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Home My WebLink AboutZBA-06/22/2004 Hearing TONN OF SOUTHOLD ZONING BOARD OF APPE.AT,S COUNTY OF SUFFOLK : STAT~ OF NEW YORK 5 T O W N C, F S O U T H 0 L D 6 7. Z O N i N G B O A R D O F A P P E ~' L S.~ 8 Sou~h©ld Town Hall 10 5309b Main Roa~ Sou~hold, New York 11 oune 22, 2004 12 9:30 a.m. 13 Board Mes~ers Present , 14 RUTH OLIVA, Chairwoman 1E VINCENT ORLANDO, Vice Chairman 16 LYDIA TORTOP~A, Board Member 17 GEP3t~D P. GOEHRINGER, Boar~ Member 18 OffiCES DINIZIO, Board HemLer 19 LINDA KOWALSKI, Beard SecreEarl~ 2O 21 ! AUG ~ 2 2004 COIIRT REPORTING AND TPc~I~SCRIPTiON SERVICE ,:631) 878-8047 2 1 2 CHAIP}IOMAN OLIVA: TRe first hearing is ._.... Debra VicEoroff. is Ehere anvhoc{y here to 3 represent Miss Vicuoroff? [~ove to adjourn for 4 I See minutes for resolution.'~ CHAIRWOM}=N OLIVA: Our second Rearirlg is 5 Steve Axelrod and Sandra Schpoent, and we have received a ieEter asking for a wiuherawal of ~neir 6 applicaEion. I'd like to maF_e a resolution accepting their withdrawal ef their application. 7 ,See minuEes for resolueion_~ 8 CHAIRWO~.C~ 0LF~A: Is there anyone here nna~ is for the Saunters' application on 9 Pranklir~ville Road? O~herwise iE's going Eo he reschecinled for 11:05. 10 Our nexE hearing is the VanBergens on }{orEon Avenue. Tt~ey just need two fronU yards; is 11 there someone here who wo~lO li~e to speak tcunis application? Yes, ma' am. 12 NS. i?ANBERGP~N: I'm Jeans~e VanBergen, swner ef the properEy and I made the 13 applicar_ion. ,2HAIP_WOM}2,~ OL%VA: WhaE are !?ou proposing 14 to do? HS. VAi~BERGEN: Proposing Eo add an 15 addition to kited of extend my living space. It's 120 square foo~, ere of Ehe rooms o~1 Ehe end of 16 the house is omly half the widEh of Ehe hoese. i'd just like to take that ~he fell width of the 17 house. ,2HA~RWOM~2} OLIVR: Square it off? 15 ~.{S. VA3~BEN GEN: Yes. CHAIRWOMielN OLI~?A: Alld '~ou have Ewo front 19 ,~erds so you're raEher confined in what yen can do. 2,3 MS. V/~NBERGEN: Yes_ It's Ilonconforming to the 3b foot sea. backs. 21 C}{AIR~qO[,LA~[ OLIVA: hr. Orlando, do yen P~ave any questions? 22 BOARD ~.IEMBER ORL~i.~DO: The house is a sne snor~' house; will the addiuion be a single story? 23 PIS. VANBEt{GEN: 'l?he addinior~ is going to conform to the existing roof line. 2% BOARD MEMBER ORL.~I~DO: The exisuing tic,ge line? 2b MS. V2-t[BENGEN: Yes. EO~P.D MEMi~ER ORLANDO: No outer questions_ dune 22, 200% 3 1 2 CHAIRWO~,~2~ OLIVA: H~Ss Tortora? BOARD HEMBER TORTORA: 'Phis is a 10'9~ Dy 3 !2 feo~ addition? ~vlS. VANBERGEN: Yes. 4 BOARD ?4EMBER TORTORA: i don'~ ha~e any quesnions _ 5 CHAIRW0~L~2~ 0LIVA: Jim? BOARD ME~BER DINIZIO: No_ 6 C}L~IRWOHAN OLIVA: Jerry? BOARD MEMBER GOEHRII,IGER: No. 7 C}~%IRWO[':Lni'~ OLiVA: Does anybody in the audience have any questions on this application? 8 if not, I'll make a motion to close ~he hearing and reserve ciecision until laEer. 9 ~See minuses for resolution.? 10 CtiAIP_WOMA2[ OLIYA: Our next applicaEion is for David and Jane Starweod on Sun Lane 11 concerr~ing an as-buil~ deck addition at less than 75 feet from the bulkhead. 12 PP_. STAPWOOD: I'm Mr_ SEarwood. CHAIRWOI~tAi,[ OLIVA: H_~z understanding is 13 tn~t you're just trying te replace ute deck Ehat's alreaOy ~t~ere? 1% HR. STAPP~OOD: Ne. The deck was helle bl; the previous owner and they were misinformed er 15 scmeuhing and thought uhat the deck dien't need a ,SO if it wasn't a%tached to the house. When I 16 lookeO into i~2, I found it needed more %hen a CO, i~ neeOed a variance because ir. was close to Ehe 17 bulkhead. Though I den'5 intend to change ~_he deck at all, I jus5 want even5uelly te gee a CO 18 fsr i~ and have it legal. CHA I RWC,MA2'.I OLIYA: Jerry? 19 BOARD HEMBER GOEHRINGER: N[r_ S~arwood, uculd lou just go o.~er with me Ehe size of khe 20 .iecF_, because I ha;e to wr~e this decision. The dec~T pro5rucies out from tt~e ilOllse wha5 depsh 21 approximately? How far does it ge out toward Ute bulkhead? 22 MR. STAPWOOD: Fifteen feet I believe. BOARD ~'IENi~ER GOEHRINGER: ~tow far zs it 2i across? NR_ STA_RWC, OD: TwenEv feet. 24 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRiNGER: iE shell remain open, you na.-e ne intonations of enclosing it? 2~ NR. STARWOOD: No. ~OARD MEMBER GOEHRiNGER: You ha~,~e no June 22, 2004 1 2 objeceion ~e a restriction ~ha~ it remai~ open ~he sky? 3 ~R. STARWOOD: No, I don't_ CHAIRNOMAN ~ 4 BO~_D ~{EMB~:R ORLA2~DO: ~'lhen did p~rchase this house, sir? S HR. ST~_WOOD: Going on fi?e 5e~rs now, nhe deck was bniiE ~bout Ee~% years ago. 6 BOARD NIENBER ORLf~i~DC.: And ~he lawyers ,ii.~n'~_ pick up with Ehe CO? 7 MR. STARWOOD: The~ picked up about the CO, h. uu apparently there was a biu of cer~fusion. 8 The,2 thought all i needed w~s a CO, and it wasn'~ un,il i got in~o Ehe paperwork ~tau I saw that it c, also needs ~ variance. 10 BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: He questions_ H~IRN%P 22[ OLIVA: Jim} 11 BOARD HE~BER DINIZIO: No quesuions_ CHAIRWONAi,[ OLIVA: is hkere anybody in 12 uhe audie~ce who wishes ~o speak for or against this applic~uion? Hearing none, I ~,~euld like 13 m~ke a metLon uo close the hearing and reseP.'e decision ~..~nuil later_ 14 ,'See minu~es for resolution_ ~ 15 C[tAIRNO~U~i,70LIVA: Hext application is for ['~lr. I,louro~N~s on Central Avenue in I.IaEEiLuck, 16 end he wants te puE ~ little porch en his - de s-2. u have ~he affidaviE for the receipEs? 17 [,IR. NOUROUNAS: Yes ~.h~nding* . CH=~IR~'[C~IAN OLIVA: Thank ~ou_ 18 HO. KOWALSKI: Did you hand in the cerEified receipts tee? 19 PIR. ~{OUROUNAS: I have ~hose. CHAiR~[OPLm}I OLIVA: It' s my understanding 20 tha~ you really just wane te pu~ a percii on Ehat little niche on the house? 21 MR_ HOURO~AS: EP~ecEl=~. ,~M~IR%bNglY OLIVA: Nhich ~,,;ill puE you a 22 liuule closer Eo ~he fronU lo~ line thaz~ you wem-e and a liE~le bit furEher ill fron~ Ehen ~our oEher 23 neighbors I believe,~orI~ ~=cE7. [,~R. [4OURO~AS: Correc~ _ ,~H=.IRNOPU~I OLIVA: Hr. Goehringer? BOAI. D [~{EMBER GOEHP_INGEP.: This is ar~ 2B enoiosed porch; is Ehat correcn? PIR. I.IC, UR~S: Just hmve a roof_ June 22, 2004 1 2 BOARD ME~4BER GOEHRINGER: Roof but open on nhe - 3 HR. NOUROUNAS~ Open oR ~he sides all around. 4 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGEP.: I ha.~ e no questions. S CHA i R~ON~2~ OLIVA: Vincent? NR_ ORLI~i,~DO: This was an afEertheugl~u 6 after the construction star~e~? MR. MOUROIINAS: Yes. ~ecause wRae 7 P~appened was when we went for t~e original permit, ~.he t~euse was suppose0, to Ye squared off, if ¥o~ 8 look. a~ ~he house. Then ~hey said we couidn'~ do it, then nhe arcnicecn decideO ~o drop it back, 9 {~hen we kind of switched our plan and said new abou~ we ~rl~ ~e apply for a variance and kind of 10 raake it a lithle differen~ in that area just [~ake nhe house look square, pu~ a porch on 11 outsi de. CHAIRWO±~Ai,] OLIVA: Give more 12 architecUural detail? RR. MOUROBI,IAS: Exactly. 13 BOARD ME[,[SER ORLANDO: The house wesn'e supposed to be logged en aN angle, you're sailing 14 original 1_~? IdR. MC, UROIINAS: The house, i-ou can' u ~ell lb from ~he s~ree~, I tRink ~here's pictures_ BOARD MEH~ER ORL_~2.[DO: It gives Ehe 16 illusion iu's parallel Eo the street_ ~{R. HOUROUNAS: ThaE' s what it ~oes. The 17 prspert? line sits back I thir~ 12 feet and then Ehe other side tRere's eight fee~, EhaE's wry Ehe 18 house loo~s li~e it's sideways for some reason. ~OA~D MEMBER TORTORA: The survel~ ysu had, 19 is ~.haL an updahed surve_~? P[R. HOUROUtIAS: Yes . 20 ~OARD MEMBER TORTORA: The width of Ehe house is five feet? 21 MR. HOUROUNAS: Prom the house ~o Ehe end of nhe porch woule be five feet exactly. 22 BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: You're requesting a so,back, according ~o your plans, the BuilOing 23 E, epartmen~ sa:'s plus, minus 30 feeh so you're requesting 29'6"? 2% NR ~4OUROIINAS: E×ac~ly. BOARD ME~dBER TORTORA: N'o further 2S questions. ,2HA I P3'~ON~.N O~iVA: Jim? June 22, 200% 6 1 2 BOARD HEMBE~ DINIZIO: ~.s questions. ,2HAIRWO~{ OLI'~A: Is there anybody in 3 uhe audience that wishes uo speak for er against this applicanion? If non, ~e }~ou have any ether 4 remarks ~o make to ns? BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Ne. S CH~IRWO},L~N C, LiI/A: Then I'll make a mouion ao close the hearing ann reserve decision 6 until later. ,See minutes for resoluuion.~ CHAIRWO[~2{ OLIVA: The next hearing is 8 Bryan Villan~i and Inger Boyajian. This is for Ehe property eR Bay Avenue in East Marion thee you 9 ~ish ~o cover 75 percent of the lot with a Oeck a~di~ion? 10 MS. MOORE: Here they are, I was looking for mi' green car~s thaE ca~e in_ 11 ,2HAIRWO[{~{ OLIi~A: 10:00 a.m. I'd like to .open ~e nearing for Bryan Villanti on Bay Pzenue 12 in E~s~ Marion, Pat? ~S. MOORE: Yes_ Good morning, this is a 13 very unusual case in ~haE we have a Suilding permit for the renovation ef the house. This 14 been a long process. The prior owner s~arted the process aR~ my clienE, wne~ he purchased the lb preper~y, continued the process_ The house was damage{ during one of the severe winter Oc~cber 16 s~orms and at ~ha~ time ~he decking was dalnaged, an{ it was known tha~ we were going to need ~o 17 repair it, replace it. As we got t~rougn the permit process, the DEC stated uo us than we 18 needed to do certain work that had been required, which was gahien, it described -- iE required mesh 1.9 PVC gabion strnctures all under the decking tha5 was 5here_ Ail Ehis work had ~o be done prior te 20 ~he rene,-ahion ef ~he house_ Because un,er uhe F£I.'L% regulations 5he gambian walls, the bulkhead, 21 ha~ uo be in place uo protect ute surucEure and t~ere were helical screws that ~ere put under Ehe 22 n,s~se in order to men5 the PEr,LA guidelines for the heighE of the firsE floor ele?etions. 23 So all this work was done, i5 was time consuming, very expensive and we finally goE 2% the poin~ where we could submit the building permit application. We submiuue~ uhe Duildin~ 2b permi~ application and ~he Building Department said because we had 5o remove 5he deck uo do all June 22, 200~ 7 1 2 ~he underlying str~lctural supports for ~Ne house nhat we had lost the right te have the deck there. 3 i don't believe that's an accurate reading of what the code requires_ When yet make a repair % to ~he house and you h~ve to ta~e ou~ ~he part of the structure te make that repair, it's no~ an 5 intention to eliminate the s~ructure_ It's for the o~ner structural alterations, You sometimes 6 neeO to move things around, move them out of ~he wa/, and it was obvious ~o the Building / Department, to everyone who ~nows ~his propers/ ~hat the decR was there, a~d there were multiple B pictures in ~he file of ~he deck and ~he ccnditions of the deck, which, obviously haO been 9 iamaged b~' the s~orms. Nhau my client has given te me, which I 10 would like te put on the record, is a 1992 aerial photograph and ute property is I'll put an 11 arrow to ~he ~orUh on t~e back - on the far top righu is the end of Bay ~zenue, that is the house, 12 and ~ou can clearly see the deck ~hat was ~here in 1992, and was t~ere in various states as time went 13 cn and the permit process got longer and longer, ~he condition ef ute deck and the cen~i~ien sf U~e 14 house .continued to deteriorate right ~ere next to %he water. Se we ultimately had to come before lb this Board bu~ just for ~he variance for t~e replacement ef the deck. 16 As you probably saw from your inspection, this house is somewhat elevated_ The structure ef 17 the gabion and t~e sand that goes as the underlsimg support ef the structure is tesigned 1% wi~h Oecking on ~op to pu~ a cap essentiall,~ on che gaOion and the sand. Se it's a full 19 inuegrated structure, and net he have a deck on top of it undermines the rest of U}~e structural 20 design. V~nat I have also for 5-our file is section 21 SA, wnic}l is a ,~ertical/horizoncal drawing of the underlying strucUure. This is what the DEC and 22 the Trus~ees approved, the gabion baskets with the PVC and iG says rebuilt {ack en Gap. So I nave 23 these two documents for you i. nandi~g) . Here's the cross-secsion so that you can point ou~. Here's 24 the arrow in the fron~. CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: i'm familiar. 2S [,IS. ~{OORE: Ne have also a phot©grapn right across ~he boat ramp, are all the June 22, 2004 8 1 2 properties, the wauerfrone properties nhau are developed along Lhis corridor, and uhey are ali 3 similarl/ designed winh the bulkhead to pfc, nosE nhe house and with decking on top, and we have the 4 neighbor righE directly ecross from ~he boat rsmp directly across from us, which kas the same S structure with fencing across in for privacI. Here's a phonograph of that. 6 It was very frustrating to have to be here for nhis variance given the hard work than we nook 7 no gee the house renovated_ My clien~ did not ask to increase ~he size of nhe house ~o try to avoid 8 ~he delay factor of getting variances for the renovation of the house. He's Oeen doin.~l this 9 work on his own, as a ,SC for himself so the work ~rogress is slow. As you can see, there's been a 10 tremendous amou~lt of work done to the house but -~ou don't see iE because it's not aesnhe~ic yet; 11 it's ali underl;.ing supports and structures. The desk is kind ef the final pieoe of this 12 renovaE ior~. If !?ou have questions, we'll Er~ ~c 13 address ~hem. CHAIRWOPIKi? OLIVA: Pat we just had one 1% ,question, which map is the official map? Ne h~ve several here_ 15 piS. HSDRE The surve5 i?ou're ~alking ab s,~n ? ~HAIP. NOLILiI C)LIVA: ~es. There' s one from !0 '22"02, ttlan shows the deck, bun nhere's one 17 from '04, but thee doesn't have the deck. NS. MOOP~E: i have here uhe proposed 18 gab%ohs, which is 01.03,,'03. NS. KOWALSKi: I,[e have a later ,one uhan 19 ~haE thee deesn'u shew ~he deck_ Wt~ich one should we be using? 20 HS'. HOOi~E: They're all the same survey_ They jose show different aspects of 21 sonsEructicn. MS. KONALSKI: Which one is the eno winh 22 ~he deck, [','lurch 3, 2003? MS_ HOORE: The decking is going to the 23 gabion structure and ~o the wood bulkhead, I ~hink ~ 3..',s~, ~ha~ one has ehe gabions installed at tPzan 2% ~oint and ~he wood bulkhead. So now we know what the wood structure's going to be on top. 2S BOARD MEN~ER TOR'fORA: Ma'am, Chairman, I don'n [~a~e a survey shewing nhe deck. ~une 22, 2004 9 1 2 MS. MOORE: Ne're sorry for ~he confusion. Ne just wanned to s~ew i?eu ~ha~ ~he B deck was ~here before the gabier~s wen~ in. When ehe gabions we'nt i~, eSviously %he deck had te be 4 removed. BOARD [,[EHBER TORTORA: The ~urvey LhaE is 5 dazed 1998, is this zhe survey that i~ou ,~euld like us te put in the record as te what you are 6 propos lng? MS_ ±~OORE: "~l~. This one sho,~,~s the wood ,? deck on ~op. Wood deck wiuh wa.~e atteneation gabions, which has the decking on ~ep of the 8 gabior~s_ This one would be probabli? the easiest eo use in writing a decision. 9 BC,ARD HEHBER TORTORA: i guess Rhe real question b~ere is, is Ehis map with the deck, ~he 10 exac~ deck that you are proposing? HS_ i~OORE: it has the exisning plus the 11 proposed. At thaE ~ime, the existing plus ~he new ieck as tt~e teE~l deck_ So, yes, that is tP~e one 12 chat reflects ,,,~here ~he end of the deck is going ~o go, which is on top of all the existing 13 sLrucL~re _ [.{S. KON.~hSKI: Wha~ abou~ on the sides? 1% MS_ MOORE: AE Ehe sides i~ was already ~here. I believe Ehe deck{ng was shown en that iS survey as existing. It's replacing what was already nhere. 16 NfS. KOWALSKI: Talking about the March 3, 20,,2,3 survey, correct? 17 MS. ,~ORE The March 3, 2003 is ~e one thaE hes ~he proposed gabion. The Harch 3, 20,33 18 t~as the proposed gabions, ~hen the 6,.11'03 l~as the revis!ed neEes and ultima~ell- tt~e 19 "snow cover," is the one where ~he bulkheads and Yhe gabions nave been ins~lled. 20 [,iS. KOWALSKI: }_nd the 2004 doesn'~ change ~he deck? 21 NS_ MOORE: None .of them change the deck_ The deck is always on ~op of ~hat s~ruc~ure. 22 BOARD [~IEMBER GOEHRIN,SEP_: ~{ew b~g is the deck? 23 NS. NOORE: it covers ~o the propar~y i~ne. This property is ertl!? a 30 by 75.86, so :k~ 24 gees, it's certainly l0 feet in ,,,;i.i~h, Ehe deck, beca~se iu goes around Ehe house; then it's jusr~ 2~ shsr~ of the length of the propert5~ because ~he wood bulkhead was setback Ehree, four feet from June 22, 2,D0~ 10 1 2 ins original position. So the original deck was actually te the bulkhead that was originally 3 there, which was four feet seaward of Ehe existing ku£khead. 4 BOARD MEMBER GOE~RINGER: So the deck is actuall~, en ~ep ef the gabion? 5 ,2HAIP_WOM£-i,~ OLIVA: Yes. the gabien's what's holding ~he house and the deck in_ 6 BOARD NIEMBER GOE~RINGE~: i'm confuseO besause if we have a notice of disapproval which 7 reeds lot coverage of 76 perceE~u, and if you filled in that {eck, you've got to be in 90 8 percent. I4S. MOORE: I ~idn't ie Ehe calculaEien, 9 he did. BOY~E, MEMBER GOEHRINGER: You' ;e ge~ to be 10 90 percent, there's onl/ eno little part an~ that portion in uhe ~ack that's out of 11 MS. MOORE: He may have exclude{ the house from Ehe lot coverage. 12 MS. KOWA~SKI: Who is he? HS. MOORE: I ~hink Damon wrote 13 tecisien. BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: Hay I, Ma'am 14 Chairman? CHAIRWOM2~I OLIVA: You may. lb BOARD HEMMER TORTORA: ORe, I'd like to see a breakdown of the io~ coverage, certified 16 hreakiown of the lot coverage_ MS. MOORE: From the survey©r? 17 BO£~tD HEMSER TORTORA: ~es. with the dec~. Two, fou mentioned before t~at the Cock is 18 similar u.s. cubers in the neighSorhoed, your a.ijsining properti~ owners. The square footage of 19 Ehis lot is 2,2~9 square feet. HS_ HOC, RE: 2,299, 20 BOARD MEHBER TORTOPsl: You are seeking multiple variances to maximize this lot; we ha,~e 21. never approve~ lot coverage of 76 percent. ~4S_ P4OORE: That's wh~' this is unique. 22 It real£y doesn't require a ?ariance. it's a replacemenu. There was no intention -- ~ad the 23 Building InspecEor honored the discussions thaE we had, multiple discussions before getting uo a 24 building permit, because he saw every step of the .a" because obviously the FEI~hA issue was discussed 25 with him early on in the begisning. The issue of ~;heuher or to w~au exten~ we coul~ reno.-ate nhe Jl~ne 22, 2004 11 1 2 ~sese was discussed earlier in ~he beginning, to have him believe ~haE the deck wouldn't be damaged 3 and wouldn't nee~ to be replaced immediately. ~[e ~ere in shock when he told us, I'm sorry, 5-ou have 4 to go to the Zoning Boara for this decking. I don't think that you need to issue a yariance 5 ~ecause I think ~hat's something ~ha~ maybe you don't want to do. I think given the 6 sircumstances, tRe nee~ for ~he structural alterations and the need for the DEC and the i Trustees regulations, our need to remove the ~eck temporarily while this underlying structural 8 repairs was being done, should give us the automatic right to put it back in. There is never 9 an in~ention ~o aDandon ~he structure_ It was getting it out of the way for the construction 10 then putting it right hack. The only reason we haven't put it right back is because the suilding 11 Department stopped us from doing that. Ss. you don't need to go ~o ail Lhe extreme measures of 12 all the variances that the Building inspector required at the notice of disapproval. T}~ae's whl 13 we limited the size of t~e house. ~e kep{: e~'eryEhing exactly uhe same_ in facu, uhe deck is 1~ four fee~ less uhan the original s~ructure_ BOARD MEMBER TORTOP3: Wait. You said 15 the ~eck was four feet less than the original structure. TwenEy minutes ago I aske~ you is Enis 16 ~e deck tha~ is before us; ~went~- minutes ago you ]7 MS. HOORE: Hay I answer your question? BOf~P_D MEHBER TORTORA: Yes. 18 MS. ~{OORE: In 1993 ~he Town received the original survey. The original survey had the 19 decking that wen~ the entire length of t~e property. When the DEC and the Trustees had us 20 replace the ~ulkhead afuer the snorm, uney didn't allow us te replace the bulkhead in-kind and 21 in-place; ~hey had us mete the bulkhead four feet ]sack from its original position. So the nev~ decK, 22 ehe replacement deck is going on ~op of ehe bulkhead The bul]~head is now four feet less than 23 its original position. So I'm no~ directing you to ~hese surye~s, it's shill the same request we 24 hat made and presented to the Building Depar~men~ day one. I~'s less than ute original structure. 2E ~OARD rdE?4BER TORTOP3_: Which was Suil~ when? June 22, 200% 12 2 HS. HOOP. E: Nhich was buil5 before zoning_ It was there in '$6 when 5his serve,:' was 3 dcne. CHAIRWOHA~I OLIVA: It's been there since 4 I remember. NS. MOORE: This house was probably built 5 in EP~e '%0s or '50s as a cottage. hR. VILLAI.N?I: It's been ehere since the 6 '20s_ I~'s originally a F. etcham house. If you look aU Ehe 1972 Van Tui~'l survey, we have the same 7 exact footprint ef Ehe deck and the house as it suands uoda!? with the exception ef ute bulkhead 8 being four lose landward of where it was originally, and thee was because it was a TrusEee 9 decision to move iY landward. C, rigi~lalli? this proper~!' was 92 feet in length, over the co~rse ef 10 ~ime i~'s eroded due ~o a problem with the bulkhead and all Ute paperwork tibet's gone through 11 o, er ~he course of time. This her been ini~iaEed in== 1992 to preserve the right te renovate this 12 house in-kind/in-place with the deck tha~ existed at least until 1972 U~at shows on the VaR Tu,fl 13 snrvey. HS. MOORE: Actually up through '86. 