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HomeMy WebLinkAboutZBA-05/19/1966 APPEAL BOARD MEMBERS Robert '~. Gillispie, Jr., Chairman Robert BerBen Charles GreBonis, Jr. SerBe Doyen, Jr. Fred Hulse, Jr. Southold Town Board of Appeals SOUTHOLD, L. l~, N. Y. Telephone SO 5-9660 MINUTES ~OUTHOLD TOWN BOARD OF APPEALS May 19, 1~66 A regular meeting of the Sou%hold Town Board of Appeals was held at 7:30 PM, on Thursday,. May 19~ 1966~ at the Town Office~ Main Road, Southold~ New York. There were present: Messrs. Robert W. Gillispie, Jr.~ Chairman; Fred Hulse~ Jr.~ Charles Grigonis~ Jr. Absent:Mr. Serge Doyen~ Jr., and Mr. Robert Bergen° PUBLIC P~ARING: Appeal No. 843 ~ 7:30 P.M. ~E.S.T.~ Upon application of PeterSledjeski, Main Rmad~ Orient~. New York~ for a special exception in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article X,.Section 1003A,. for permission to renew~a farm labor camp permit that was grantedMay 13, 1965. Location of property: south side Route 25 Orient, New York~ bounded north by Main east by J. B. Droskoski, south by Jo Tuthill and J. Dyer~ west by J. Tu~hill and J. Dyer. Fee paid $5.00. The Chairman opened the hearing by reading the application for a special exception~ legal notice of hearing~ affidavit attestisng to its publication in the official newspap~r~.and notice to the applicant. Southold Town Board of Appeals ~2~ May 19~ 1966 T~R CHAIN: Is there~anyone present at this time who wishes-to speak for-this application? MRS. PETER.SLEDJESKI: Ye~ I do. T~. CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone against t/~is application? (There was no response.) THE CHAIRMAN: Since there will be no changes in the camp... MRS. SLEDJESKI: There will be only four men this year- he had about six-or eight last year. CHAIRMAN: Same quarters? MRS. SLEDJESKI: Yes. After investigation and inspection the Board finds that PeterSledjeski wishes to renew a farm labor-camp permit granted ~q~;~u,~= 11, 196~. The Board finds that there will be no changes in the camp for the year of 1966. There haven't been any complaints or objections to this camp being operated. The Board feels that this camp is necessary to the operatorsince the closing of the Greenport Labor Camp which used to house a large number of laborers. The Board finds that the public convenience and welfare and justice wi~ be served and the legally established or permitted use of neighborhood property and adjoining use districts will not be permanently or substantially injured and the spirit of theOrdinance will be observed. On motion by Mr. Gillispie~ seconded by Mr. Hulse, it was P~SOLVED that PeterSledjeski~ Main~Road~ Orient~ New York~ be grante~ P~S~on&~%~renew a farm labor camp permit that was granted~~ on property 10catedsouth side Route 25,. Orient,. New York. This permit is granted forone (T)~ year. PUBIJC ~RA~ING: Appeal No. 844 - 7:40 P.M. (E.D.S.T.)~ Upon application of Southold j Summer Theater, SoundviewAvenue, Southold~ New York~ for a special exception in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance~ Article IV A~ Section 420~ Subsection 2a~ for permission to operate a place of amusement. Locationof Southold Town B6a~dof Appeals --3- May 19~1966 property: north side Soundview Avenue, Southold~ New York~ bounded north by Great Pond, east by Douglass J. Currie~ south bySoundview Avenue~ west by Florence-Kramer and Ano. Fee paid $5.00. The Chairman opened the hearing by reading the application for a-special exception~ legal notice of hearing, affidavid attesting to its publication in the official newspaper~ and notice to the applicant. The Chairman also read a statement of the plans and objectives of the Southold Summer Theater. TME CHAIRM~N: We have received a number of communications in connection with this. CThe Chairman reada letter from Mr. and Mrs. James S. Murray~ Soundview Ave.~.Kennyes Road~. Southold~ New York; a letter from F. F. Cobet~ Kenny*s Road, Southold~. New York; and telegrams from Mr. and.Mrs.