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HomeMy WebLinkAboutTR-04/19/2000Albert J. Krupski, President James King, Vice-President Henry Smith Artie Foster Ken Poliwoda Town Hall 53095 Route 25 P.O. Box 1179 Southold, New York 11971-0959 Telephone (631) 765-1892 Fax (631) 765-1366 BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES TOWN OF SOUTHOLD MINUTES Wednesday, April 19, 2000 7:00 PM PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE CALL MEETING TO ORDER NEXT FIELD INSPECTION: Wednesday, May 17, 2000 at 11:00 am. TRUSTEE FOSTER moved to Approve, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES NEXT TRUSTEE MEETING: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 at '7:00 PM. WORKSESSION: 6:00 PM. TRUSTEE KING moved to Approve, TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES APPROVE MINUTES: Approve Minutes of March 22, 2000. Minutes not complete. Iii. MONTHLY REPORT: The Trustees monthly report for March 2000. A check for $5,154.12 was forwarded to the Supervisor's Office for the General Fund. PUBLIC NOTICES: Public Notices are posted on the Town Clerk's Bulletin Board for review. AMENDMENTS/WAIVERS/CHANGES: S.E.L. Permits on behalf of MATTITUCK INLET & MARINA requests an Amendment to Permit #5058 to reclaim lost fill 5'-10' seaward of reconstructed bulkhead to a depth of 3'-3.5' at apparent low water. Located: Mill Rd., Mattituck. SCTM#106- 6-13.3 TRUSTEE KING moved to Approve the application and that we charge for the 20 cy. of fill TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES S.E.L. Permits on behalf of BELVEDERE PROPERTY MANAGEMENT LLC requests an Amendment to Permit #4475 to dredge approx. 145 cy. in landing craft site, install 12'X 70' concrete and rubber access ramp and two 7-pile dolphins. Dredge material to be placed upland for future beach and bluff nourishment. Located: Robins Island. SCTM#134-3-5 TRUSTF. E POL1WODA moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE FOSTER seconded. ALL AYES Land Use Ecological Services on behalf of E.M. KONTOKOSTA requests an Amendment to Permit #5092 to include the placement of 75+/- cy. of Natural Long Island Stone (300-500 lbs.) at the toe of the proposed bulkhead to act as armoring. Located: 54155 Middle Rd., Arshamomaque. SCTM#52-1-2&3 TRUSTEE FOSTER moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES Land Use Ecological Services, Inc. on behalf of WILLIAM MALLE~IS requests an Amendment to Permit #5116 for a 3'X 30' seasonal ramp, a seasonal float and 4"X 4' piles for the dock and 4"X 6" piles for the float, as per the request of the DEC. Located: 70 Jackson's Landing, Mattituck. SCTM#113-4-3&4 TRUSTF. E KING moved to Approve the application TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of PAUL A I:ILER~S requests an Amendment to Permit #1437 to extend 4'X 30' dock by 10', installing a 32"X 16' ramp to replace existing and turning 6'X 20' float straight instead of"T" configuration. Installing eight 2-pile dolphins. Located: 1905 Gull Pond Lane, Greenport. SCTM#35-4-16 TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to Approve the application with the condition that the structure be no further than the neighbors with a total of 3 dolphins off-shore with revised plans, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES ANNE L, SCItWIEBERT requests a Waiver to construct a wood deck approx. 20'X 40' onto existing house. Located: 1075 Mill Creek Dr., Southold. SCTM#135-3-40 TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to Approved the application, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES FRANK ZITO requests an Amendment to Permit #4526 to change the floor of the tool shed from concrete to wood. Located: Broadwaters Cove Marine, 8000 Skunk Lane, Cutchogue. SCTM#104-8-2.5 TRUSTEE FOSTER moved to Approve the application with the condition that there is to be a drywell in the rear of the shed. TRUSTEE POLlWODA seconded. ALL AYES Jennifer Gould, Esq. on behalf of ROBERT R. & ALLISON A. WlECZOREK requests a Transfer of Permit #5127 from Sharon L. Mc, Elroy to Robert R. & Allison A. Wieczorek. Located: 385 Gull Pond Lane, Greenport. SCTM#35-4-28.26 TRUSTEE FOSTER moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE KING 'seconded. ALL AYES 10. SUSAN CACCItlOLI requests a Transfer of Permit ~4103 from Carol B lassuci to Susan Cacchioli and Steven J. Gueci. Located: 1040 Holbrook Lane, Mattituck. SCTM#113- 6-13 TRUSTEE KING moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE FOSTER seconded. ALL AYES MARTIN & MARJORIE DUNN request a Transfer of Permit #1676 from John H. Brochard to Martin & Marj0rie Dunn. Located: 1570 Ole Jule Lane, Mattituck. SCTM#122-4-3 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to Table the application a plan of the dock is submitted and drawn on the survey. TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES IV. PUBLIC I~iEARINGS: THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING IN THE MATTER OF THE FOLLOWING APPLICATIONS FOR PERMITS UNDER THE WETLANDS ORDINANCE OF THE TOWN OF SOUTHOLD. I HAVE AN AFFIDAVIT OF PUBLICATION FROM THE SUFFOLK TIMES. PERTINENT CORRESPONDENCE MAY BE READ PRIOR TO ASKING FOR COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC. pI.F. ASE KEEP YOUR COMMENTS ORGANIZED ~X2qD BR1F. F: FIVE (5) MINUTES OR LESS, IS POSSIBLE S.E.L. Permits on behalf of TIMOTItY & NANCY }tlI, L requests a Wetland Permit to install a 4'X 45' catwalk, a 3'X 12' ramp and a 6'X 20' float with 2 piles. Located: 360 Oak Ave., Southold. SCTM#77-2-2 (Tape malfunctioned.) TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to Table the application until the May meeting. The Trustees will speak to the Town Attorney regarding the Covenants and Restrictions of Goose Bay Estates. TRUSTEE POL1WODA seconded. ALL AYES Eh-Consultants, Inc. on behalf of JAMES & MARY ABBOTT request a Wetland Permit to install (18) 8" diameter X 16' timber batter pilings to reinforce existing +/-101' timber bulkhead. Located: 8810 Peconic Bay Blvd., Mattituck. SCTM#126-5-3.1 TRUSTF. F. FOSTER moved to close the hearing, TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KING moved to Approve the application with the condition that the batter pilings be no more than 30" seaward of the bulkhead ar beach level and that when and if the bulkhead is re-built, the piles, are to be removed. TRUSTEE FOSTER seconded. ALL AYES En-Consultants, Inc. on behalf of EDNA RICHARDS requests a Wetland Permit to construct a fixed timber dock, consisting ofa 4'X 58' fixed catwalk elev. 3.5' above marsh, a 3'X 14' ramp and a 6'X 20' float secured with (2) 8" diameter pilings, and steps 2'X 4' landward of existing stone wall, Located: 2300 Broadwaters Rd., Cutchogue. SCTM#111-1-1 POSTPONED AS PER TIlE AGENT'S REQUEST UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE En-Consultants, Inc. on behalf of JAMES MIFIALIOS requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 77+/- timber retaining wall with (2) 12' angled returns and truck in from an upland source approx: 150 cy. of clean sand t° be used as backf'dl and planted with Cape American Beach Grass. Located: 640 Lloyd's Lane, Mattituck. SCTM#99-3-4.1 POSTPONED AS PER TFIE AGENT'S REQUEST UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE Gary F. Olsen, Esq. on behalf ofNEIL SCItI,USSEL requests a Wetland Permit to construct a single-family dwelling. Located: Stillwater Ave. East, Cutchogue. SCTM#136-2-7&8 (Tape malfunctioned) Carl Vail read a letter regarding his concerns about the application. TRUSTEE POLlWODA: ... of the wetland boundary and then we go and check it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well we'll all look at it on this one. We'll need the wetland line placed on the survey and then we need to show...the applicant has to try to accommodate the Board on the 50' non-disturbed buffer from there. DAVID OLSEN: Do you have a copy of that? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes, we do. You can take this back. So, you'll have to have someone have this put on the survey, the wetland line. We don't consider this to be the wetland line. That's the top of the bank, the actual open water. DAVID OLSEN: So someone where around here, and you want it 50' back from there. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's right. Then, we'll have to have it staked inthe field and we'll do a field inspection. Any other comment? Do I have a motion to Table the hearing? TRUSTEE FOSTER: I'll make that motion. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: So this will come up automatically next month. Now, if Mr. Schlussel can't the surveyor or whatever, if he can't get it done, just let us know and it will be postponed until, or it will automatically come up the next month again. DAVID OLSEN: We just can't submit the map showing the revision? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh sure. DAVID OLSEN: It would have to come backup? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh yes, because we just Tabled the hearing. We didn't close the heating. But, if you could do it in a timely fashion, or next field inspection we set already for May 17. If you could have that for us before then and have it staked on the site, then we could go back out there again. DAVID OLSEN: Thank you. Costello Marine Contracting on behalf of DONALD BRENNAN requests a Wetland Permit to remove existing jetty/bulkhead, then constructing 68' of new jetty using vinyl sheathing at a slightly different angle. Construct 42' new bulkhead using vinyl sheathing and resheathing the remaining 76' of existing bulkhead. Located: 1663 Bridge Lane, Cutchogue. SCTM#118-2-4.2 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here to speak on behalf of the application? GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: I'm representing Mr. Brennan. As you can see, the structure is existing, the jetty is existing, the bulkhead is existing. I just turned it and put a slighter angle in it. The reason for that is that when you're entering that channel along the southwest wind on your stern four-quarter, it makes it a little difficult to get in there. Usually this channel is filled in from the southeast side so you basically have to hug this section, the northeast section to get in there to clear that sand bar. That's the reason for the new configuration. Obviously the bulkhead that is there now has a falling in comer on it and it needs repair. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I just had a question on the description. The plans seemed clear. You're just going to take the angle out of that. GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: Correct. We're just talcing that comer out. That knocks down the footage a little bit. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Does anybody else have a problem with the description? What's the total length of the.new vinyl. It says 42'. GEORGE COSTEI,LO SR.: It's 38' as ihe existing jetty is 38' and it's going to come out and go right back in the same line and the sam~e distance off-shore. That doesn't change. The~i there s 72' of new structure and we re calling part of that structure, the first 30', jetty, because I can't not put a backing system in k. Actually you could call it a bulkhead. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh I see. I just didn't understand the wording. We looked at it in the field and we looked at the plans and it looked like it made sense. GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: I clarified it that the 30' for the jetty, for the DEC. That's why I wrote it that way. TRUSTF~F. KRLrPSKI: Is there any dredging associated with this? GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: No. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there any other comment? Does anybody have any problem with this? But you'll have to take out the material that's in front of the new one, won't you? GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: Correct. I'm going to excavate behind the bulkhead before I pull it out so it's not called dredging. It's called excavating. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Okay, but you should still include that in your description with the yardage and whatnot and deposit the sand right up there on the beach, I assume. GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: Correct. TRUSTEE Ki~UPSKI: The CAC recommends Disapproval with the concern with the proposed increase in the length of the jetty and where the existing spoil from the changing angle is going. We've resolved where the spoil is going and the jetty is not getting any longer really, is it? GEORGE COSTELLO SR.: No it's not. It's not changing. TRUSTEE K~S~: Alright. Do you have any problem with that? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I didn't see a problem. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTEF, KING: So moved. TRUSTF~ POLIWODA: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEF, KRUPSKI: Do you want to make a motion Ken? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'll make a motion to Approve the Wetland Permit with excavation included behind the old bulkhead and the fill will be placed behind the new bulkhead. TRUSTF~F. KRUPSKI: Just give us a yardage figure and then the depth to which you're going to go to. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of WEST LAKE ASSOC, requests a Wetland Permit to dredge the entrance channel and adjoining portions of West Lake to 3' below MLW, place a total of approx. 