14 [.{R. VILLf-i'[TI: i have eno from '72 also. I'm not urying us ask for anyEhing 15 differenU. Along wi~h the Building Deper~men~ since day one, I've been ueld as long as i stay l~S with the same footprint of Elle deck and ~he home of what it is toda]~, which I have never tried te 17 enlarge or ask, I alwa,,s reserve nheu righn. Now I ¥~ouldn'k have spent all this money 18 ,ever Ehe course of time over the lose 2,1, mon~hs to always reserve that deck, ~hen Ehe one day I hove 19 bo take it curt Ee do work on the house, under the Trustees permit, which was ells. wed to do. for the 2,3, bulkheed and the Plelical screws, no raise the house and else with ~he DEC, wihh Ehese rights 21 with those permihs, and wha~ happened was r~he deck had ~o be removed in order to do ~ha~ werF_. ~ 22 wouldn't have gone down and jus~ threw the righ~ ts reserve the deck right out the window_ it's 23 alwa!?s beer~ Ehere. PIS. MOORE~ The use of this house doesn't~ 2% make sense without the decking. The gabion, the sand, all ef this is designed with a top ~c 25 pro~ec~ ~he s~nd and gahion, otherwise rain and s~orm will erode ~he stru~c~ure enderneaeh. This June 22~ 20,0% 13 1 2 whole design with decking on top puts a cap, elm.out like a lid on a pot no keep the underlying 3 structure safe and in plate. So i was quite flabbergasted when the Building Department said, 4 no, go fur a zoning variance because I appreciated the face it was a significant variance because 5 it's evervm.~here {rom end Eo end, property line to properu5' line just about. 6 CHAIRWOHi~ c, ~ ~LI ,~.. L~/dia ? BOARD HE[~tBER TORTURe_: I would like Eo see 7 a breakdown of the lot coverage_ IdS. HOURIS: I can have the surveyor break 8 iu town. BOARD MEI[BER ORL.A~DO: Hiss Moore, did you 9 represent i~our cl lent with ~he Trustees? MS. MOORi : i did. i have been in this 10 process since ea~iv '90s late '90s. I~'s been so lung. I 11 BOARD HE~IBER ORLANDO: No erie's disputing ~hat the deck exLstsd. Ne can see pictures. The 12 question here isI it was removed wi~hou~ a permit as ~er the n.c. nicA~ of disappreval. When yc.u speke 13 wish the Trustees,~ did the,/ sar you can rem,eye ih, er did you sell ~hem? Dc. we have it on ~es~imc, ny 14 ~hat fou say, 'fop're on podium, arid -_floe said, we're going Eo remove uhe deck, life up she heuse lB arid do all ~he s~uff like that? HS_ MOOR~: i can't go back and think 16 whether or not the ~estimony was as clear as shat. BOARD MEHBER ORL_R2.IE, O: Your .client' s 17 saying you sold ~veryone you were going ts remove Ehe deck. 18 [,'iS. MOO~E: The TrusUees know how Css(_elie raises a llouse. They have to lift Iht 19 hsuse up, pul t}e helical screws_ It's pounding. BOARD M~MBER ORL}2iDO: Ne one's disputing 20 that. i ~hink liE's how it went about_ ~.is. MOORE: I think in was always 21 uniers~eed tha~ Ithe decking, ene, had ee be repaired becaus~ it was leaning, iE was all - 22 Bi~ARD MNMBER ,2, P, LI~2.1DO: When you_ think is' s a gi~.en, i~'s nqE~ aiwai-s a given. 23 LIS. MOOP~E: It was ob.~iously clear shat the deckin8 ~he~e-~ had collapsed and needed to be 24 repaired and replaced. BOARD MEMBER ORL~2.~DO: I don't know if 2S i~'s their jurisdiction ~hat tells ,/ou ~o lift up and put iE back on, ~he Trustees. June 22, 2004 1 2 MR. VILLi-I~TI: I don' t tF~in~ there' s any such permit in the Town_ 3 SOARD MEHBER ORLANDO: Nh·ch building inspector have you had conversations with? Maybe 4 we can tal~ with him. I{S. ~,~C, ORE: · was dealing wi~h Hike 5 Yet·ay ~hreughout the whole Eime. Te me, I assume that people understand construction when tt~ey are 6 a building inspecEor. So to me, · don't go tt~roegh ~he whole process of we have to move ~his 7 o~ of the way because we have to pu~ ~he helical ssrews we have to put_ ~he bulkneaeing. 8 BO}iP_E, ~IENIBER OR~INDO: Ne brought ~'.{ike in lasu public hearing te clear up s gray area like ~ tRis, because you' re saying we had msnl zcnversations, and he knew we were doing this. Ne 10 should ask nlm_ MS. HOORE: He believed somehow or 11 another, i have learned m~ lesson wi~h MiF_e, I now confirm e~.eryEhil~g in writing_ E;erlf~ime I meet 12 ~iuh nlm ± do a confirmation letter. BO}iD HEHBER ORLANDO: Tha~' s no~ a bad 13 ~hing. MS. PIOORE: That's not t~e rignu way to 14 operate. You should ~e able to ~.3eme in and know what. the rules are, ~hey're pretty 15 sEraigh~.forward. You come in and say I'm doing this renovation I have to replace, I have ~o fix 16 ~his, fix ~he desk. The building permit's going ~o come with, the_.? say ~ou have to de full 17 drawings, engineering, you have ~e s~lbmit everluhing; uhat's w~at we did_ It was quiEe 18 exUensive. This underlying structure doesn't wor~ ~.~itP~eut decking Eop. Plus the fact, if ~ou saw 19 iE, the house is ne~e - BOARD ME[~IBEP_ C, RLA2~DC,: Bac}~ ~o the 20 ~ecking, ~nis is going ~o be your sEanciard deck ~.~i ~h Nlan~ing? 21 MS. HOORE: Yes. ~OAR_D HEMBEP. ORL}i[DO: What' s going ko be 22 going Ue step waLer going uhreugn it? HS. MOORE: You cion't have an open, 23 expose{ sand and gab·on sEr~cEure. BOARD MEMBER ORLL2~DO: Tile rain' s still 24 going to go ~owr~, ~e snow is still going ~o go down. 25 CHAIPI,[C,NI}t[ OhlVA: It's going to drip do?fn instead of pouring down, because it has to June 22, 2004 15 ] 2 hold uhose gabions in place. HR. VI£~L2-2{?I: Another Ehing is, ?,,ithout 3 that decking, small children or whoever, i mean creates a hazard of pla!lng on the rooks or going 4 unierneamh mhe house, you're preventing the hazard by having that deck because what you did was seal 5 any possibility of having that hazard. And also, I don'~ know if there's~ an-:, permim in this mown in 6 regards to removing mhat deck. It's like i tell vsu for 10 years I'm coing te =~pla~= mhis deck 7 one da,f, i finally ge~ my permiEs and e~ eryuhing, I ge eno .iai~, tear iE down, next day i apply 8 because I P~a,?e ~e ge through steps me do i~ righE way, and Ehe ne×~ day you tell me, well, yo~ 9 ~c, re it down yesterday, so you can't have that. Now you haYe to ge before the Zoning Roard ef 10 _~_pp=~l~, which if hhat s the way it might be ~_hen Lhat's the way i~ is. But it's something that's 11 always been there, always with uhe inmenUion ef preserving mhose rights of wh~m was there. Nora to 12 urn.~ ~o e}roend or an!/thing. Aid in regards Eo leu coverage, if you 13 ha~e 2,299 on the square foc. u of the let, if minus ,sun the house, thaE's about 900 square feeE 14 of tha~. So right there, you're ~ot at 76 percent of let coverage_ If you look on the northern 15 side, i ~hink mhat's another maybe lB0 square feet minus cue ef the equation, mhen a little bit .on 16 the wesE end, normh side of tt~e home on the nermh and ease and the wesu. So it's definitely 17 nowheres near 76 percent lee coverage_ RS. HOORE: You're including ~he house 18 into ~he lee coverage. ~OARD MS±~BER T-,RIeR.~_: i didn't de the 19 calculauions, mhe Building DeparEment did. I'm ~sking you to. 20 You're submitting testimony about what Building Departmezlt said and whaL Ehey .didn'L say, 21 iE's kind efa eno-sided affair, and I woul{ ask mhe Chairwoman, if we're going Eo take mhat _=~tzm.~h, into censideraELon, mham ~.,e aisc, listen ~o mhe Building Departmen~ so that we can hear 23 their version of what happened_ ['.IS. HO,ORE: I just find it somewha~ 24 ludicrous to have a building inspector =._p=c~ us tc pum helical screws and gabion wiEhour~ removin9 2g the structures on mop. BOARD HENBER T,DRTOPJ~: He's not here June 22, 20,94 16 1 2 de f erid riimseif. MS. MOORE: Common sense_ 3 CSAIRWOHAN OLIVA: Suppose we get Nike F~ere about 11:30. % Jim, do you have any questions? BOARD HEHBER DINIZIO: I do ha,~e a 5 q~esx_ion for the building inspector. wcndering if having a removal permit preserves 6 right for ehem to hove a deck. And i'm wondering ?~here itl our code it says that because I had 7 always though~ ~raditionally if you had some~hir~g and you woulci be main~eining something, tP~en that 8 5 s~ always nad HS. [4SORE: Ac~uaily ~he code ~.zes say ~c, ths~ even nonconforming structures -- Not nonconforming uses, but nonconforming 10 s~ruc~ures -- are permitted to ~e repaired, replacee. The lang~age nas Seen in the c.s~e, and 11 over ire couple of '.,-ears we've eroded awe2~ t½a~ right to ~he point ef a~serdity_ The TowxT Board 12 has even legislated five years age fur r~oncenferming uses allowir~g them ~o expanO. So if 13 ~he Town Boarci alloweO nonconforming uses expand, wh5~ are we ~_reati~g nonconforming area 14 set~acks almos~ more strictly than ~he r. cnconforming use. So over time it's jusu getuing 1S ~s a point wRere we lose kind of the common sense f_aceor in zoning. 16 CRAIRWOM}2.] OLIVA: I E}~in~ Jerry nas one more q~esEioN, then le~'s adjourn Ehis to 11:3,}. 17 BOARD NEMBER GOEHNINGER: The onl~ sEatemer~E I wan~ Es make is it's very difficulE to 18 cSetermine what you had when 5~0~1 don'~ see it later. You're nee submitting pictures to us of l~q wtlat: ~he dec~is look like excep~ for ~he fron~ iccP., EhaC.'s Number 1; and Number 2, Il reallp 20 don'e bu_,~ the issue tbaU ~he dec~ needs te be replace~ ~o proEect the gabion because you can put 21 a s~lrface on tRat property, anOI c{on't csre if iE's bluestone, i don't care if it's stone in 22 general, c_haE will renar~ ~he same procedure tiiaE a deck would do. 23 MS NOORE: I woul~ respectfully disagree. 2% BOARD H~i~4BBR GOEHRINGER: I'm not_ an engineer. 25 MS. NO,DP.E: ~,xa~t£,_ Then I would waist tc have an engineer's teszimony on whether or Not ~, 2,50% 17 1 2 the gabion and Costello, the way it was designed, everything here was designed with the decking on 3 rep. Now yon have a whole set of speedf's rep:lauiens uhau have just been adop~ed_ I'm sure 4 you've heard about i~, which talks about prevenuioN, it's erosion con,roi and prevention, 5 and there's a whole section on what rainwater does no erode uopsoil. And Now we have no go through ¥ erosion con~rol, poliunion conurol, plans au ~he Plan£~ing Board process for anything over as~ acre 7 because of the concern ef Eopseii storage, of material sUorage, consEruction process, of hc, w 8 rain ca~ses erosion and uitima~ely the runoff problems that are created on roads and in 9 sensitive wenlands areas. So, you know, iE's a recognized principal_ Se I don't agree with that 10 analysis, that, in fact, rainwater does ca~lse a g~eat deal of erosion. _zm~d here :'au are next to 11 the water, so you'ye gal storm damage, z.;hich is even more prevalenL, so ,,iou'-'- got a lot of ,,;ind 12 acEion and tidal action Lhat you've got ~o protect againsz, that's why Ehe gabion and uhat's wh~'Ehe 13 bulkhead were puZ in place. BOARD MEn,BmR GOEHRINGER: Is Hr. Costeilo 14 an engineer? [~IS. MOORE: I don't think he's an 15 engineer. BOARD MET~[BER GOEHNINGER: Then we need Lo 16 get an engineer here. [.IS. MOORE: I need eo know whether -:'au're 17 psing te honor a pre-existing structure. I base a survey from '~,~h which shews the decking from end le ~o end. I gave i-au a photograph from '92, which is before hmo snorms hin and started damaging the 1} structure. So I believe you have in your record ~reof than i~ was there. You have old surveys 20 tha~ talk about dilapidated decking that has to. be replaced_ So, I don't ]{now when more to give ~:~ou. 21 I have eld photographs that were submitted back in 2,0,:32 as part of the permiu process, probably the 22 DEC or ~he Trustees, whic~ show Ehe decking all along the side of ute property and the back of the 23 property, the front, the landward side has never beezi an issue so I don'~ know thau anpbody'~ taken 24 pictures of it. But You can see uhaE Yhis is part c.f ~he collapsed s~ructure. 25 BOL!D ME~IBER GOEHRINGER: Hfs. [.'bore, mosL ~ ~he werk that uhis Board has done zc. nin~-wise June 22, 2004 18 2 was done it~ the m~d bs lateer '90s, and an the Lime of looking at ellis s~ruc~ure and comparing it 3 to Eke surrounding neighborhood, I have ~o tell you than Eke dilapidauien of uhis building was so 4 severe than i couldn't believe that ehe building was still standing a~d than was my particular 5 spinion. We can give i?ou ~he names of those people, 6 they were noU necessarily on ntis side ,of the street, bun we looked at bouh sides. They were on 7 ehe Rabbit Lane side, and I can tell you, this is a relatively good depiction ef what I had seen, 8 end i~ didn'~ even ieok like a s~rucnure ~o me an tha~ po~nn_ I have To be honest with ~,on. 9 MS. NC, ORE: Actu~ll~f, ~he roof has non needed to be replaced. The seructure has a grea~ 10 deal of is~tegr~ty because ~here was a building permit in the renovation of it, hue most of iE is 11 remaining in place. SEructu~rally it looks horrendous, ~he shingles are beaten up by the 12 elements, and he has been going t~rough the process of renovaeing or attempting no gee all the 13 permits in place to renovate ehis structure since ....... ~ it hasn't been his fault. Ke has 14 wanned ~o go ar~,t fi~< it. BOARD HEMBER GOEHRINGER: We' re not saying 15 it's an!body's fau~_ HS. MOORE: You understand the 16 deuerioration of ehe strucn~re continues while ~ou're goin~ through the permie process. There's 17 probabl~ $S0,000 worth ef underl~ing struc~_ure for gabion - 18 HR. VIL~ANTI: A~ lease_ IdS. NOORE: So he's had aa invesemenn of 1S, over S~n, ~. ~, 000 in punning the underlying structure ~s protect this Rouse because this house is very 20 close ~o the water, as are all the o~ner homes off ef Rahbiu Lane. 21 BO.mP~D MEMBER GOEHRIN,SER: How come they didn't make you ge eo a flood plain level? 22 HS_ HCORE: The?' did. That's why the helical screws were putz in. The Building 23 DeparLmenz said do in precautionary. The ele,.rat[on, the FEI~ standards when you're 24 renovating a house as long as -:-ou're not: increasing Eke structure more t~an 56, .... ' 25 whist is not the case here, we're ,exactly in kind. in-place, ycu can keep bo bhe eT~isning June 22, 2,30~ 19 1 2 titivation; rather than take that approach, he puc in the additional irivestmen~ of raising the house 3 2% inches, the helical screws were put in underneath, and they had ko be brought ce a heigh~ ~ of 24 inches for PEHA standards_ BC,Y~.D HEHBER GC, EHRiNGER: So the house was 5 raised 2% inches? RS. ~,{OOR£: Yes, for the FEP~~_ stendards. 6 He complied with all the DEC regulaticns a~d permits. 7 CHAIR~'~ONE~2,~OL±-"~* -~_-'~. Could we keep this? MS. HOORE: Of course_ ~ NR. VILLZ~Ti: i agree with you tha~ the houlse is in hol~rible condition, but i'm net the 9 one ~,The left it in that. I'm ~he one purchased it recently in the hopes of trying to 10 better it. The neighbors h~ve even ~old me that they will sign petitions when I was workin._9 down 11 there two weeks age. Some of {:he r~eighbors came over to get the right to pu~ back the deck and 12 ',.;h~ever they can do in regards ~c. helping. It's snlv bettering the area. I'm trying to stop a 13 hazard ~hat existed for 20 years_ I won't deny an!, of that. But I'm net the one who left it in 14 ~han condition, I'm just trying to impro~re what ,~ze ha~;e. 15 CRAIRWOM2~2'[ OLIVA: If we .just adjourn ~hi.s hearing until 11:30 ~o see if we ,can ge~ the 16 Buiidir~g Departmenk here. ,'See minutes for resolution., ,C'HAIRNOMP~2,~ OLIVA: Our next hearing is we 18 need a resolution ~o adjourn T~omas and Laura Nigro application to July 15th te 10:05 a.m. 19 (See minu~es for resoiutien.) 2,0 CHAIP, WOHP~ OLIVA: Our next hearing is fs, r 21 Dehra VicEorcff on Dogwood Lane in Southold. It's the building of a new house and this application 22 has been going en for a ':-ear, and we tla;e the new map, and I thought it looked .~ery - frankly, I 23 think vet fit it in ,.-er':- nicely, hut let's see what ever'~body else has eo say. I.'~r. Geehringer? 24 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: It's mY understanding there's ne swimming pool_ 25 HR. FiTZGEP3_LD: Yes. Ne took our. the swimming poei Ne took one the surroundir~g deck. Jun. e 22, 2,504 2O 1 2 Ne made the house smaller_ We reduced the size of the deck behind the bedroom and moved the house as 3 far as necessary, according ~o ~he Trustees, away from the quote, wetland, area. Ie's uhe bose we 4 can do. The house is a minimum size, ~he lo~ 2o-~erage is about 12 percenE. 5 BOARD HEHBER GOEHRINGER: Thank you. An~ we are still going with that original 6 disapproval -- the reason I'm asking this question is Secause ± have to write uhis ~ecision. The 7 April 20, 2004 approximaEely? HR_ FITZGERALD: That's approximatel2~. 8 Nc, ~.~aiE a minute_ April 20th. BO~_D MEMBER GOEH~INGER: I~ star,ed 9 February 11, 2003? ~{R. FITZGERALD: The latest daEe is Sune 10 l~t~. ~S. KOWALSKi: That came in last ,~¥eek. 11 BOARD HEP~BER GOEHRINGER: Can I ~ave a lzok at t~at? 12 HR. FITZGERALD: I~ says Damon sen~ iE. MS. KC,WALSKI: It's part of the file. 13 BOARD ~EMBER GOEHRINGER: I'm going to copy ~his before ,?ou leave, and 1'11 give you a 14 MR. FITZGEPJ~LD: Sure. You're going to 15 hold it now. C~IRWO~,'IAN OLI\~: Vincent, do you have 16 anv questions? BOARD MEMBER ORL~{DO: No, I think you'ye 17 .~one a fine job massaging it, moving it all around. 18 CHAIRWOP,tmU~ OLiVA: Only too~ a year. HR. FITZGEPJaLD: The designer is Miss 19 YicEoroff herself. ~OYiD ME~{BER ORLANDO: IU nas a 10 foot 20 fronu ~ar~ setback, is that where we are no~? CHAIRWOM}2~ OLIVA: Right, the Trustees 21 moved i~ up. ~dR_ FITZGERALD: And, of course, that's 22 wi~ most things in Ehe Town ~hat's from the property line, the edge ef the pavemene is ansEher 23 12 fee~ beyond Etch. BOA~_D HEHBER ORLi~I~DO: So t~a~'s the only 24 ~ariance you actualll- need from us today wculd be a front zard setback? 2g MR. FITZGE~%LD: Front and rear_ BOARD MEMBER ORhAU~DO: How far is your June 22, 2004 1 2 rear yard setbac}~? NIR. FITZGERALD: I Rave to look. 3 BOARD ~{EHBER ORLA~IDO: I don't see it on Ehat survey. 4 BOARD r,[~HBER GOEHRINGER: It' s net mentionei. 5 ~IR_ FITZGERALD: It's not incticaEed, SuE it scales to 37 feeE. 6 HS. KOWALSKi: It's onP~ disapproved for Ehe fron~ ~ard from tRe Ruilding DeparEmenE. ? MR. FITZGERALD: Okay. It's 3, feet_ MS. KOWALSKI: Yen don'E need a rear yard 8 variance. BOARD MEHBER ORL}2IDC,: it should be 35 and 9 CHAIRWOHAN OhlVA: hydia? 10 BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: It's been a long haul, hue I really Ehink :~ou have dena a very good 11 job. Iz's an extremely long haul. MR_ FITZGERALD: Hiss VicZoreff, wu'Ye 12 .~one whatever we can. BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: I think you've dena 13 a ,~ery good jeO over the l'ears. HR_ FITZGERALD: It's ~er doing 14 CHAIRWONL~2,~ OLIVA: Jim? BOARD HEMBP~R DINIZIO: i have a nozice of lb disapproval EhaE disapproves bo~h. The disapproval says yau need a rear yard and 16 MR. FITZGEP3LD: That's not the latesE. We have June something '04. April 22nd. 17 The lazesz is - BOARD MEHBER C, RL~I[DO: dune l%th. There' s 15 a list of :hem here. B,O_A=RD MEMBER DINIZIO: So you don'E need a 19 rear yardi MR. PITZGEPS_LD: That's correct. 20 CHAIRWOM32.~ OLIVA: Is Ehere anyone in the auOience t}la~ wishes to speak for er against this 21 application? NS. ROSENB~UH: Helen Rosenbl-em, 125~ East 22 Main StreeE, Riverhead, for some of Ehe neighbors of the applicant. ~ou have ~o excuse me, I Oidn't 23 expect to he here today so mI, file is in Ri~.,erheat. 24 i naven'E seen the no,ice of disapproval_ i did note ttlat Ehe line was nee even skeEched in 2h sn the sursey shewing Ehe rear yard measurement. I wanted to pun a couple things in the June 22, 2004 22 1 2 record. It's going Eo be unarEfully done because, as I sa-~, my file is in Rivernead. I ,rote Eo you 3 sencerning first and foremost what I consider to be the problem with this leE. · den'~ ~hin~ it 4 has been addressed. I talked Eo the Building Inspector, Miss Victoroff old as well, and I think 5 yen ~eed Eo have some kind of ruling from him as to whether or net this is a valid leE. 6 The let i~ your Section 100-24 is ,~er-~ specific as te hew a lot is recognized that is 7 non-conforming, and this is significanEiy suOstandard, it says if any one ef the following 8 apply, and if the lots have no~ merged, and if the identical let was created by ~eed on er before 9 June 30, 1983; this lot that's before you was created b~, deed in like 2002; and the le~ 10 conformed to the minimum lot requirements as of the .lane of lee creation; cerUainly, iE did net as 11 sf 2002_ Was this apprevee bi, the Planning Board? ± don't Oelieve tha~ iu was, Out I could be ,rong. 12 Nas iE on a subdivision ~ap approved by the Town Board prior te 19837 Again, I don't believe EhaE 13 it was. ~as it approved by you prior to 19832 The BuilOing Department file and the assessor's 14 file Oidn't nave an~ indicauion ef t~at. · think this is something EhaL as iS representing the neighbors, they have a right to knew whenher this lou is a ,~alid let; it's 16 someuhing EhaL should have been resolved ~efore you even heard the issue ef the variances, and I 17 woul~ ask uhat a deuerminatien be made by Eke Building OeparLment in writing, so EhaL Ehau can 18 be appealed to vo~ as well. All of that is in my letter. I don't want to take a loc of -?our time 19 by going through ~nat_ Again, my understanding was t~at there was 20 a rear yard request for variance, apparenn£v that isn't the case_ There are other problems_ We are 21 reading tko house presently as a larger s~rucLure, tha~ is 23 percent larger than the s~ruc~ure that 22 was before you before we wen~ Eo the Trustees. T~ere is an addition to ~hat 104 square foot deck, 23 ~here are stairs that are 48 square feet from the side of the house_ So ~hat the house is larger 2% than ~he one ~haE had been before you; although, ~e patio and the porch that were en ~he prior map 25 had been remove~. In t~e mop that was ~efore you, ~he porch dune 22, 200e 23 1 2 was bordering the fronn yard, wes parallel to nhe front y~rd for 20 feet, now the house is Ehere. 