HomeMy WebLinkAboutZBA-09/28/1967Sou Town Board eals
$OUTHOLD, L. I., N.
Telephone SO 5-£6d0
APPEAL BOARD
MEMBERS
Robert x,~. Giilispi¢, Jr., Chairmen
Robert BerBen
Charles Grcgonis, Jr.
SerBe Doyen, .Jr.
Fred Hulse, Jr.
'~ ~I-N U T E S
SOUTHOLD .T~WN'B~%RD OF APPEALS
September 28, 1967
A regular meeting of the Southold Town Board of
Appeals was held at the Town Clerk's Office, Main Road,
Southold, New York, on Thursday, September 28, 1967, at
7:30 P.M.
There were present: Messrs: RobertW. Gillispie, Jr.,
Chairman; Robert Bergen, Fred Hu~se, Jr., Charles Grigonis,
Jr., Serge Doyen, Jr.
PUB$~C HEARING: Appeal No. 1138 - 7:30 P.M.(E,D.S.T.),
Upon application of Richard Menzer, 38-70 50th Street,
Woodside, New York, for recognition of.access in accordance
with the State of New York Town'Law, Section 280A. Location
of property: west side Right of Way, west side North Bayview
Road, Southold, New York, bounded north by Nelson, east by
right of way, south by McDavid, west by Goose-Bay Est.
Fee paid $5.00.
The Chairman opened the hearing by reading the application
for recognition of access, legal~notice of hearing, affidavit
attesting to its publication in the official newspaper, and
notice to the applicant.
Southold Town Board of Appeals -2-
September 28, 1967
The survey of the property in question was viewed and
briefly discussed by the Board.
RENSSELAER G. TERRY,.JR.,ESQ.: I checked on a deed that
I picked up in the area from here to here. It was a deed by
Rosenburg, and I believe this parcel runs along land now or
formerly of Rosenburg. He must have had some sore of right of
way over this to give him access of this road, as well as this
one.
THE CHAIRMAN: I asked Mr. Rosenburg tonight about 7 o'clock.
He said there is access to this property~from either direction.
The right of way extends in the deeds from South. Bayview Road.
You can get to that property'from either direction.
RENSSELAER G. TERRY,JR.,ESQ.: The objection is to close
this road off here and to keep it a private road. It would
appear to me that Mr. Kosenburg has a right of way here.
THE CHAIRMAN: I have a letter.here that I will read.
"Mr. Robert~W. Gitlispie, ~r., Chairman,Board of Zoning
Appeals, Town of Southold, Town Clerk's Office, Southold,
New Yo~k 11971.
"Re: Application of Richard Menzer for recognition of access
Town Law, Section 280A, Application No. 1138.
"Dear Mr. Gillispie:
'"The captioned application for recognition of access covers
premises bounded north by Nelson, east by a right of way, south
by McDavid and west by Goose Bay-Estates, and is the westerly
one-half of property formerly owned~byDembrowski, consisting of
the subject property and lots 42-46, map of Goose Bay~Estates.
I unders~ nd that access to the parcel was heretofore had over, the
GOose Bay Estates roads, since the parcels were formerly in signle
owne~hip prior to being dividedbyMr. H. Menzer.
"Two private rights of way leading from the area cf the
subject premises are involved. One is a 20 foot private right
of way-running from the lands of Schumacher in a northeasterly
direction to the North Road to Bayview; th~ other is a 30 foot
private right of way running from the lands of Schumacher and
Nelson. in a southerly direction to North Bayview Road. Examination
~ 'the ~uvjegtapPl~cation indicates a lack of clairty as to whether
ne app±~can~ is seeEing access over both of~the aforesaid rights-
of way or over only one, and if so~ which one.
' Southold Town Bo~d of Appeals -3-
~-September 28, 1967
"I represent the property owners abutting the 20 foot
private right of way running in a northeasterly direction from
the lands of SchumaCher to the North Road to Bayview; these
people are in the process of p~rchasing the underlying fee title
to said right of way. A cursory examination of the deeds into
applicant a~d his predecessors in title (Dembrowski Estate to
H. Menzer~ Aiber 5065, cp. 151; H. Menzer to H. Menzer, Liber
5094, cp. 85; H. Menzer to R. Menzer, Liber 5167, cp. 313) indi~
cares that the grantees and the present applicant have no right-
of way whatever. However, a detailed title search might
indicate to the contrary. Such a title search is presentlyunder
way in connection with the acquisition by'my clients of the 20
foor-~ight of way above mentioned.