-G. M, Tisdale~ Vincent F. Carnagie, and Ernest Gibson. These communications were all opposed to the summer theater at this location.) THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone here who wishes to speak for this application? MRS. BE~t%Y LYTT~: I may be out of order, but on the advice of counsel-I was advised to ask, before you.proceed~ for an adjournment. THE CHAIRMAN: On what grounds? MRS. LYTT~: We are fully aware you have met legal requirements, but the area in general is populated - or property owned by people who are only here weekends until summertime ~nd who are not fully aware of what is going on, and that they may have time to learn about it'and express their opinions, either for or against. THE CHAIRMAN: I appreciate your position. In fact~ it's happened before -- it doesn't make ~uch difference whether you schedule it at one time or another - youwon~t please everyone. So, we have always proceded on the theory that as long as we have met the legal requirements we proceed with the hearing. It's only fair to the applicant. MRS. LYTLE: We have people who live out of the area.. Southold Town Board of Appeals -4- M~y 195 1966 THE CHAIRMAN: Thatis frequently the case. I'm afraid I~ll have to deny your request. MR, TOM PEPP: I think we should straighten this thing out tonight. .. THE CHAI~: That's the purpose of the hearing. I have asked before both/you spoke to hear from anyone for? of Ml%. BAR~Y-~MALLiN: (Southold ~ummer Theater.) It is my understanding that the site we are planning to use-was originally used as a restaurant and an inn a number of years ago so that this would not be the first ~ime this property would be used in this fashion. It received a non-conformkng zoning permit pre- viously. We are'planning to operate three nights a week - this would be for an adult audience of 200 people - it is my belief that-an audience of this size and of adults would not create a disturbance in the area. What the theater will give to Southold far outweighs any problems that may result~ from cars coming into the area. I think that Southold is a growing area - I think it's an ~rea that more and more people are coming to know - more and more summer people are recognizing the appeal of the area and feel it*s a godd place for the summer~ and I think a theater here would provide permanent residents and summerresidents with a place to go for the evening - where we can present good theater. We are a group of young people. My wife used to spend summers=in.Southold. We know the area and a lot of the people here. We are bringing in a director who teaches in a high school~onLong Island. He has worked with 'young people - He will provide the theater with outstanding plays. We are starting the first year.on a modest level. We are fully aware of our responsibilities in operating a project.of this sort,~ and for these reasons I feel that Southold will gain from the benefits of a theater and the people and residents here will be able to simply enjoy themselves for an evening's'entertainment. MR. BIT~ SCREA~TZ: Concerning the noise problem$~ I think certainly during the show with the people in the theater it doesh~t constitute a tremendous amount of noise - the theater is sufficiently isolated - quite far from the nearest house. It'sLset back quite far from the road and our performance only lasts'about two and a half hours - a parking attendant will direct the cars out - we don~t anticipate a gn~eat problem. People come to the theater in large groups - it may be 50 cars. Southold To~n B6~rd of Appeals -5- ~ay 19~ 1966 MR..SAM ZAP:Our intention is not to push ourselves upon the community. We®re only here attempting to start the theater. People thinkvery~highly of this idea - I'm only sorry that these people are not here this evening. We have evidence on the other side and I would be tempted to be disappointedw but I knowthat people not here this evening - that the response is one of recommendation. THE CHA~: Would you care to go into more detail? As to how many people? MR. MA~.LIN: Mjr.~Albertson, and I spoke to Bob Witherspoon, Mr. Lefine~ Mr. Rothmann - these are some of the people that we have contacted and spoken to about thetheater and we have written letters to the Chairman of the Chamber of Commerce, Mr. Hulse, and we go by a very enthusiastic le~r from him - thought it w~s a fine idea. MR. ZAP:.People from the North Fork Community Theater have given complete support. They have asked us to speak before their next production... · HE CHAIRMAn: Are you gentlemen summer residents of the area? MI{. MAT.?,IN: My wife as a child used to spend her summers here. Not at the moment we are not. MR. PEPP: Are these folks asking for a permit of non- conformity or a change of zone? THE CHAIPJEAN: Where the district is