3 So it's like I'm hoe sure Ehat the 10 feet is in keeping winh the neighborhood. I think most of % the houses on ~he Dogwood Lane have setbacks of the houses themselves is considerably more than ,2HA[RWOPZ~t[ OLIYA: Hiss ResenOlum, we do 6 understand Ehat the Trustees pushed the house forward beceuse of the wetlands. ? ~S. ROSENBLUH: Yes, E~ey did. It was their suggesnion for wetlands reasons. Their 8 jurisdiction is we~ands an~ yours is obviously something else_ There were a couple of other 9 things I jus~ wanted no put into the record. The pre~ose~ house is on piles, ± don'E Ehink if iE's 10 in nhe noEice of disapproval from ~he Building Inspestor tna~ nhey reviewed that_ I'm assuming 11 -,es, but i didn'n know ~here was a new notice of iisappro~ el until just now. Again, it may no~ Se 12 in keeping with the neighborhood. The test hole has been move~ abo~E 30 feet 13 from the ini~iel survey to the presenn survey and the calculaEion ef the groundwater Oased on this 1% test hole on ~ne latest survey is incorrec~ by one lsat, an,~ if our calculations are correct, the 1~ renaining wall would have to be raised by an aOOitional foo~, which would make i~ %.7, while 16 four fooE maximum is what is required in nhe zcning code. This might require anoEher ~ariance, 1~ and I ~hink ehaE the fooEings encroach on your properEy and also en the Rosac~is' property_ 18 There's no indication for enough room for two parking spaces as is required by Town code. 1} That's really pretty much it. I ~hink the ma~n concern really is Ehe issue is ~his a legal 20 ncncenforming lee for you Es be ennernaining anynhing on. Lz~d I think we're entitleO te have 21 ~han passe~ on Oy ehe Building Inspector in -,;rining. Thank you very much. 22 ,2HAI RWOM~{ OLIVA: Jim? [,IR. ~ITZGEPeLD: Just briefly, the 23 propert5 card for these properties in an entry daLed 1~27/03 says, "Combined two parcels as per 2% deed." I think thee ~he reference that Ms. Rosanblum referre~ to in Eno Town coon Eal~ing 2h aSoun nonconforming lots is non addressing the quesEion of combining lots but ranter of ma~ing June 22, 200e 2 them further er less conforming than they are now, and, of course, the i~erging of the ~wo lets, as I 3 understanO it under New York State law, happens autcmetically when they are bonh owned in nhe same 4 name, and, of course, that's the way in has been. The things that Hs. Rosenblum has been referring 5 to are all paper, and nhey don't aOdress, I don't thin~, the spirin of the zoning regulations eno 6 what in is ,e're trying to do. So I think in is a legal let, any eno of se~eral ways. Arid nne last 7 point is the quesnion's peripheral in m~, min{, ~uestions about the sanitary system are matters 8 which ~he Mealnh Department i'm sure ~ill examine very carefully_ And, of course, ~hat wi£1 be our 9 next step and we will meet nhere at some time in the fuEure -- net !,ou folks -- but the neighbors. 10 MS. VICTC, ROFF: I'd also like to speak, if I can. 11 CHAIP_}'[0Hi~'[ OLIVA: Sure. MS_ VICTOROPF: I'm Debra VicEeroff and an 12 nhe Town Trustees meeting, when we came before ~hem no get the wetlands variance this issue ef 13 the merger of the lots was brought up an nhae time, and the morning of nhan meeting I went ant 14 spoke ~o Hike Veri~y in person. I told him ~ha~ this was po~enniaily an issue_ Me gave me a cepl 15 of ~he portion of the code that refers to this issue, 100 2% and 100-25, I have a copy of it. 16 Part A says a let crea~ed by deed er Town approval shall Se recognized b? ~he Town if any one of the 17 following standards apply and if the lets have not merged, but they are merged Decause, as defined in 18 Secnion 100-2~, a merger that a nonconforming lot shall merge with an adjacenn conforming or 19 n©ncenforming lot which has been held in common ownership with nhe first lot aE any time after 20 Ju£y 1, 1}83_ The lot was owneO by the same two people in 1962, and it was sold in 1987 Eo Sandra 21 Rave, who owned beth pieces ef proper~y. So according to 100 2S, these lots were merge~. The 22 reason that it didn't shew up un, il 20,33 was because I wrote a letter an Jim Finzgerald's 23 instruction to ~he ~oard of Assessors, which I have a copy, and, ef course, they Oo too. "I'm 24 writing to you as the ne. owner ef ~wo adjacent lets of vacant property in Seuthold, New York. 2b This le~er is to acknowledge that the two above referenced lo~s are merged and are dune 22, 2,304 25 1 2 considereO no be one single and separate building ion for building purposes. I request that the 3 assessor's office recognize that ~hey are combined 4 So it's Decause of me that this showed up sn the tax chart, and not because they decided no 5 merge it because it was considered so in the deed. i also have, if you would like te re,~iew 6 in, my title search, which shows The owners, traces back the owners to 1952 and who owned ia, 7 and the transition from 19S2 ~o me in 2003. With regard to the setback cempari6en 8 between my house at 10 feet and the other houses in the area, I went Eo the Town clerk's office, 9 and I gs~ 16 surveys of the 16 houses which surround me, including Mr. Rose,is, who is the 10 chief objector to ~ building there, his house sets back 1% feet, mine sees back 10 feet. He 11 dces ncT have a driveway, I understand it might be require.t, I am not asking him Eo gee cne. I do 12 have a driveway, perhaps it's smaller than in shoult be, DuE I guess in's better than not having 13 a driveway. I would also like ~o read a letter that I 14 didn't ~ave a chance to send no you, but it is addressed no the Zoning Board and the Chairwoman 15 and the Members of the Zoning Beard, if I may? CNAiRWON~ OLIWA: Sure. 16 MS. VICTOROFF: This is in response To stauemenus that have been made aDout my 17 presentation and Jim's presentation and what the information that we Drought Oefore yen and 18 especially a letter ~hat was read before the Trustees at the £as5 Trustees meeting bi 19 Mr. Ros~kis in regard to my ~pplication. ,2HAIRWOH}2[ OLIVA: Jus5 don't make it 20 ~ersonal. if it's personal then · will not accepL 21 LIS. VICTOROFF: I would like to say at Jim siszgeraid's defense, that aT ~he last s~a~ement, 22 i~ v, as said that we ma~e incorrect representations cn cur application to the DeparTment of 23 EnvironmenTal Conservation, and · would just like to say that the Departmenn of Environmental 2% Conservation, we applied to them to find out if uhey had jurisdiction on the wenlan{s. They 25 responded that the}~ didn't_ I was concerned -- CHAIR~O~.'~=i~ OhlVA: I think ~he Board June 22, 2004 26 1 2 feels this is irreievanE. BOARD H~BER TORTOP_~_: Hiss .... .~.c~rof£,- 3 Es the issue of whether Ehis lot is a legally recognized lo~, 100-25 states ~he Btliiding 4 Department upon request shall issue a written determination of merger; ,~,ou say you P~ave a Eitle ~ search. Did the ~uilding Department issue you a written determination of merger? 6 MS_ ViCTOROFF: I don'~ know v~haE ~ha~ is. It's en my Eax card it is considered merged. 7 HS_ KOWALSKI: It's mz- understanding Ehat ute Building Department will address mE later, 8 Ehat was up to hr_ FiEzgerald. I,IS_ ~-,~ ~ ~ - _ .,I~TCR~FF. Ma,/ i respond Za ~haE in n~ another wa~.~ . Nhen I spoke to Mike Verity_ when I ~oid him ENis was an issue and he gave me this 10 sheeE, he said any issue of tha~ ~iqse would be addressed when the Building Department lee]ted aE 11 my survei? 8gain. According Eo Jim, he's given him 12 BOARD ME[,{BER TORTOP3_: That's kind of backwards. How can we issue }ou a variance on a 13 piece of properly -- MS_ ViCTOROFF: Hike implied EhaE if we 1~ c~c.t the disapproval letter ~hen it was considered a merged 15 MS. KOWALSKi: A recognized loB? BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: That issue is noL 16 before us, and there's someEhing very v~rcng in ~_his precess. Nhat's wrong is you can'~ gee a 17 building permit, a~d you can't gee a varia]lce unEil you have a recognized lot. it is incumben~ 18 upon the Bnilding DepartmeN~ EO clear the way for yah to do that by issuing a wriEEen deEerminaEien 19 c.f merger, nob after we have given permius huiii something on aioE. We ha~e ~e knew this. 20 NS. VICTOROFP: I don'E know what I needed to do ~o ask Ehem to merge the leE. 21 BOARD HEMBER TORTONA: i don't know how mhis process got backwards, hue right at Ehis 22 point iL is very m~ch backwards. HS. VI,2TOROFF: We have followed the 23 prscedure_ i can't imagine where it went wrong. BOARD MEMBER TOP, TON_~: I'm no~ questioning 24 you, I'm saying that Ehe Building DeparEment cemn.c.E sal.-, well, we'll issue a determination 25 ,;teEter _~on've gob a legal ic.u afeer you gee a variance to build ~he house_ June 22, 2004 27 1 2 [~S. VICTOROPF: According to the code, ~hJs defines a merged lot as one that has been 3 held in common ownership. BOARD HEMBER TORTOni: I know the code. % The Board Members know the code, but it's not our calL1 at this poinn. 5 CHAIRWOMAi,~ OLIVA: · Ehink you need a lo%her from the Building department_ 6 BOi~.D ~{EMBER TORTORA: Say here's nhe csle, this is what it says, it's not your 7 responsibiliti~ Iu's the Building Deparnmenn's respon~ibiiity us issue a written determinauien on 8 whether you have go~ a legal lot or not. That's the law_ It's cut and dried_ 9 ~4S. VICTOROPP: Isn't it their responsibiliny then ne do so? 10 BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: Yes_ If "ou ask 5hey are responsible. You say you have a title 11 search, ~hen you're half way home. MS_ VICTOROFF: Hay I go get Lhat £etter 1.2 from them? CHAIRWOM2~ OLiVA: Yes, if 5~ou can get 1.3 that letter within ~he hour. [dR. FITZGEP~LD: Two sentences, ~he Board 1.% in nhe pas~ has always focused -~ery direcnly on the notice ef disapproval from the Building 15 Departmenn, w[~et has been and when has non been disapproyed_ And it seems no me that if that was 16 a question with nhe Building Department, something about it would have shown up on nne notice of 17 disapproval_ BOARD ~EMBER TORTOP£e: But counsel for 18 adjoining neighbors, who have raised questions specifica£1y te that issue, have brough~ this 19 before ~his Board_ It would be remiss not no address counsel's concerns. 20 MS. ROSENBL~I: Thank you very much. Pirst of all I want no say as far as if 21 [.[Y. Resakis said anything inappreprlate in his letter, I apologize for it_ He's rece~ering new, 22 I'm no~ going to get into what's wrong with him, bun I don't think if Hiss Vicnoroff ends up as his 23 neighbor, I don't think he wants a bad relationship winh her. He's e very intense man_ 24 I think this is a mather of importance ~o him_ I nhin]¢ it's new assumed he's putting i~ bac~ into 2b context_ I just wan~ to say firse ef all some of June 22, 2004 1 2 the issues Hr. Fitzgerald indicated were Health Department issues are Town code issues, like the 3 height of the -- CHAIRWOM~i'~ OLI~/A: Retaining 4 [,IS. ROSENBLN,I: Right_ That stuff and the other thing is the merger issue is an issue, but 5 100 24 is really tRe issue_ It's clearll~ a nonconforming lo~. I know tha~ the lots existed 6 in some form way back, bu~ if you look a~ ~he provisions under A, which I as~e~ Mike to de, it's ~ very specific. And i~'s no~ like it's the question of the spiri~ of the zoning ce{e. This 8 is what a zoning co~e is here, i~ either meets ar it does not. Al~ I understand because · have o explaine.~ to ~f clients, that it's very hard for a zoning hoard or ~ewn bear~, or any agency in a 10 nown to say ~nis lot is not a legal lo~ winnout buying it_ I understand the issue having my own 11 municipal background, but if the lot is clipped ~hrough the cracks and the Ruilding Department 12 shoul~ no~ have sanctioned it or something shoul~ ha~;e teen done, that h~ppens all ~he time, and if 13 i~'s not a legal lot, it's ne~ a legal 1o~. That's all I'm asking. I asked Mr. Verity to 1% consider it_ We are entitled to have those ~ues~ions answered Secause, quite frankly, ieoking 15 a~ 100-2% it doesn't meet anything that I can see if you parse out ~he word spirit or net and s.s. 16 forth. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGFR: That's very 17 interesting. This is a very interesting ~ssue. You know, we have made decisions on this 15 ~©ar~ for 25 years subject to Health Departmen~ sppreval, anO conceivably, if the Health 19 £epartment doesn't appro~e someuhing, then you ~on'U gee nhe building permit. We could also make 20 a Oecision based upon the fact tnaE iu was a legal leu anO there was a determination made bI, the 21 Building Inspector that this was a legal lot. You could make it subject te that Ese. 22 LeU me just explain something to you, at ~he time uhau I walked ouu here, Madam Chairperson 23 asked me ~o walk out and contact the ~uilding Department regarding anou~er matter, tMere are 24 only ~wo building inspectors aE ~he Town Hall at Ehis time, the ot~er gentleman ha.~ retired_ So 25 uhe presen~ chief building inspecuor is ouu doing inspections, so it's difficult_ ousE so you're June 22, 2004 2 a%,~are of thaE situation. So that's why I raise EhaE issue, subject to, because thaE's an issue 3 ~ha~ ~he Building Department will research prior Ec Ehe issuance. 4 ,2HAIRWO~2~ OLIVA: How about make a reselutian te close ~he hearing with a written 5 reply from Ehe Building DeparEment before July 1st. 6 BC,ARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: ~ don't think you're going to get i~, Ruth. 7 CHAIRWCM.~ OLiVA: Bs~ July lst? MS. KOWALSKi: If you don'n gee it, ~hen 8 iJcu could make your decision subjec~ BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: Subjec~ to what? 9 CHAIRWO~tml~ ~LI,ZA: Subject to a written determination from the Building Department that 10 is a legal lot. BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: Thee it's a legal 11 lc,~ in accordance with 100-2%? CHA I RWO~'2~ OLIVA: Right_ 12 MS. ViCTOROFF: Can I said ask a quesEion? CHAIRNONL~2? OLIVA: Yes. 13 ['.IS. VICTOROFF: Nhen you were just sai:ing ~hat ~eu didn't think it coui.~ be gotten before 14 Jul? - - BOARD MEHBER GOEHRINGER: That was lg .opinion. NS. '~I~TuROFF: You don't think i could 16 .gee it today? CHAIRNOf,L~2~ OLIVA: They' re short-handed_ 17 One inspector retired, and I ~hink they're all running around down Ehere_ 18 Pis. ~I,~TOR~FF Nould i~ have Eo come from [.like ~!eri~y? 19 CHAIRNOMY2[ OLI'~ZA: .... z~, he's Ehe chief building inspector. 20 BOARD MEN[BER TORTOP3_: We really neei ciarifv Ehis issue_ I~'s ,.~our call, we can close 21 the hearing -- CHAI RWOHYi,I Obi ~..~_. Subj ace 22 BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: As far as rendering v2. u a te~ermina~ion, i'm not inclined to do 23 that. MS. VICFOROPP: How long will the hearing 24 ccn~inue ~oday? I'd like E.9 Er-, to get it. I'll tr-,' to come back. 25 C~L~IRNOMAN OLIVA: AbouE another hsurs. Do you wane us te hold anything open until June 22, 200,4 3O 1 2 ~ou come book by sar' 1:007 [{S_ VICTOROPP: Sure, or if ?on can hold 3 it off until the end of the hearing. CHAIPA'IOH:Ai,~ OLIVA: %[e have a shore da"_ 4 I don't think wa'il be here let's say 12:00 to 12:30. 5 ~{S. ViCTOROPF: If I'm nee able ~o get it nhen 6 CHAIRWOHI~.I OLIVA: Otherwise we'll jnsE make a resolution holding it over unEil July lot. 7 ~,{S. KOWALSKI: Close ~he hearing subject to a writnen submission by Juln- lot. 8 t~OARD MEMBER DiNIZIO: Can I make a comment? Seems to me tha~ you're getting bogged ? down in semantics nero. She's come before us with an application. She did se with full faith that 10 we would listen te her application. Whether er not nhis le~ is merged or unmerge~ er non is the 11 determination ef the Building Inspector, I Oelieve tha~ it is. Bu~ I don't ~hink that tha~ ~as any 12 Searing en ~ne decision tna~ we ma}, make in that we can'~ force the Building Inspector tc no,~,, give 13 a building permit to them if t~ose lons are net merged er have been merge~, if the~,'re not iega] 14 ions. None ef that is subjec~ of the hearing ~hat is before us, nhat I understand. I realize that I 15 wasn'~ on nhe Board prior to '04, Ou~ in just seems ~o me like if we coulO look at the 16 application and make a decision based on the application that we nave before us, yeah, this 1¥ £a~y may be ~ack before us because someone's to sa~ nhat the lo~s are merged, and she's going to 15 have to pro~,e t~at in's no~. Ne have no obligation to her jus~ because we granned or 19 didn't grant or restric~e~ wha~ ~his laty wants do now te grant her a waiver of merger, if tnan's 20 nne case nhat happens Ee follow here. CNAIRWOH~3I OLIVA: I don'~ ~hink she 21 wan~s a waiver of merger. Am I correct or not? BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO~ That's the subject 22 of this application, · don't believe tha~ Lhat is. ! believe 5ha5 our application here is setback. 23 he-~ond whether i~'s a legal lot or not is before us, eno to hold her up in any way to me 2% doesn'~ seem proper, nhaE if other agencies in Town don't wane no make 5he ~ecision or they're 25 going to take too long to make the decision, nnat's nc5 our purview. So i think we ought tc June 22, 2004 31 1 2 gem on with mhis. Later on sba'il come back to us if that's the case. She doasn'~ have an 3 applicanion one way or the other with us and regardless of when someone in nhe auOience may get 4 up to salT, guess when, they don't have ~he power to .determine whether this is a let or net, any S more than we do. I think that this ladf should go away from here today with us deliberating on the 6 application she has pun before us and amen~e~ se.~en times_ So beyond that, · mean, nhe 7 neighbors an~ trio applicant can do whatever thel feel is necessary to make their own lives happy, $ bun it's jus~ not before us. Whether nhis is a lon er not is net Oefore us. Se I don't think we 9 shoulO be making a determination one ~a~ or nhe o~her on it; that's mi' opinion_ I would hope tha~ 10 we coul,~ ~o that_ HS. VICTOROFF~ I agree winh you. if you 11 could make a denerminamion on the surve5 then · cculd contingent on my ability to get confirmation 12 from Mike Verity as to wnenher it is a legal lo~_ BO~iD MEMBER DINIZiO: It wouldn't be 13 ccntingenn, ma'am. We are maMing nhe decision based on the fac~s ~hat are presented to us and on 14 ~he a~plicanion presented to us base~ on the notice of disapproval. Beyen~ ~han, I feel, it's 15 enl, my opinion, ~hat we make a decision, it ieesn't mean that you're going to get that house; 16 it just means nhat we made a decision based on ~he ap~licanion before us and the building inspector 17 may find something else nhan's net proper, bun our lecisien doesn't force him Eo allow you to build 18 that house or give you a building permin. This is a very small piece of what looks like a huge pie iS here of litigation or whatever is going to happen, and we jusn need ~o make a decision based on nhese 20 and our decision doesn't, to my mind, doesn't hinge on whether ~hese lots are merged or not. 21 CHAIRWO[~h~i'~ 0LIVA: Let's move alang. I'~ like no make a resolunien closing the hearing 22 subject ~e the submission efa determination of the £egalitf of nhe lot from nhe building 23 tepartmenn. ~See minutes for resolueion_i 24 HR. FITZGERALD: When does t~at mean? If ~e present this documentation no you, you will 2h continue as if you had it here and now? CHAIRWOM~i'~ OLiVA: Correct_ June~, 2004 32 1 2 NS. KOWAhSKI: If E~ere's a deuermination Eha~ Ehere's a problem, then i~ will he a separate ~ application_ CHAIRWO~t~2~ OLIVA: Thank you ,~ery much 4 for coming in. t{R_ FITZGERALD: Thank CHAIRWOMSl'~ OLIVA: Next nearing is for 6 Kef. in and Susan Perrell, who wish Eo ex,end ~heir dec~ and build a pool a~ less than 100 feet from ~ ~ne bluff in MatEi~uck. NS. HESSIA2~O: ,Seed morning, my name is 8 TaEherine Hessiano_ i'm here on ~ehalf of Ehe Serrells, who are the owners ef proper~i located 9 a~ 130 hioyds Lane in MaEEi~uck. We are here before you requesting a 10 yariance for a setback from ~he bluff ef loss Enan 100 fee~_ Hr. and Hrs. Perrell purchased ~his 11 property a couple years ago; at that time they were given a CO for ~he structure that was issued 12 in 198%. At that time the final survef shows a house wi~h an aEtached deck, b~ Ehe CO was 13 wri~Een, for lack of a be~er ~erm, very poorly, ani it just s~a~es a new dwelling. I~ didn't 14 illuminate ~he perEinences and attachments. The final survey shows a deck, however, Ehe Building 15 De~arEmen~ didn'~ specifically s~a~e a deck_ That's part of Ehe reason why we're here before 16 you. Mrs. and Hrs_ Ferrell are proposing te replace their existing deck. They heven'n naken 17 it down yeE, it's sEill standing sErong. They found in doing some exploratory surgery, if ~ou 18 will, hhey found Ehat the deck was nee er is nee shructur~liy sound enough in that its footings are 19 ieficienE, and therefore, they want te rebuild the deck in-kind/in place with new conforming 20 s~ructura£ supports with new conforming structural supports, in conjunction wiEh that, Mr. and Mrs_ 21 Ferrell would like te extend the exisEing deck easherl? and wiEhin thee deck place a pool. I 22 weuli like to give the Beard a copy of Ehe plan Decause I undersnand there's been some confusion 23 as te what is the proposal_ I ha~e a suOmission here nhan I'm going ~o give you nhan has e number 24 of o~her ~hings Ehat i'll get to_ The exisning deck zs approximately 25 91 and a ~a£f feen from the edge of the ~luff, and Hr. and Hrs. Perrell are proposing nhan deck June 22, 2004 33 1 2 extension easterly ef the existing deck and a slight extension seaward that would give them 3 nhe nearese peinn 55 feet setback from ~he Bluff. BOARD MEHBER TORTOPA: with the pool. % HS. ?,IESSI~ffO: That will encompass Eke pool in the decking. 