3' X 30' open pile dock to Mulholland and twin pilings to each on remnant piles near waters edge of Mulholland property. (NOTE: Applicant revised plan for dredging: 1) the depth has been cut from 4.5 to 3.0 feet, 2) the Bontje & Mulholland docks will be extended further to avoid vegetated wetlands and sloping will be increased to 2 on 1 to prevent slumping of the adjacent spartina area, 3) dredge material will be disposed of off site. The August Acres development has agreed to take the dredge material to one of the lots which is outside the Trustees jurisdiction. Located: 725 & 802 Island View Lane, 300 feet east of Bayshore Drive, Greenport. SCTM ~57-2-23 & 24 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of this application? MICHAEL BONTJE: I went over most of the changes to be more specific on the dock extensions. The Mulholland dock went from a 3' X 30' long by 4' wide down to a 3' wide but 45' long. That was at the request of the DEC to avoid vegetated areas on either end. Also moving the dredge area further off shore by about 6' or so also caused an extension for the Bontje dock, 3' wide of about 14' on an angle out to the creek and then a 14' "L" Shape along the dredging. In other words the dredging has been extended more to the south combined and diminished east to west. It's also been shallowed up from 4 1/2' to 3' below MLW in addition to the sloping area which is already mentioned. The total for dredge material is 325 yards for both. Also on one of the items that we have agreed to for the DEC purposes is, there are several patches to the shore line adjacent to my existing dock and adjacent to the Mulholland shoreline which there is spartina on either side 6' wide 12' wide, whatever it is, a long length, and there's no spartina in these patch areas. So what we're gonna do is come in and put spartina altenaflera in those patches. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do you have a DEC permit? MR. BONTJE: No, we do not have a DEC permit. We've met with them however, I believe it was the 21st of June with Leu Chirarella and Diane Sanford and also Mark Hellman of the Army Corps of Engineers and this reflects their comments. We got a written authorization from Posillico Construction to dispose of the material on one of their lots. So I want to submit now. It has some conditions. (See letter dated 6/29/95) As I've already indicated to you is on the August Acres subdivision we will not .... in other words if he said put it on "X" lot and there was a wetland there, I would say no we have to stay 75' from wetlands so as not to need another permit. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do you have a location of that dredge site for us. MR. BRONTJE: They haven't given me written location but the expected location is on western end of lot 15. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else who would like to speak on behalf of the applicant? Is there anyone who would like to against the application: DEREK MORCOMBE: I am adjacent property owner. You have already two,letters against this application. Mr. Bontje stated that the Southold Town Board & Trustees will have no further jurisdiction in this matter. I would like you to verify that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm sorry I don't follow you. MR. MORCOMBE: The application for a wetlands permit. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: We have all the authority in granting it or not granting it. MR. MORCOMBE: Agreed. MR. BONTJE: May I clarify this. The reference was to the disposal area not being within your jurisdiction. Only the disposal area. MR. MORCOMBE: Not withstanding the precaution that Mr. Bontje has offered, I think it will be a concern to the Property Owners Association I would like to know how as an adjacent property owner and go with other property owners~ how I can be~kept advised exactly where it is going and when. TRUSTEE GARRELL: The dredge spoil? MR. MORCOMBE: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Are all your comments in relation to just the dredge spoil locationMR. MORCOMBE: My comments outlined in the two letters you have on file which behance more or less by different location of this dredge material. My objection principally was to having it within less than a stones throw of my bedroom. It is extremely fetid muck. I speak from experience of ten years ago. I can give you a drawing, I can quote whatever information you need. We will need more than a weeks notice. I suggest a week because the Property Owner's Association only meets from here on. We would like on-going information. This meeting was not advertised. I only learned it yesterday from my neighbors. It was a great surprise for me. As you know, as an adjacent property owner the Corps of Engineers are required to evaluate the deed, etc., etc. So I am now suspicious of any further procedures and am taking the liberty to speak on behalf of the Property Owners Association, of which I am a part. ROBERT SLING: I live on Island View Lane and my property is on the northeast part of this creek. I have a question and an observation. The question is, will there be any adverse affect on the water flow and the amount of water that's in front of my property due to this dredging. This will be the second dredging on the other end of the creek. I'm not in opposition with somebody improving their property, I'm just concerned about the affects on my property. My second observation is that the creek should really be dredged at the Bay Inlet. The egress and the entrance to the creek is really the problem. And that's just an observation that I would like you to consider. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's something that was brought up' during our work session. The fact tha't...now that's Town owned bottom, that little waterway there? MR. SLING: I have no idea. MR. BONTJE: The bottom is private. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You think it's all private? MR. BONTJE: The whole thing is a tax lot for Mulholland. But your talking about the inlet to the Bay? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes. MR. BONTJE: That may be what Sage owns too. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: The Town has had the position that we can't ask the County to come in and dredge a creek that belongs to somebody else. In other words we don't want the taxpayers to pay for your channel. So that's what the questions are coming from. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But to go back one further. Most of the underwater land in the Town is owned by the Trustees from the Colonial Patent of 1676. So by virtue of the patent everyone in Town owns that property. For whatever reason throughout the years Suffolk County, the Dept. of Public Works maintenance dredges the mouths of the inlets that are public property. If this is privately owned bottom than it's like any other parcel and the County will not operate in that area for the benefit of a private individual. And there's other areas .... MR. SLING: The entrance of the Bay isn't owned by an individual. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But the interface there, there's some property line~ It starts somewhere between the state .... and in cases like Wunneweta Lagoon and Nassau Point and Spring Pond in East Marion and Sages Basin in Greenport where the County will not dredge because it's privately held bottom and that's why the County doesn't dredge this area, doesn't keep the mouth open. MR. SLING: What I'm asking for is that you positive your position, if you would review it and if it's possible if the County be involved in dredging, that they be asked to do it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We just did recently review it. What happened and we were told what happened by a long time resident earlier, was that Gull Pond was originally privately held. All the land owners deeded the property to the Town so that the County would dredge it. And now it's Trustee Land, it's the same as Patent Land. But unless that's done, it's just like having the County come and do work on any private piece of property. TRUSTEE GARRELL: The alternative is also clear if you want a creek as a private group you have somebody like Costello or Tom Samuels who can do that. In fact we've had a couple of proposals that way. People have to get together and decide to do it, and we are not adverse to that at all. MR. SLING: But nobody answered my first question. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I can try. Water seeks it's own level. Where there's a big hole underneath or a shallow hole underneath, the water level itself is gonna seek. And that's determined by the highs and lows of the weather pattern going across, the pressure pushing down on the water, etc., etc. So the fact that your water will move up or down won't be any different depending on underneath the surface of the water. SPEAKER IN AUDIENCE: Wouldn't that be characteristic of~ the amount of time a tide is in and out. Obviously it will seek the level of the deepest spot. TRUSTEE KRUPSK~: This is such a small project given the whole area of the creek that's it's not gonna have an affect. SAME SPEAKER: Mr. Meyer from the DEC in Albany said that while it wouldn't be significant there would be a difference in the displacement of water based on... TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: More water might move in and out but the height isn't going to change. In other words your worried about the height of the water in a storm. That's not gonna be controlled by how much water is in a hole underneath the surface of the water. It's much more controlled by external winds blowing and the pressure on top, when a hurricane comes, the pressure is so low the water comes up higher. That's what drags the water in and its not the hole underneath it. SPEAKER: What your saying to me is the fact it's deeper in one spot based on the amount of time the tide has to come in and out, it's'not going to impact the water ..... I understand, we lived at this house for 24 years, so I know what happens ..... TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Let me try to explain. Here's a level at low tide (indicating with his hands), at high tide it's gone up two feet, so only that top two feet of water has moved in and out. Whether this is a hole 50' deep or 4' deep that water tends to stay there. In other words it's only a movement of 2.4' or whatever that tidal range is for that day. At low tide, here's level of the water and at high tide here's the level of the water and its that water moving in and out and whether there's a hole there underneath doesn't have any effect. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other comment? MR. MORCOMBE: In the future any matter be advertised so that I can be given something more than 36 hours. CLERK: It was advertised in the paper in April and than it was recessed, the public hearing was recessed for further information and then Mr. Bentje requested that we recess it again until He had time to get the information which was now. SPEAKER: When was this done. CLERK: It was April. That the public hearing was going to be taking place in April, which it was and then it was recessed. And then we don't have to republish again. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We probably should. TRUSTEE GARRELL: The other thing is it's a good suggestion that we republish. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We're not running right through this either, we received the initial application in mid January. We've given it quite a bit of review. MR. MORCOMBE: So have I, if I may say so. The two advertised sections in the paper, you have detailed comments on file. I object this now because I did not know this meeting was taking place and I did not have time to research it, I did not have time to write a letter. If not for my neighbor, because she is nearer the dredged area now I'm speaking without the necessary approval on behalf of the Property Owner's Association~ TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: If I can paraphrase what you've said, your objection is to the spoil site. MR. MORCOMBE: My objection is in the two letters. This is extremely fetid material. I cannot believe that people are not gonna be surprised when this done. A lot of people will be affected by this. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: This property is all privately owned, where it's gonna be dredged, right? MR. BONTJE: Yes. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: The whole creek is privately owned~ MR. BONTJE: Yes, where you see it on the drawings, it's privately owned. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: What is the depth of the creek outside of this area? MR. BONTJE: What is the depth? In other words to the south? TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Right. MR. BONTJE: We're gonna be dredging down to approx. ordinary high water line. So that at low water you would have basically an inch at the southern end. At high water you'd have an extra feet, 2 1/2' on top of that. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Just to follow up, at low tide you can't get in and out? MR. BONTJE: Right. You'd probably get in and out with a sail boat. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: How far does that shallow extend? MR. BONTJE: 50 to 100'. It gets progressively deeper as you go out. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: You don't own that property? MR. BONTJE: That's still privately held and owned by Mulholland. BUt it was never dredged. It was not dredge in 1960's. The area we're dredging now was dredged in 1960. In other words we're going up to that old dredging line and stopping there. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I think that was a concern that we had originally that you might be creating a hole there where the water would never move. MR. BONTJE: No more or less than Carlucci and Baldwin. However, the shallowness being 3' deep, I don't think you have to worry about it being stagnant. You didn't have that problem with Carlucci and Baldwin before. Actually it's attached to their basin. MR. ANGELL: Is there any dredging spoil being on the lawn? MR. BONTJE: No. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Why did you change the spoil site? MR. BONTJE: We had some discussions with the DEC regarding where they consider the wetland line be placed. As you know I am a wetland expert and an Army Corps of Engineers Certification for wetlands and have been doing it for 16 years, so Lou and I were back and forth. Technically he has to notify the property owner and hold a public hearing in order to change that line. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You work for the Army Corps. MR. BONTJE: No, I don't work for the Army Corps. They certify professionals to do wetland delineations. He and I had a technical discrepancy as to what a line would be. I~ decided to do is instead of worrying about that argument see if I could seek an upland location off site. I did. I found one that I thought was suitable. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Did Lou feel there was spartina that would be covered by the fill? MR. BONTJE: Originally? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes. MR. BONTJE: Yes, he felt there was some .... it was marginal, right on the edge. TRUSTEE GARRELL: I guess you intend to watch that fill carefully and safeguard it. MR. BONTJE: What we intend to do is remove it and take it to that site and in that process it should get a tremendous amount of aeration and again Carlucci did his basin, which is right next door to mine. I was right there too and you do get an odor for a couple of days, no doubt about it. I characterize it as a low tide odor but it's not a Bronx low tide. TRUSTEE GARRELL: What about a farm field or can somebody use that stUff as spread. MR. BONTJE: Frankly the reason August Acres agreed to take it was they thought it would stabilize a nice top soil. Carlucci's property and Baldwin's property is built on this stuff since the 1960's. So they felt it was decent material they've got a feeling that one lot is a little low in the front end and they would like to put some material in and we had the material, so it was a good match. We intend to put it on the property, work it aerate it and then finally spread it out within one week into about a foot of depth which is pretty minimal and lime it and plant it. We also want to do it when the weather is less warm, less traffic, fewer people in the area and then it's also cooler out. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: How do you de-water it? MR. BONTJE: Just let it sit. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No, how do you move it when you pick it up it's just ...... MR. BONTJE: It's got enough integrity, we're gonna do it by bucket. So it's got enough integrity to do it at low tide. To hold in a bucket and put it right into trucks. You can line the trucks with f~hric and just run them back and forth. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Let's face it dredge are the issue of the point for a century because all along the coast now your running up against where to put dredge spoil. L.I. Sound there's a terrible issue going on right now with the Themes River. MR. MORCOMBE: Farmland then belonged to Berduncker Farms with a potato farm that was fertilized with a Union Carbide project namely Temic. That poisoned my well and wells in the entire neighborhood. There was a class action lawsuit. We were recompensed about $100. Plus they put in a new filter. Ail of that I know from experience drained into the creeks. But this is not simply leaves and branches. The cesspools drainage is there, the residue of Temic and there is the smell which is indicative of sump. I just want to put to you as fact. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Where do you live in relation to the new spoil site. MR. MORCOMBE: Quite a ways away. Perhaps a half a mile or more. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But you think that new spoil site would affect you. MR. MORCOMBE: No. Only as a member of the Property Owner's Association. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The only concern I have is that when you move the spoil, you can't just pick it up and put it in a truck because the physical property of it is just prohibit you from doing that. Your gonna have to de-water it somewhere. MR. BRONTJE: We could probably accomplish that on the border of Mulholland and Brontje. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think your genna have to do that because it's just a sloppy mess. MR. BONTJE: Yes, then a couple of days later handle it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think we should co-ordinate with the DEC on that. They're gonna have different conditions on how to handle that. Did Leu talk about that at all? MR. BONTJE: No he did not. We can agree right now as to temporary disposal on the border of Bontje and Mulholland. The de-watering site. We were intending to being the trucks right now down my driveway on Bontje, turn them slightly to the east and go around the shed on the house and bring it down to the waterfront close to the dock where the lawn goes. What we could do is take that area between the pole and the house and over to the property line landward of the dock and use that area as disposal intention, as a de-watering location. Then we'll have to same trucks come in and won't have to go as long. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I have a problem with the dredging project as a whole. Digging a pit in the back of a creek that is very shallow to start with is ..... I personally do not favor any kind of dredging like this. MR. BONTJE: I don't own the property out from my property. If I don't dredge I will loose my riparian access. It's that simple. It was dredged in 1960 to create riparian access to create water front. If I do not dredge I will loose that and loose half the value of my property maybe more. Also Carlucci and Baldwin were given the same consideration in having that done and there's been no significant factors, no stagnating or anything like that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm gonna make a motion to table this until I see a site for de-watering and I want to co-ordinate with the DEC. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: What I just said too was I don't think we have a new diagram of the new dock. MR. BONTJE: This is it, the cross section and measurements. (indicating on map) TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm sorry to have to hold you up for another month, but I need a de-watering site. I'll make a motion to recess the hearing. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES MR. MORCOMBE: May I please ask that the Trustees to re-read my letter of April. When I addressed I over heard Mr. Bontje speak about haybales. I have a comment on haybales. They attract rodents and they are not as satisfactory to stop runoff on the delicate wetland area. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The haybales would only be a temporary measure. What we're requesting. He's requested an off site disposal area for spoil which is probably gonna be fine with us. I don't know see any way of moving that unless he de-waters it for a day or so. MR. MORCOMBE: What's the difference between de-watering or run-off? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: All the material that is in suspension of the water will not reach the wetland. It will only be just the water that will run or percolate through his soil back into the ground water. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It is the same water that was in the creek and will find it's way back into the creek. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We don't want the mud running back into the creek. And he doesn't want the mud back in the creek. So the idea is to retain that and we'll work with the DEC because they have quite a bit of experience. 9:50 p.m. In the matter of Susan Tarshis on behalf of STEVE GREENBAUM requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 4' X 80' pier with two elevation lifts, a 3' X 20' ramp, a 7' X 30' float with 4 float piles and 4 mooring piles. Located: 1073 Bay Home Road Extension, Southold. SCTM ~56-5-38 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak either in favor or against this application? CAC recommends approval. TRUSTEE WENCZEL: We discussed it last month and this reflects the revised plan. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Meaning that they still have 4' TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Well it's on the Bay. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Move to close the hearing. TRUSTEE ALBERTSON: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I'll make a motion to approve the application. TRUSTEE GARRELL: Second. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to go back to the regular meeting, TRUSTEE WENCZEL seconded. ALL AYES V. ASSESSMENTS: 1. MARTIN J. BANCROFT JR., requests a Wetland Permit to enlarge and enhance an existing freshwater pond in width. Located: North east corner of Narrow River Road & Platt Rd., Orient. SCTM ~27-2-2.3 TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve for a Negative Declaration with condition the applicant provide location of pond on survey with sideline setback 20' & new drawing, TRUSTEE ALBERTSON seconded. ALL AYES 2. En-Consultants Inc., on behalf of BORIS GRZIC requests a Coastal Erosion & Permit to construct 4' wide stairs from top of bluff down to beach. Located: 16125 Soundview Ave., Southold. SC~ ~50-2-19 TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve for a Negative Declaration based on an accurate survey of redefined plan, TRUSTEE WENCZEL seconded. ALL AYES VI. RESOL~UTIONS: 1. CHARLES RIESTERER requests a Grandfather Permit for a 4' X 100' dock, rebuild 4 jetty's: 10' X 23', 9' X 31', 9' X 35' and 9' X 35' and rebuild concrete ramp. Located: 1945 Calves Neck Road, Southold. SCTM ~70-4-47 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve the Grandfather Permit based on new plans showing a 4' X 33', a 4' X 22' and a 4' X 22 jetty only and a brick rebuilt ramp, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES 2. Nicholas Aliano on behalf of BEACHCOMBER IMOTEL requests a Grandfather & CoaStal Erosion permit to remove and replace in same configuration 45 1.f. of existing damaged foundation and place 10 c.y. of backfill, remove and replace in same configuration on east wing of motel 30 1.f. and 80 1.f. on west wing and fill with 10 c.y. on east and west wings. Located: 3800 Duck Pond Rd., Cutchogue. SCTM ~83-2-1 TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve the Grandfather Permit as submitted on plans, TRUSTEE LABERTSON seconded. ALL AYES VII~ MOORINGS: 1. ROBERT B~ GRATTAN requests a mooring in Goose Creek for a t7'~outboard with a 100 1.b. mushroom, as per Bay Constables recommendation. ACCESS: Private. TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve, TRUSTEE GARRELL seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL moved to approve, TRUSTEE GARRELL seconded. ALL AYES 2. DRAGIC~ POCINA requests a~mooring in Goose Creek for a 16' o~tboard with a 100 1.b. mushroom. ACCESS: Public TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES 3. GARY GUJA requests a mooring in Mattituck Creek for a 21' outboard with a 100 1.b. mushroom. ACCESS: Private (As per Bay Constable Dzenkowski's recommendations only) TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to approve as per Bay Constables recommendations only, TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL seconded. ALL AYES RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED BY: Diane J. ~rbert TI4-E SOUTHOLD TOWN CLERK DATE P;~. I~5 HOUR Town Clerk, Town of Southold