zoned business~ the Board of Appeals may grant a special exception permitting activities which are primarily concerned with amusement - that -would include several things. Prior use of this property - it was a bar and restaurant principally before zoning~ I believe. The use~ I believe~ w~s zoned non-conforming at the time of the Ordinance. When the Town was zoned originally~ the various uses that appeared business were made into business areas... M~. PEPP: If this property hasn't been used for two years, it reve2ts back-to residential property. THE CHAIRMAN: The non-conforming use expires - I believe this property~ras zoned "B" so it would not expire. ~General discussion followed as to whether or not this property were zoned business or not.) Southold Town Board of Appeals May 19t 1966 TMR, CHAIRM~N: Anyone to speak for? MR. HULSE: I have a-question. Do you plan on serving re- freshme~ts~ MR. MALT.IN: Soft drinks - Coke. MR. HULSE: No liquor license? MR. MALLIN: No. THE CHAIRMAN: Anyone else for? Anyone present who wishes to speak against this application?- MRS. LYTLE: I speak also for Mr. Tisdale and Mro Cobet. The area~immediately around the property in question is resi- dential and the top-class waterfront p~operty, top tax rate. If there is any hardship to be considered, it is a hardship on the people living in that area - the road is not~uilt for heavy traffic, too hilly~ too bumpy. We will have a policing problem as wellas traffic. The parking of the cars is something one never expects to find in a residentialarea when you buy property in a residential area. The people right across the way are going to have continual traffic. The very fact that these people are ~not here to speak or not aware of itt shows that they come out here to get away from a lot of activity. We are looking for peace and quiet and have paid top prices and top taxes for it. Your greatest problem will be the traffic on that road.and your problem with the police. There are also many questions in our mind as to just how this theater is going to be run. There are statements made here tonight, yet there are prepared statements that are entirely different than have been made here. If you want to make it a matter of record~ I will submit a brochure which I hold which talks about an "outdoor" theater and the building is for living purposes, so you must meet certain ordinance requirements for living, and a theater outdoors anywhere in that lake area X - anyone isgoing to hear a performance whether they want to or not. The brochure says four nights a week. One of the last things we want in a nice residential area where people pay high taxes is the loss of quiet. The building, I admit, was in its time used verynicely for'a restaurant, but it has gone downhill just from non-use and if this theater comes inand, unfortunately, does not make a success - what will be our problem at the end of the first season? The people are not going to have privacy. I think the Southold To~n Board of Appeals -7- May.19~: 1966 biggest thing is still the traffic which will bring in the accident problem. THE CHA~: Anything else~ ~irs. Lytel? This brochure you mentioned was published by the applicant? MRS. LTTT~: Yes~ it is. Their announcement was in the paper prior to.the hearing. It may be all perfectly all right~ but people in the area feel a little uneasy as to what might happen. X ~HE CHAIRMAN: Would you suppose that that is the real question in the minds of the people you represent? The type of activity? MR. LYTr~: A theater'at all. ~ CHJk~: Is there anyone else who wishes to speak against? MR. PEPP: About two years ago Dan Smith applied for a zoning of land he owned on the other?side of Great Pond. He was turned down because he.as told that there would be too much traffic off Kenny's Road. If there was too much traffic on Kenny~s Road~ this Soundview Avenue would certainly be a death trap. MR. DAN SMITH: We applied for a rezoning for anultiple residence. We were turned down because the people came here and said there would be a lot of traffic. We were turned down on a multiple residence and I think it unfair that we were turned down and then let someone have a business in the same area. T~M, CHAIRMAn: The chief reason was traffic? MR. SMITH: Right. THE CHAIRMAN: Anyone else? Mi{. AL VONH~SSEL: I'm just openly opposed to anything other than residential in this area.