5 ,2HAIRWOH~2I OLI%:e: That's going to be an above greunfl? 6 MS. MESSIANO: That would be hechnicallf a an above-ground pool because they're no~ digging 7 i~ down into Ehe earth. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Hew deep is that 8 pool? NR. FERREhL: The pool is 52 inches in 9 heigh~. MS. NESSIA[~O: Four ~nd-a-half feet_ 10 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Thank MS. HESSI£~iffO: Does the Board katie 11 ~uestions? BOARD MEMBER ORLANDO: No quesUions, 12 commann. They did a nice job putting it in and angle, puuuing it in close to the house. 1 13 ccmmend ~llem. MS_ HESSIANO: ThaU was our innention 1% try and snug it up as close as we cou£~. CHAIRWOMi~2ff OLIYA: I'm glad you looked 15 inno nhe footings of nhe deck_ Hy son has a deck sinning at the etge out in Seattle, very cognizann 16 of nhe fact of having it s~ructura££y sound besause when you have parties on Ehem, the~'ve 17 collapset. MS. MESSIANO: I had 30 people aE my house 18 !ash week an~ I decided ~o entertain down on the lawn rate, er than 12 feet up. 19 CMAI RWOMAi,I OLIVA: Smarn. Lydia? BOAP_D MEMBER TORTORA: How high is Ehe 20 decking? NS. HESSiANO: Four ant1 a-half feet higP~_ 21 BOi~i%D [',iENBER TORTC, RA: And Ehe dec~ing is going ne be flush with nhe peel? 22 MR_ FERRELL: Actuall? the c~ecking is going to be up five and-a half feet, six facE_ 23 MS. HESSI}2~O: Depending en ~he contour of the ground, hut l?es, it will be f£usn with the 2% pcol. CHAiRWO~,L~2,I OLIVA: oim? 25 BOARD MEMBER DINIZiO: No. CHAIRWOHAi~ OLIVA: Jerry, ~,ou're okay. June=~, 2004 34 1 2 BOARD NEHBER GOEHRINGER: I ha~e no ohjecnien no it as long as all of the deckinc 3 remains open to the ski'. MS_ HESSIANO: That is our in~ention_ 4 CHAIP_WOM~{ OLIVA: See if a~ybo~y else in ute audience wishes to speak on Oehalf of uhis 5 application? ~.IS. MESSI~IO: Before yen do t~at, i know 6 ~nat ~here will be comments from ~he audience, an~ I would like to address that. i~ came te our ~ a~en~ion after our application was submitted and {}ur notices were mailed out than Neneysuckle Hills 8 has covenants and restrictions ~ha~ prohibit the installation of an above groun~ swimming pool; 9 Yha~ was brough~ Eo Mr_ Farrell's atEenEion_ We did some research. Mr. Ferrell nas met with some 10 of his neighbors who are officers of the Honeysuckle Hills homeowners Association. He has 11 Drepared a leUEer and nhe board has prepared a letter te be sent ~e ute preperts~ owners asking 12 them ~.s vo~e oh t~e issue. The,~- ~idn't ~,~an~ ~o send tram out nnEil t~e Board ~ad rendered its 13 decis4on. So we're aware tnaE there is and will be commenus te uhat effect. But I would jusu like 1% ~o say that I've been before this Board in t~e past ,~here in specificall!, iE was stateO Eha~ it 15 is not the Board's position or purpose ~o enforce coyenants. So tRaE is not aN issue that nee{s ~o 16 he expounded on in this hearing. I think uhe Ewe issues should stand separatell' because witMenE 17 3, our permission a ouilding permit will not be issued and without the permission of ~he 18 association, the bull{lng permit will net be issued. So I just wanned to suaEe Uhau so ~hau we 19 didn't drag nhis out any longer than necessary. Antached ne the map than I gave you is t~e 20 letter from ~he property owners association to its members requesting their vote and Mr. an~ Mrs. 21 Farrell's corer letter explaLning ~¢} ~heir neigMbors w~au their intention is. ~nd I would 22 iust like Eo sas' t~a~ at t~e time that those covenants were constructed, I think it was 23 probabl~ the intent of those individuals ~e eliminate ~he possibi£iuf of na~ing ~h~u ~ery 24 a~EracEive large blue plastic ~hing in the middle of the backyarO percheO precarieusll' close to the 2b bluff, and a~ ~he ~ime ~he setback was at 75 ~een. T~ere is a seubeck res~ricEion of 7S feet June 22, 2004 2 so in no case could iu have been built closer, hut the thought processes at the time these were 3 csnsuructed and the thought processes now are a little ,different as is the zoning. Ne would have 4 been allowed ~his under the zoning at the time this house was constructed. So I would just like 5 not ~o drag it out any farther ~han i have already. 6 ,2ti-~IRWOM.~i'~ C, LIVA: Is there anybody else who would like te - 7 NS. CAPPELLINO: ~, i would like te speak. Hy name is Louise Cappellino, 65 Soundview 8 Avenue. i am ease of the Ferreli property, which is directly next to nhem. I have a prepared 9 s~a~ement which I wrote, and I ~vill give you a copf of the stanement. My husband was not able ~o 10 be here, so I speak for both him and myself. "We have lived in Matti~uc],~ [or 25 years 11 and still can remember when the properEy west of us was all weeded. Over uhe years the property 12 ,,,as developed, and we realized that our neighbors were seeking the same life we were seeking in 13 MattiEuck. "Nith regards te the proposal for the 14 absve ground pool, we would like to sEa~e the following: According te the plans it is our 15 belief that Ehis structure will diminish the scope cf our ?iow we have enjoyed over the ,~ears_ The 16 proximity of the structure raises tremendous doubt as to uhe adverse effecus this will impact on our 17 property ,~aiues. The Ferrell deck is high and our property has a more sloping and h~lly effect 18 ~hereby making the structure's elevation higher than what is being shown. This plan lacks fact, 19 elevation of this structure lacks definition. There is contradiction in measurements pertaining 20 to pool and deck size_ Perr~aps this is nhe reason for lack ef stats pertaining t,o elevation. Pools 21 have drainage cellars; where: woula Ehese be placed and where would iu drain into? The proximity of 22 the structure also raises ar~ additional threat as the pc. Eential of a water leak_ 23 "As stated, our property is naturally sloped. The water would then run east creating 24 satch basins for thousands of gallor~s of chlorinated wa~er. For those of us who have lived 25 t_~ere long enough are well aware of the intense nor'easters Ehau have hiu this area and the June 22, 2004 36 1 2 su~sequenh destruction. Twice we lose s. ur stairs to the beach and three times we watched the cliff! 3 cascade down taking with iE all the vegetation. Ne replanEed and also hoped thee it weu~{ ne~er 4 c, ccur again_ The winter the ice and snow is formiOable. These above-ground pools have been 5 known to burst when the ground is frozen. Where will ~his waEer go? What en?ironmental crisis 6 would we face for the bluff and surrounding prcperties. The siEe selecEion for nhis structure 7 is ill conceived and no~ a wise choice. Their front Nroparty offers a betEer advantage and more 8 area. it has been our belief ~hat an above-ground psol was never an option for recreaEion si~cR as 9 proposed. The aesthetics for Ehis proposal is not conduci-~e to life on ~he bluff. The sEruc~ure is 10 an eye sore. We do not seek to £essen the enjoymenE Hr. and Mrs. Perrell seek, hewe~,er iE [s 11 cur opinion ~ha~ our life will change, and the view that we have come to love will be co~promised 12 as well as Lhe potential for damage to Ehe properly 13 "We are asking the Board to deny the requesL and hope this will non cause our neighbors 14 ~.~ look unkindly on us_ Thank you, Louise Cappellino." 15 MS. ±CC,WALSKI: Could we ask for a copy? MS. CAPPELLINO: Yes, I have one, I ~ave 16 six copies. ,2HAIR~OH~ OLIVA: Ansone else thee 17 ~shes ~o speak for or against? Mr. HcGreevy? [dR. MCGREEVY: M~~ name is Ran McGreevy, 18 2b0 L!oy~'s Lane. i'd like Ed give these ts ~he Bcard so ~ney can leo~ Ehem over as I spea~_ 19 I want te ad~ress this on three separate levels. One, the Town deer neE, nor should the 20 Tcwn, enforce private covenants and restrictions, bu~ if informed ef legally recorded covenants and 21 restrictions, the}~ should be respected. This is jusE such a case. Honeysuckle Hills Property 22 O?;ners association dces ne~ allow abo~,e ground pools, period. Also, our covenants and 23 res~ricEions do net allow for a variance to ge forward unless i~ has been appro~ed by eno hundred 24 persent of the propers!~ owners_ This particulaz association has 18 properties. To ge back even 25 furEher, not~ing can be done Ed Ehe properny unless it's approzed by Ehe association and its June 22, 200% 37 1 2 architectural committee, ef wh~cA I am a member. Now, that's one, they have been reenforced 3 b-' our constitution ~hat s~ates, and I've given 5-ou a copy of it, proposals impacEing deed 4 covenants and restrictions must be reviewed with an~ approves by legal counsel before ~hey can be b brought ~o a veto, they require unanimous approval of all property owners wiEheut e~ception_ I 6 ~hink ~ha~ the Board here should respect those consonants, and I ha-?e put the libor and page 7 number on there, they are recordee. Moving en from tna~, I got a notice from 8 the Town that Ehis was ~aking place, i went ~here ~e look a~ Ehe recerOs, t~e paperwork that the 9 Ferrells and their expediEor have forwarded to you, and I find they Oen't even knew the size of 10 Eheir peel and deck area. I have uhree separate ~umbers -- or 5'eu have -- in the paperworK. On 11 5 '12,04, the5, seato tine pool and deck area will be 350 square feet, then on 5/14, in a letter from 12 ~he expediter te Ruth Olive, thai' sta~e 860 square feet, that's an inorease of S10 square feet in %we 13 da~s. I wonder what they're going to build. In uhat packet, you also have paperwork stating Ehat 14 it's going to be 800 square fee~. In all than paperwork this is an 15 above-ground pool in a very delioa~e area, every one of ~'ou are aware of Ehat. Nowhere do I see 16 any ele;ations of the preper~y recoree.i; although i ho see a piece of paper from the expeditor 1~ saying that the~' will be pro~ided. Ha~,e nhey ever prsvide~ it? This deck is net an above ground 18 deck, it is really above groun.i, because where the pool ~s going if it's only four and a-half feet, 19 what's happening te Ehe other fsot under iE. I Ehink on tha~ it should be disapproved 20 ~l.aw, on t~e main issue, ~he sensiEi~,ity ef the Oluffs, mosE of you are aware of Ehe 21 uremendous problems that ha~e happened east of Ma~ti~ck Inlet Es those bluffs, they get denude~ 22 of vegeuation ever an~ ever again. Te allow an above ground pool where uhere is a pessibilit2 of 23 lightning s~rike or lightening s~rikes hi~ing , trees going dowm on the pool an~ releasing all 24 that water will defir~itely carr5 uhe nap ef uhe bluff awei and prcbabl2' mos~ of the vegetation on 25 ins way down to the beach, lu should be disapproved on ~hat reason. June 22, 2,304 38 1 1 .... Hy 2 i ha,?e owned by properny since ~ _ yard facing the Sound has been struck by 3 iigh~ening nw~ce. Once it blew out the sprinkler s_~stem, the second time is blew up a tree and I 4 had glowing lumber all over m? yard. If that same scenario were uo happen and hit an above ground ~ pool, it would be disastrous to ~he bluff. The flood plain area in ~his area is a 6 gesd deal higher ~han the bluff, on ~ha~ alone this also should be disapproved. That's all ~ 7 ha~e Eo say. Thank you. ~H_~IRNOI.£~/~ OLiVA: Thank you, Hr. 8 HcGreevy. Is the. re anyone else who wishes to ~=~k. Yes, Doris? 9 NS_ MCGREEVY: Doris ....... Mc,=r==,.:. i am the Ferreil's neighbor, and it's unfortunate that we 10 have ~o speak in this arena aE this time o~er ~his beoause in our covenants we do have a process, and 11 r~he Ferreils ha~e been in the association or been liYing ~here for a fe~ ]'ears, and have been 12 invited [o the meeEings and so fer~h_ So, as I say, I feel very uncomfortable, but having said 11 ~hat I do. have to ]us~ speak mi mind. I feel and mi' husband, also, Eha~ it's not 1% in keeping with ~he neighborhood. Having an above-ground pool in that location along the 15 bluff, in's unheard el. So this would be a very significan~ variance because once something like 16 ~ha~ is accepted, ~here may be other people on ~he kluff wh~c feel, well, you know, or the Ferrells 17 ha~.e now begun a new nrend. L~d nhaE disturbs me bso, Oecause we have spoken abouE uhe fragile 18 nature ef the bluff, and environmentally, we really have to consider tha~. 1S, Fhe o~her poin~ I wa~l~ ~o make, and i'm responding to uheir expediuor's words, Mrs_ 20 Hessiano, she said chat now, coda,f, the fIood processes are differenn about above-ground pools, 21 ma]he, but I ~hink they are differen~ in the face ~han nhey're susceptibiii~y ~c. endangering the 22 cliffs is very, var?, significant here. I ten't really believe ~hat the above-ground pool, the big 23 blue thing, I don'~ ~hink ~ha~'s the question here_ i don't care whet color i~ is personaii!,~, 24 but I do know that li,,.ing en the bluff and loving living in i,Ia~i~uck and having this iifesEyle, 25 ~hey can find a place where iE's safer for Ehe en.~ironment and the people that are aicngside i~ June 22, 2,2,04 39 1 2 because it may be an unsafe situation if somebody walks by, and it breaks or something like that, 3 e.en during ~Ne warm whether. During the said, whether ~he bluff freezes over so if that should 4 burs~ during a verl/ cold day, the land does not absorb iu It runs right off ute cliff, and ...... 5 seen blowouts a couple of doors down_ Yhe,:~ built some sort of wall and Ehere was a blowout and she 6 cliff took a grea~ deal of damage. So I'm asking you to consider this seriously. 7 And there is also room in the front of their home where most of the people on she bluff 8 do locate their in-ground pools. Thank you. CPLa_IRWOMAN OLIVA: is there anybody else 9 wh&} wishes te speak for or against this applicaEion? Any more questions from anyone en 1,2, Ehe Board? Jim? BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: I want ts. ask eno 11 .of Ehe homeowners, I guess I ceuid ask ~e~, I dcn'U knc. w. These covenants ani restrictions, ehe 12 rules that the gentleman handed me, how does that wor~? You purchase the house; do yoh~ have ~o sign 13 on uo this? [,'iS. HESsI=i~,s: No_ What happens is when a 14 properEy is developed during the develcpmen~ ~roeess covenants are desi gned that are 15 appropriate, for lack of a beuEer ,,~erd, at uhau Eime, and those covenants and restricEions are 16 imposed upon that land by recording ef those covenanEs_ r~m~d it's a recorded document, like a 17 deed weuid be a recorded document, se it sets forth, leu know, you shouidn'E have cleEhes lines, 18 no garbage cans iR the fron~ yard, you can't park beat trailers in ,four driveway, er house urailers, 19 you can'U ha?e flee roofs, et cetera_ So iE will restricz cr direct the development ef the 12. ts ill 20 that proper~'. So that process occurs a~ the time that the propertg is developed. 21 Now, you don't seek membership. It's not as uhcugh you went to a yacht club and ssi,i, gee, 22 I'd like Lo buy into that and i want 5o be a member ,of that and pal~ dues. It runs with the 23 land. Sc. when yo~ buy a house in an area Ehere are covenanEs and restric'nions aLsached n.o than 24 iced. No~v Hr. and Hrs. Ferreii and I had a discussion wi5h about Ehis and at ne time 25 because the:, nave reviewed their paperwork - were 5hey e~er made aware thee there were covenants and June 22, 2004 1 2 restrictions, or to the exeunt thaE the covenanEs an{ restrictions had reached. 3 So this was something that came during ntis process, Out to answer your questions, % co~enanes and restrictions are designed, constrnc~ed by the developer of the site_ They 5 are recorded wiEh deeds ~o the property, and it's a cen{ition that runs with Ehe property just like 6 an easemen~ wo~lld run with the property. Have I said answered your quesEion? 7 BO3P_D HEMBER DINIZIO: I want to get how do 2~ou gel Eo know about these restricEions? 8 There is a restriction in here that sa~s you can'~ sell it unless your neighbor says so. So, my 9 assumption is if I'm going to purchase a house, I would wane to know thac. I jusu need to know what 10 process iE is -- NS. HESSI~2.]O: I can answer thaE in ~ 11 generalization, when ~ou are in Ehe process of Suying a piece ef properuy, it should Oe incumbenc 12 upon Yhe seller to disclose everything about ~hat properEy. It should be incumbeNE upon the 13 purchaser or purchaser's atCorney t~rough their nitle processor the tiEle company te uncover these 14 things and the purchaser should make ~his known to the purchaser_ If there's a real estate broker 15 in, olved i~ should be incumbene upon the real estaEe broker no educate the purchaser as to what 16 he's buying besides the four wails_ So that's ~he mechanism for Ehat. Since it rnns wiEh ehe deed 17 and it's a recorOed document, when nhe eiele work is dena, it's something that should come up, 18 that's ~hy yom. buy title insurance. BOARD HEMBER DINIZIO: i guess I don't 19 know, di~ it cema up? }dS. MESSIA2~O: The Ferrells tol~ me that 20 they were net aware ef this, and than they have Oeen ~cld than their Eitle company could be 21 responsible or liable Zor ~heir net ha~ing been made aware of this. 22 hR. FERR~LL: Excuse me, may I clarify, ssme~hing here? Kevin Ferrell. We were maOe 23 aware thaE ~here is an association. We were told that ~here was e St0 annual fee and in essence 24 was to insure and take care, maintain the property gcing from Ehe stree~ down te the bluff, down the 25 stairs between our house and Hr. and Mrs. Mo~reevl~'s ho~se. Never were we made aware that June 22, 41 1 2 there were any onher sovenants cr anything of that sorE. We simply assumed it was a $50 annual fee 3 fur mainLellance of the paLh going down r. iuff. Ne were neT;er given a copy of the 4 covenants, never given anynhing_ Do I have an issue winh Ehe title company? Yes, I think i do S have _ BOARD PIEI~BER ORL}I~DO: And your closing 6 law-?er. MR. FERRELL: This lust came up last ~ I,~edneseay, so this is certainly all new Eo all of us. Thank you_ 8 BOARD ~IEHBER DINIZIO: I ~or~'~ know what, an attorney probably is going ns have to ~ell 9 this, but if I they're saiing a house can't be sold, ~han I guees I'm getting at is were these 10 consonants and restrictions enforced enniral¥, er are ~hey just pulled out when the assocmation 11 wants to pull nhem oun? If a house can't be sold there withouE the acknowledgement of nhe 12 association, then how are nhese people supposed know? That's my thought. 13 BOARD N[EI~IBER ORLANDO: Is this numOer 2, Jim? 14 BOARD ME[,IBER DINIZIO: I just read it somewhere. 15 MS_ MESSiANO: When you purchased ~he property did Dr_ Nbrreli ebnain approval from 16 assecianion to allow him to sell you nhe property? HR_ FERRP~LL: No. There was ertl_,~ a letter 17 from ~he associa~ion saying ~hat Dr. Morrell, the previous owner, was in good snanding eno ~is dues 18 were paid te date. BOARD i~IE[~[BER DINiZIO: So the assumpnion I 19 guess was he must ha,~e made them aware than he was selling nhe house, and they approved in? 20 HS. HESSI}2[O: if he got a letter in good sEanding, nhat would be the assumption. I would 21 just li~e ~o go hack to my earlier sna~ement, in is not this Board's posinion er authority 22 enforce covenants. That's something that is under the purview of the Building Department_ If :~ou 23 see fit -- why are ?ou shaking your hea{, Hrs. Tcrtora? 