"If the current application for recognition of access is
over the 30 foot right of way south to North Bayview Road~ the
application is of no concern to my people. If, however, such
application is for access over the 20 foot right of way north-
easterly to the North Road to Bayview, objection is made'only to
the extentthat the current application fails to show the
existence of a right.of way by grant over the road in question.
If the applicant in fact has such an easement, of course there
can be no objection to his using such access.
"Accordingly~ the person involved in the 20 foot right of
way~ Witten, Price, Laymon, Warren, Trautman, Loesges, Espten~
Solomon, Primich, Runion, Mallgraf, Irimescu, Schweitzer, McNeilly,
and Wekmeister request that the Board require record proof of
a right of way by grant over the road in question, if the~ 20
foot right of way is the one involved. Alternatively, the Board
might wish to delay action on this matte~or a short period of
time until the title search above referred to is a~ailable to
resolve the question.
"Very truly yours, /s/ Joseph J. Snellenburg II
"cc: South Goos Creek Property Owners".
RENSSELAER G. TERR¥~.JR.,ESQ.: His clien~own property on
both sides and seek to close~f this. They don"t want it to
become a traveled through-fare. /
THE CHAIRMAN: He apparently'represents the South Goose
Creek Property Owners. He is sending a copy of this letter
to them. That about states the situation here. I have a copy
of the deed here, between Harry Menzer and Ellen Menzer and
Richard Menzer and Kathleen Menzer, the a~icants in this
variance application. Are you familiaz eith this deed Mr. Terry?
Southold Town Board of Appeals
-4-
September 28, 1967
way.
RENNS~.?~ER G. TERRY, JR. ,ESQe: Yes, ~ am.
THE CHAIRMAN: There is nothing in the deed about a right of
RENSELAER G.~ER~Y,. JRJ,ESQ.: No there isn't. The deed to
the applicant describes thel~d as running along land now or
formerly'of Rosenburg. If you would like me to speak in favor
of the application I shall do so.
THE CHAIRMAN: Do.you represent the applicant?
RENNSELAER G. TERRY, JR.,ESQ.: Yes. I would like to
call you attention to the fact that on the second page of the
deed it states together with pertinent and estate rights of the
party of the first part. I will tell you as a matter of law
when a man buyes real property he automatically has access to
a public highway, even if you make no mention of the right of ~-
way. He has access by necessity.
THE CHAIRMAN: If the former owner has or had right,of way.
You can't give him right of way over something you don't own.
RENNSELAER G. TERRY, JR.,ESQ.: Yes. Butthe people who
originally sold it had access to it.
THE CHAIRMAN: Who did Harry Menzer buy the property from?
RENNSELAER G. TERRY~ JR.,ESQ.: I think from'Dembrowski.
I think that~Dembrowski go it from Rosenburg or from the same
grantor as Rosenburg. I say as a matter of law, any property
or any lot in here has access by necessity. I believe they
have access over both roads without it being in the deed.
MR. HULSE: You are applying for access over which road?
RENNSEI~%ER G. TERRY, JR.,ESQ,: We are applying for access
over both roads.
THE CHAIRMAN: These roads are rough.
RENNSELAER G. TERR~.: Yes, they are.
Southold Town Board of Appeals -5-
September 28, 1967
RENSSELAER G. TERRY, JR.,ESQ.: I also have an abstract of
a deed I picked up that he sold to another party and granted
access of this right of way in both directions.
MR. HULSE: Where is it in relation to this parcel?
RENSSELAER G. TERRY,JR.,ESQ.: I don't know exactly.
THE CHAIRMAN: I think we can dispense with this and grant
access in a southerly direction providing they have the right to
use it.
(The tax map of the area was presented to the Board. The
parcel of property in question and other parcels in the immediate
area were discussed.)
TPNECHAIRMAN: Is there anyone else present who wishes to
speak f~this applicatinn?
(There was no response.)
THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone presentwho ~ishes to speak
against this application?