= (The question ~as brought up by Mr. Yon Hassel as to who the C"Mr. Hulse" referred to~M. Fir; Mallin was. He was assured that it was not the same Mr. Hulse presently serving on the Board of A~peals.) Southold Town Board of Appeals -8- 1 May 19, 1966 The question w~s raised by Mrs. John Buck as to what would take place there on the other four nights when the theater was not in operation. Mr. Mllin assured~the meeting that the cast would rehearse and live off the premises and that no youth activities would be held in the buildingS' on the nights when there were no shows. THE CHA~: kuyone else to speak against? reply. ) In the interest of clarification and in order to be somewhat constructive, does anyone recall where some of the other summer theaters are located? (Replies indicated that all summer theaters seemed to be in more ~usiness-ltype areas than the one proposed.) May we give an opporltunity to the applicants to answer questions ~hat may have beenasked here? MI{. MALLIN: On the question of the brochure. This was writtenlabout eight or nine months ago. Since that time we have obtained a director and spoken to him about using a theater and he thought it would be best to go indoors and he would be presenting people he has worked with from Long Island and many of the things in the brochure are outdated. We said four nights-- it~will be three nights. TMM. CHAI~:Does that answer your question? MRS. LYTLE: Why did you plan and put money in something and not even know if you were going to get permission to do it? It raises a peculiar question in my mind. Mi{. MALLIN: Lights and seats are being donated to us. We will not pay salaries. (Mr. Mallin explained that with an operation such as thisXkthey would have had to go ahead and make plans because they could not wait until the last minute to set everything up.) MR~.~LYTLE: ~Mrs. Lytle showed the Board a clipping from SNewsday" of the previous day announcing the opening of a summer theater inSouthold.) "Newsday" was not happy about being called on it. ~. MALLIN: I apologize if I gave them that prematurely. In talking to different people in the Town they told us that ~t~ey had no control over the Board of Appeals as far as your decision on these various things .... $outhold Town Board of~Appea!s -9- May 19, 1966 THE CHAIRMAN: You gave "Newsday"'a release? Mi{o. MALLIN: That is true. We felt we had to create enthusiasm for the theater in order'to develop an audience. When we spoke to various individuals in Southold we met only with enthusiastic-response and this is'why we went'ahead~' and it comes as a great, surprise that there is opposition to the theater. THE, CHAIRMAN: It surprises me that a law student would jump the gun and announce the theater. M~. ZAP: I think the three of us are a little unfamiliar with the workings of local government. We apologize if we - we didn't mean for this to come out in this man~er. We didn't realize that this was going against the wishes of the Board. THE CHAIRMAN: It just happens we are charged with the job of determining v~riances and exceptions to the Zoning .Ordinance which has been passed and which is sometimes enforced. The best enforcement, perhaps, is whether or not something is granted in the first place. That's~why we're here tonight. M~. MALLIN: May I say anything about the traffic problem? I think there may be some misunderstandings about the amount of traffic. There will be 50 or 60 cars coming in an hour before the show and the same amount leaving between 11:00 and 12:00. This is not at the time people come to the beach amd we will have attendants seeing that the cars are properly ledout of the parking area. THE CHAIRMAN: I don't think that is the concern - what happens before and after they get there. Mi{. MALLIN: These people will be adults who are respon- sible citimens. This is not a honky-tonk bar - no liquor will be served on the premises. People who are mindful of their responsibilities - not a lot of young people. THE CHAIRMAN: ~Read "Free acting for children" from the brochure.) What is the explanation of that? MR. MALLIN: That would be carried on during the day, sort of a part time day camp if any youngsters in the area were interested in participating in drama classes and working on a S~outhold Town Board of Appeals -10- May 19~ 1966 play - we wou~d have people working with them. MR. ZAP: This would be only a