2% ~OARD HE~{BER TORTORA: E'm s~aking my head, actually when I purchase~ myself, a number 2~ of ~.ears ago, I researched t~is whole subject, and I was noid -- mi- attorz~el/ may have been wrong June 22, 200% 1 2 that it is net up to the municipality te enforce covenants a~d restrictions. Likewise, 3 propert~ they purchased ~id ~ave covenants end restrictions en it and I asked the legicai % questions t~aE's fine, who enforces them? It's a civil m~t~er. T~at was the answer that my 5 a~torney gave me. Not the Building Department, no one. 6 MS. MESSIANO: I'll back up and restate wna~ I was going to say. i~ has been 7 experience in ehe past that the Building E, eNartment of this ~own does leek into such 8 ma~ters, an~ I have known them to make decisions based on ERe contents of the covenants and 9 restrictions thaE are recorded against a property an{ are pare a subdivision approval. Whether er 10 no~ tne},'re suppeseO to legally is a ma~ter ~hat I don't e~en want to touch, bu~ I do have personal 11 knowledge of tRe Building Depar~men~ ef ~his te~n ~a~ing tha~ position. But I would like te go back 12 to m5' original statement and sa,~ tha~ we are spending a let ef time on this ce,~enant matter and 13 that's nee a matter for this beard to adjudicate. We're talking abe~t a setback 1~ variance far an e×isEing structure tha~ we believe ~haE the Building DeparnmenE was remiss in net 15 specifically listing on the original building certificate of occupancy in 1984 and we're asking 16 ~er a setback variance far 91 and-a Malf feet for the existing Oeck; eno we are asking for a 17 ~ariance of 15 feet to construct a proposed deck that is approximately 300 ~o 3~0 square feet, 18 ~viEhin which a pool will Se set_ CHAIRWOM}~.? OLI.JA: Jerry has one 19 question_ BOARD MEHBER GOEHRINGER: Mrs. Messiano, 20 you have come Sefore us witR numerous pool applications; how would you compare this pool 21 scmeone wanting to construct a lap pool, oni-~ the difference in design - and I'm answering the 22 ~ueshion for you is ehe fact uhaE these walls are supported by steel raLher ehan cement; is that 23 correct? MS_ PIESSIANO: That's n~' understanOing. 24 BOARD HEMBER ,30EHRINGER: In the ~owns of East Hampton and Southampton, they require 2~ cesspools,'sanitarv ~pe s/stem adjacen~ to ~heir peels for ~he purposes of pumping the peoi off, J~:ne 22, 200% 1 2 ~ohh in the win~er time and when and if the pool needs to be drained totally for the maintenance ef 3 Ehe pool? MS. ~,~ESSIf-2~O: Righ~, dry wells for 4 backwash_ BOARD MEMBER GOEHRI£,~GER: This eoard could 5 place Eha~ on restricEions on Ehe pooi if thel~ ~ere so inclined ~o granE this application. 6 MS. MESSIRNO: i believe the Ferrells would fully anticipate putting in such a dry well 7 because they would not be so shc. r5sighEe.i as 5c, pull the plug and lee h©wever man~' gallons were 8 contained in ~he pool run freely. ,~P_RD I[ENBER GOEHRiNGER: sec~.ndls, ~his 9 Board could impose some sort of lattice work underneath uhe deck so as not ~o see the pool. 10 [,'IS. HESSI}~[O: That is already proposed if ycu look at m~~ s]c_eEches, ~hat there is lattice 11 proposed the entirety ef the face of the decking se as ncr to have an open exposed site. 12 BOARD NIEMBER GOEHRiNGER: Thirdly, this is the most unpopular eno because ,,,~e den'~ like te 13 kreech Lhis issue, and I'm referring as a general staEement but I'm going Lo ciEe specifically and 14 say i~'s from me, is it your undersEanding ~hat ~here is an-:, scenic easemenE oyer this ~roperEy? 15 MS. MESSIA2.~C,: I have no knowledge ef any scenic easemen~ over the properUy, and i woult 16 like to further state ~hat Hrs_ Cappellino, who mate the first sEatement, spoke abouu her scenic 17 v~ews, eE ceEera, the area be~,~een their property and ute Farrell's deck and proposed deck is 18 woc dud_ BOARD ~,IEMBER GOEHRINGER: That' s what I 19 noticed. MS. CAPPELLINO: No, i~'s neE. In the 2,} fail the leaves fall and i~'s all open_ There ~lsed to be woods, there is no woods, it's nee any 21 more. It's all open. MS. M~SSIANO: This proposed str~lctura and 22 the existing structure conforms Eo Ehe required side yard. Ne're not requesting a side yard 23 variance, nor are we requesEing a height ,-ariance. Ne're not proposing a structure Ehat is solid end 2~ obstructive. It also angles away from, if book e~ my sketch, I take ~hat back, it does 25 no~. But subtleLy, it's probably not visible to Eke naked eye, but subtlety £t does angle awa_~ June 22, 20C, 4 1 2 from ERe side yard as Ehe lot line Eravels in a seaward direction because the house is not 100 3 percent square on the lot. Hy c.~her commenE is ~hat Ehe front yard is hOE a viable alternatiye 4 for the pool because of the (a! location of the sepEic sysEem, the conueurs, nhe ..egetaEion. 5 There would be major construction necessary ~e wipe eu~ the front yard ef than property, take 6 a~zay ERe dri~-eways, eE cetera, in erbar to put a pool_ In tha~ woulO be more deleterious Eo Ehe 7 nature and character of the area, I think, then ~o extend Ehe deck because except for this pool 8 issue, I don't Ehink any of these neighbors woul~ Se here. To exuend this deck -- I forget t~e 9 width, Kevin. MR. FERRELL: The exisEing deck is 13 10 and-a-half feeE_ HS. ~.[ESSI}2~C,: From side te side, from 11 easu to ~esE, uhe new deck is hsw big? BOARD MEMBER GC, EHRINGER: It's an 12 irregular shape. HS. HESSI}2~O: 28 fee~. If we were 13 overall ~o exuen{ the existing deck withouu a swimming pool in it, 28 feet b~, 30 feeE in a 1% north-south direction, I don't think we'~ nave a neighbor here to comment on Ehis because it does 15 nothing bu~ increase ~hat ~orizonEal plain a~ that fi~e ani-a-half ~e six an~ a half fooE level, so I 16 really don't support the contenEions that were made. AnO again, we're here to discuss a seEbac~ 17 variance of 8S fee~ and ~1 feet for ~he existing dec]{ Eo be reconstructed. 18 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: LasEly, Mrs_ Hessiano, I need Ehe exact gallonage ef that pool_ 19 it doesn't have to Oe given ~o us today. ,2E~IRWOHf~{ Ohio/A: I'd like to make a 20 resolution closing this hearing and reser~ing iecision un~i£ la,er. 21 MR. P~CGR~EVY: I'm going ~e make it ~ery shorE. First of a11, I heard the e×penditor say 22 that wMen the house was builE the setback was 75 foot, that's completely in error. In 1984 iE was 23 100 feeE, jusE like it is now_ I'm a founder ane an officer in an organizaEion that is made ef ep 28 of practically everi, Sound fronE homeowner all aroun~ the inlet and from the inle~ east, ali 2~ around Cutchogue. · do ne~ know of one above ground pool. ·h is tough to buil~ a pool en June 22, 200% %5 1 2 the bluff net in ~he front yard no~ in ~he back yarO, you always wind up with ,~ariances. Ever~- 3 veriance ~hat nas been granted, people na~..e put ~hem on the side and in tl~e front yard_ To sa,_,' { the front of ~his property is no~ a place ~o put a poo£, there's well over half an acre on the frenE S of '~lieir propert~~, well over 27,000 square fee~_ You can find an area te put a pool there_ 6 F~r~her, e,~eryone in this association has known about these covenants. Pracnically all with the ? exception of one have put variances in for bulkReads and received them; and they also 8 £n~o the association an~ received 100 percen~ approval te put the variance in. Now, if everyone ~ else can do it, · think ~he Ferrells can. Personal£y, I have no objection for ~hem putting 10 in a variance for an in ground pool because to say nha~ aboye ground peals doesn't affecn a 11 neighberhee~ is a lo~ of baloney. We don't want Nat~iEuck, we don't wan~ Lleyds l, ane Eo star~ 12 loa~ing like western Nassau County with ail those above-groenO pools_ They do hate an effec~ sn ere 13 neighborhood; in-ground pools, not so, bu~ a~s~e ground pools hove an effect on 1% neighborhood. I've seen ~5' bluff hleweu~ fear ~imes, everl, bit of vegetaEion gone_ Madam 15 Chairman, you know Ehat. CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: I know, ~hank yo~l. 16 ~{R. HCGREEVY: It's veri? dangerous up there and water, especially in ~t~e win~er when 17 Ehose Oluffs are frozen, the erosion is Eremendoes. I don'n care w[-~am vegetaEion you 18 ha~.-e, ~rees, shrubs, bushes, gro-end co?er, ik all goes. Thank you. 19 ~C, APdD [~IE[.IBER DIN~ZIO: Sir, I jusE wane ask v©u e few questzons. Going ~owards Ehese 20 covenants and restrictions. Do you gu~ys meet regularl5'? 21 hR. MCGREEVY: Yes. The Perrells nave never been to a meeting. 22 SOARD [~IEI~'[SER DiNIZIO: Ail I want te do is yc~ handed up something, · want Yo make sure ~hat 23 ~hes"re valid. If you're meeting regularly, soun,~s to me when ~he gentleman sold the house 2% must have sstnehow call, acted yon; is ~ha~ Erue ~,~hen they scld the house to these people? 2g ~.iR. MCGREEVY~ Ne. · jus~ copied cereain sections of uhose covenanEs; I highlighted them oune 22, 2004 1 2 because Ehey per~ain to this, the others Can't. The association only issues semeEhing net 3 that you can er can't sell your property, EheI just sell it, trey write something thee says they % have paid all their dues. We just finished with a property in Fairleighs Beach Road_ Woman who sold b Ehe proper~y was named ScarabS, never pai~ dues_ They were forced Ed pay dues when the house was 6 s©l~. T~e new owner ha~ te pay the dues. Now ~he dues are non set at X amount. They're not for 7 beautifying Ehe gully; Ehef're for paying taxes, paying insurance and for maintaining Lhe 8 properEy. CHAIR~O[~2{ 0LiVA: We need a Oreak right ~ now. So if Jim wanes to carry on the con~ersation wiEh you - 10 BC,ARD MEMBER DINIZIO: No, that's fine. CHAIRWOMAN OLIYA: I'~e made a resol~a~Jon 11 closing t~e hearing an.O reserving decision until later. 12 ,.See minuEes for reseluuien.i 13 CHAIRWOMAN O~IVA: ReconveRe our public hearings_ 14 HS. MOORE: Do you want to finish up on VillanEi? lb CHAIRWO~.%~2~ OLIVA: Go ahead_ MS. MOORE: These are important poinEs 16 tnaE I don'E wane him te lose, bnE Ed ~egin with, I wa~t te emphasize the fact that the preper~y 17 righ~ now is a dangerous cendieien. The house is there, the gabien and the bulkhead is exposed, and 18 i~'s right next to the boat ramp, so tRe boat ramp is a public facility. 19 CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: The Ooat ramp is closed elf. 20 HR. VILLYi,4TI: The bean ramp is closed off, but it's an enhancemenE that more people come 21 down there. CHAIRWOMAN OLiVA: You cannot launch ~our 22 LeaE because of ~he guard rail. MS. P{OORE: BuE it is a puOlic facility 23 thee people use. Se iE is open and a hazar~ Ed Ehe owner as well as to the Town. 24 WhaE I did is I Eoek from my files several documents, the first one here are photographs 25 Eakea 11/24,02_ This is eno of the OcEober storms and this is when the town boat ramp, the end June! 22, 200% 47 1 2 collapsed and caused further damage to my ciien~'s ~2roper~y. i~ shows the storm damage ~ha~ can 3 occur there and that's why the gabion, the bulkhead, all ~he structures tha~ have teen placed 4 there have been required by ~he DEC, the Trustees and ~he owner wants them. Le~ me start with this 5 document, one by one. Here are photographs, the E, cteber storm. Hr_ Orlando asked whether or nee 6 the deck was discussed aE the TrusLees, fact, the original '93 permit that was issued by 7 uhe TrusUees which had then later been - because DEC took so long, you only have two years on these 8 permits, yeu have to ge. back and re hear and ex~end it. We were before the Trustees once 9 before in 2000, 2002, you have t~e permit in there. The permit itsel~ was Uo reconsEruct the 10 deck and home within the existir~g footprint and aid a wave attenuation gabion revetment within ~he 11 focuprinu of the same. So here ~here's a permit~ issued b5~ Bredermyer and Board Members that were 12 in place in June ef 1993_ I have that, i'll just list ~l~e documents I have. I also pulled ou~ from 13 m? file, consultants. He was originally retained by Sandra 14 Zatarian, who is the prior o,,.~'ner. He reci~es tt~e history ef this property, and that in 1992 the lB northeaster had torn out a bulkhead which occurre,~ an the so~thern end of the properuy opposite nhe 16 southern end of ~he Town boat ralnp_ This bulkhead was evi.ienced on the '72 survei?, and had just been 17 replaced in 1991. A second wooden wall or bulkhead was apparenu at the southern end ef the 18 deck; it ',¥as intact a~ the time. The survey in t}ze phoLegraphs were part of the evidence efa 19 case ~hat was at the DEC. The DEC back in 1992 gave ZaEarian the prior owner a real hard Eirae 2,3 ~.bsut rebuilding the bulkhead. They apparentll? tidn't see i~ on their maps, but iE was ~here_ So 21 they ended up going te court, and the c©urt, in.iex Number 92-11934, granted the applicant Ehe right 22 to replace, reinstall the bulkhead in its original !ocaEion_ 23 He goes en and on and talks aboeu nhe fact 24 this le~er? MS. K~N~-i~S5.1.-~'~ ' ~Io, bu~ we'll ge~ the 25 letter from you. MS_ HOOR~: He goes into the hisbsry_ June 22, 200~ 1 2 The other tocuments I found in my file in 1971, the Building DeparEment issued a permiE Ee build 3 an addition and make alteraEions to the existing d~Jelling_ That permit shows actually the % enclosure gone in '71, which was enclosing a reofe{ over part of the strncEure, the main 5 sEru.2ture, but it also shows the open deck Ehat was pare of the original permit. So you nave 6 evidence that ~he Town actuall5 recognized in application processes thee showed thee nhe deck 7 was there. I'm submiEting everything one by eno. I think there might he some confusion and 8 maybe it's mi' doing, I apologize, wi~h respec~ to the let coverage issue. The dec~ doesn't go along ~ the entire property line. iE begins, and I have a deck suryey here that might be mere helpful, 10 says survey 10 '22.'02, C-E-H L added 1"13. 02, and the deck there shows where it begins and iE 11 actually' seer, s wit~ a little sEoep going Eo nhe fron~, it doesn't include the decking. There is 12 no decking en the north end of Bay Avenue en ~he north side ef the property_ The decking is the 13 original decking that was in place so tha~s consistent wit~ the let coverage that was 14 .2a£culated. The deck begins here an~ JE begins on this side here. This area to the north is 15 decking_ Maybe that's what, ± think, Jerry, ~eu and I were - 16 ~OARD MEMBER GC, EHRIN,SER: Pat, does the preperEy line go ~o the bul~head? 17 [,iS. MOORE: On the south side_ BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: There's goE to 18 be more property than that. CHAIRWO~4AN OLIVA: There isn't 19 IdS. ~dOORE: There were Ewo bulkheads, --es. The bulkhead, nhe currenE bulkhead is placed 2,3 four fee~ landward ef the property line_ BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: That's the 21 question, though, was the 76 percenE calculated on the o10 in place/in kind, er was it calculaEed 22 the new in place,,'in kind bulkhead? [dS. MOORE: It was on the new 23 in-place'in-kind. ,2HAIRWONL~2~ OLIVA: Supply ~h~t Eo us. 24 roes anybety else haye anl~ q~estiens? NIS_ MOORE: Wait, wai~, wait. I have 2b msre papers. I wane Eo snow 2~ou as much as possible. June 22, 200% 49 2 CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: Submit it ~e us in writing_ 3 HS. MOORE: I only ha..e two more sheeEs. in '71 you have Ehe building permi~ I gate you. 4 The Town actually ~ook a photograph in I believe '¥1, afEer uhe alterations, uhe renovations to uhe 5 house, and it actually shows the bulkheae excuse me, shows the decking which incorporates 6 t~e bulkhead ~hat was ~here a~ the time. So you have the Town pictures EhaE show ~he eecking in ~ place. And finally, I ha~e the set of plans that Ehe Building Department, we were using for tne 8 Building Department ~hat shows ~he area of the Socking ~hat's being replaced and hopefully that 9 will assis~ leu as well. So here's everything I na~e from my file thau I think adequately supports 10 our position that the decking was there. We're replacing what was there and the Board could 11 acEually over5urn the Building Department's inuerpreEation 5hat when you ta~e a deck 12 temporarily to puE in underlying sErucsures and the 2%2 section of the code says you can repair 13 and replace what's existing, EhaE we shouldn't De Mere for ~he ~ariance. C, Eherwise, ~eu gransed us 14 n~e variances we're requesting, Out ~o not h~ve a lock there where it's been proposed really does 15 end up with a very unsafe s~ructure un{er uhe Mouse and expose uhe Oulkhead. 16 MS. KOWALSKI: I had one quesuion_ You made statements a~ouu the building inspector; are Ii -'au ~ithdrawing ~hose statements about whau buil4ing inspectsr said or do ysu wane uhe Board 18 ~z. atjourn i~ so we can have tha~ clarifie~ b-~ ENo BuilOing Department? 19 MS. MOORE: If you feel there's adequate prE. of in your file to support our posiuien, then 20 we don't need to ha?e the building ~nspecter nero_ MS. ±{ONALSKI= YOU ha;e to furnish cuber 21 copies uha~ we don't have. MS_ MOORE: You want me a~ ~he mi~e or 22 you want me te hand you the copies? Any other questions? 23 CHAIRWOHAN OLI,~A: I'd like ne make a mcEion closing Ehe nearing and reserving decision 24 unnii la,er. PIS. KOwALSKI. Subject ~o nme breakdown on 25 ~he lo~ coverage. HS. HOORE: For ~he record I want E.o put June 22, 2004 1 2 in photographs of the open s~ructure right ~lew se %,~e can have in ~he file the contitions that are 3 presently ex_isling. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Before I second 4 thaE, Ruth, assuming a deliberation siEuation, there are questions ~hat we still need ~o ask the S building inspector, we ~ay need ~o reopen ~he hearing. 6 MS. ROWALSKI: C,f course. ^ ~' ' ~ ~OEMRIN~=ER: that B ~.P_P.D HEMBER ~ ~ In case 7 I' il second. ~,See minutes for resolution.) CHAIRWOI,~_N ~LI ~_. Next hearing is 9 Wolleben en Bridge Lane in Cutchogue. They wish Els do a new accessory garage. 10 MS. MESSIAi~O: CaEherine Messiano oz~ behalf Df John Wolleben, the owner ef the subject 11 property_ .Subject sine is a 1.06 acre ,.,;auerfront ]c.U located on uhe southwest corr~er of Bridge Lane 12 and Bayberry Road in Nassau Point. Property is zoned R40. We're before you reqk~esting relief 13 from uhe required front yard seuback for an a.u.2essory structure Ehat is proposed to replace an 14 existing accessory s~ructure, an existing legal accessory snrucnure. The existir~g strucnure is 15 presently 40 fee~ from the front lot line, and the existing s~ructure is set caddi~~ corner to the 16 front lot line. We're proposing to replace that accessory s~rucnure wi~h ~ 24 by 30 two car 17 :ie~ached garage with storage above_ We're n~eeting the required side yard setback ef 10 feeE, and we 18 are requesting ~he 35 fooE setback from the front. This being a wauerfroet loc, we are allowed an 19 azcessorl,- structure in the front yard under your code, ant we are asking for relief of ~l~at 20 rezluired fron~ yard setback. Do you h~e ~uestions? 21 ~H~IR~uMAN OLiVA: The garage is going to be as ~he 21 feet te the ridge? Ms MBSSI:A2~O: That's correct. 22 '~. CHAIRWOMA2~ OLIVA: The upstairs is going 23 to he used just for storage? MS. NIESSiANO: Jus~ for storage. 24 CHA~IRNO~,~_z2.~ OLIVA: Any elec~ricit:- or water in the garage? 25 MS_ HESSiANO: There will be water in the 8stage. It's waEerfrent properu%-, boating, June 22, 200~ 51 1 2 fishing; there will be water to the garage for those purposes associated with ~he recreational 3 use of the property. CMAIRWOM~2,~ C, LIVP~: Vincent? % BOARD [4EMBER ORLanDO: I visited the si~e and spoke to the owner_ He nas a nice little, I 5 guess a guess cottage there new. NS. HESSIANS: What's there nov~ was ~here 6 when he bought the property. BO2~tE, NEMBER ORL~{DO: ± spoke to 7 aboun nhat_ He said ne has no ineention of making an upstairs gues~ room on this one. It's strictly 8 ENo garage, upstairs storage. His garage is au~acRet ~o his house new_ After this is built 9 ~nd approved, ne will make tha~ the more extension of t~e house. Se aE this point, not that we're 10 opposing an upstairs apartment in there, this application is not for that_ 11 MS. MESSIA~O: NoS for Ehau purpose. And i want Eo add toe, the existing structure doesn't 12 have foe~ings and foundation; i~ sits on the tiff. Sc. i~'s quite mouldy and musty, so even ~houg~ iE 13 has the appearance of a queue, guest cottage, it's not really useable as such because ef the dampness 14 an~ the mustI' condition in there. So he's seeking ~o improve that compieEely because iE is a lb structure that's sitting on the dire without foundations and footings. 16 BOARD MEMBER ORLf-2~DO: You're aware of the letter from ~he neighbor? 17 [qS MESSIAHS: · am aware of the letter from the neigMbor, and we'~e {one additional 18 research, and I can presen~ Eo ~he Board a cop5' of the sur~.ey EhaE I picked up from our sur~e2~or this 19 mcrning. I as~e~ him no show us where nhe asphal~ dri?eway ef the neighbor Es the south tRat 20 would be Neey -- I asked him ~o demonstrate ~hat, se I'll give this to you as well ihanding~ . 