600 cy. of dredge spoil on indicated skes, maintenance dredge to same conditions as necessary to max. of 3 additional timed during the next 10 years. Located: 505 Cedar Point Dr. West, Southold. SCTM#90-1-11 TRUSTEE KRESS: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? JIM FITZGERALD: I'm here for the Association. I don't personally have anything new to add except for that I would like to point out again that the Trustees did Approve essent'hally the same project in the past, although there is some question about whether or not it was ever consummated. I understand that the Trustees also have received letters t~om members of the Assoc. and I think that some of the members are here tonight to talk to you and I believe also we have Mr. Edgar who is a contractor who would like to describe how he would propose to do the operation in some detail, and I think you spoke to him at the site at the last inspection. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We did. Briefly, just to recap the last month's, our concerns were, well our big concerns were the integrity of the neighbor's bulkheads which is based in black and white in the Code, preventing us from doing something that would undermine the lateral stability of the adjacent neighbor's property. I think something that on the order of... well I'm getting ahead of myself, maybe, I'll let everyone speak and then we can ... JIM FITZGERALD: Mr. Edgar is here and he can talk to both the insurance aspect of the situation and the opinion of he and I think Mr. Costello; who installed the Moi's bulkhead or repaired the Moi's bulkhead sometime ago, as to whether or not the bulkheads would survive the proposed activity. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. Would anyone else like to speak? JOE EDGAR: I'm the contractor. I met with you on site. I had an opportunity to speak to George Costello the day of your inspection. Based on the profile we're requesting, he feels there would be absolutely no problem with the integrity of the Moi bulkhead. My feeling is the same with the opposite bulkhead. The profile, which we're looking to achieve, basically, we'll maintain an angle of repose which will not dramatically change the material against the bulkheads at this given time. The main problem is the sand delta which is built up just inside the lagoon. It's a continuing, expanding delta and I feel that as it widens and rises in profile, it's going to start to accelerate erosion into surrounding improved properties including vegetated wetlands. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: How would that accomplish that. JOE EDGAR: Well it's like pouring a pancake on the griddle. As it widen it's starts to rise, which this sand delta continues to do, water, as it enters and exists the lake is going to take the path that's least resistant, which would be around the sand delta. On one side of that particular bar is wetlands. On the other side there is a dilapidated bulkhead and as you move further toward the Peconic, you have an improved bulkhead, I believe it's the Greenfield property. Another scenario which can occur (noise) in profile, could cause the lake to stagnate. Not to mention it is a serious navigation hazard. Somebody unfamiliar with that particular area, and I have some pictures if you would like to review them. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh sure. We were fortunate to come at low water each time so that we could really see the elevations. Fmjust going to take comments from everyone else first. Is there anyone else who would like to speak On this matter in favor of or against. MIKE ZEVITS: We own a piece of property on West Lake that's 1945 Little Peconic Bay Rd., and I just want to speak up in favor of the dredging. I speak in favor of the dredging for many different reasons. One of my favorite is to keep the marine life alive and well in that particular creek. I look in the past at two other creeks that were in that area that were specifically Terry Waters Creek, and it's now called a pond, and also there was also another creek, which is now a pond also. Ithink it's called Midway Creek but, as a boy, I remember going into those creeks claming, fishing, catching the crabs, etc. and now it's gone. It's gone because it's all shoaled up. Essentially, that's what I'm seeing in West Lake. I grew up in that creek alSO and I've done boating out of that creek many times. I have a small dock on the creek itself and I can tell you right now, coming in and out of that creek, it is a danger. It's a navigation hazard at:this point, specifically at low tide. One of the,problems I see, specifically with more, well some boaters anyway, when they try.to get out, they're actually picking up their engines and the engines are out of the water so that they don't hit the bottom. Some of them are even getting out to push the boat along. Ican foresee someone getting hurt, seriously hurt. What's also happening because of that shoaling, is that when it is high-tide, the water is rush'mg in, it's rushing in like rapids and what's happening is that the boats are coming in and they have more ora tendency to crash into the bulkheading on either side, so it's:a hazard for the boaters who use it right now. ObviOUsly it's a benefit to all the people to, have this particular lake, or creek, dredged not only for the marine life but also for.the isafety of the individuals and more importantly to enhance the property values on that particular creek. Il'that does shoal off or Lfit does become unnavigatable certainly the~pr0perty values do decrease and certainly the tax rate for the Town of Southold will decrease also as a result. One thing I'm concerned, and I have written a letter to the Trustees,. there is a health hazard. I look at it, and maybe it might be far out, but I'm looking at the West Nile Virus. I look at the mosquito population in that area and it has increased. It's terrible in the summertime there. In fact, if the creek does stagnate like Terry Waters Creek did and also Midway, we might have a problem there also and I wouldn't like to see it happen and I speak on behalf of several individuals here but I think they have something to say also. Thank you. PATRICIA KELLY: I have property on Little Peconic Bay Lane also. The reason I want this creek dredged out is because I'm a bird watcher. I used to go watching birds over in Terry Waters as a little kid. The birds that are concerning me most are the herons and the egrets and the plovers that jump and that you see roaming around there. You won't find these marsh bird egrets in Terry Waters anymore. They don't even go near where the entrance was anymore because all their food is gone. I was doing a little research on this and I was looking down in Cape Canaveral down in Florida where they closed off an area to prevent, I don't know just to make a park out of it, and it was to prevent mosquitoes. What happened is when they closed it all off, the mosquito population got so large because these kinds of marshy type birds that go in and out with the fides were eating all of the mosquitoes so what happened was that they had to use chemicals. We have a septic system, and what is it, like 75 % 0fthis area is septic system, and we really don't have regulations on our septic systems and by leaving this estuary open so that the natural drainage can clean out this area, it's going to save us all a lot of money in the long run, especially since last summer when the mosquito population was horrendous. If we can take care of this stuff naturally, by keeping this place dredged and allowing the natural filtering of the water, everybody in the area is going to be a lot healthier. Thank you. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. CATHERINE BARBADO: My husband and I have ahome on West Lake Drive and I was unaware of the meeting last week until one of my neighbors called me. However, we were aware of the fact that there was a meeting for Campanelli which was posted. I don't know if it's a policy that all things must be posted or not. I knowthat West Lake has two signs. One on Mid Way and one on East Peconic Lane and we saw no notice whatsoever there. I went to your office there and I obtained a few things. The first that I want to address is that your Conservation Advisory Council has given you Approvals. However, they stated West Lane instead of West Lake and Southold may have a different West Lane. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It might be a typing error. It's probably a clerical error and not any intention to mislead anyone. CATHERINE BARBADO: Well if they do the dredging and they use the crane and the crane goes up and down West Lake, our road, and they do any damage to the road, who is going to be responsible to fix that road for us? We would like to know if the Association is going to pick-up the costs. We've had problems with, in 1987, with the road and we don't want the same problem. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The contractor should be responsible for any damage. CATHERINE BARBADO: So we will have someone to rely on that could take care of this? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's a good to have someone...that's something that hadn't yet been discussed in this application is the access for eqmpment to do this job. CATHERINE BARBADO: Well how would that be done, sir? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's usually don't by having the applicant orthe contractor post a bond. CATHERINE BARBADO: Now another thing. If you recall, we had a private meeting with the Trustees on October 5, 1990 and it was just my husband and I with the Trustees and I would like to know if you keep the records of our meeting with you filed with the West Lake Assoc. or under our name in your files? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What was the meeting about ma'am? CATHERINE BARBADO: It was about the many illegal things that were done around the lake. We were concerned with the illegal ramp that was put right at the end where il comes through. The reason we're concerned is because we've had people stopping us, two or three times, asking us about the public ramp of Southold. They wanted to use the road to go into the lake. Now is this going to become a public ramp that everyone has access to? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well the lake itself is owned by the Trustees of the Town of Southold and therefore the bottom is public property, however, you cannot use private land to access that. CATHERINE BARBADO: So in other words, if the ramp remains there, they have access to the ramp? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well I don't think the ramp would necessarily give them access. If it's private property, you can't cross private property to access public property. CATHERINE BAPd3ADO: And we can be assured of that then. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: You can be assured that we wouldn't ever give anyone to cross private property to access public lands. CATHERINE BARBADO: Now according to the impact sheet that I have here, it says that it was expected that the project wSll have no significant affect on the wetlands and the tidal waters of the Town. What we expect and what natural deals out are two different things. I don't know if we should question impact statements or not. TRUSTEE tCRUPSKI: Oh go right ahead, ma'am. That's up to you. CATHERINE BARBADO: Well the reason I say that is because we've been living there for a long time and we have experienced different results from the different dredging that they've had there. Many, many times, when they did not have that bulkhead along the canal, we had not problems there. When they put the other connecting one here, that's when the problem started. We remember, when our children were small, that canal was deep. The blUefish and other fish would go in and out of the lake into the bay. TRUSTEE ~ICRUPSKI: Excuse me, I'm unclear as to what you just said. TRUSTF~ KING: She means that this didn't start to shoal up until these bulkheads were put in. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is that it? CATHERINE BARBADO: As the canal enters the lake, akight, let me show you. You say you own the bottom there? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's correct. CATHERINE BARBADO: Alright. You know where the Greenfields are? Right in front of them, abutting along the canal, and then there's another along the lake here, that is what I'm talking about. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. The bulkhead. CATHERINE BARBADO: Yes. Now, many illegal things were done here and unfortunately whatever was done on the water, does not go away and lasts us for years hnd years and years, and that is the reason that I question the meeting we had on October 5, 1990 to be reviewed by the residents that were unaware of this and postpone this meeting for another time so we can discuss it further. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well that we would have to look up and see if Lauren can find the minutes of that meeting of 1990. CATHERINE B)dll3ADO: Well I have most of the correspondence at home. I did not bring it because I was unaware of the meeting and I didn't have too much time to discuss it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well anything that's relevant to this application we would certainly welcome. 10 CATHERINE BARBADO: Well I would certainly appreciate it if you would consider it. Thank you. JOE BARBADO: I live at 200 West Lake Dr. and I'd like to make a few comments. We've been there over 38 approx. 38 years and the problem seems to be...well I think there's two reasons why it's filling in the way it has been filling in. First of all, back in approx. 