(There was no response. )
After investigation and inspection the Board finds that
the applicant requests permission for an approval of access.
The Board grants this application as applied for, subject to
the determination of the rightof the applicant to the zight
of way'running in the northeasterly direction on a 20 foot
right of way to North Ba!~view Road. It is the Board's under-
standing from Mr. Herbert'Rosenburg, who originally owned this
property, the original grantor gave right of way in both directions,
northeasterly and southerly from the property that Mr. Rosenburg
owned. Howe~er, the northeasterly access is presently being
subjected to a title search and final approval on that will
await result of the title search. In the-maantime this access
shall be made passable to emergency vehicles up to a width of
15 feett and subject to the final approval of the Southold
Town Building Inspector.
Southold Town Board of Appeals
-6-
September 28, 1967
The'Board finds that~strict application of the Ordinance
will produce practical difficulties or unnecessary hardship;
the hardship created is unique and would not be ~hared by ali
properties alike in the immediate vicinity of this property
and in the same use district; and the v~riance does observe
the spirit of the Ordinance and will not change the character
of the district.
On motion by Mr. Gillispie, seconded by Mr. Bergen, it was
RESOLVED Richard Menzer, 30-70 50th Street, Woodside,
New York, be granted recognition of access on pxpertylocated on
the west side Right of Way, west side North Bay~iew Road,-Southold,
New York, subject to the conditions pointed out above.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:- Fir. Gillispie, Mr. Bergen, Mr.
Hulse, Mr. Grigonis, Mr. Doyen.
PUBLIC HEARING: Appeal No. 1139 - 7:40 P.M.(E~D.S.T.), Upon
application of'Edna A. Brown, Main Road, East'Ma~ion, New York~
a/c Helen Hildergarde ~awkins~ 2807 SpanglerLane, Bowie, Md.,
for a variance in accdrdance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article
III, Section 303~ Article X, Section 1000A, for penmission to
divide premises with insufficient-frontage and ~rea in either lot.
Location of property: south side Main Road, East Marion, New York,
bounded north by Main Road, east by Arthur'Limouze,Est., south by
Bay~ ~st by Michele Monz. Fee l~id $5.00
The~Chairman opened the,hearing by reading the application
for a variance, legal notice of hearing, affidavit, attesting to
its publication in the official newspaper, and notice tothe
applicant.
THE CHAIRMAN: There was a hearing on this property October 11,
1962, Appeal No. 519, in which Edna A. Brown applied for the
approximately the same thing that is being applied for here. Toninght
the property division is differmnt. The findings of the Board
at that time were:
"After investigation and inspection the'Board finds that the
applicant has not produced any evidence to support a hardship.~r
practical difficulty.
Southold Town Board of Appeals -7-
September 28, 1967
"She proposes to cut off approximately 4700 square feet
with a' r~d frontage of 14 feet and~spose of the ~alance of
the parcel.
"The applicant's situation is not unique and to cut off
a lot with 14 feet frontage would change the charcter of the
neighborhood."
There is also a letter there from H. Hildergarde Hawkins
to Edna A. Brown.
That is about the back ground on this. At this time is
there anyone present-who wishes to speak in favor of th~s
application?
EDNA A. BROWN: I dm.
THE CPL~IRMAN: Does the application state it all? Do you
have anything to add?
EDNA A. BROW%~: I think you have everything there.
~R. HULSE: What are the size of the lots?
THE CHAIRMAN: About 11,000 square feet.
MR. HULSE: 11,000 square feet each?
THE CHAIRMAN: They are pie-shaped lots. Does M_rs. Ha~kins
use the main house'~Y~ herself?
EDNA A. BROWN: She uses the little house and rents the main
house. When her mother died she willed the whole thing to her.
THE CHAIRMAS~: How long ago was that?
EDNA A. BROWN: About six or seven years ago.
THE CHAI~qAN: When was the bulkh~ding done?
EDNA A. BROWN: About 1960 or 61.
THE CHAIRMAN: Ail the way across the property?
EDKAA. BROWN: Yes.
/-7
Southold Town Board of APpeals -8- September 28, 1967
THE CHAIRMAN: What was that other building on the road.
EDNA A. BROWN: That is a garage.