21 C~iIRWO~[~N OLIVA: Than~ you_ MS. MESSI}2[O: I neEe ~hat en the 22 neighbor's letter of sbjectien, she makes reference ~o obstructing ~he view when exiting her 23 driveway, ~hus causing a hazard, and I need ~o heine cue the facu uhat a~ ~he point aE which one 24 would clear the road side, the fron~ side of the proposed garage, there is still 35 fee~ from that 2S poin~ ~o ~he intersection of the existing asphalt driveway, and Bayberry Road, and Bayberry Road is June 22, 200% S2 1 2 not a hoax ily traveled public thoroughfare. It is a pri/ate drive for the residents ef Bal-berry 3 Dri,re. I don't think /ou have major traffic there, hue regardless ef the traffic condition I 4 don't believe Ehere's a sight oOsEruction occurring because you do ha-ze 35 feet from the ~ neares~ point of the garage to the intersection of nha driveway and the road. And proper~y -- 6 another point I'd like to make as well, is that from E~e fronE, that front corner, the 3S foou 7 eis~ance from t~e road to ~he garage, ~he land, Ute elevauien drops about four feet, i think we're 8 a~ abou~ 12 foot elevation a~ the garage an~ we're a~ about an eight foo~ elevation at the road. So 9 t~e lands drops away, so i~'s nde as t~ough eno were about Ed peer up a mound or a ~ill or around 10 a bend, ~here's a s~raight line of vision from that point, I just wanted to make ~hat point. Are 11 there an5 quesEions? CMAiRWO~i~ OLIVA: Vincent? 12 BOARD MEP~ER ORLAi.[DO: No furEher ~uestiens. 13 ,2HAIRWOM~ OLIVA: ~ydia? BOARD HEHBER TORTORA: The question I have 14 is t~at the exisming garage is 20 feet from the side ,'ard an~ 40 feet from ~he front properEg 15 line, and nhe proposed one woul~ Se 10 feet from the proper~y line and 35 feet from the front yard; 16 whI can't you meeu code? MS. HESSi}2[O: Why can't we meet code? 17 BOY~_D M[iHBER TORTORA: Right. ~dS_ MESSI~O: If we were te move the 18 s~ructure back to {a) mee~ co~e or at least mee~ %~e existing setback, we'd have te take down a 19 significant tree that's en the property that really benefits Ed the aesthetics of the properEy. 20 BC, ARD M~MBER TORT,DPJ=: gna tree or two trees? 21 MS. MESSI~I~O: One large Eree_ Vinnie, you were there and I think there was some 22 discussion between you and £)r. Welleben. BOARD MEMBER ORLANDO: He discussed t~aE 23 he like~ that tree. BOARD M~MBER TORTOP2~: HOW far is ~he ~ree 24 from the ~roposed garage? IdS_ MESSII~iqO: I'm sorry, but I don'E have 25 ~ha~ information. I would say iE's a maEEer of facE, but I don't think we would ~uild it closer June 22, 2004 53 1 2 E© the Eree Decause you don't wane to run the risk of ha~-ing ~he roots affecting the foundation, the 3 fcotings, .~ou know, you don'~ want to get too c£ese to the tree and disEurb the root si'sEem of % the tree either. ~md I would point out that this Beard nas seen fit to grant a ~zariance en Ehis 5 property on the Bridge Lane side granEing a 35 fcot seEhack for an accessory swimming peel en 6 thee side, so Ehe 3b foeE setSack was found Es be approvahle on the Bridge Lane side, eno this side i I see noEhing different on this side than the eEher side. We're NeE asking for mere than we've 8 already been granEed. ,2HAYRWO~ 0LIVA: Jim? a BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: I don't have any questions. 10 CE~ I RWO~Ki~ OLIVA: gerr2'? BOARD MEHBER GOEHRINGER: No_ 11 CMAIRWOM~[ OLIVA: Anybed}~ in the audience thee wishes ~o speak fer er ageinsE Ehis 12 a~plica~ion? BO~RD HEHBER ORLANDO: You're ha~ring 13 electric in this garage bun no running water? MS. MESSIahS: There will be wa~er SuE the 14 reason for having water to the garage is Doing weEerfront properEy and having a $oaE on the 1S propertf an~ so on, when people come off the boat, Ehey can use water and wash ~heir hands, clean 16 their fish, eE cetera withouu having ~e go in the hcnse ~o do theE. 17 MS. KOWALSKI: Is Ehat for a sink, then? MS. ME$SI}IO: That's my understanding. 18 CHAIRWOH~2~ OLIIZA: You don'E mind if theE's a condition for Ehe approval? 19 MS. M~SSIANO: No. CHAIRWO~-L~2~ 0LIVA: Hake a motion closing 20 the hearing and reserving decision unEil later_ ~See minuEes for resolution.} 21 .............................. CHAIRWOMAi~ OLIviA: Our next hearing is 22 nee{ a resolution Graham Head_ This is Graham Kead. This is for a new aodition with a lb foot 23 minimum on the side yard aE Goose Creek Lane on the side yard_ They want to make a res©l~ion to 24 open the hearing and adjourn i~ for continuation for guli lgth, correcE? 25 HR. GC, RM~lq: Mf name is Rill German. I'm here for Graham and Barbara Head. We'd like to June 22, 2,504 5% 1 2 conr~ect The house to the garage, with a hreezeway, and then raise the garage, put a second floer en. 3 Ne're asking for a variance of 12 feet, we're ~hree feet from the propert] line, and Eha~ would 4 he it. CHAIRWO~IAN OLiVA: Dees ~nybody have any 5 ~uestiens now or ra~her wait un,il July 15th? BOARD MEMBER OR~}2~DO: I guess we'll w~i~_ 6 BOARD HEHBER GOEHRINGER: My question is how do you get ~o i~? 7 BO}~.D ME[.{BER ORL_~qDO: it's hhe one by Ehe bridge _ 8 CHAIRWONC~2.I OLiVA: Is there ans'bodf in the audience Ehat has come to speak for or against 9 ~his appiicaEion? If noE i'd like ~o meke a msuion to adjourn the hearing until Jullf 15th. ,s== minuues for resoluEion..} 11 C~%IRNOHAN OLiVA: Our nexE hearing is Racanelli for a piece of property at 3300 12 ManhasseU Avenue in Greenporu. It's a small lou_ Hi, Pan. 13 MS. MOORE: Yes, i~ is a small lot_ In's c. ne of many of the lots in ~han neighborhood. 14 Their're all cen,.erting no less seasonal ~nd more ~-ear round homes and this familf has four children 15 o~ ~heir own_ They need ~he space, this house is quLte small. 16 There is flexibility wi~h respecn no Ehe locanion of which side of the house shoeld have 17 nhe garage_ i think the original application and uhe design the archiuect prepared has nhe garage 18 wt~en you're facing the house on Ehe corner of Nanhesse~ and Wood Lane_ There would be certainll 19 no objection to reversing it if that would be what Ehe Board and the neighbor mighn prefer ~o see 20 because ~he gerage is a one story gerage and prokabiy more similar in size to the adjacent 21 house. ~o,e that cer~ainiy we kind of debaned nnat issue and we reallf leave it up ~c. Ehe neighbor 22 and nhe Board. I think nhe preference was on the oUher side, but uhey could live with it reversed_ 23 You can see ~hat the seubacks were estabiishet by the original strucnure, end they 2~ have uhis othe~ accessory building next docr, wkich is also close uo the properny lines, both 2S property lines; tha~ seructure is being removed and giving more room, 7'10" to tt~e side properEy June 22, 2004 55 1 2 line of tile house adjacent to the neighbor on Wood Lane_ No matter where you put :his house, there 3 are variances in all directions. CHAIRWOI{AN OLIVA: Jerry? 4 BOARD MEMBER GOE~iRINGER: Can I assume that the setback with tile jog toward Manhasset 5 AveNue is 6'8"; is tha~ correct? }IS. MOORE: it's I'm no~ sure which jog 6 '~ou're talking about. BO.~I~D MEMBER GOEHRIIIGER: Rigilt here, 7 Pat. MS_ [~{OORE: The original se~bac~? ~ BOARD MBMBER GOEHRINGER: I' m looking a~ it as 9 BC,ARD HEHBER ORLANDO: 6' 3" iE looks like. MS. MOORE: Yes, that's what iE is, 10 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: You're proposing ~'10" on uhe second ileuse ~r~ en Wee~ Lane; is ~hat 11 correct? HS. MOO}~E: Correct, 7'10" ~o the 12 neighbor en WooO bane, right. Now there's a let of room ~© Manhasset Avenue, i-au conl{ ceruainly 13 mo-e ute house Lowards Manhasset Avenue, and particularly if you reverse the garage, the main 1% house it would be, ~-eu could treat just about BOARD HEHBER ORLL2[DO: Is this a ~emo, lb Pat? MS. MOOP~E: The foundation is being 16 reused_ Se the existing feLlnOation is being re~se~. 17 BOARD NEMB~R ORL_~2[DO: Part 4al ? MS. HOC, RE: Paruiai, well, at ~he uime 18 these're going Eo put a basement underneath the portion ~hat's hoe already a slab_ So they're 19 going to ~ig a litule bit deeper, create a storage area under nhe house for a basement but whatever 20 is -- BOARD MEMBER ORL}2[DO: Demo to grade. 21 [qS. HOORE: Except for, as I said, the foundaEion sta) s because it's still in good 22 condition_ BOARD MEHBER GOEHRI?IGER: I need the exact 23 square footage of the footprint. HE. MOORE: Which eno? 2% BOARD HEMBER GOEHRINGER: Of the new proposed, which places it at '~4 percent. 2S NS. MOORE: It says 3S'4" by 57'5" That's Ehe footprint en the survey. dune 22, 2004 56 1 2 BOARD HE~,~BER GOEHRINGER: Hrs_ Moore, again, we'~e known you many, many years, wh~f is 3 uhere net a proposal uo put uhe garage underneath the house and reduce some of Lhis? 4 MS_ HOOPE: Under the house? BOAPSD MEP[BER ~OEHRI~ER: Under ~he house. 5 There is no reason why ~his garage could no~ go under the house with a garage on the Manhasse~ 6 side ? MS. NOO~_E: You mean basement level? ,, BOARD MEMBER ~3BHRIN~ER_ Yes MS. MOORE: The groundwater is preEny 8 higt~. BOARD ~I~f,IBSF~ GOEHRINGER: Build the ground 9 up. [.IS. MOORE: You're going to be ~owering 10 o ~er the o~her houses. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: You' re gc. ing te 11 be 'towering over an5, way, it's ~_~vo and a-half suories high. 12 NS. HOOP. E: You have neighbors en Manhasset that's actually 27 ~,e the mean and just 13 under 3S so it's a trne two stori~. BOARD i,IEMBER GOEHRII.?GER: Do we have a new 1.~ survey indicatir~g what the groundwater situation is there? Because Ehe houses across the street on lB Angler, those houses have basements on ~he cpposi~e side. 16 MS_ HOORE: i'd have to discuss it with the owner aboun putting a .garage under the house. 17 BOARD MEMBER ,30EHRIHGER: I'm not speaking fsr my fellow Board members huh this Board is not 18 granting a 44 percent lot coverage, it's jusz not qeir~g ~o happen. The easiest ~ay ~o deal with it 19 is ~c, either eliminate the garage or pu~ it under nhe house. That's my opinion. 2,0 [,IS. HOC, I{E: I'll ask ~he client. BOARD HEHBER GOEHRINGER: That's to 21 eliminate an immediate 10 percent in my opinion, ~hen we can stern nalking nhe 3% percent. 22 [,'IS. KONP, LSKI: You're s~ill going ~o need square fooEages. His question was riel answered, 23 he wants ~he sq~re footage. [.IS_ [,~RE: There is a survev that was 2% sub[ni~ed in your packet the~ has ~he s~rveyor's calculations of all ~he square footage. I jusu 2h b-a~e to find which one it is. NS. KOWALSKI: Send iE in a letter June 22, 2004 2 separately_ BOARD MEMBER ,~bEHRIN~EP.. Yes, all the 3 questions nhat we have. MS_ MOORE: You have a sur~ey Ehat has & writing on the side that came from the surveyor. Tkose are the square footage calculations. 5 AUDIENCE [,'IEMBER: Could i ask wha~ date is on Ehat survey? 6 HS. MC, ORE: April 12, 200&. BCARD NEMBER TORTORA: Ne have that sur!-ey 7 but there's no lo~ calculation. i,'[S. MOORE: I think i get a call from $ Linta asking for specific square footage, which is when i asked the surveyor to please break it ouE, 9 and I finally submiE~ed it_ MS. KOWALSKI: I~'s not in the file. 10 MS. MOORE: I don't ~now wha~ happened it, actually I have 11 BOARD I.IEMBER C, RL_ZJ[DO: If you could read them no us. 12 [.IS. HOORE: I can make a copy for your file. You're going to need in in your writing. 13 B,O.~RD MEHSER TORTOP~A_: I would like no kncw what the existing square fooEage of ~he l& s~ruc~ures on ~he lots are, and what ~he proposed square footage is. That's all. IS MS. HOORE: I don't have the existing square footage, se I'll have to ge~ that, or i 16 don'E think I de. i have proposed. NhaE i' il do is i'ii ask ~he surveyor and I'll put 17 once. BOARD HEHBER TORTOPJ~: We could sit here 18 and do the calculations, ~he exisEing house is by 27 and now you want a house that is 35 by 57. 19 MS. MOORE: Right. And also the other structure, which is 11.%0 by 2~. 20 [.IS. KOWALSNI: I have seven copies of a sample diagram en Ehe house but there's nothing on 21 the lot coverage, we never got that. MS. [~iOORE: I'll get ~ha~ to iou. i tell 22 /cu, i .got i~ and thought I submitted it. It mai? be attached to your notice of disappre, ral. 23 [,IS. KONALSKI: No, we checked that Eoo_ MS. HOOP. E: Doesn't ma~ter, I'il gen it 24 eo You. Any other quesuions? BOARD ME[~[BER ORL_RI[DO: Yes. The adjacent 25 ~roperty just west ef the property in quesEion is ~ ~ery modest two-story but is a Ewo-sEory, but June 22, 2,2,04 58 1 2 Ehat is ~he only two story house on Wood Lane. EC.O]£ a ~horeugh drive down, and maybe the largesE 3 single story building there was 1,200 square feet, ~i~.e or take, they're very small houses 4 there. This would be a very ou~ of character house on Wood Lane, 11'8" front -'ard setback with b the heigh~ of this house woul~ be overbearing. MS. ~OORE: I just do wane to point out 6 for Ehe record, I gave you pnoUegraphs of oEher houses in the neighborhood. 7 BOARD MEMBER ORL~{DO: I Oreve it. I didn't need to look au pictures. If you ge 8 further down Manhasset east - MS. MOORE: There ha,~e been 200 feet of 9 t~is Inlet Manhasse~ is all a similar development, you're geuuing over time as the homes are Seing 10 sold or ERe family members are Eaking o.er for the older owners, these houses are getting renevatee 11 and being enlarged for their needs. So right on Wood Lane is a house uhat I uhink I was here un a 12 vmriance on uhis one, is kind of a moeern looking hcuse unat is right on Wood Lane, and you ha~ze the 13 neighOer right next door, which is a two-stor. beautifully done. 14 BOARD ldEMBER ORLP2~DO: Modest t.,~o s~ory. MS. NC, ORE: This house actuall', looks ih -~er5 elaborate, but size-wise, it's hoe E~a~ big. BOARD MEHBER ORLANDO: We're going te get 16 back to the 44 percent as I Ehink Mr. Goehringer has stated. And I uhink we need to push Sack u~e 17 setback on Woods Lane. That's ~ery close. HS. HOORE: Okay. 18 BOARD MEMBER ORL}i{E,O: Just m.- opinion. MS. MOORE: I am going back to the owner 19 and see if there's ssmething ~hat wouiO be more agreeable to this Board, I'll speak to Racaneili. 20 CHAI P_WOMA2[ OLIVA: dim? BOARD ~4ENBER DINIZIO: Go Oac~ Eo the 21 c~¥ner i think, Pat. There's no way this is happening. 22 MS. MOORE: The fact thee it's a house with the garage I think it adds a lot of square 23 footage. BOARD MEMBER DINiZiOz The neighborhosd is 2% mos~iy houses llke mine, bungalows, if .ou want ~o call them. Five foot, I'm surprised ~hat this 25 nctice of disapproval is not like three pages with Yhe Nalz Ening. That's just an opinion, of June 22, 200% 59 1 2 caurse, I don't sway the Board. 1'11 be honest with you. 3 BOARD ME~.~BER ORL~i,IDO: How many variances are there, four? % MS. MOORE: The existing structure right new is already nonconforming. 5 BO.~_D ME[{BER TORTORA: I just did some rough calculaEions, you're talking about ever 6 2,000 square foot footprint en this 5,000 square feet lee and that's just for Ehe first fleer. 7 MS. HOC, RE: Okay. BOARD HENBER ORLANDO: I Ehink Ehe easiest 8 way to Oo this is what I do on the lasE one, is we come up ~,ith a percenEage over tile 20 percen~ and 9 you'd be aOle Eo massage and mould whaEever you like_ ± ~on'E wan~ you Ee ge back and forth_ 10 BOARD [{EHBER ORLYI:DO: Linda, the largest yariance issued te daEe? 11 MS. KOWALSKI: E,;eryEhing is different, whaE ~ime frame ~{o i?ou wanE? We c.suld research 12 it _ BOARD N~M~ER TORTOgA: They're looking at 13 2,,5,3,3 plus square foon. MS. KOWALSKI: i've seen 25 percent 14 granted, i've seen 26 percent. This area could be researched. I could find ouE, but it takes 15 zime. I c[on'E knew if Pat did zhe research on tnaE already? 16 MS_ MOORE: I di~ some research en :ariances that were granted. 17 [,iS. KOWALSKI: Were the'_, higher Ehan 26 NercenE? 18 MS_ MOORE: T}ley were mostly area variances because at the Eime existing wasn't a 19 ,~ariance. So this area has been ~eveleped and ilnproved over time without variances. IE's only 20 in the more recen~ time. CMAIRWONL~I[ OLI~A%: CUE it down to 21 percent? BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: The t~ouse as it 22 exists is prebaOly 2%. HS. HOORE: I' 11 gi .~e you Ehe square 23 footage .of what' s exisEing. CHAIRWOM~i~ eL±VA: Suppose we just 24 adjourn ~his ~o the August meeEing, which is 19Eh anO have the information in b? July 22nd. 2b [.iS. [.~OORE: Lot coverage, square footage is what you requested so far. An~~ ether quesuion June 22, 200~ 6O 2 requests? MR_ DWYSR: John D~er, 550 Need Lane. 3 ~4S. MOORE: Whose house is this? MR. DWYER: I've been ~here fur nine 4 years, there hasn'~ been any house enlarged on ~hat block, and there's Ewe ether neighbors Rare, 5 so ge5 your facts straight if you're going ~e make representations ~e this court_ 6 MS. MOO~E: I have photographs on the recer~ ~hat houses ~hat have been enlarged and are 7 pare of ~he neighborhee{, and I'd ask ~hat you just incorporate it in~e the record. I limi~e~ my 8 photographs to Wood Lane and within a block of the house. As far as wha~ the address, I'd have ~o go ~ compare ~o ~he ~ax map, I assumed that you would drive down and see ~he same houses I did. 10 BOARD MEMBER TORTOR>~: Madam Chair, run this b~.~ the others, 1,200 square feet 11 feouprin~. How {ees nhan sit with you? BOARD ~dEHBER DINIZIO: I'm ne~ prepare{. 12 I'm not going with the box ~hat's there now, let's see what ~hev come back wi~h. 13 MS. HOO~E: 1'11 talk bs. ~he client. BOARD I~E~BER ORL~i~DO: he~ your clien~ be 14 creative and co,ne up wi~h something. You know the guidelines Kind of the parameters_ 15 CHAIRWOl{32~ OLIVA: Yes, ma'amP HS. TZANNES: My name Ceralee Tzannes, I'm 16 the nex~ house from Dominick, and I'd like to see nhe photographs the lady she has, because I think 17 one of the house doesn't belong to our block. ibis is Ewe blocks away from me un{ this is feur 18 houses, i~ doesn't belong nex~ ~o me. Exactly ~f house is right here, if you have the picture, this 19 is my house. NS. MOORE: Very nj ce house. 26, HS. TZANNES: Thank ?ou very much. RS_ MOORE: Did you need a variance fur 21 this house? MS. TZ~[NES: Let me finish. Nex~ to me I 22 ha?e a property with no houses. Dominick is next te me, Dominick has, as you know everybod+, here, 23 is a var>~, very, small proper~y. He has to build a house, yes, of course, I like him. I ~on'~ sa5' 24 not, but ycu have Eo go with the existing house. Here new is exacLly nine years, the house is in 25 terriOle, terrible condition. As a matt~er of facE, my husbanO every summer time he p~l pl=~wood oune 22, 200~ 1 2 ~o get it off ~he holes ef the Rouse. Number 2, iR the ~ack, he has for 15 years 3 Rs legal, all glass, a big s~ory, eno story. E_~ery week I clean his beca~se he's exactly in my 4 side, the grass in all these 15 !,ears because this house is nine years nob©dy lives, before nine 5 },ears eno family was live, and uhey didn't have a ~oilet inside_ Ss I don't know whaE animals in 6 that house. Now, as I see, uhat house between my properEy, in my ~riveway, he ~,~ants to cema three 7 feaR, whioh the existing house, I measure is eight feet. So, i'm siEting here, all these 15 years 8 ~nd i'm watching ~his horrible house, and I pay my naxos. I work ver~~ hard to have a clea~ house, as 9 I hear Before, this gentleman wane around our neighbors, o~ay, now, he can build as 5au ~now, in 10 ~his small proper~y ~hat huge house, the two story. We bought the house to live in coun~rl, 11 nee in Hauha~an, not in Queens. I ha~e a house in BaysiOe and even in Bayside I don't have tnis 12 small property_ I have 100 bi 80 in Bayside, no~ in Green~orE, I have this small property, and he 13 likes Es come all the way up. If you see in ~e ~ic~ures ~he lady she has, of sourse, she doesn'~ 1% ta~e my front area, o~ay, I have to show_ And thanX you very much because I can show here very 15 good job leu di~, okay. Here, this is my house and this is my driveway, this here is existing 16 house here is eight fee5. This pare is legal, is nsc legal, o~ay, he likes Ee come three feet nero 17 all the way in the ~ack, which ~he back is all glass is ne legal_ Now, lee me tell you, you can 18 see ho..~ big driyeway i have for m? house, yes, iE's Ewo-sSory ~ut two -- 19 BOARD HEHBER ORL~.IDO: How many square foot is your house? 20 MS. TZ~{NES: I'm sorry, I don'L answer you. 21 MS_ HOORE: it would be helpful to puE on Lha rocor{ what size house she has because 22 actuallI iE's comparaSle of what my client wants, excepLion ef ~he garage, maybe very similar in 23 square footage. [,IS. TZSl,?NES: If this is a t¢~o sEory house 24 i~'s raining, all ~his water, where is i~ going Es ge? If ,Sod forbid someEhing happens wi~h the 2h !ire, what's going to ~appen? We are at 1,000 feet from Ehe waEer and new all these insurance is June 22, 200~ 62 1 2 very har.i ~e get insurance_ As a matter of fact, Dominick, he snow up once every year and he sa,~ to 3 us, E like to build a house because I nave growing kids, whicN I like to hove a par~y, nex~ ~© my 4 nose, three fee~ away from my house, if four kids which 20 years, 18 years, if I live, if I want b live, I can live in ~4anhattan, not in Greenpor~. I pay mY ~axes, a iot of taxes bs have mi; grass. 