1978 the Born brothers had that dredged by Latham in East Marion. They dredged that whole lake out and put the spoil on the main land so they could have depths to set up his property along the lake. Now what's happening, throughthat course of time until now, all that silt is long washing down and most of the property on the west side of that lake is undermining and filling in and there is approx., I guess, and it's only a guess, it's approx, about 25' of mud and silt. The problem came when the bulkhead on the west side of the lake on the nOrthwest corner where it comes into the lake, somebody put illegal bulkhead and,the ramp. Before that was put in, that. canal was at high tide and low tide, a sufficient amount ofwater going back and forth to keep k open. Look at your records. It's been dredged many a times. I've been there appro~:. 36 years and it's been dredged 3 or 4 times, If this dredging goes through, for what I read on the last agenda that you have, you're going to have them put the spoil on the east.side of the canal, well when you get a southeast wind or a northeaster like we have been getting for the last couple of years, all of that nice soft sand is going to shoal fight back in. My suggestion is, before you issue a dredging permit, that there should be something done about having the silt come into the lake and then you have a job that will be well done and only be applied for once in a lifetime. Also, when that small bulkhead was put in and the ramp, there was a huge.colony of fiddler crabs and you know what fiddler crabs do to the bottom. They clean k. Also, there was a huge area of oysters there in which when they dredged it, that vanished. The dredging can be done if it's done right. There's quite a bit of wildlife, Last year I noticed maybe a couple dozen of scallops Starting to comeback in to the lake. Years ago, that lake was a wonderful spoiling groung.~ for scallops. Today we have a problem with scallops especially in this locality. There are a lot of fish that are going to be hurt and,killed by this dredging. I'd like you to have consideration and look back into the past that had been done to concur with today's meeting. Thank you. TRUSTF, F, KRLrPSKI: Any other comment? STAN RUGOSKI: I live in the same area. I'd love to see that lake open and I feel the wildlife would be gone and we'll a lot of mosquitoes and I don't want that. I want it open. Thank you. TRUSTEE KRLrPSKI: Any other comment? JOY ZEVITS: I don't have any statistics or anything like that. I just want to say that I'm in full favor of the dredging and pretty much for what the other people said. It really has to be done soon. I know you don't want to destroy the wildlife but if you don't do it know, that creek, like Terry Waters, is just going to fill in, you won't get boats in and out, there's no access to it, the fresh water from the bay is not going to come in and out. It's going to become stagnant, mosquitoes, everything is going to die, wildlife, plants, the fish, the crabs, clams, and I grew up there and we've been there for over 35 years. My idea is to preserve that part of it. If you don't dredge it, you say "well I'm protecting wildlife" you're going to destroy the wildlife, basically, so it has to be clear to water from the bay. It has to have the tides coming in and out. That's my idea. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. 11 JOY ZEVITS: Do you what I also want to say, since I have a whole list here, because I came here for so many years to Southold, I love Southold. I think it should be maintained and preserved and if you don't do it know, down the rides, our kids and their kids are going to suffer. I think that's important. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We'll take all the new speakers first. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: I think it's a given to just react to other speaker, that every one of us here loVes Southold and I think we're all here particularly because we want to keep it the way it should be otherwise we wouldn't be here. I think I'm on record. I'm Marcelle Greenfield and I am directly involved because it's my bulkheading that is on one side of the canal: I'm on record being opposed to the dredging and one of the reasons I want to also clarify since the last meeting and re-iterate is that these other closed lakes do not.have bulkheading on both sides. What the Moi's have done and I have done has maintained that bulkheading to do it for the whole community as well as ourselves and as long as that bulkheading stands there, that water comes in and out. Sir, you're a fisherman,: you know the area. The other areas that are closed are closed because they are not protected by the bulkheading. I'm very concerned, and I know everybody has the best intentions, if the work is done, to be done as professionally as possible, You can understand that I also deserve to have a guarantee that if it is approved, that there will be no damage to me, to my property, and my bulkheading. I want to be assured before it starts, and I'd like to know exactly how and the work is being done to see that.., aside from that, there are monies set aside that this will always be cared for. The other thing is, I'm very concerned about automatically permitting "that the maintenance dredged to same conditions and to be done three additional times in the next ten years". Number one, if the dredging is permitted, I think before it be done again, we have to have another review because things change, tides change, water level changes, the ecology is changing. Do we know what three years down the road is going to do, what the results will be from the original dredging. I think, first of all, that "automatic" should be erraticated. I don't approve of that at all and I'm very concerned about that. As far as the bond is concerned, or however you will be doing the indemnification, it should be not less than 10 years that this should be taken care of. I don't know if there's anything else: Thank you very much. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else who hasn't spoken? JERRY CASE: I live on West Lake also. Many people have been talking about how long they've been here. My family got here in 1669 or something. I've been coming out here for 69 years myself working, swimming, and boating in Peconic Bay and I have access to the bay now and I can see that it's quickly disappearing. It hurts me in many ways, not the least of which is property values but also a certain amount of enjoyment why we bought the house, why we came here and why picked that particular house because we had access to the water, and it looks to me it's clearly filling in much worse this that it was two years ago or last year. I utterly urge you to pass this permit and let us dredge that lake. Thank you. INA GREENFIELD: I'm right on the bulkheading on the mouth of the lake and I'm just concerned about how long it takes to dredge? What is the time period and when would it be done? We're directly affected. I don't know how many people are in support and are in favor of it. I understand their enjoyment of the area but how will they directly be affected as opposed to our peaceful enjoyment of the area if it's right on our backyard 12 because a lot of the people, I don't know how dose they are. (changed tape) we swim on the lake, as you can see I have a young son, and we're concerned about the traffic, and all these things affect us. If it's going to occur repeatedly over the next ten years, it's a large chunk out of our enjoyment and we're concerned also about the traffic. In fact, right now there's restricted because of the high and low tides. Obviously the Town of Southold doesn't have the means to police the area and a lot of people don't really know how to use their boats within the law, the legal limits, how to use the channel, how to go out 100'. My father was run over by a boat, swimming. So, these are issues for us and we're concerned about it and we want to see how that would be taken care of. TRUSTEE KRUP SKI: Thank you. Just a brief question to the contractor, how long would the dredging operation typically take for that job? JOE EDGAR: That situation could be as little as three to five days. As far as noise, most of the access or all of~he access would be via the water. The accuracy of this particular unit would be monitored via laser. As far as some of the problems with the roadways, there are no large cranes coming in. Everything will be handled from a barge and a remove dredge that will be deployed down the channel. The dredge could be moored as far as 100' from your property, in terms of noise or bother. As far as sensitivity to the shellfish, basically the delta we look to remove, I didn't see any sign of any activity, scallop, shellfish, or otherwise, we're only talking about bringing out the material in the canal and that delta that's blocking it. JOE BARBADO: I clam there practically once a week or every two weeks or whatever, and I have noticed the scallops coming back. I noticed the clam is starting to come back. JOE EDGAR: I also know that they rely on a higher salinity content that you're going to see if in fact that canal closes up. JOE BARBADO: Well if that parcel of land with that illegal bulkhead and ramp was removed, and go back before they built that, there would be such a flow of water coming in and going out. The amount of water coming in and going out, you wouldn't be able to walk across that canal. As of now, with that restriction there, I grant you it's a restriction, no doubt about it, and there are restrictions there because of the illegal stuffthat's been put in there. That's the problem that you people have to deal with. That's why you can't get in and get,out. Before that was put in there, there was no problem. TIPPY CASE: I live on the lake. I'm in favor of the dredging and it's basically maintenance. We've put money and time and the permit into it before, in 1990 1 believe it was, and it needs to be done again, and I ask you to give us the permit. Thank you. JENNY HARMES: I'm one of the few people who do live on the lake full time. I'm all in favor of the dredging. With all due respect to Mrs. Greenfield, if the bulkheads are in fact protecting it, why have I seen it, in last four years, drying up. The problem with the restriction and the problem with the traffic is that there is a few hours a day when all the people who live on the lake and have a right to use it, are trying to get in and out and that's what's causing the congestion. If it were more free-flowing, we wouldn't have to all wait for those few hours when we could get in. [ believe it would benefit all of us, not just me, but it would benefit everyone. That's all that we're asking you do. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: ]fi could make another point too. I had a bulkheading expert come and see the area and in response to Ken, you had mentioned that you had seen all that white sand flowing around out there and moving back and forth outside the mouth of the canal, I had originally had a groin extending about 20' beyond the lower 13 bulkheading on the beach and that has been destroyed by various ice storms and when we had that, when it was working, there was much less sand in the canal and there was much more sand on my beach. I don't know how many years, we just let it go and it had gone and broken up and I'm wondering if we were able to get that, it's just a low 20' groin gOing beyond where you see the original foundation is still there, that that in itself might prove a stabilizing factor to maintain the depth of the canal. You might want to address that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I just want to read something that's in the file here. "You probably notice each year that the canal is slowly filling in and the pond is becoming more stagnant. As evidenced my large masses of flooding seaweed...if nothing is done the pond will eventually close itself and become a stagnant smelly area with no water- life..", it goes on to say about making the lake useable and the property values and the use of boats and whatnot in the canal. If this sounds familiar, it was written February 25, 1976. So this is not a new issue down here. I think we do, this Board appreciates the concerns of everyone for the water quality in the lake. I think there's a couple of big concerns we have one of which is the integrity of the bulkheads next to it and how can that be resolved. JIM FITZGERALD: I think the only thing we can do is rely upon the testimony of experts because it would seem to me the alternative would be to dig them out and see if they're Ok. In this case, we would be destroying them in the process. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well looking back through the old file, there was mention of, conditioned on a 1987 permit, that proof of contractor's liability insurance is requested and a licensed survey showing the depths of water taken prior to the dredging. Some assurances that if any damage is done to the adjacent property that it will be repaired to the original state. IIM FITZGERALD: It would seem that any contractor doing work any place in the Town, or any place for that matter, if the person hiring him is intelligent enough, he would ensure that the contractor is responsible for damage he does to any property, whether it's dredging or putting in a septic system, or building a house, or whatever it is. It doesn't seem to me that this is an unusual case. TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: Well k is in that it's adjacent to it and our objection isn't the restoration of the water flow. That's one of our biggest concerns we have. Artie, what do you suggest here as far as assuring that someone is going to be responsible in a case that a problem does occur here due to either mechanical failure of the bulkheads due to mishandling equipment or just the fact that once this project is, say it's done perfectly done perfectly to specs, but the bulkhead couldn't take it and offit goes. TRUSTEE FOSTER: I don't know if it's our position to require it but the people hiring it should require some so~t of... TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well it is. It's in the Code. We can't allow them to do anything that would undermine... TRUSTEE FOSTER: Well require a bond. TRUSTEE KING: We have a time frame we have to worry about too. It could collapse 6 months down the road. TRUSTEE FOSTER: You can require they maintain a bond for a year, a year after the completion of the work. Somehody's going to have to pay for it so they have to write it in the contract, but that's one way of doing it 14 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is that something that would be acceptable to the applicant? JERRY CASE: Well we would have to understand the different costs but on the face of it, certainly. We want to assure the people on either side that there would be no damage done to their property. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well we've been assured that there will be no damage. TRUSTEE FOSTER: You wouldn't go buy a new car without a guarantee. TRUSTF. F. KRUPSFd: Well we have to see that in writing to protect the adjacent property owners. NEIGHBOR: I also live around the lake and I wondering if West Lake Assoc., where does this actually go around. Do I get a bill at the end of this as a resident? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You might. NEIGHBOR: Well the other thing that I just want to state is that the Assoc., as living there for 30 years myself, this problem has always occurred. The other thing, if you do dredge it, you're inviting commercial fisherman to come in and take the shellfish. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well it's not their shellfish though. It's public property. It's my opinion anyway; that by keeping the water flow open, you keep the whole area, you're basically you're maintaining the status quo and the health of the estuary there. The more you restrict the flow, and it's not a natural system, you have a bulkhead on either side and we've seen this all over Town, you put two bulkheads, you've never seen a straight channel anywhere in the world in nature. Man tries to restrict his environment to suit his needs and it never works. So, you never have a straight channel and of course, you put the bulkheads up, and it wants to fill itself in. You can see the channel doesn't run straight there now, it' s pushed to one side. You're fighting nature there and it' s going to be a constant :source of maintenance on the structures, on the dredging, on the amount of sand coming in and there are no guarantees that if this is dredged, suppose you have a storm, you might get one boating season out of it. It could fill in right away. NEIGHBOR: The lake wasn't designed for some of the boats that these people are moving in and out of that channel. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well that's a different problem but the depth of the lake is going to be the limiting factor there also, not just the depth of the channel. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: With all due respect, the commercial fisherman have a much better track record for safety when they come in, they are very careful, and they are very respectful. I worry about the other people who come in flying through, and for the record, where on the beach where my family ail swims, they do not maintain the minimum 100' from the shoreline. I'm always out there yelling my lungs out. Some of them will listen and they'll think about it and do it once and next time they're back to speeding. That's our problem. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well I can't answer to the bay. We don't have control over the speed limit out in the bay. Within Town waters we have a 5 mile an hour speed limit. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: I'm talking about the canal. Speeding directly into the canal at full gun. TRUSTF. E KRUPSKI: Well give you a toll gate too. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: But, you don't see commercial people doing that. CATHERINE BARBADO: I have in my possession here a letter addressed to Edward Brennan, the Vice President of the so-called West Lake Assoc. which is dated in 1990. I would like to know if they require all new permits for doing this thing here because it 15 says here, if you wish to make use of other permits, they can only be transferred by approval of the Town Trustees after consulting the Town Attorney. Now, the private meeting that we had where the Town Attorney addresses all these permits that were obtained, that is the reason I am requesting a review where all the members could share it. If you can't find your files, I have my files at home. I thank you again. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What is the date on that letter ma'am? JOE BARBADO: I have been hearing a lot of comments about the mosquitoes but anybody knows (can't understand) the concept of mosquitoes is hypothetical as far as I'm concerned Something else I'd like to bring to you. The Peconic Bay Estuary, were their authorities informed on this? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Which authority is that? JOE BARBADO: Peconic Bay Estuary. TRUSTEE KRESS: I don't know of any authority like that. JOE BARBADO: They are trying to protect Peconic Bay. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I thought that was our job. JOE BARBADO: We'll there are other townships that are all combined. TRUSTEE KRIYPSKI: Well we keep in touch with Southampton Trustees and the East HamPton Trustees but I don't know about any other authority besides the DEC, that wOUld have jurisdiction in Peconic Bay. JOE BARBADO: Well there is such a thing as the Peconic Bay Estuary. It's on the federal docket also to protect that. TRUSTEE KING: But it doesn't have any sort of regulatory authority of any type. It's a study of the bay. JOE BARBADO: Well I think they should be notified of what's going on because you are protruding the dredging into the bay. I thought I would bring your attention to it. TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: Well the bay is owned by NY State. JOE BARBADO: Thank you. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Another problem, well it's just a question I wouldn't say a problem, is as you come in, if your coming in from the bay into the West Lake, there's that illegal bulkhead on the left hand side, who owns that property there? JIM FITZGERALD: It's privately owned. JOE BARBADO: Nobody owns that. It belongs to the Town. JIM FITZGERALD: According to the tax map, it's privately owned by, can we look at the tax map? TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: Go ahead. JIM FITZGERALD: It's here and belongs to this piece of property and extends into here. Based on that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It would be better to see a survey because the tax map isn't always the most accurate. What the last speaker said, that illegal jetty, that old one there, and the resultant fill there, if that were removed also, besides the bar, would that increase the water flow there and make, I mean if we cOUld do something like that, if you could decrease the amount .... maybe everyone should hear this since everyone is here for this, we're talking about that illegal structure that's built on the inside of the lake as you come in on the left hand side and the spoil placed behind that, now if part of that were removed, there seems to be some kind of feeling that it would increase the flushing action which 16 would of course maintain the salinity and channel depth in there, and then the resulting fact would that it would have to be dredged less frequently. JIM FITZGERALD: I think one of the speakers indicated that before that magic bulkhead existed, everything was Ok. JOE BARBADO: It was. JIM FITZGERALD: See. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm glad we have this on tape because we would never believe it. CATHERINE BARBADO: I have four children and at the time that they were small, they would dive into the canal and the water was so deep that I as afraid that the children 6 years and under and that the depth ofthat water was over 6' if not more. In fact they fished in there. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But is that something that we should maybe explore as part of this. JIM FITZGERALD: If that's what we need to get the permit, then I would think so, yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well I mean I think it might be advantageous to everyone to do the project correctly and then you might not have to keep maintenance dredging it. You might not have to keep revisiting this and that would make me happy. JIM FITZGERALD: It's one of those things. You never know what mother nature is going to do. We have a expert testimony that before it was there, things were better. Presumably, if we were to take it out things would get better again. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well I don't think there's a guarantee that it would get better. I don't think it would get worse, but there's a possibility that they would get better. What you have there, and we never considered it when we were in the field, but now that it was mentioned, that does restrict the flow as it comes into the lake. JIM FITZGERALD: It has all that gook on it too. TRUSTF~F, KRUPSKI: It does have a lot ofgook on it which we were concerned about also. MARCELLE GREENFIELD: We originally had white sand there before that was built. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well I don't know if gook is the right word but there's something there that's on the beach that is preventing any sort of vegetative growth there. There should be a healthy marsh fringe there and there's not. There's something that's coating the beach and the rock. It looks like something was dumped there. That area was concerning us and that area is going to part of some sort of replanting after it anyway. JOE BARBADO: Replanting? You should eliminate it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well that's what we're discussing. JOE BARBADO: A normal body of water, per say gallon flowing through, and by eliminating that, instead of going around in circles, the current of water is hitting the bulkhead where Moi is at and goes out. That's what was happening prior to until they put this thing in. When they put this thing in, it changed the whole concept. You could just pull it up or they could just cut it off at the sand line. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well if you were going to go... I don't know if that would be that big a deal to pull that up. That's not the most substantial structure there. Then you could really do a better job opening that up. We would have to go out on the site and take a look at it and see how much you would want to open that up. I have a question fi.om the contractor. 17 JOE Fr)GAR: One of the things we considered on your site inspection was to remove the material that is non-conducive to vegetation. If we could excavate that, perhaps remove that bulkhead or open that area up, stabilize it with a biodegradable fiber-log which which would basically rot away within 2 to 3 years but give vegetation the ability to establish. Then you could remove the old stuff, replenish it with some of the spoil, utilize the bio-log, vegetate it, open it up in contour, that could all become part of the dredging process. It's relatively simple and it's effective. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Another thing we...well as far as the placement of the dredge spoil that hasn't been completely answered, we have on the east side, could you put any on both sides or is it limited to the east side, in your opinion? IOE EDGAR: You can put it anywhere you like. Mr. Moi was concerned until he talked to his contractor as to the affects of it and after our meeting he was welcoming whatever fill I could put there. I never had an opportunity to meet Mrs. Greenfield. I'm not sure how- she feels about sand placement in front of her place. The only reason I thought that area on the inside would be temporary source and would give you the ability to excavate the old engine block, that black material, and what you see there, and replenish it with some of the cleaner fill directly inside the canal. If it is in fact Town owned and you have the ability to. remove that structure and shape some kind of contour to widen it, it's a very simple task. TRUSTFF. KRUPSKI: That's why my question was, who owns the property. Ok, that's what we have to fred out. If it is Town owned, we can authorize that. CATHERINE BARBADO: May I address that? At one time when we were talking to Mr. (can't understand) when this so-called ramp was put in there and he received a letter from the Board of Trustees asking him to remove it. He told us that he wrote a letter back to the Trustees saying to give him the deed of the property and I will remove it. That property belongs to the original Cedar Beach Assoc. and it's just a part of the Assoc. that no longer is in there. When West Lake Assoc. was formed, I don't know what right they had to take the 50' at the other end and also the piece of land that we're talking about now. That's up to you Trustees to decide. TRUSTF~ KRUPSKI: We're going to need to see a survey on that parcel. CATHERINE BARBADO: I'd like to emphasize again, I would like you to review the meeting that we had private with the Trustees on the recommendation of the Town Board. TRUSTEE ICRUPSKI: Well what would that be in regard to? Why would we review that meeting from 19907 CATHERINE BARBADO: Because k contains information that is very relevant to this dredging, especially if they want to use the same permits. TRUSTEE tCRUPSKI: Well they don't. They're seeking new permits. CATHERINE BARBADO: They're seeking new permits? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's right. CATHERINE BARBADO: Well if they are seeking new permits I believe that you should give us time that the residents around should get together and inform themselves of this particular meeting and then come to their own conclusion as to the way it should be done. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think that's what's happening now though. CATHERINE BARBADO: Well I don't have any proof to show you. 18 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Proof of what though? So we'll make a motion to Table the application and, go ahead Ken. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: The 600 cy. How did you arrive at that number. Was it a guess? JOE EDGAR: It was an estimated guess based on profiles. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: We have a calculation sheet showing .A, .B., with numbers and a diagram. JOE EDGAR: We can't produce it. I don't know. Did you bring a survey? We can be more precise. JIM FITZGERALD: Ken, what is it that you want? TRUSTEE POLlWODA: Calculations. How many cubic yards of material. It says 600 but that could be just a guess. JIM FITZGERALD: That's on the survey. JOE EDGAR: The yardage was based on the topographical data established for the survey. TRUSTF, F, POLIWODA: Okay. That's what I wanted to see. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm going to make a motion to Table the application. I'd like the applicant to, well the applicant can if they want to, to look through the old file here, there's old insurance policies holding the Town not liable to any damages, going back to 1987, or anything you want to refer to out of the old file. We need some sort of bond posted that's going to satisfy the neighbors, as far as the integrity of their structures, during dredging and then a new plan showing an enlargement of the dredging project and replanting of the wetland fringe on the left-hand side, I guess you would call it the western side of the inside of the inlet, and removal of that old illegal bulkhead and jetty there. JOE EDGAR: I have Some information on the shoreline stabilization. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: Well familiar with them thanks. What we need to know is the final scope of the project, I mean there's quite a bit of leeway there and we want to make sure that it's going to be done correctly, as far as enlarging the project to that left side in relation to water depth there. Then you can contact Mrs. Greenfield about putting spoil up on her side if that's acceptable to her or just to have a place to put the spoil. JOE BARBADO: If the Town owns that parcel that you're referring to on the northwest comer, that includes the ramp that's interfering with it too? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That we don't know. We're going to find that out though. JOE BARBADO: I would appreciate it if that is looked into. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We will. I have a motion to Table the heating. Do I have a second? TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of WlLl,IAM PENNEY requests a Wetland Permit to raise existing garage and construct new first floor under; no change in existing footprint of structure. Raise existing shed/boathouse and construct new first floor under; no change in footprint of structure. Add covered porch 10'X 43' on concrete or concrete block foundation. Remove existing wood deck and in same footprint construct 21'X 24' full height addition to house on concrete or concrete block foundation. Add 13'X 41' 19 conservatory on concrete or concrete block foundation. Add 15'X 41' wood deck on CCA-treated wood posts. Located: 2200 Hobart Ave., Southold. SCTM#64-3-4 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to briefly comment on this application? JIM FITZGERALD: This application is exactly the same as the material that was covered in the Trustees Permit g4379 which was issued in 1995 and expired 1997. The property changed hands during that period of time and Bill Permey, the new owner, was not able to take advantage of the provisions of the permit and he would like to start doing the work. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone else who would like to speak about anything concerning this permit? (changed tape) the CAC also thought that the shed be repaked inkind or be elevated on piles. We were wondering what the purpose of elevating all of the sheds and making them into second-story buildings? JIM FITZGERALD: You mean as opposed to building on top? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No, as opposed to not doing anything, I guess. JIM FITZGERALD: Well he would like to have a two-story structure. TRUSTEE FOSTER: Above the 10' contour. Doesn't he fall under the FEMA regulations on having to raise that anyway, above mean high water? JIM FITZGERALD: No. It hasn't entered into any of the activities so far. I don't think it applies to accessory structures. TRUSTEE FOSTER: Maybe it's only the house. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: This is different, the CAC is right. JIM FITZGERALD: What is different? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well we have an approved plan from 1994 but it doesn't include raising those two garages up at all. JIM FITZGERALD: It includes adding a second-story. TRUSTEF. KRUPSKI: No, one only a gamble roof and one a dormer. Dormers added to existing garage to provide second floor storage space and the other one is a gamble roof added to existing boat house. So, we have a number of concerns, here. Mainly that the structures are basically in the wetlands and the other one is directly adjacent to it. The material from some sort of minor excavation has been already pushed in the wetlands there. We would like to see that addressed. JIM FITZGERALD: Material in the wetlands. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Now is there any proposed grading at all on site? Besides what's already been done. JIM FITZGERALD: No. I don't think there are any changes in the grade of the property as proposed. I think what he wants to do is end with two two-story accessory structures that meet the zoning requirements and are in the same footprint as the original structures. TRUSTEE FOSTER: No bathroom? JIM FITZGERAI.D: No bathroom. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: What's submitted here is not an accurate wetland line because what's shown is an existing wood bulkhead, is not a functional bulkhead. This is actually something that's fictional. This here. The wetland line actually, which we would have to have it shown on the survey, actually comes up right up against this building and almost underneath it. After one season, of course, k will be growing up right underneath it. We would like to see that corrected here. Is this actually a survey? 20 JIM FITZGERALD: No, this is a project plan. TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: So I guess we should see the wetland line depicted accurately on the survey and we don't consider this wood bulkhead functional and we wouldn't want to rely on it as a functional bulkhead, or see any fill placed behind it. JIM FITZGERALD: It was not shown what the intention of securing or reliance on it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Okay because we didn't see it and then we noticed it on the survey and we had some difficulty in finding it. Did you ever see it? JIM FITZGERALD: Yes. Well I saw it in 1994. But, it wasn't easy to find then. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I don't know what kind of, or what else he's going to construct in there, or how much demolition he's going to do beyond what's he's done, but I think we should put some hay bales up where he's working now. He had those piles of dirt which actually went into the phragmites. RUSTEE KRUPS'lCd. Now how does, well maybe I'm just missing this here, is there some sort of work plan? How does he propose to construct the first-story underneath those garages? JIM FITZGERALD: An application into the Building Dept. with plans. Would you like to see them? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well the reason we're concerned is that you can't just place it there. You have to do excavation and whatnot and move material around. JIM FITZGERALD: He's going to put it on cinder blocks. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Then you have to put a footing, excavation for a footing, I would think. TRUSTEE FOSTER: 3' below grade. TRUSTEF, KRUPSKI: We need assurances that the marsh won't be affected any more than necessary there. JIM FITZGERALD: We always have to assurances. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do you have those plans with you? JIM FITZGERALD: No I don't. Besides, they wouldn't show that anyhow. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do we have any other concerns? One of the concerns was that this was going to mm into a residence. Second-story residence. JIM FITZGERALD: How about the answer to the question is, there's not going to be a bathroom in it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yeah because we don't want to see any water put out into it or a septic system or anything like that. That would be a condition of the permit that there would be no water, running water. JIM FITZGERALD: There may be water in it now, but there will not be a bathroom. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I don't think there's water in it now. Where would it go? JIM FITZGERALD: I don't know. That stuff has been there a long time, as you can tell by what appears to be the septic tank right between those two structures and it's like 10' from the wetlands. TRUSTEEE KRUPSKI: We didn't see that. JIM FITZGERALD: It had a concrete cover. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'm glad you mentioned that. Thank you. We can condition the removal of that. JIM FITZGERALD: It may be that the septic system is serving the house. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well they show a new septic system proposed here. 21 JIM FITZGERALD: I don't know if that was installed. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But it's proposed on the plan that we received, so we assume that... JIM FITZGERALD: Well that was the plan that was submitted with the original application for both the Trustees and the DEC. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We have it stamped March 31, 2000. JIM FITZGERALD: Yes. Revised. However, the items we're talking about are those which are referred to on the map as the upland construction activities because also included in the original proposal was replacement of that other bulkhead and the building of the dock which happened. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We did notice that. Is everyone satisfied then? Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTEE FOSTER.' How do we feel about this one? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well if it's just storage and an office with no water, remove the septic, it shouldn't have any...you have two building there already, it shouldn't ... TRUSTEE FOSTER: Non-disturbance? TRUSTF~F. KRUPSKI: What I would call for, let's keep the meeting open, would be to place the accurate wetland line on the survey and to put up hay bales at it. No soil is to be brought in or re-grading of any kind, remove what is shown on here as an existing wood bulkhead, it is more of debris than...it's not functional. Remove the existing septic system on the north side of the asphalt driveway, and no disturbance on the seaward side orthe wetland side of the of the new wetland line. Hay bales at the wetland line. TRUSTEE POLlWODA: Where is the no-disturbance line? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: At the hay bales which is what it is now. How far along are you with the DEC Permit ifI may ask. JIM FITZ(3ERALD: The Permit is still valid. The original is 5 years. IRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: So now do I have a motion to go offthe public hearing? Close the public hearing? TRUSTF~ POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTF~ FOSTER: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTF~ KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to Approve the application with the following conditions: before a permit is issued, we receive a survey with an accurate wetland line drawn on it. Hay bales be placed on the new wetland line before any other work is done. What is shown as an old wood bulkhead on the north side of the property be removed. No grading is to be taking place except and no fill brought in and that the septic system on the north side of the asphalt driveway is to be removed and that no septic or water service can be used in either of the two garage, which is noted as garage/storage areas or existing shed areas. TRUSTF~ POLIWODA: Seconded. ALL AYES Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of DEBORAH POLIDORA requests a Wetland Permit to construct a fixed open walkway 4'X 100', hinged aluminum ramp 2.5'X 20', and floating dock 6'X 20'; install two 2-pile dolphins to secure floating dock. Relocate existing gazebo approx. 