THE CHAIRMAN: The garage has been there a long time?
~DHA A. BROWN: Yes.
THE CHAIRMAN: Didn't we talk about~ this about a year ago.
I suggested trying to get a piece of prgperty from' Limouze est.
EDNA A. BROWN: We ha~e tried that~and tried to get a pie-
shaped pe~ce from~onz. We can't get anything from either one.
The ~.imouze property is tied up in the estate.
THE CHAIRMAN: There is no way to enlarge the property.
Limouze doesn't have too much property.
EDNA A. BROWN: He has enough for another lot, but he wants
to keep it.
T~E CHAIRMAN: The Limouze property, the one we just spoke
aboutt what does she use it for?
EDNA A. BROWN: She uses it for a private beach.
THE CHAIRMAN: There was reference made to the guest house.
Were you talking about the Mal/a~ Inn?
EDNA A. BROWN: Yes.
THE. CHAIRMAN: I understand there is a water problem at the
Mall~f~Inn. What is the water situation there?
EDNA A. BROWN: They have good water.
~ CHAIRMAN: When ~e made the decision in 1962 we did not
have a water survey.
MR. BERGEN: How~arge is that bungalow?
EDNA A. BROWN: One bedroom, kitchen, bath, living roo~ .....
~R. BERGEN: }Iow does this come in under the housing code?
EDNA A. BROWN: I don't know that much about the housing code.
Southold Town Board of Appeals -9-
September 28, 1967
(The proposed Housing Code for the Town of Southold
was briefly discussed.)
EDN~ A. BROWN: Down on Bay Avenue, a parcel was divided
into two and they have less than the required square footage.
THE CHAIRMAN: You mean total area?
EDNA A. BROWN: Yes.
MR. BERGEN: If you divide that up you have two small parcel~.
What are you going to do abo~t that small parcel, it is not large
enough to build a dwelling on w~thout a variance.
EDNA A. BROWN: The houses are close together.
MR. HULSE: That's true.
MR. BERGEN: The lot is 85 feet~ on the water according to
this map.
EDNA A. BROWN: They are 85 feet on the road.
MR. HU~$E: You are not going to end up with any more than
what you have now. The problem is in the future when someone
eventually buys this property. I don't know if you can tie it
down.
( A division of property that took place on Bay Avenue
in East Marion was again discussed. This was a division of
property that was started prior to the enactment of the Zoning
Ordinance.)
MR. HULSE: Why don't we reserve decision on this and we
can check it out.
THE CHAIRMAN: What would you want to check out? The side
lines or what?
MR. HULSE: We can talk about that later.
Southold Town Board of Appeals
-10-
September 28, 1967
On motion byMr. Hulse, seconded byMr. Srigonis, it was
RESOLVED that~the decision be reserved on Appeal no. 1139,
upon application or'Edna A. Brown, East Marion, New York, a/c
Helen Hildergarde Hawkins, 2807 Sprangler Lane, Bowie, Md.
Vote of the Board: - Ayes:- Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Bergen, Mr.
Hulse~ Mr. Grigonis, Mr. Doyen.
PUBLIC HEARING: Appeal No. 1140 - 8:00 P.M.(E.D.S.T.), Upon
application ofRobert S. Pascale, Rabbit~Lane~East Marion, New
York, for a variance in accordance with the Zoninq Ordinance,
Article III, Section 303, Article X, Section 1000A, for permission
to divide property and construct two dwellings with insufficient
frontage andarea. Location of property: Rabbit Lane off east
side Bay Avenue, East Marion, New Yor~, bounded north by Rabbit
Lane, east by V.M. Gray, south by Gardiners Bay, west by Reichart.
Fee paid $5.00.
The Chairman opened the hearing by reading the application
for a variance, legal notice of hearing, affidavit~attesting to
its publication in the official newspaper, and notice to the
applicant.
MR. BERGEN: Do they plan to have their own water?
STANI~Y'CORWIN,ESQ.: I am not sure that they want to.
There is no city water. They may have a common water supply.
THE CHAIRMAN: The way I figure the area t~e is about 19,250
square feet. That would be less than 10,000 square feet for each
lot.
Is There anyone present who wishes to speak for this
application?