6 If he's going te Duild, ever here l~eu see I have that 5roe. This tree belong Ee me. If he's going 7 to suilt a 5wo-s~ory, why I going ~o lose mp 5ree? This tree make 100 years Ee grow, we need country. 8 Me likes ~o build a house, big, he can build i~, be my guest, go get eno acre prcperty and Ouild 9 i~, don't come one b/ one and build it. Did anybodf from you wants to have next to you 10 somebody like t~a~? BOARD MEMBER ORLL2~DO: You heard our 11 sommenEs. HS_ KOWALSKI: Can I ge~ the spelling of 12 your last name, please? MS. TZi~[NES. T-Z-A-N-N E S. One more 13 thing, before 5hey're going ~e buil~ any cement, en~ nails in ~hat property, · like ~o see i5, 1~ please_ BOARD MEHBER ORL}2[DO: You can come t2 our 15 next hearing. PiS. MOORE: I will also research a~ the 16 Huilding Department if they have a survey, unless she has a survef she can provide to the Boar{, 17 would be helpful ~o know your property lines and ~he size of your house; so you have a survey? 18 [4S. TZAi,[NES: I don't ~ave i~ with me. Ne~{~ ~ime I'm going to Oring i~ with me. 1~ CHAIRWOHAN OLIVA: Does somebody else ~_ant to say something? 20 HR. DWYER: Js. hn DwJer. I'~ jusn like ~o reiterate what this lady has put forward nero. I 21 li~e across ~he street_ Right now ~hat house, and for t~e last 10 years, has Seen an eyesore. We 22 are giving somebody or granting somebody a request for a larger house, a bigger piece ef p. roper~y 23 tha~ will encroach on ~heir neighOors when the house ~ha~ ~hey have now encroaches en their 2% neighbors because i~ isn'~ being taken care of. One major factor tna~ you have ~o watch su~ for 2~ he~e, and I'm speaking en behalf ef my neighbor Larry, who lives nex~ deer but has a little bio of June 22, 2004 63 1 2 a hearing problem, he's the adjoining house, and that's fire. These are careless people. You've 3 driven hy this property. I don't think i've sa~ here all da? about people complaining ef this, % ~haE and everything else, I don'~ think there's anybody in Seu~hold wiEh a worse situaEien in a ~ neighborhood as ~his house. I said dafI you te sa/ that. Te allow this person who has shown no 6 censideration for 10 years to ge closer tea neighbor is srazy_ He has a right, yes, to the 7 existing proper~y_ A~d the las~ factor is we are ha~ing a reugl~ ~ime there get~ing insurance 8 because of the location to the water. Now ~he problem there with the house relation of fire when 9 close, the wind blows we're right off ~he bay, 700 feeE my house is, and ~'m ~elling you Ehis wi~h my 10 experience with the Hassapequa Fire Department for 35 fears, put that houses close, and you're 11 risking every neighbor around there, tha two adjoining hcuses with a fire, wiuh a very careless 12 person. CHAiRWOHAN OLIVA: Thank you, sir_ 13 MS_ MOORE: For the record, ~he owner Racanelli, who is before ~his Board acquired this 1% property in August of 2003. The prior ewner was George Taiiambeuris, that was the prior owner. So 15 i ~hink the complaints about the condition of ~he house was the prior owner. The owner Racaneili is 16 Erying ts fix the house_ And I hope will he a much keEEer neighbor and care far the ~roper~y 17 lnuch more carefully uhan the prior owner. CHAIRNOM_~2{ OLIVA: We are adjourned ~hen 18 ~e AugusE 19th. Haye Ehe maEerial in bi~ July 22nd. 19 MR. DWYER: Clarification on ownership here. 20 MS. HOORE: George Taliambonris was the prior owner unzil Racanelli bough~ iE, i have a 21 title survey which shows he took title in i. IS_ TZf-2.iNES: Ra.2anelli take it from Ehe 22 faEher in law. MS. MOORE: But the faEher-in-law was Ehe 23 F~rior owner. The current owner is Racanelli, ~nd he's the one who's going to puu all ute money in 24 Ehis house and is responsible for i~ since August of 2003. So in the past year he's been the 25 father who's elderly and hasn't maintained it. MS. TZ}i.iNES: I understand, but all Ehese June 22, 2004 64 1 2 2ears, in 10 years ne doesn't come Eo cue nhe grass. 3 CHAIRWOHA2~ OLI~/A: C, kay. Resolution Lo a~journ ~o Augus~ 15th. What's the dale? 4 MS. KOWALSKI: There's another gentleman. HR. SAVBGLIA: I'm Larry Sa~reglia, I live 5 a~ 475 Wood Lane in Greenper~. I'm on the sounh side ef ~his house in question. I have properly 6 nhere for 50 years, and had no problem wi~h space or anything un,il just ~his time now. There's 7 Lhree houses on this corner and just a small space tna~ everybody has_ Now, if ~hey want to come and 8 make Lhe space smaller yet, i~'s reallI going ~o Se a problem_ My two bedrooms face ~he property 9 in question, and Ehey wann ~o make an extension on ~heir house another 25 er 30 feet which would pu~ 10 t~em within seven or eight feeE fram n~~ house. The two bedrooms would be direcEly across Lhe way 11 from it, that is ne privacy at all. PurLhermore, i ~hink if this goes through, the value on these 12 houses are going ~o drop down, not only on the three houses on EhaE corner, hue on the three 13 blacks. BuE I sit there and i~'s preEEy busy in the summer time and a lot ef people come down and 14 go ~o ~e beach, and if this goes through, ~hev'll see uhis conglomerate of houses togeEher and 15 probably Ehin~ i~'s one uniE. And it's really a shame, we're in the country, we live in the ciL~~, 16 we ge Lo Lhe country, and we expec~ to have a little breaLhing room, but now as it is, 17 everything is geYting closer ani closer, if the Town doesn't s~ep it. There's snill a lo~ of ions 16 in Greenport, ml~ area, ~haL are 50 by 100; if this goes through, ether people are going to do the 19 same thing, they wahl to expand Lheir houses. Nhere is iE going to leave us? We mighE as well 20 pack up and go back to Ehe cit-~. Thank -~ou. BOARD MEMBER ORLfa2.[DO: Adjourned te which 21 da~e again? ,See minu~es far resol~Lion.! 22 ,2HAIRWOM~2~ OLIVA: Next hearing is Blaine 23 Nesln, on Gull Pond Lane, Greenpor~. MR. SAETTA: .Seod afternoon, I'm Richard 24 Saen~a, i'm representing Elaine hesin. C~IRWON~N OLIVA: Would you like ~o gi~e 25 us ~Re background on ~his piece of proper~y? hR. SAETTA: Firsn we're going for two June 22, 200e 1 2 ,~ariances. One is an area and one is a usage. Usage first, there was a restrictior~ on four lots B in this area tha~ were considered not buildable. Since then three lots have been built on. We also '4 have gone to the DEC, the Board of Health and ~he TrusEees, and all these permits are in place for 5 this piece of property. Any other questions on that particular variance I would answer, if I can 6 help. ,?HAIRWO~.~2'~ OLIi~_: I belie,~e e~er~ though I ~he houses were builE, the original covenants were Ehat people came there reall,~ just te have a deck 8 so they could sleep on the boats and have an acsesscri? building for shower and a bauhroom. But 9 my understanding is if you wan~ed a house ~hen you wsuld have to give up the ability of having the 10 large boat there because the,r ,,?ere sleeping on the boats . 11 PIR. SAETTA: There seems te be some question ab.suE Ehe covenants in one it seems ~o be 12 a phanuom one because no one can find it, n.sE even the title company. So if we can geu a copy of it, 13 the title company can'~ find iE. The %own doesn'~ have iu, se who has this restricuion? When I wenE 14 Ec Ehe Board of }{ealth, ~hey had the restriction. Phey teid me, wow, ~hese o~her three lots were 15 built on. They shouldn't have built on any, so I .~luess I'm going to have to giye it he you because 16 r_hese were all buil~ on. And so, if you allow three uo build and nou uhe other, I mean, forget 17 about being fair, iE's just hOE righE. ~½a_IR~O[,IA2~ OLIVA: Any of the Board 18 me~bers have any questions on ~his? BOARD HEHBER DINIZIO: i de. 1£, CHAiRWOHAN OLIVA: Go ahead. BOARD MEHBER DINIZIO: Boat slash, 2,8 whatever. You said ~ou found somewhere where there is a covenant on this? 21 MR. SAETTA: No, I think ~here ~<as eno ~ha~ came before the Board in the pas~, they gave 22 te ~hem, the title company, the lawyers, nobody could lint ~his covenant. 23 MS_ KOWALSKI: A zoning covenant is whaE iu is, it's a Zoning Board covenant. 24. BOARD HEHBER DINIZIO: So the Zoning Board mate a decision aE some poinE in Eime? 25 IqS_ KOWALSKI: Yes_ And iE was accepted by the owner and they used it_ They wen5 and June 22, 200~ 66 1 2 built wha~ ~hey wore going to build, the2' accepted i~, but the,_,,' never followe~ it up with filing a 3 csvenant with the county clerk's office. The Zoning Board covenant is still in effect under 4 zoning. BOi~P.E, MEMBER DIMIZIO: When was that? 5 BOARD MEMBER ORLP~i~DO: 1978. BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: MaYa you owned E}le 6 property since ~hen? HR. SAETTA: They llave, yes_ 7 BO2~i~,_D ME~,~ER DINIZIO: Size got tt~e variance from the Zoning Board? 8 MR. SAETTA: They were in partnership with other people. There were twa groups of people 9 unau owned iT together, then ~hey bought uhem out. BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: They were ~here? 10 HR_ SAETTA: They have been there since 1978 The}' were there_ 11 BOARD PIEMBER TORTORA: I don't have a copy of the prior. De we have a copy? 12 PIS. KOWALSKI: It was with the inspecuion package with Jessica. 13 ~OARD MEMBER TORTOP~_: Ne, the ether one they mentioned there was a prior, ~,~e didn't ha-re 14 chat in c.L~r packet either_ BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: We're going uo 15 research that. i',~R. SAETTA: I was going te answer a 16 question wi~h a question. If they accepted tt~is, ?,as there a restriction put on the people that 1~ built on their lots, because the boats have arrive,~ tRere, so apparently they have boats. 18 That's why i?eu're on the canal, that's why you build a dock_ 19 PIS. KOWALSKI: There ¢,as a prior, yes, they came to the Board and as},~ec~ for relief frsm 20 the conOiEion, but they also agreed ~e void Enat prior covenant, and ?old the prior use in exc[lange 21 for bull.ling the house. MR. SAETTA: That's basically what we're 22 asking for. ~[S. KOWALSKI: Wha~ are you giving up? 23 MR. SAETTA: If the ot~ler people came in ~nd Ehel. naJe a house and they have a ~ock and a 24 heat, ,,~hae did uhey give up? PiS. KOWALSY~I: There's a Zoning Board 2~ file, and what 2~eu mighu wanu Eo do because you ha?e not ~een in ~o examine uhe file or Eo become June 22, 2004 67 1 2 familiar with the property consonants that have ~een on the record for over 25 ~'ears. Ss you 3 should take the time te come in and examine the file, and 5,on may wane to go over it with an 4 attorney, we had suggested tha~ when you filed T'our applicauion. I don't Know if you censulued b anyone abouE it. It's a cevenan~ in the record, become familiar with in, and you can decide wnat 6 Ehe owner wants to give up. HR. SAETTA: Can you give me an idea when 7 you want Ehem to give up? MS. KOWALSKI: This is an appeal process_ 8 You ha, e to find out what /on have firsE. BOARD HEMBER DINIZIO: Can I jusu comment~ 9 · am going to road the decision, ~ecause when 1 read ~he applicaEien, there is no indication hew 10 ~haE came about. So there's no way I would have asked the question that ~nere was a prior on this 11 It should have been en there. I'm going te read nha~ decision. If ~hat decision says that this 12 was a buildable lo~, a lot tha~ could nave a house on it, bu~ these people wanted ~e put their SoaE 13 ~here and live on their boat, ~,~hich is like a gray area of Ehe Town, ~,ou can't have Ewo residences on 14 one piece of prepertl, and you agreed ~o, no, we wen'~ build a house, we're going ~o live en ~he 15 boa~. 2~md as long as we're living en ~he boat, we wcn't build a house. That's what tha~ decision 16 sa~s, I'm noE sure tha~ iE Oees, DUE if it does, then no my mind it is just a quesnien of you're 17 ho~ going to live on the boat; you're not going ~o ha~e permission Ye live on the boat anymore_ To 18 ~ne now, may be not ~he o~her members, it ma~~ mean Lo somebody you can't baize a %0 fooE boat_ To me, 19 I don't think thaL that's correct_ I believe, i~ would make sense wiEh my experience, if they 2,3 agreed the}' wanted ~e live on ~he boat, they needed to have water and electric down Eo EhaE 21 boat, and nhey still didn't want te build a house in order ~.s do it, which is prc. babli, required by 22 aur code Dack then, and te my mind iE's just a question 23 PIR. SAETTA: The picture's very clear_ They ~,ere ~ne only couple of ~he four lsns that 24 actually accopte~ and put something there_ So now ~hat has Eo ~e revlsi~ed as to w~at they're going 25 to take one as far as boa~ size, there's a 43 foot hcat next door. I thin]{ iL may be the possibility oune 22, 2004 68 1 2 of giving up whether uhay can live on the boat or non. The5' wouldn't wan~ to live en the ~oa~ if ~ ~he%- had a house. BOARD MEHBER DiNIZIO: Again, it could be 4 that the decision was made ~o allow them to live there wimhouU having a house on there_ MiT mind, b cnce the house is buil~, who cares. hR. SAETTA: As far as, now there's the 6 second TTariance, which is an area variance? BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: SetOac~. 7 MR. SAETTA: We're asking for 51 feet at the closes~ point_ The neighbor was granted it in 8 2003, 38 to 40 foot. The ~ouse, we have a se~ac~ frcm ~he DEC ~o the wenlands te the cesspool is 9 100 fee~. We have a freshwater wetlands across the street, and you'll see the line where ~he 10 pools are set righ~ on iE. We managed ~o keep ~he front yard and uhe ~wo side yards, so we're asking 11 for a variance ef S1 feet to the cleses~ poinE of Oul~nead, which is acEually further awaf from the 12 neighbors. ~0ARD I~EMBER TORTOP~: iE's a~solutel.- 13 impossible to grasp this withou~ seeing Ehe priors on this, and I don't have them, so. 1% HR. SAETTA: I don't understand what leu mean by priors. 15 CHAIP~[OH~I~ OLIVA: In eEher words, the whole history of Ehis piece ef property from the 16 late '70s, when these people were given permission te ha-'e reallf kind of a private marina sa the~ 17 can live on their boaE and have some onshore faci£ities for bathrooms and so forth and so on_ 18 A~ that time they had to go even for a si~e plan ~o the Planning Board and the Planning Board 19 deemed nha~ because ~hey nad more er less a semi marine use that ~he let was no~ a residential 20 £ot. I do realize since that time the o~her properties have been buil~, and I know you ~e ha.~e 21 ehe permzts from ~he DEC and the Trustees, and from the Board of Health and se on, but we have to 22 go ~a.2k and research all thaE. If the rest ef the Board members are no~ familiar wi~h iE, in order 23 Eo reach some sort of decision. HR. SAETT~: You're saying Ehe~~ ac~ual£~ 2% had a commercial marine use? ,~Hs_IR~[~M2~2I OLIVA: Semi cemmerciai. 2S MR. SAETTA: So c~n we expect to hear from you abou~ wh~E you would like ~hem te give uN.? June 22, 200% 1 2 BOARD MEMBER D±NiZIO: No, let us go anezher month. I know it's more time. 3 MR. SAiETTA: These people are also in their mid 70s. 4 BOARD [',{EMBER DINIZIO: We don't have the informazien before us. gust the decision alone 5 it's going to help you one way or ~he o~ner if we can clear that up. 6 CHAIRW,DI,L~2~ OLIVA: It's a better clear title to your property and what the conditions er / covenants were that some time in the future o~her owners don't have to go Sack and scra5ch ~heir 8 heads and wonder what was going on. This wa!? if we 2an straighten i~ out new it's to your 9 benefit. NhaE might Se a good idea tee, look back 10 in },our title and see if there's any covenants in ~,'our ~iEle, and if there are, could make copies 11 for us ant give them ~o ~s? MS_ K,D[^~ALSKI: Have the attorne?'s office 12 send it to ?'ou and then send it over. BOARD MEHBER ORLZ~lqDO: I ~ave a 13 clarification question, just on the setback from the bulkhead, I nave a copy of the sur,?el, I don't 14 s~e the 51 feeE, i see a setback of 75 -- HR. SAETTA: Ne, it's 67 and 51. You're lb £ooking at, it looks like. CPL~I RWOMAN OLIVA: Jerry? 16 BOARD HEHBER GOEHRINGER: I ~a~re no comment at tP~is time. I need to see that some 17 time. CHAIRWOHAS{ OLIVA: Whau is the Board's 18 pleasure? BC,.Li~.E, [4EMBER TORTORA: I'd like to recess 19 this until -- CPLZ~I RWOMAN OLIVA: August. 20 BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: Jul~~. BOARD MEMBER TORTOP2~'_: It's our fault, it 21 should have been included in our packages, so we could have addressed that. 22 MS. KO?IALSKI: IE's not exacEl:~ because I had a lo~ of communication with them en what we 23 needed_ BOARD MEi'4BER ORL~2~DO: She askei ~hem Eo 24 aitres s this_ ~dS. KOWALSKI: It wasn't submitted with 2~ the application. He didn't {e the research. We're Er?lng ~e help vou along with it toe, bu~ at June 22, 2{,04 70 1 2 the same time if somebody c'an research the file. NS. ,~ ~ ~ _ =_.LL~-_~MER: Courtney Gallagher. I 3 work for Rich Saetta_ I did come in and I wes %oli to look on the computer, and what I tid find 4 on the computer had nothing to do with the covenants. I had spoken with the secretary that 5 works in the office and we did research, and I found one thing. I~ was Jessica_ 6 i4S. KOWALSKi: Did you look at the criginai files? 7 MS_ ~=P_LL.~.=HER. Yes She pulled ~hem for me. The only one in there was _~r.~nm, who S applied for a setback for a deck of 38 feet from the bulkhead. ~' PIS. KOWALSKI: Nothing ,on the Sarah Rouch. HS ~_LL.e~HER: Linda had faxed something 10 to me asking reasons for the use variance and we had worked for those. 11 [,IS_ KOWALSKI: i~'s all par~ ef this file. Let me kne,.,z when ,:ou're coming 12 MS. ,~_LL~HER: Maybe we could sit down together and leek into it because in the computers 13 there is nothing according to tax map ID. HS. KOWALSKI: Not the computer, ~Rere are it files. MS ~_LL.~=HER: This is what I wa~ 15 instructed to de, te go onto the computer. MS_ KOWALSKI: i wasn't there when you 16 came by. So I guess you didn't get all the essistance that you could have. Sorry about that. 17 CHAIRWOt~L~? OLIVA: I4r. Nesin? [.iR. NESiN: My name is Arthur Nesin_ 18 There's a lot I don't quite understand about whae's 9sing en here_ Could I gi;e you a little 19 background about what went on? CN_A~I RWOI'4AN OLIVA: Sure. 20 MR_ NESiN: In '75 this particular piece of property which extended, I'm not sure how many 21 feet, was s~bdivided by the Village, I guess was the Village or Town, into four separate 22 parcels, all the same. New I've heard about this covenant; i have never seen an;-thing about a 23 ssvenant at all. Our neighbor Helen Rakowski, who is on 5he soush side of us, she never heard of it 2% end she F~as a house. Helmut Spi~zenberger, who ~,.as ~he last piece of propertI cn the north side, 25 he had no trouble_ He had a looai builder who bull5 the house up. When Helen Rakowskl put her June 22, 2004 71 1 2 Rouse up, there were nwo partners in that piece of ~roper~y. They had two 40 foot ~oa~s, and they 3 asked for permission to pu~ in desks for the two 40 foot boats, this was around 1975, and for % permission Ed Du~ up a house, and it was granted to them, so far as I know nothing about a 5 co~-enann. About 1978 a frien~ of mine, Dr. Rouch, was a very good friend of ours, asked me if 6 we wanted to go in on another piece of proper~y_ Talk about property now, I'm astounded iE was 7 qui~e inexpensive at that time_ There was a lot of propertf available along Gull Pond, along 8 Fsrdham Canal. We said, yes, we would go in, and we ~oo~ a mortgage on the property_ Then Sarah 9 Rsuch was Marvin Rouch's wife, we appiieO -- I was working, I'm a school teacher. I was working in 10 New York City. My wife was working as a registered nurse wi~h the West Hampton School 11 District, and Marvin ha~ a ~ental practice in Far Rockaway. We didn't wanm a house at ~han time, 12 ]sue we loved it out in Greenpor~. As a matter ef facE, we had Oeen out five er six years previous 13 tc that in a little private marina, I t~ink it's o~,~ed by Bruer new, all the wa-~ at the head of 14 Sterling Basin. Anyway, we applied for permission to put 15 in a small utility she~ and for permission Ec put docks in so we could bring our boats there. 16 well, Harvin ended up buying a hcuse, but we were living on the boat all ~hese lears, it was a 17 differenm boat at that time_ We liveO on that property for about 25 years_ The firsn piece of 18 proper~y on ~he north side was purchased Dy Spitzenberger. As I mentioned, nhey put up a 18 house, that's two houses, our property made it three, and Bob Wisman pun up a house in the '80s 20 and this is the only time I heard menuion of the covenants_ It's not on our dee~s, never saw 21 anything at all about a restricted piece of property Marvin, who's 90, sol~ his boa~ a few 22 years ago. Sold his property mo ~f daughter Nancy, move{ to a retirement village in 23 Pennsyi~;ania. Anyway, we're retired now, and we deciOeO we love Greenport_ Ne spenu almosm all 2e our a~ailable time dUE here. Na would like to move out eno £ive permanently in Greenport on this 25 property. Now I don't understand this gi~;e bask dune 22, 2004 72 1 2 thing_ You're going to make me sell mi- boat for what reason? Certainly I'm not going to live on 3 mT- boat. CHAIR~'~OMS~N OLIVA: Sir, let us sort this ~ thing out. MR_ NESIN: I'm 76 years old now, my wife S is 74. It's not so easy no say let it go for another month, another two months_ 6 CHAIRWONk~=N C, LIVA: Is someone ii'ting on ~he boat now? ~, HR. NESIN: Yeah, my wife and I, we're sta~:ing on the boat now. We ha~e the building, 8 which gives us our sanitation facilities, and we sleep on the boat. 9 MS KOWr~.L~KI: Are .