community service. We would only do~it if the community ~ranted it. We're trying to make the point that we want to be as helpful as we can. THE CHA~: What is your previous experience with this type of operation? Where? What success have you had? M~. MALLIN: We don't have any direct experience ourselves. We have obtained a director who has operated theaters himself. He has had production experience - acting experience. He is the one that is guiding us in this project. CHAIRMAN: Where would your r~hearsals occur? MR. MALLIN: He would use his school. He brings his people together on the Island. THE CHAIRMAN: Is this a reperatory group? MR. MALLIN: Yes. People with full time jobs on Long Island such as~teachers, radio people, etc. THE C~AIRMAN: It is a group that has operated in the past? MR. MALLIN: He has used the~e people in other projects. THE CHAIRMAN: You plan to serve no meals? MR. MALLIN: No. THE CHAIRMAN: What happens to the money? MR. MALLIN: Most of the money will be going for operating expenses. Atlthe end of the summer we will be giving the Reiter's a percentage for rent~ the director will get a percentage and the rest of the money will be going into publicilty, royalties, etc. THE CHAIRMAN: How many on the Board of Directors? MR. MALLIN: Five. The money goes to the cast if the~e is any left. THE CHAIRMAN: Open end percentages? Southeld Town Bo~d .or,Appeals -11- May 19, i966 MR. MALLIN: 10% to Reiter, 10% to the director, and the rest to expenses. If we are successful we would take in a gross of $16,000 for the summer. From $2.25 to $3.25 a ticket. THE CHAIN: Anyone else? MRS. LYTLE: We would like to say one more thing. If you should vote favorably on their application, we would ask that you grant the variance or permit~ or whatever you lmay call it, for one season only and you will be in a position to know for sure, if you have granted it, whether it is detrimental and you will be in a position to withdraw it. THE CHAIRMA/~: There is one other point - I don't know whether you have considered it - the question of signs. I presume you would w~nt a number of directional signs. (Mr. Mallin agreed with this.) Anything else? (The traffic problem discussed again at length.) THE. CHAIRMAN: The problem of noise - will these be musicals? MR. MAiSLIN: No, dramas. Just voices - no loud music. THE CHAIRMAN: Any other questions? If not, we will close the hearing and the Board will consider.. MP~.LYTLE: You will not consider a continuance? THE CHAIRMAN: Actually a public hearing is'a place where you solicit info£mation and not opinions. I think we have a 100% representation of opinion against this project and to postpone further consideration inorder to give others a chance to speak wouldlsimply augment what we have. No one here is against summer theaters per se - you are against it because of other reasons. I believe that sums it up. MRS. JOHN BUCK: Would the value of the property be affected? THE CHAIRMAN: I believe it would. My own opinion is that a suzL~Ler theater would be desirable but this is the wrong place for it. However, we'll go into more detail before making a decision. The other~embers of the Board may not feel the same way. The meeting is now closed. Southold Town Board of Appeals -12- May 19, 1966 The following residents from the Soundview Avenue-Kenny's Road area appeare~ before the Board in opposition to the summer theater in this location for the reasons previously stated - traffic hazaz~ds~ noise, residential area. They had no objection to a su~er theater in Southold - just not in this area. M~. TO$ PEPP M/kS. HAZEL PEPP MRS o_ELEANOR SHRIEFER MRS. JOHN BUCK JOHN BUCK ROBERT FF~THERSTON-HAUGH BITTER Telegrams were also received fromM/%. A~THUR BROWN~ and MI{. VINCENT SARDI in opposition to the theater in this location. After investigation and inspection the Board finds that the area is unsuitable for a summer theater. It is the Board's belief that the establishment of a theater in this loc~Lion such aswas described would inevitably change the character of the neighborhood during the summer months. Too, that the traffic problem which is already severe in the area during this time of the year will be considerably increased and a real danger exists of traffic accidents caused by an unusual flow of ~raffic during the evening. Neither Kenny's Road nor Soundview Avenue have any street lights in this