STANLRY CORWIN,ESQ.: We are here and urge the Board to
grant this application on the grounds this is a strictly
summer colony. In ~w order to have open competition he
Wants-to get a couple of buildings on 55 foot lots. It is an
economic necessity.
Southold Town Board of Appeals
-11-
September 28, 1967
THE CHAIRMAN: You argue it is an economic necessity. He
bought this lot in 1967.
STANLEY OORWIN,ESQ.: He and a second partner bough% several
parcels in there and divided it up.
MR. BERGEN: Our place is to not keep these places going,
but to overcome 'them. I don't see why we should divide that
up to have two small l~ts. We have to stop somewhere.
STANIEY~CORW~N,ESQ.: You are in an area where it is suitable
to this type of use for single dwelling use.
THE CHAIRMAN: We don't grant variances just because it is
only used in the summer.
STANLEY CORWIN,ESQ.: If any one wantsto go down there
and build a new house, knowing what the conditions are, he is
going there with his eyes opened, then he should have his head
examined.
THE CHAIRMAN: This is contrary to everything we have learne~
along the baywhere our biggest water problem seems to be. In
the study that has been made it indicates there are density
problems along the bay. This area is about as dense as any place
on the bay that I know of.
STANLEYCORWIN,ESQ.: There would be no violation of the
Ordinance to grant a variance for what is already there. The
Board is not to make the policy for the Town in an application
of this particular nature. There is some reason for making
a variance for allowing situations that are effective and here.
MR. BERGEN: This man has a lot that is big enough to
buildlone house one, and he wants to divide it. Why should
be divide this when it is denied to everybody else?
STANLEY CORWIN,ESQ.: Because you don't have this type of
situation up by the Main Road.
THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone else who wishes to speak for
this application?
(There was no response.)
THE CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone present who wishes to speak
against this application?
(There was no response.)
Southold Town'Board of Appeals -~- September 28, 1967
THE CHAIRMAN: I would have to speak against this because
of the water in the~area~ and because of the density. Across the
street from this area in the application are dwellings 10 feet
apart. One of~the agruments is this is a summer colony. The
experience of the Board has been, wherever people buy summer
homes they tend to want to convert them for all year around use,
with drainage on the water supply.
STANLEY CORW~N,ESQ.: I dOn't think that anyone would make
a sizeable investment in a home in this area.
THE CHAIRMAN: I would have to agree.
STAI~Y-COR~IN,ESQ.: This Board need not be concerned with
water problems and sewage problems. That is a matter for the
health department.
THE CHAIRMAN: If you want to stick to the zoning aspect of
it, density would also apply to summer population. We have
situations where people have put alot of money in houses that
are not in especially good locations. A man who buys a peice of
property and aware of the Ordinance and then want s ~z~w to
separate it, this is a self imposed hardship.
STANLEY CORWIN,ESQ: You should take into consideration the
neighboring uses.
THE CHAIRMAN: I agree with the one family ~welling. That
would not change the character of the area, but this lot is
large enought for"one house and he wants to put two houses on
it. This is a self imposed hardship.
Is There anything further on this application?
(There was no response.)
After investigation and inspection the Board finds that
the applicant requests permission to divide propertywith
insufficient frontage and area on both lots; and erect a dwelling
on each lot. The Board denies this application because of
Article III, Section 353, Article X,.Section 1000A of the Building
Zone Ordinance, which governs the size and area of a lot. The
Board finds the circumstances involved here are a self imposed
hardship. The lot in question is just~bout large enough for one
lot, and it would be in violation of the spirit and intent of
the Ordinance to divide this property'~ ..... in order to
make two undersized lots with dwellings thereon. The Board
also points out there is a lack of fresh water supply in this
immediate area.
Southold Town Board of Appeals -13-
September 28, 1967
The Board finds that strict application of the Ordinance
will not produce practical difficulties or unnecessary hardship;
the hardship created is not unique and would be sb~red by'all
properties alike in the immediate vicinity of this prgperty
and in the same use district; and the variance does~serve the
spirit of the Ordinance and will not change the character of
of the district.