~u going to live en the boat after you build the house? 10 MR. NESiN: Of course not. i don't k~nderstand why we have to get rid of our boat. 11 ,?HAIRWONtm2[ OLIVA: Hr. Nesin, we just want to sort out the different covenants that were 12 ph~E en your property or en all these properties =~ears ago so that we can straighten it out so 13 eser,_,thing is free and clear as far as you're concerned_ So you don't have worries that some 14 day one of ,:'our heirs is going to suddenly find something that they don't want to find_ iS ~,IR. NESiN: We have Eo wait another month? CHAIHWO[~2,I OLIVA: Yes. On July 15th, 16 ~hat's nee so long, three weeks. HR. NESIN: I guess i have no choice. 17 There's nothing I can do about it. ~H.~_IRWCM.'m2~ OLIVA: We 11 see you on the 18 15th. Hspefully we'll get everything straightened ou~ far you. Thank you. 19 Make a motion Eo adjourn the hearing. ~'See minutes for resolutio~l_) CHAIRWON~2[ OLIVA: Our next hearing is 21 Hr. John Car~,,~a,:,_ Smith Driye North, who wished to have a proposed deck au less than 35 feet from the 22 rear property line. HR. CARWAY: Hy name is John Carway, 1350, 23 Smith Drive North. We h~ve some mere of the cards that came back. Hopefully, this is reietively 24 straightforward We'~e had the house since 1~. and we lived around the corner since 1971, and 25 there is a small concrete patio right outside in the back of the house, and we're just proposing to June=~,~'~ 2,3,,2,4 73 1 2 just ge ever them and make a regular deck. The house is only 35 feet from mhe rear property, and 3 we just wanmed me go o~t another 10 feem, which ~oult make it a 25 feom setback_ Tham's 4 essentially i~. We'd like to have a little bit larger house and be raised up so I wouldn't have 5 te go up an~ down the steps righm now. It's kind of ~art te use the patio as it is. 6 C~IRWOH~i~ OLIVA: Jim? BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: No, I haye ne 7 questions. CMAIRWOMi~ C, LIVA: Lydia? 8 BOARD MEMBER TORTOPJ%: The size of mhe deck is 20 by 27? 9 MR_ CA~_WAY: Tham's correct. B,0~,D MEMBER TORTORA: with the house, 10 v~hat is, if i'm facing the site plan, which is looking am it from mhe rear yard, what ms on that 11 side of mhe house tram would ~e on the -- HR. CARWAY: The small side? 12 BOA~_D MEMBER TORTORA: Nhere the deck is. MR. CA~I~AY: Right in t~e Deck mhere is a 13 smockade fence which abuts a vacant let on mosm of the area, and then mhere is another stoc~aOe 1% fence, there's a house behind us to one side, but right behind the deck itself there's a ~acant, a iS small ,.acant let which I'm ~eld wasn't buildable, Out ycu ne~er know_ 16 ,2HAIP_WC,M~2~ OLIVA: True, never say never. HR. C~AI_WAY: There is a house, there is 17 about 13_8, 13.S feet setback te the propert~~ line, and t~en proOably anomher lb or 20 feet on 18 the other side ef that there is another house. BOARD MEMBER TORTOP3_: The only .other 19 ~uestien I had for you to get access to it, you Show a ramp coming down toward the rear yarO; is 20 that going to be -- MR. CARawaY: There's steps, there ~.~euld be 21 steps coming Oown from the ~t the rear. BOARD ME}dBER TORTO?A: So it won't ~e a 22 ramp? HR. CARWAY: i can manage it. The big 23 problem mham I have is going, when you're outside you're consmanmly going ~ack an~ forth to gee 24 something. Every time I go up and Oown those smairs i~ kind of knocks me for a loop. 2b BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: · don'E have an~, ether questions. June 22, 200~ 74 1 2 BOARD MEHBER ORLANDO: No quesEions. CMA I RWO~t~I~ OL I\%~: Jerry? 3 B,OA~_D MEMBER GOEHR£NGER: This deck is ]se open ~o ute skiT, no enclosure? 4 MR. C~_~IAY: No enclosure_ CPrelRWONL~ OLIVI%: Is there ans,one in the 5 au,~ience who would like to spea~ for or against this applicauion? If not, I make a motion to 6 close ~he hearing and reserve ~ecision until laner. 7 (See minuEes for resoluEion.i 8 CHAIRWO~2~ OLIVA: Next ~earing for Riverhea~ Building Supply for nhe placement of the 9 thir~ wall sign, yes, sir? MR. VON EIFF: Good afUernoon I'm Bill Von 10 Eiff for Peconic Sign Company on Sehalf of Ri.~erhead Building Supply. Basically applying for 11 a nhird sign, but it said third wall sign, i~'s actually a second wall sign. A third sign Oeing 12 nhere's one road sign, sign over the entrance way an~ Ehis is an additional sign -- 13 MS. KOWALSKI: Third sign all together. HR. VON EIFF: Third sign all together. 14 MS. KOWALSKI: Code only allows ~wo although. lg BOARD MEMBER ORL}iqDO: The only sign in question is the illuminated eno recessed in ~he 16 building. ~{R. VON BIFF: Yes, thet's t~e 17 question. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: An~ you're 18 proposing what? MR. VON EIFF: To be able to have a ~hird 19 sign where you see thau picture. It's basically a illuminated sign. 20 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: This is the .~nderson sign? 21 MR. VON BIFF: Yes. BO~D MEMBER GOEMRiNGER: How big is uhat 22 sign~ MR_ VON EIPP: Tha~ sign is 1% inches by 23 six feet long. CHAIRWO~2,? OLIVA: That's going to be 24 p£aced where on the building? },IR. VON BIFF: As l,ou see on ~ha~ picture 2£ of Ehe building, it snows the placemenE ef the sign over ~ha~ window, and Ehat's in a recessed June 22, 200e 75 1 2 area, and there's also a picture there nhat shows the complete building with the existing signs and 3 that ~dditional sign, where it's not too overwhelming er anything_ in acnually will work 4 very nice. And the reason for nhat sign is because EnaE whole end of the building has been 5 dedioated as a window and door showroom, so the.' really want to indicate nhat for people no know 6 nhat. BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: Why does it ~ave to / be illuminated? MR. VON tIFF: At night time we have the 8 rcad sign liE, and iE would look very nice to ha~.e nhat one lit as ~ell because tko cut letters than 9 cver nhe main ennrance nhey're liE. It's just Eo make it uniform looking. During the day in 10 basically ioo~s like a white sign, SuE at nigh~ it woult be nice to have than lit. In would Se 11 uniform to have that liE; nhe road sign's liE, above the doer's lit and that one would be lit_ 12 ,2MAIRWOt,~m2{ OLIVA: Vincent? BOARD MEMBER ORL}i[DC,: Are all your signs 13 lit 2%;7? MR. VON tIFF: Yes anO no_ Probabl/ the 14 road sign comes on about 9:00 in the evening and would shut off in the morning. But yes. 15 BOAiD MEMBER ORLAi{D,D: During the I4R. VON EIPF: During nhe night hours. 16 BO~_D MEMBER TORTORA: Both internally liE, the other two }~ou have? 17 MR. VON EIPP: No. The lighns are in the roof, so you don't see them, and ~he cue lenner 18 sign over the ennranceway has fixtures that light that. 19 BOARD MEHBER TORTORA: Because i was ~rying ne figure iE out, it's not permitted in the 20 Town, internally lit signs. OMAIRWOM}2[ OLIVA: Internally lit signs 21 are not allowed because I was on Eta co.Se e.smmittee when we put it in. 22 $OARD MEMBER DINIZIO: Depends an ehe zone 23 [iR. VON EIFF: This zone is business. BOARD MEMBER DIMIZIO: I believe it's 24 permitted_ MR. ¥©N tIFF: It is perminne.~ because 2~ we'~e dena ether lit signs. We did Southold Flooring, which is in light industrial, that was June 22, 2004 76 1 2 permitte{. CHAIRWONL~? OLIVA: For internally lie 3 signs? I have to look at i~ again. HR. VON EIFF: There's a bunch of ~hem ~ around town, it depends. They don'~ look, all is is a different way ef lighting them up. 5 toesn't look bad a~ all. As · say, during the day it's ver}~ nice looking_ 6 ,2MA I RWO~.k=2.~ OLIVA: Jerry? BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Because of the 7 size an~ magnitude of uhe ~uilding, I ~on't see Ehat that balances out ef character. 8 C~_IRWOH.~2~ OLIVA: It' s a beautifal building. 9 MR_ VON EIPF: IL is_ CHAI RWOMr~2I OLIVA: Lydia? 10 BOARD MEHBER TORTORA: I said, ~es, uhe building is beauuiful. 11 CHAIRWO[~kA2'I OLI.~: Such a nice addition iown there. 12 t,[R. VON tiFF: I was very nappw about in, I'm acrass the street. 13 CHAiPI,.IOM~ OhlVA: Hake a motion to close the hearing and reserve {ecision until !a~er. I 14 don't ~hink there's anybody here against i~. ~See minutes for resoluuion.? lb ......................... CHAIRWO[~I~ OLIVA: Next nearing is 16 Pa~ricia Buerkle, Private Road in Sou~hold. She'd like to put a porch on her front ~here_ Hi, 17 [,Iarge. MS. STEVENS: I'm Harjorv Stevens, I'm aU 18 33S Pri'~ane Road 3, and i'm here for Pat Buerkle and as a neighbor. I don't kno,¥ what I'm suppssed 19 to do. As · understand it, Pat v~anes ehe porch ,.~hich infringes a bit on her properUk line. 20 CHAIRWON~N OLiVA: I like nhe way she has this marked out in uhe picuures with uhe 21 ne~.~spapers. CHAIP_WOMA2,~ OLIVA: ~erry, any questions? 22 BO.AiD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: No. I was over mb~ere, l~'s a nice £iEule community. I really 23 have no problem with this. CH_kI RWOMAN OLIVA: Vincent? 24 BOARD MEP[BER ORLAI,IDO: Net going to ask :~our standard question? 2b BOARD M~F~ER GOEHRINGER: Is iE going be open to the sky? Ie's going ~e have a roof? June 22, 200% 77 1 2 MS. STEVENS: No It's going no haye a roof. 3 EO}~.D MEMBER GOEMRINGER: It will remain open on three sides? 4 HS. STE~NS: Yes. ROARD MEMBER ORLY2~DO: That's ~he Jerry we 5 ~now and love. ± ~ave no quesnions. It was ~.-ery nice. I like zhe way nhey put the addition offset 6 in the back_ MS_ STEVENS: It seems ~o me I've seen her 7 plans in all her exciting stages and she kept in keeping with the neighborhood. 8 BOARD MEMBER ORL}$~DO: You still may lose one er ~wo of Ehose Oig oa~s, Sun it happens. 9 CHAIRWOM}i{ OLIVA: Lydia? BOs~.D HEMBER TORTORA: I don'e have any 10 quesuions. CHAI RWOI~EaN OLIVA: Jim? 11 BOARD MEMBER DINIZI0: No quesZions_ CHAIRWOI%~I OLIVA: I'll make a motion to 12 close the hearing, reserve decision until later. {See minutes for resolution.} CHAIP~OHAN OLIVA: Next hearing is for 14 the lo~ line change for Saun{ers on sranklinville Read. !b MR. GOGGINS: Good afternoon, William C, ,Soggins, 13105 Main Road, Hattituck, New York_ 16 Gco~ afZernoon to Members of zhe 8oard_ we submitEed an application for a lot line change 17 with Ehe Building Department, an~ they sent us here for a cariance_ 18 MS. KOW}~SKI: Can I have ~he affidavits? MR. GOGGINS: Yes, I have Ehe affida,'its. 1~ I'm still waiting for one. And a commen~ as te ~ ~he sign posting, there is a pa,,ement from the 20 s~reet to ~he front of the ~wo szructures zhaE we're ~alking about, se i was unable to pose 21 winhin 10 feen. C~aiRWOM~i~ OhiVA: You pes~ed, I saw_ 22 MR_ GOGGINS: I pos~e~ en one building, one building is 17 feet from the road, the other 23 ~uilding is 20 fee~ from the road. Mis~ory of ~he proper~y Le~ 4.1, the 24 ~repert5 te the east is the Elbow Two Restaurant. I~'s been owned for over a0 years by 25 the Saunders' family, i~'s now in a corpcrate name. The properEy Eo the wesE, Lot 3.1, is new June 22, 2004 78 1 2 an upholstery shop; that was purchased ever 30 years ago by Jean Saunders' la~e husband and E~en 3 Eransferred te Joan Saunders. The purpose of buying that property was primarily he extend the % parking lo~ of the restaurant, which was done a~ about that time. So for the pas~ %0 years er so 5 the restaurant has used ~he preper~y to ~he west as part ef their par}~ing lot without ever 6 separaEing the properEies, an~ t~at's kin~ of how O£iff Saunders OiO ~hings, ne was a little loose 7 with how he did Ehings. And Joan is different. She likes to straighten things out. So what we 8 propose is moving the lot lines to conform to the parking lot location. ~hile sitting here waiting ~ for us to De called, Mrs. Saunders and I had many sonversauions about uhe lot line and as we had 10 proposed, and we thought the lines should be moved Eo be more conforming. And in sit~zng here 11 waiting, we Eheugh~ it would be a geed idea if the line Ehat we nad proposed that ,.,e mo~e in 12 Lo the east from the street site, 13 fee~; uhen thee would conform £o the Eetal side yard 13 setbacks, and it would also conform to uhe side yard setback te the west en the property of 3.1, 14 and that ~euld avoid two of the concerns an~ also ine~e the loE line on Eno rear end ef the proper~y lb 12.5 leon, nhen draw a s~raight line from the two psin~s. 16 BOARD M~MBER GO~HRINGER: That's a gooO i~ea. 17 B,i,i~_D MEMBER DINIZIO: You're still ualking abouu ute setOacks for uhe two suery 15 building would Ehen conform? MR. GOGGINS: CorrecE. That would conform 19 with the lot line change and t.s the side yard setSack as well as Ehe total si~e yar~ setbacks. 20 BOARD HEMBER GOEMRINGER: How long will ~aMe you, Bill, uo submiE ~hat to us? 21 ~.~R. GOGGII~S= Two wee~s. BC,2~iD ~dEHSER GOEHRINGER: Can ~..e ad~ress 22 Ehis as a final on Ou£y CHAIRWOI~CeN C, LIV/e: Hopefuil~. If you do 23 it before July 1st we can do iE. BOARD MEMBER TORTOR~: Do you ha,e to go 2% to Ehe Planning Board for this? MR_ GOGGINS: The process is now you go 25 nhe Building Department, then nhey send you where they think they should send you. At least June 22, 2004 79 1 2 e~ere's some direc~ian now. So we went to the Building Department and got sent to bot~ places. 3 So I dit nave a work session with the Planning Board, and they said it was fine with them, 4 subject to the approval of the Zoning Board of Appeals, and they kind of starEed giving me a hard b time, ant{ mi? response was, 2.ou ]CHOW, · don't need approvals, I coulci do an easement and not have 6 go through an.,- of the process_ But we didn'~ want te do treat_ ~,{e wanted ~o do it right and get the 7 property line so it's there forever_ --t the end of the meaning, they sort of agreed. 8 ~45_ KOWALSKI: Are you talking a~ou~ une Planning Board? 9 NR. GOGGINS: Yes_ BOARD MEPIBER TORTOP_A_: Sound very good. 10 If you could just submit some modifications so we R'now exactl} what the size of the lots are. 11 MR. GOGGINS: We will give you brand new, f~ll size survey of the line we're proposing for 12 everybod}'. BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: You're going to 13 move than Sack 12 feeu? HR. GOGGINS: Yes_ On the street side on 14 Franklinville Road, we're going to move the proposed let line change 13 feet to ul~e east_ 15 Then on the rear of the property, we're talking about 3.1, the widtll is 32_5 feet, and we'll 16 exuend that width to 50 feet. Se ,ve'll be moving iE 12.S feet t.s the east in the rear eno 13 17 fee~ - BOARD MEMBER DINIZIO: 17_57 18 MR. GOGGINS: We wane Ed do 12_6_ Se it wcuid be 45. 19 B,DA~.D MENBER Di~[IZIO: I,b.~e iE 12 feet_ [.IR_ GOGGINS: 12.5 feet_ 20 BOARD MEHBER DiNIZIC,: So that's going to make it 45. 2~ MR. GOGGINS: Right. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: S~raight £ine, 22 right? NR. GOGGINS: Straight line from Ehat 23 poin~. .2HAIR?7OMfai~ Oh£VA: Oka? Make a monion 24 to adjourn this ~o Ju£y BOARD MEHBER GOEHRINGER: Second. 25 CHAIRNOH~2~ OLiVA: Subject to Hr_ Goggins giving us new lot lines. June 22, 200e 8O 1 2 MS. EOWALSKI: About 6:00 p.m. on :he lst_ 14R. GOGGINS: Thank 3 !See minumes for resolution.! 4 CHAIRWON~ QLIVA: Next hearing was the Southeld Fire DistricE./Omnipoint Communication, ee 5 cetera. I do Selieve ~hey wish an a~journmenE until July 1SEh because they nave new information 6 as ~o ~he horns on top of the propose~ cell towers. 7 MS. KOWALSKI: For the decibel levels_ CHAIRWOI~2~ OLIVA: Is there anyone here 8 ~at wants to speak about this now? Okay, make a motion te adjourn the hearing until July 15tn_ 9 {.See minutes for resolution_, 10 ,2HAIRWOM~ OLIVA: Next one is Bremer's Market and Deli, also known as North Pork Mar~eE 11 an.t Deli. MR_ CONDiN: Oo~n Con,in for Henry Bremer, 12 ~vho is the owner of North Pork Deli. This is our second trip before the Board. Since last month ~e 13 re, ise~ the site plan, hopefull/ te your sauisfaction_ In addition uo that, we also 14 presented the same site plan ~o t~e Planning Department. T~ey formallf accepted it, and we'll 15 act en i~ pursuan~ Eo your decision_ The new site plan has several new changes. 16 First ef all, ~he asphalt that was shown in uhe front of the builOing has been replaced with 17 grass. We're proposing grass ~ere as well as an entry wa£k from ~he side of the buil.iing Ee 18~ fron~ of ~he building_ The parking spaces, as .~ou requested we 19 pu~ in nine parking spaces on the 1o~. The Planning Depar~men~ based en t~e square footage 20 and size of the building requested eight, anO we found roeln fbr nine. 21 Another c~ange that we haO maOe was nhe adjacenn owner ha~ expressed some concern aDoun a 22 fence that was along ~he proper~y, whae we're propasing is ~e put a s~ockade fence along his 23 proper~, tha~ would be on ~he eastern side of lot as well as the northern side_ 24 And ias~ but not least, we have a one way entrance to the property coming off the Main Road 29 ani a ~wo-waf entrance and exit on to Legion Avenue. There's nwo on the eastern side of Ehe 81 1 2 building. CHAIRWOM~2~ OLI\i'~_: i found eight. 3 HR. ,20NDIN: Then the handicap~e.d over on the end of the building. 4 BOARD MEMBER TORTORA: So the setback to the property line, would be 23 feet there? 5 HR. CONDIN: 23 feet. BOP~I.D MEMBER TORTOP3_: Right here ,,ou .... 6 got -- i:'s an improvement, no queshion abouh it. BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: Where are the 7 septic systems going to go? MR. CONDII'I: In the back corner of the 8 lct, back ~;estern corner, ~here's five leaching pools, and where the building makes an "L" there's 9 a ,grease trap and septic tank right aE location. 10 BOARD MEMBER ORL~J~DO: Are those proposed? NR_ CONDiN: No, those are in there_ The 11 septic and grease trap are brand new_ BOARD MEMBER TORTOFeA: The only question i 12 have, and I'm sure the Planning Board must ha~.e addressed this, you're going to have deliveries 13 coming in here, and where are ~he deli-.erl~ trucks going to -- 1% MR. ,~NDIN: i belie,~e abel/ require something like 4~ feet in the back of the 15 bnil,ting, and if you take a look at ~he back of uhe building to the back ef the lot, we have a 16 uoEal of S4'5". Se, we figure that any deliveries that ?,,oult be required, ~he/ osuld maybe take up 17 o~]e .of the parking spaces while they're doing the deliveries and ~hen have enough room ~o pull out 1~ and back on to Legion Avenue. BO. ARD ME?,[BER TORTORA: That would be the 19 only thing I'd say is that ~his is going to be ~ight ~n here because ehe delivery trucks are 20 coming in here and historically with a ,deli, in the morning everything is very busl/, actually 21 ~:00, 6:00 too, pretty busy, delivery ~rucks are ~cing to be coming in, and I don't ~_now where 22 they're gozng to park, and hopefullf fou're going tc. have customers, and how ~he customers would get 23 out around the delivery truck. I'm not sure ~hat there's sufficient room ~here. 2% MR. CONDII'T: I~'s a ~ery limited lot_ BC,Ai~_D MEMBER GOEHRINGER: No worse than 25 was before_ MR. CONDiN: It's a iinEle betmer. June 22, 2,2,04 82 1 2 BOARD MEMBER GOEHRINGER: It's a 100 percen~ ~e~er. MayBe that curb cue on Legion 3 AvenL~e could be opened up a li~le Oi~. HR. CO~FOIN: The onl_~, thing ~hat restricts ~ tna~ is ~nere's a telephone pole right on the northern edge of it. 5 CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: Couldn't the deliverTM trucks go all the way straight in almosE ~o the 6 o~her side and then back in~o one of the stalls and come out? 7 MS_ KONALSKI: Behind t~e building. MR_ CONDIN: Sure. There's enough room te 8 ds that and back the truck in. I don'~ ~hin~ we're talking aboL~t tractor trailer tYpe trucks as 9 far as deliveries. CN_AIRWOHAI{ OLIVA: Hostl.? ~we bi' fours or 10 ~., hat ever. MS KOWALSKI: They have always gone in 11 the back anyway for that. BOARD i.'IEP~BER DINIZIO: ~'[e're not going to 12 alleviate that problem_ CHAIRWOMAN OLIVA: Any other questions? 13 BOARD ME[{BER GOEHRINGER: None. BOAP, D ~dEHBER TORTORA: Ne. 14 ,2HAIRWOM?~ OLIVA: I'~ like to make a motion to close the hearing and reserve decision lb ~ntil later. ~.See minutes for resoluEisn.,, 16 ('Time ended 1:27 p.m..~ 18 2O 21 22 23 24 200% 83 1 2 3 C E R T I F I C?~ T I 0 I'I 5 I, Florence V. Wiles, Notary Public for Lhe 6 SLate of New York, do hereby certify: 7 THAT the wiEhin transcripE is a true record of 8 ~he EesEimonv given. 9 I further certify Ehat i am no~ rela~ed by 10 blood or marriage, te any of the parties te this 11 action; and 12 THAT I am in ne way interesned in the outcome 13 of Ehis maEEer. 1% IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto se~ my 1S hand this 22nd day of June, 2004_ 16 17 ~ ] , -., / !, {~ Florence V. Wiles 21 22 23 24 June 22, 2004