10' landward. Reshape the face of the bottom terrace to reduce angle, to minimize nm-offand erosion. Plant the banks with rosa rugosa, to be sheared low, seaward of a line between tree on E side to the present location of gazebo. Plant the 22 10. area between bottom of the lowest terrace and the existing spar'dna altemiflora with American beach grass. Located: 1055 Point Pleasant Rd., Mattituck. SCTM#114-1-1 TRUSTF, I~, KRUPSKI: Is there anyone who would like to speak in favor of the application? JIM FITZGERALD: Everything except the dock is what the Trustees and their inspection decided needed to be done in order to assist in the restoration of the landward side of the Polidora's property to the way it is perceived as having been. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak on behalf of this application or against it? Our concerns were two-fold on this. One, is on the dock, which...what was your comment on the dock? TRUSTEE KING: I think it should be moved to the west about 35'. JIM FITZGERALD: To the west. About how far? TRUSTEE KING: Maybe 35'. JIM FITZGERALD: Why is that? TRUSTEE KING: Because there is much less wetland there and there's a little bite that comes in there. Maybe you can get away with a shorter dock. Did you take any soundings because I didn't have a change to. JIM FITZGERALD: Not where you're talking about. There' s 3' at the end of the structure. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: Another concern we had is that these restorations plans might not match what the DEC is requiring. We think it would be better for everyone if the restoration plan that we permit and the restoration plan the DEC permits are going to match and are identical. We'd rather wait until the DEC approves their plans and we'll review that and then we can approve our plans. They can all come together as one restoration plan and then we don't want the Polidoras stuck in the middle of two different permits and so if we could Table this until next month. JIM FITZGERALD: Could we act on the dock? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We'd rather meet with you on that and move it over to a better location. JIM FITZGERALD: Do we need to meet? TRUSTEE KING: We won't have to. I'll go take soundings if you don't want to do it. JIM FITZGERALD: That would be wonderful. It's not that I don't want to do it. Do you want me there? TKUSTEE KING: Well as long as you believe my soundings, I have no problem. JIM FITZGERALD: No, fine. TRUSTEE KING: I can assure you they'll be accurate. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: ['11 make a motion to Table the application. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: Seconded. ALL AYES Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of C&D REALTY requests a Wetland Permit to construct a single-family dwelling with private well and on-site sewage disposal system. Located: 3640 Cox Neck Kd., Matttituck. SCTM#113-4-1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Would anyone here like to speak in favor of the application? JIM FITZGERALD: I know you need and want a new and better and accurate survey but unfortunately my surveyor is in Maryland and I wasn't able to bring it along. 23 11. 12. 13 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well is there any other comment on this application since we have the public hearing open? I'll make a motion to Table the public hearing until we get all of our information. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES Suffolk Environmental Consulting, Inc. on behalf of MARK MCDONALD requests a Wetland Permit to construct a single-family residence with pool and attached garage. Located: 1030 Clearview Rd., Southold. SCTM#89-3-11.3 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We're going to open this hearing. This is an application that was not staked in the field and the Board visited the site last week but it was not staked and we did not know where the applicant proposed to construct the house and if there's no comment from anyone, I'll make a motion to Table the heating on this until we have it staked. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of FRANCES E. NIELSEN requests a Wetland Permit to construct a deck, pool, patio, retaining wall, pool equipment shed, backwash, leaching pool and regrade area of pool. Located: East End Rd., Fishers Island. SCTM#5-1-8 POSTPONED AS PER THE AGENT'S REQUEST DANIEL C. MOONEY requests a Wetland Permit to construct a one-family dwelling, foundation, septic system, driveway, water well if required or hook-up to public water, retaining wall for septic system, and proposed decks. Located: 295 Rabbit Lane, East Marion. SCTMg31-71~11 DANIEL MOONEY: I think the application is fairly straight-forward. Several years ago made an application and you had given me an approval for it. This is a modification of that. It comes a little closer to Marion Lake with respect to the deck. The difficulty you have with the Health Dept. is the house itself is a little further than what it was before because there is a deck on the front of the house and you cannot place the septic system any closer than 10' from the edge of the deck. That is the reason it goes back a little bit further. The house is still 74' fxom the Lake. The deck is 59' from the lake. Other than that, it's similar to the prior plan that we had, and you had approved before and the DEC also approved it. I don't know if you have a copy of the DEC approval from 1996. If you don't, I can hand that out to you. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: ['11 look. We might have it. Is there any other comment while I'm looking? DANIEL MOONEY: Here's an extra copy. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Thank you. I have something from them in 1995. DANIEL MOONEY: I believe also that we will not have to put in a well then we will be eligible to get public water. There is public water on that street and I've written a letter to the SCWA asking to hook up. When they first had put the main in, I had signed up and paid for the tap and everything else and they came and said that you can't have it because you don't have a house on the lot yet. I explained I was getting a permit for it and they said get the permit and come back. I presume that they'll let us hook-up to public water. ~4 TRUSTEE FOSTER: They still presently have a moratorium on new construction. They' re not hooking up any new construction. DANIEL MOONEY: I know that but they'll do it for a hardship. We made our application based on that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: On this application, the CAC recommends Disapproval because of their concern with the elevated septic system. Our concern, on field inspection, was that the proximity to the Lake, we would rather see the house in line with the neighbor's houses, pulled back a little bit so everything is going to have the same affect on the Lake. DANIEL MOONEY: It's only about a 4' or 5~ difference. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think we noticed a 16' difference in the field. We measured it out. We Were all out there last week. DANIEL MOONEY: The difficulty is, with a 16' difference, you mean from the deck or the house? TRUSTEE I~OLIWODA: I recall from the plans, I was on the line, and then I went to the house, and it was in line, and there was about a 10' difference, as I recall. There was a 10' difference from where you had the line on the Lake, and then move it back 10' and you would've been in line with the other houses. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Deck to deck. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: No, the house. We try to keep the houses in line so nobody takes advantage of the view or otherwise you could ask for 20' closer to the Lake and take everyone else's view. DANIEL MOONEY: I understand that. The difficulty is that I need the room in the front because of the septic system and to have an appropriate septic system, there's going to be a wall around the septic system as well, to make sure there is no problem with pollution in case there is any flooding there. The Health Dept. requires that. You may have in your file too, from several years ago, there was at that time, also on the proposal, the difference in the house and it was (can't hear) and at that time I believe you approved it. I'll show it to you. TRUSTEE FOSTER: Is this your own lot. Your own house? DANIEL MOONEY: Yesit is. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is this it? DANIEL MOONEY: Yes. TRUSTEE KRLrp SKI: That doesn't show a deck. DANIEL MOONEY: I didn't have a deck on that plan at that time. The house you'll notice is different. It's still set back and you approved that at that time. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: 1994, well that was a different Board. This house is different you say? DANIEL MOONEY: No, this is the same house. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: If you go house to house here, I think then_you're talking about roughly the 10' that's out in front. We would like to keep them all in line. That's always been our standard practice. DANIEL MOONEY: Well suppose I cut down the deck in the front. Suppose I cut down both decks and took 6' off each one and made them 10' decks. That would give you 12'. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: Sure. DANIEL MOONEY: I'll do that. 25 14. TRUSTEE KR~SKI: Is there any other comment? Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTEE FOSTER: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to Approve the application with the condition that the distance between the finished deck and Lake be increased by 12'. Instead of showing 59' it would go to 71'. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES VINCENT & BARBARA CLAPS request a Wetland Permit to place (2) 6'X 20' floating docks parallel to property against existing bulkhead, a 30"X 10' wood ramp going down existing concrete ramp to handrail, (2) 10"X 25' pilings to support floats, (1) 4'X 5' landing platform to handrail and 100' of bulkhead. Located: 450 Snug Harbor Rd., Greenport. SCTM#35-5-33 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Would anyone here like to speak in favor of or against the application? Ken, you looked at this? TRUSTEE POLlWODA: Yeah I looked at it. He has some work to do. He has to fix up his non-turf buffer. Right now he has decking that extends, it's about a 4' wide deck that comes back on the lawn. Under it he has asphalt So, he has asphalt going up to the bulkhead with decking and he filling it with dirt. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: On top of the asphalt? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: On top of the asphalt, under the deck. He's trying to stabilize his platform walking. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: So is all of this there? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: It's a mess right now. He's doing it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: He should remove the asphalt. TRUSTEE POL~ODA: He should remove everything and have a 10' non-turf buffer. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: But he can have the decking right? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: Yeah, if he keeps his planking spaced. He has to go ½" spacing between boards. That would be fine. That's 4' and then add another 6' non-turf buffer. One float is fine. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is this a dug canal? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: Yeah, it's a dug canal but he's unfortunately in the best spot of it. He's above an area which is loaded with shetlfisE which again, the floats on top of shellfish affect our bottom land by basically killing them o~.. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: He has no floats there? TRUSTEE POLlWODA: He has nothing them. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The bulkhead is them? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: The bulkhead is there, the ramp is there, everything is there. Just no floats. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTF. F~ POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'll make a motion to Approve to place (1) 6'X 20' float, with a 10' non-buffer above the bulkhead and the asphalt should be removed. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: The 10' non-turf buffer can include the 4' walkway. 26 15. 16. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: He's got a project. He's filling over the top of the asphalt underneath. He's going to have to rip the deck up, the deck is shot. TRUSTFF, KRUPSKI: R's just going to flush right in, isn't it. So we have the removal of the asphalt and he can replace the deck, Is there a second? TRUSTEE FOSTER: Seconded. ALL AYES HENRY & SUSAN RUGGIERO requests a Wetland Permit for an existing 60' floating dock with a metal ramp and for an existing bulkhead. Located: 425 Calves Neck Rd., Southold. SCTM#63-7-29.1 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? Now we spoke to her and we reached an agreement on the pile placement and.., is that in writing anywhere. LAUREN STANDISH: Yes, there was a letter sent to Angelo Stepnoski. TRUSTFF.~KRUPSKI: Reading letter from Trustees to Angelo Stepnoski. In other words, the piles on the right.side of the dock are going to go. They're essentially gone anyway. So, I need a motion to close the Public Hearing. TRUSTF~ POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to Approve the application following the description in the letter to Mr. Stepnoski, March 22, 2000 that he may repair the dock, place the (2) 2-pile dolphins to hold the float in place, repair or replace the remaining piles on the left side of the dock, replace the ramp, repair or replace the remaining piles on the left side of the dock, replace the ramp but eliminate the piles on the right side of the dock as you look at it from the house. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES DAVID KELLERAN requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 3'X 30' seasonal dock. Located: 570 Richmond Rd. East., Southold. SCTM#135-3-6 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anyone he who would like to speak in favor of or against the application? DAVID KFJ.LERAN: I'd like to do a typical dock, catwalk, ramp and float. I'd like to start the dock at the high-tide mark. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Ken, did you look at this? TRUSTEE POL1WODA: I looked at this for a 3'X 30' seasonal dock. I didn't want to approve it but since you put in a quotation that you wanted a seasonal dock I figured no problem. Now you're coming here tonight and you're asking for a float, ramp, and the whole nine yards. That's a little different. ~ DAVID KELLERAN: It is a little different. It' s a little different because...well I'm trying to think of the different ways a dock can be. I don't really care how it is. I just want a dock. Either it can lay on the soil I was thinking of putting wheels on the bottom of it so I can drag it out one way or the other. I really don't know that much about docks. I was thinking that I could put wheels on it so I can pull it on the pick-up to take it out. It can either lay on the soil, the only way I know docks go is either on the soil or the other thing I see, when I look out from the water, there are three part docks. I don't know of any other option. 27 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well you need to show us some sort of a plan of exactly what you want though so we would be able to review this. DAVID KELLER_AN: Well if what you were think ofwas Ok., what were you visualizing. TRUSTEF, POLlWODA: 4'X 4' seasonal stick dock 3' wide, 30' long off your bulkhead and then.after your boating season, pull it out. DAVID KELLERAN: I was thinking of pulling it out to preserve the dock. What is the stick? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: 4'X 4's You can basically bang them in yourself and have pieces and in the fall (changed tape) that would be a seasonal stick dock in my mind. DAVID KELLERAN: I was looking at a model. As you look at the pond to the left, there was a dock that they pulled out. I would just copy-cat their construction. TRUSTF. F. POLIWODA: Well that's a full dock. DAVID KELLERAN: Well I want to do it simple. Actually, ifI saw what you were talking about, I can kind of half visualize it, and I'm sure it would be fine. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI; If you like, we could Approve that based on you submitting plans on what it's actually going to look like. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: 3'X 30' and pulled out by November 15. Would you be done by then? DAVID KELLERAN: Yes. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: There's another comment though. WALTER BUSH: I'm in the community with Mr. Kellernan. It's a community of none homes from Richmond Rd. East. It rum between the North Rd. and Arshamomaque Pond. The community is a summer community of nine homes one of which is Mr. Kellernan's and one is mine. I'm the only one that happens to be year-around resident and that is the reason for my presence here I'm not here to either in a positive or negative mode about this request for a dock on Mr. Kelleman's property. My main reason for being here is because my other neighbor's are either in Florida, or Massachusetts, or some other place. When the Spring comes and there's a dock there, they'll ask me what happened and so forth. So, we're all good friends and I want it to remain that way, so that's the reason for my presence. I had an opportunity to talk to Mr. Kellernan earlier this evening about some reservation I had. You already discussed here a few minutes ago about the dock structure, and my reservation is that there are none in there now and that traditionally the small boats we have tied up there now on steel pole off-shore, anchored on a line to steel pole on the shore. So, this would be a replacement of it. My reservation is I came to the Southold Trustee office and say the sketch of it yesterday and it looked like a permanent type dock and there is one such dock in the community east of Richmond Rd. East but that is out serving the East Winds Condominium of 10 units. It's a structure that expands the beach up to the upland area and there is no ability to go from one side of that dock to the other. Traditionally people of the community, Richmond East, felt free to walk along the shore and pick up scallop shells and so forth and pick up scallop shells and so forth and kids would go back and forth. It isn't what you would call a bathing beach. Sometimes that happens but it's a free travel along the shore so for may be less than ~ mile, and I'm concerned that ifa dock expands that area to the Upland area that it would leave the upland people...there are 4 waterfront homes that wouldn't be affected, the rest of the community, their chances to the pond on Richmond Rd. East, and 28 it ends in a small part, maybe 25'X 40' and there's a small ramp for launching small boats. So what would happen if permanent type docks expand that beach area, it would be a very little area to the other 5 homes in the community. As I say, I spoke to Mr. Kellernan earlier, and I feel from that conversation, that this would.be a seasonal dock that would float in the water, it would not come ashore on piers or piles or anything else, there would be free access on the beach. That is the only reason for my being here and I thank you for your time. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Could you please, if you could, answer me one brief question? The dock that you mentioned from the Condominiums, what is the name of that? East Wind? Because they should have stairs so that people can go up their dock and then down agairr WALTER BUSH: Well the floating part of it, is that what you're talking about? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI.: No the part that goes on the upland so people, like you said, walking along the Shore should be able to go up on little stairs and go across it and down again and continue on. WALTER BUSH: Well you are more or less trespassing on private property when you do that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No because when they cross that they're cutting off your riparian rights of egress along the foreshore WALTER BUSH: Could you walk under it standing up? TRUSTEE KRESS: I don't know. I haven't seen it? Could you look that up and I'll waste them a letter requesting that they put stairs there. They should have stairs. Thank you. WILLIAM MOBLEY: We have lived in this community since 1963. There are 4 houses here that have waterfront property. If we allow them to start building these ramps, where are our kids and our grandchildren going to play. They have played here for all of these years. Where will they be able to play? This high water mark listed here is not true. That water goes up to that cement. Where is he going to put this ramp and for what reason would you need a 30' ramp to tie a boat to? This community, there's a road next to that which is a community road that about 35' wide, now if all four houses here decide to put ramps in, where is this beach going to be. There will be no more beach is this goes up to that mark, the high-water mark, which .is higher than what your diagram is showing, and the ramp that they were talking about was dredged and that is a permanent structure. What he is talking about is a floating ramp, is not what you're describing, it's totally different. The other people could not be here because they do live out of State. I drove tonight an hour and a half to get here just for this meeting because I am concerned about this. I think everyone else would be concerned if they had the chance to be here. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I think we're going to take another look at this. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'd like to back up a minute and ask the applicant a question. What size boat do you have? DAVID KELLERNAN: 16' TRUSTEE POLlWODA: Would it cause any problem to have an offshore or onshore stake? DAVID KELLERNAN: No, that wouldn't cause a problem. 29 TRUSTEE POLIWODA: That is what is used throughout that creek. A lot ofbaymen use it, a lot of homeowners use it. It's just one pole out offshore and one pole inshore. Four by four. WILLIAM MOBLEY: Don't get me wrong, I mean he's a nice neighbor and all but we've been in this community for a long time. I bought this house from my mother-on- law after they passed away and I don't want to see these changes being made that's going to hurt this. area and that's what we always had was poles for our boats. It: always worked very well and we never had a problem. In fact, when they rot out, you replace them but at least you're not interfering with everybody else's use of the beach too. No one is going to be able to walk on that beach. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That's why we have the public hearing sir. TRUSTF~ FOSTER: How do you feel about the onshore/offshore pole? WILLIAM MOBLEY: That's fine. You can take it out and replace. In the winter it does come out quite often too. TRUSTEE FOSTER: It's more ora seasonal thing than a dock actually. WILLIAM t~iOBLEY: Not only that but there's 9 other bungalows there, or homes there. If everybody put a ramp in, there would be nothing left. No one could enjoy that. You wouldn'~t have access to that beach or anything which is only a small area now. But all of our kids have:grown up there through the years and I think all of the other families would be against it also. That's just my personal opinion. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Any other comment? DAVID KELLERNAN: Just two things. One is, I'mnot quite sure what the ramp is that he's speaking about. There is a cement ramp that goes down to the water. In the stick formation, stick dock, :do I have a ramp with that? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: No. DAVID KELLER2qAN: So there would be no ramp. The access where the cement ramp is that goes down, where I showed the dock on the drawing is sort of in the middle of the property because more people come down the cement ramp because it's easy access. I could move the ramp over farther away from that access point. People tend to come down and sit on the beach right in this area because it also happens to be the sandiest area. So that's one solution. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I think you would be further ahead with an onshore/offshore stake. DAVID KELLERNAN: Well this whole situation started with the onshore/offshore stake. I had one but my permit expired. I went to renew it and I guess there is a year or two waiting list. So I thought, what about a dock. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: Well you own that property directly in front don't you?' DAVID KELLERNAN: Yes I do. TRUSTF~ KRUPSKI: Getting that would not he a problem. TRUSTF~ POLIWODA: I think the problem that came up with onshore/offshore stakes in there is because shellfish revive in there. But, you own a private home on that creek. I don't see a problem with the stake. It would probably save you a $150.00 on your permit application too TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well we could put that money towards the stake. We could give you a refund. 30 DAVID KELLERNAN: So that's my original reason. I was thinking about the dock idea and now it's in my head because I couldn't have a stake. I definitely would be happy ifI could at least have a stake out of this. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well we could give you a stake tonight but the dock we can't give you tonight because there have been some real questions raised here where we'd have to go and revisit the site as a whole board next month. DAVID KELLERNAN: Could we just review what the questions are about the dock. I'm very happy about the stake. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well there's a shellfish issue. There's also the beach access issue and the actual location. DAVID KELLERNAN: I would think if there were shellfish, I would prefer to have a dock because when we actually, when.there is a stake, when you walk out to get to the boat over 10' and in water especially on shellfish, if footsteps are more than one foot apart and you Walk 10' out, that's 10 steps out, 3' below the (can't hear) on a ski boat, 3 steps out 30 steps back, 3 times a day that's a 100 steps 2 days a week, that's 200 steps, that's about a I000 steps over 6 months, that's 6000 steps more than you would be taking with a dock on top of shellfish. That's 6000 less steps. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI.: Well if you don~t want the stake tonight... DAVID KELLERNAN: Maybe you should give everybody docks instead of stakes. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I really don't think there's an affect by stepping on hard clams because one of the best hard elam beds was right in front of Gull Pond within the swimming ring for years. I bet there was probably about 50,000 steps on there. After the summer was gone and people left, we started clamming in there and that was-one of the better clam beds in all the Bay. DAVID KELLERNAN: Maybe we should propose this to Cornell TRUSTEE ICR, U~PS~: I think we'll leave that up to you. If you want to leave here tonight with a stoke and refund, or we could Table this and all go out as a Board and revisit it in May. DAVID KELLERNAN: Well, why don't you give me the stake and then I'll think about it Maybe I won't want the dock, I don't know. I have to think about it. There was a stake, and then there's no stake. Stake but no dock. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It's up to you though. DAVID 'KEIzLERNAN: Can you give me a stake and put the rest ofhotd. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Sure. You'll have to come in and see Lauren and fill out the stake application mad get you a refund check for the balance. I'll make a motion to ...it might be easier to deny this and then approve a stake. Better yet, if you could give us a letter than you're going to .withdraw this then you could get your money back instead of denying it and then you don't get your money. Then, we could approve a stake application SUbject toyou filling out the paperwork tomorrow. We can approve that. I'm trying to do this just sothe paperwork comes out the easiest for everyone. If we deny it, you don't get your money back which isn't really fair to you. DAVID KELT.F~RNAN: Yeah because I'm not sure why you would deny it. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Just so we could clear everything away to approve the' stake. DAVID KELLERNAN: But it's separate. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: No, we couldn't give you a dock and a stake on one piece of property. 31 17. DAVID KELLERNAN: Oh ok. Well whatever you think.is best. I'm kind of confused. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I'll make a motion to end the public hearing. TRUSTEE KING: So moved. TRUSTEE POLlWODA: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: What we need from you is a letter to withdraw the dock application. You can bring that in to Lauren or Charlotte tomorrow and then I need a motion to Approve a stake and pulley system. LAUREN STANDISH: He did have a stake but it was cancelled. ,Can we just reinstate that permit. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: That would be fine. t need a motion to Approve a permit for an onshore/offshore stake. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'll make that motion. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES DOUGLAS ROSE, SR. & LORRAINE ROSE request a Wetland Permit to create two (2) lawn areas via terraces (smaller than present) retained by block wails. Lawn area would be set level and have contained drainage via drywells. Located: 95 Kimberly Lane, Southold. SCTM#70-13-20.1 TRUSTEE, KRUPSKI: Is there anyone here who would like to speak in favor of the application? DOUGLAS ROSE: I was the one who put the application in. I've been visited by the Trustees, I've submitted the paperwork, basically at the suggestion of the Trustees, it's a three stage application, ifI remember correctly what you wanted, was we wanted to put the two areas of grass, which is less than the grass aiready that's presently there, with a retaining wall system and also self-contained drainage system. Also included with this permit was the eventual replacement of the existing wood bulkhead which by proof has been there since 1977 or before so it has no application before the DEC and the third part was to cream a burm which, the Town property goes along Pine Neck Rd., which is the boat ramp, and there was a chain link fence there and I have since planted natural 20' and 30' trees to give us a visual buffer as well as a privacy buffer and I needed permission to add some soil to what those trees are as bald trees and that is the third.part of the application. TRUSTlC.".F. KRUPSKI: I guess we can address that other matter after. We have no problem with this do we? Is there any other comment? Do I have a motion to close the hearing? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'll make a motion to Approve the Wetland Application. TRUSTF. F. KRUPSKI: The rest of it, is it all contained here in the application? DOUGLAS ROSE: Yes it is. TRUSTF. F. KRLrPSKI: Is there a second. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTFJF. KRUPSKI: Did you see the plans we have here for the french drain aiong your property? DOUGLAS ROSE: That was one of the discussions we had when we had the visitation? 32 18. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes. We followed-up on that. Here are the plans. Take a look at it. We haven't gotten it through the DEC yet but that's what we propose. Hopefully that will eliminate the scour in the hole here. DOUGLAS ROSE: The highway came and put some fill in there and how long it lasts, we'll see. But, this is obviously our long term solution. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes, we appreciate your cooperation on this. DOUGLAS ROSE: Not a problem. Thank you very much. JOltN A. FANELLI requests a Wetland Permit to construct a 4'X 74' fixed dock, 3'X 12' ramp and an 8'X 20' float to moor a small pleasure craft and a kayak. Located: 2227 Indian Neck Lane, Peconic. SCTM#86-5-11.4 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Anyone here like to speak in favor of the application. JOHN FANELLI: We'd like to build this little dock just to access into Richmond Creek. We have a kayak and a sunfish. I~ know you gentlemen did visit me last Wednesday butI couldn't come out and meet you. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Our basic concerns for a dock, we have a standard 6'X 20' float. It's a standard size throUghout the whole Town, and that the dock not go out further than a line drawn between your two neighbors. We aren't exactly sure of the exact length but we'll put that in the Permit and then your contractor will know that' s where it will come out to, between your two neighbors. JOHN FANELLI: The DEC already told me about the 6'X 20' instead ofthe 8'X 20'. That's fine. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I don't know if there were any other.concerns there. Do you have the DEC permit already. JOHN FANELLI: I do not. TRUSTFF, POLIWODA: What's the water depth? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It shows between 2 and 2 ½'. JOHN FANELLI: Today, Army Corp. of Engineers called and said will I be willing to put in a chocked float. In other words the float can't go all the way down. Did you ever hear of such a thing. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Yes. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: Those are good. It allows the crabs, as they migrate along the bank at night... JOHN FANELLI The water can go out of the creek and get quite low. I'll do that. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: On the original house permit there, and I can't remember the name of the original owner there... JOHN FANELLI: Sam Esposito. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: There was a non-turf placed there are the top and that protects the creek fzom lawn mn-off You sort of have like a bare area there but it's non-turf but feel free to plant in native plants there to naturalize it or landscape. MRS. FANELLI: Do we need a permit to do that? TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You wouldn't really need a permit. Give us a planting...in fact I have two planting plans I have to review later on tonight. Give us a planting plan, we don't want to see any re-grading, but you can certainly plant in native species that aren't going to require a lot of care, but it will look attractive, and keep it sheared low for your view and everything, but it will... 33 19. JOHN FANELLI: Can I put lawn on some of that and leave a buffer, let's say 30' from the top of the slope. TRUSTF, F, KRUPSKI: You're going to have to check your original permit from Esposito to see what that says. I'm not sure how restrictive we were then. JOHN FANELLI: I never saw his permk. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You can call Lauren or Charlotte and find out. JOHN FANELLI: You don't mean the envelope that's on the prints, blueprints. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: It should show on a Trustee Permit from Esposito. TRUSTEE FOSTER: There should be one from previous. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Well may be not. No, it shows 75' from the wetlands. Then make a copy of the survey and give us a planting plan as far as what you want to do there. Depending on what it looks like, we may or may not.require a permit. JOHN FANELLI: Just bring it into the office? TRUSTF, F, KI~UPSKI: lust to give you an idea of what we're...it doesn't have to be this elaborate but it can be. We would like to see no re-grading. JOHN FANELLI: It is pretty well graded akeady. , TRUSTEE KRUPsKI: But if you planted that, you d preserve the bank better. You don't want the bank to wash in. It's to your advantage to have it planted. For some reason people think non-turf buffer means you can't have any vegetation there at all. We'd rather see it planted because it helps stabilize everything. JOHN FANELLI: Okay. Thank you. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I need a motion to close the hearing. TRUSTEE POLIWODA: So moved. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE POLtWODA: I'll make a motion to Approve but with a 6'X 20' not to extend any further than the neighboring docks with stops under the float. TRUSTEE KING: Seconded. ALL AYES (No further than 4'X 74' but could be less than. No further than neighbors.) PETER & DEBORAH CONRAD request a Wetland Permit to construct a wood frame, single-family dwelling, public water, septic system and a gravel driveway. Located: 595 Albo Dr., Laurel. SCTM~126-2-11 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Is there anybody here who would tike to speak in favor of the application? DEBORAH CONRAD: I don't have anything to say unless you have questions for me. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: I just have one question. It's our policy, whenever we can, to keep the houses in line with the neighbors house, so we would like to see the house moved back to accommodate that, I'm sure if we got a measurement on that. Ok, 5'. DEBORAH CONRAD: This is what the Building Dept. said the porch had to be in line. They said I should take the average of each house and that the porch had to be in line with them. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Oh, they're pushing you back from the front. We're pushing you back from the wetlands. Do you have house plans? What's the building setback there? DF~lqORAH CONRAD: It's 40'. They said we could average the two neighbors. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: Do have to go to ZBA for this? DEBORAH CONRAD: No, not for ~/veraging the two neighbors. 34 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You're lucky this is the last one here. DEBORAH CONRAD: The neighbors that are to the west, we asked them if they could see water or anything from their house and they said "no" so we're not going to interfere with any kind of view. They said they can't see anything and they have a two-story house. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: You see, what we like is, you're next to LaRosa's? You see they have a nice buffer zone between their house and the wetlands. That' s what we're going to require there. I see you have it 25' with hay bales and silt fence on the survey. DEBORAH CONRAD: Right. That was a DEC requirement. TRUSTEE KRUPSKI: We require the same thing. You would basically put that up so your backyard would lookthe same and theirs. It would be just naturalized in the back. DEBORAH CONRAD: The whole yard can be that. ~I~m sick of raking leaves. TRUSTEEKRUPSKI: Alright, any other questions? Someone want to make a motion? TRUSTEE POLIWODA: I'll make a motion to Close the hearing. TRUSTEE K1NG: Seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE P. OLIWODA: I'll make a motion to Approve the Wetland Permit with the stipulation:that there's a 25' no-disturbance buffer as shown on the survey. TRUSTEE K1NG: Seconded.. ALL AYES V. RESOLUTIONS: Land Use on behalf of GERALD RUPP requests a Coastal Erosion Permit to construct a one-story addition to an existing single-family dwelling within an existing brick patio area. Located: 19375 SoundviewAve., Southold. SCTM#51-1-20 TRUSTEE KING moved to Approve the application. TRUSTEE POLIWODA seconded. ALL AYES Jill Doherty on behalf of NANCY & PItlL WEBER requests a Coastal Erosion Permit for a 4' high fence along the top of the bluff approx. 10' down from the bluffline. Located: 160 The Strand, East Marion. SCTM#21-5-7 TRUSTEE KRUPSKI moved to Approve the application upon TrusteeFoster'S inspection for a measurement and location, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES NICHOLAS J. & BRIGITTE DEVLIN MAZZAFERRO requests a Grandfather Permit for a floating dock. Located: 2125 Cedar Lane, East Marion. SCTM#37-4-6 TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to go back to the Regular Meeting, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES VI. MOORINGS: 35 BURKE E. LIBURT requests a mooring in Narrow River for a 16' sailboat. Access: Public. TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES KENNETIt RAAB requests a mooring in Narrow River for a 24' sailbOat. Access: Public TRUSTEE POLlWODA moved to Approve the application, TRUSTF~F. KING seconded. ALL AYES TAKAMI YAO & MARGARET SMH,OW request a mooting in Narrow River for a 19' boat. Access: Public TRUSTEE POLIWODA moved to Approve the application, TRUSTEE KING seconded. ALL AYES Meeting adjourned at 10:50 PM. Respectfully submitted by, Lauren M. Standish, Clerk Board of Town Trustees RECEIVED AND FILED BY THE SOUTHOLD TOV~N CLERK Town Clerk, Tom o~ Southold