vicinity. Prox.imity to a summer camp argues against this location for a summer theater. There is also a Town Beach several hundred yards away whichis in constant use during the summer months. On motion by Mr. Gillispie~ seconded by'Mr. Hulse~ it was RESOLVED that Southold Summer Theater be denied a special exception to operate a summer theater in the building known as Lake Lodge ~n property located on the north side of Soundview Avenue, Southold~ New York, bounded north by Great Pond~ east by Douglass J. Currie, south by Soundview Avenue~ west by Florence Kramer and Ano. Vote of the Board: Ayes: - Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Hulse, Mr. Grigonis. Mr. and Mrs. Stuart Anderson, 22 Sea Cliff Avenue, Sea Cliff, New York, appeared informally before the Board to submit an application for a special exception and to ask advice as to what steps were necessary. They were advised that there would be a notice in the local pap. er and they would receive a copy of that notice 1 and should appear at the time of the hearing. Southold Town Board of A~pealsl =13- 1 May 19~ 1966 On motion by. Mr. Gillispie~ seconded by Mr. Hulse, it was RESOLVED that the Southold Town Board of Appeals set 7:30 PM, CE.D.S.T.), Thursday, June 2, 1966, at the Town Office~ Main Road, Southold~. New York, as the time and place of hearing upon applica- tion ~X of Miriam and Stuart P. Anderson, 22 Sea'Cliff Avenue~ Sea Cliff, New York, for a special exception in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 300, Subsection 5a, for permission to convert a building into a two family dwelling. LocatiOn of property: west side Bay Avenue, East Marion, New York,' bounded north by Novak, east by Bay Avenue, south by Thiel~ west by Washburn. Vote of the Board: Ayes: - Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Hulse, Mr. Grigonis. On motion by Mr. Gillispie~ seconded by Mr. Grigonis~ it was RESOLVED that the SoUthold Town Board of Appeals set 7:45 PM, (E.d.S.T.), Thursday, ~une 2, 1966, at the JTown Office, Main Road, Southold, New York, as the time and place of hearing upon application of A. A. Cooke, Nassau Point Road, Cutchogue~ New York~ for a variance in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 300k subsection 6, for permission to locate an accessory building in the front yard area. Location of property: east side of a private right of lway off the south side of Nassau Point Road, lot no~ south ½ of 82, all of lot No. 82A and 82B in the Nassau Point Club Properties, Inc., Cutchogue~ New York. Vote of the Board: Ayes: - Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Hulses Mr. Grigonis. On motion by Mr. Gillispie~ seconded by Mr. Hulse~ it was RESOLVED that the Southold Town Board of Appeals set 8:00 PM, ~E.D.S.T.~ Thursday, June 2, 1966, at the Town Offices Main Roads Southolds New York& as the time and place of hearing upon applica- tion of John Drossos~ Main Roads Greenport, New York, for a special exception in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article IV, Section 408, subs~ion ~ for pe£mission to erect a wall sign. Location of property: North side Main Road, Arshamomaque, New York~ bounded north by John Rempe, east by Long Island Lighting Co., south by'Main Road, west by A. Drossos. Southold Town Board of Appeals -14- May 19t 1966 Vote of the Board: ALyes: - Fir. Gillispie, Mr. Hulse~ Mr. Grigonis. On motion by Mr. Gillispie, seconded by'Mr. Hulse, it was RESOLVED that the Southold Town Board .of Appeals set~z~ ~ 8:~0 PM (E.D.S.T.), Thursdayt~ June 2,' 1966, at the Town Office~ Main Road~ Southold~ New York, as the time and place of hearing upon application of Lilli N. Woersdoerfer~ Main Road~ East Marion~ New York~ for a variance in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 300, Subsection 1~ for permission to expand a non-conforming use. Location.of property: not-th side~lMain Road, East Marion, New York, bounded nort~ by Dzenkowski, east by A. Malanauskis, south byMain Road, west by A. Dzenkowski. Vote of the Board: Ayes: - Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Hulse~ Mr. Grigonis. The next meeting of the Southold Town Board of Appeals will be held on Thursday~ February 10~ 1966, at 7:30 PM at the Town Office, Main Road, So~thold~ New York. The meeting was adjourned at 10:30 P.M. Respectfully submitted, Janet G. McLean, Actlng Secretary Southold Town Board of Appeals