On motion by Mr. Gillispie, seconded bY M_r. Bergen, it was
RESOLVED Robert S. Pascale, Rabbit Lane~ East'Marion, New
York, be DENTRD permission to divide property with insufficient
frontage and area and construct two dwellings thereon, on property
located on north side Rabbit' Lane, East Marion, New York.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:- Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Bergen, Mr.
Hulse, Mr. Grigonis, Mr. Doyen.
STAbILEY'CORWIN,ESQ.: Would you have the record indicate
that the Board waives any irregularity in the description in
the publication ?
THE (Iq'AIRMAN: Yes.
On motinn by Mr. Gillispie, seconded by M_r. Bergen, it was
RESO~ED that the Southold Town Board of Appeals set 7:30
P.~4.(E.D.S.T.), Thursday, October 11, 1967, at-the ~own Office,
Main Road, Southold, New York, as the time and place of hearing
upon application of George Bauer, Southold, New York, a/c Herman
Poerschke, North Road, Arshamomaque, New York~ for a variance in
accordance with the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 300,
Subsection 6, for permission to locate a private detached garage
in the front yard area. Location of property: north side North
Road, Arshamomaque, New York, lot number 17 in Subdivision of
Young & Goodale, bounded north by Long Island Sound, east by
land now or formerly'of Cunningham, southby North Road, west by
land now or formerly of Nissenfeld.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:- ALL
Southold Town Board of Appeals
-14-
September 28, 1967
On motion by Mr. Gillispie, seconded by Mr, Grigonis, i t was
RESOLVED that the Southold town Board of Appeals set 7:45
P~M.(E.D.S.T.), Thursday, October 11, 1967, at the Town Office,
Main Road, Southold, New York, as the time and place ofhearing
upon application of Gunter Morchel, Marratooka Road, Mattituck,
New York, for a variance in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance
Article IV, Section 404, for permission to construct a business
building with insufficient setback from Sigsbee Road, Location of
property: Old Main Road and Sigsbee Road, Laurel, New York, lot
number 102 in Mattituck Park Properties Subdivision.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:-
On motion by Mr. Hulse, seconded by Mr. Doyen, it was
RESOLVED thatthe Southold Town Board of Appeals set 8:00
P.M. (E.D.S.T.), Thursday, October 11, 1967, at the Town Office,
Main Road, Southold, New York, as the time'and place of hearing
upon application of~Norman Reity, Mattituck, New York, a/c the
residents of "Shore Acres" Mattituck, New York, for a speical
exception in accordance with theLZoning Ordinance~ Article II$,
Section 300, Subsection 10, for permission to erect and maintain
an identification sign on the property of Agnes D. McGunnigle.
Location of property: north east side BayviewRoad and Mill Roa~
Mattituck, New York, bounded north by'M. Chudiak, east by Shores
Acres, south by Ba~yview Road, west-by Mill Road.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:- ALL
On motion by Mr. Bergen, secondedby'bir. Grigonis~. it was
RESOLVED that~the Southold ToWn Board of Appeals
P.M.(E~D.S.T.), Thursday, October 11, 1967, at the Town
Main Road, Southold, New York, as the time and place of hearing
upon application of Anna S. Edwards, .HEdge Street, Fishers Island,
New York, for a variance in accordance with the Zoning Ordinance,
Article III, Section 300, Subsection 6, for permission to locate
a privatd detached garage in the front yard area; and for
recognition of access in accordance with the state of the New
York Town Law, Section 280A. Location of property: private right
of way, Fishers Island, new York, boundednorth by West Harbor,
eastby Hurlburt, south by private Right of Way, west byBurr.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:-
Sonthold Town Board or'Appeals -15-
September 28, 1967
On motion by'Fir. Gillispie, seconded by'Mr. Hulse, ~ was
RESOLVED that the minutes of the Southold Town Board of
Appeals dated September 14, 1967, be approved as submitted.
Vote of the Board: Ayes:- Mr. Gillispie, Mr. Bergen, Mr.
Hulse, Mr. Grigonis, Mr. Doyen.
The next regular meeting of'the SoUtholdTown Board of
Appeals will be held at 7:90 P.M~'~Wednesday, October.il, 1967,
at the Town Office, Main Road, Southold, New York,
The meeting was adjourned at 9:15 P.-M~
Respectfully submitted,
Barbara C. Dittmann, Secretary
Southold Town Board of Appeals