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HomeMy WebLinkAboutTB-10/06/1999-S SPECIAL MEETING SOUTHOLD TOWN BOARD OCTOBER 6, 1999 5:00 P.M. PUBLIC COMMENTS ON PROPOSED ZONING MAP CHANGES ON ROUTE 48 IN THE TOWN OF SOUTHOLD Present: Supervisor Jean W. Cochran Councilwoman Alice J. Hussie Councilman William B. Moore Councilman John M. Romanelli Councilman Brian G. Murphy Absent: Justice Louisa P. Evans Town Clerk Elizabeth A. Neville Town Attorney Gregory F. Yakaboski SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: I would like to reconvene the hearing on the proposed zone changes on Route 48. This evening will be doing Peconic 2A and 2B in this first segment. Bill will read the tax map numbers of the properties and who the owners are. COUNCILMAN WILLIAM D. MOORE: Peconic 2A, SCTM# 1000-74-3-13 Dorothy Victoria and John Mumster; 73-3-14 Sidney Waxler; 74-3-15 Mr. E Mrs. Edward Dart; 74-4-15 Mr.& Mrs. Paul McGlynn; 74-4-16 Louise Day; 74-3-16 Patrick 1; Robert Adipietro; 74-3-17 Olive Hairston Hayes; 74-5-1 Mr. E Mrs. Bennett Blackburn; 74-5-5 Mr. Robert Johnson. SUPERVISOR: Would anyone like to address the Town Board in relation to any of these parcels? At this time? Yes.. LOUISE BLACKBURN, PECONIC: I am sorry that 1 come here kind of ignorant of the law and the zones, but I received a letter about wanting to change into a hamlet business district there. I am trying to understand, is that the property where the school was proposed for? Or is it actually on Route 48? 1 don't understand... SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: We will have to find you on the map first.... MRS. BLACKBURN: We are right on Peconic Lane. That little "L" shaped piece across from the park or recreation area... SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: O.K. Let me find you, Peconic 2... MRS. BLACKBURN: 2 B. It is actually under Bennett Blackburn E wife. I received a letter and it stated that you wanted to change it to a hamlet business district and 1 am not sure that I understand what property you are talking about. COUNCILMAN BRIAN MUPRHY: Your property. MRS. BLACKBURN: What about the property that was proposed for the pool? would that include that area also? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: No, that 's going to be a playground with baseball diamonds, all for children. It will remain a recreation park area like Tasker Park? O.K.? MRS. BLACKBURN: O.K. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Would anyone else like to address the Town Board? (There was no response.) COUNCILMAN MOORE: Are you sure? (There was no response.) SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Would anyone else like to address the Board in relation to Peconic 2A or 213? or in general, in relation to the plan? If not, then we will adjourn until the next hearing at 6:00 P.M. Time: 5:30 P.M. 6:00 P.M. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: O.K. I am reconvening the hearing on Peconic 2C, D, and E. COUNCILMAN MOORE read the SCTM #'s and owners of the property as follows: 2 C, D, E E: SCTM# 1000-74-3-19.3 Kenneth Dickerson; P/O 74-3-19.2 Kevin Terry; 74-3-20 Alice Platon; 74-3-24.2 Mr. E Mrs. Alvin Combs. SUPERVISOR: Thank you. You have heard the parcels we are discussing. We would appreciate your input? Is there anyone that would like to address the Town Board? (There was no response.) SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: If not, we will adjourn this section of the hearing and at 7:00 P.M. we will take up Southold 1, 2A, 26, and 2C. Time: 6:20 P.M. 7:00 P.M. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: I will reconvene this hearing in relation to proposed zone changes on Route 48. This hearing will cover Southold 1, 2A, 213, E 2C. Bill will read the lot numbers and the land owner. COUNCILMAN MOORE: SCTM# 1000-69-4-2.2 Mr. E Mrs. Gerald Gralton; 69-4-2.3 Helmut Haas; 69-4-3 Ruth Enterprises, Inc.; 69-2-1 William Zebroski, Jr.; 69-2-2 Carol Zebroski Savage & Others; 69-2-3 Steve Doroski; 69-2-4 Bayberry Enterprises; 69-3-1 Steve Doroski; 69-3-2 Steve Doroski; 69-3-3 Steve Doroski. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Would anyone like to address the Town Board on any of these parcels? ROBERT JENKINS, CUTCHOGUE (representing Steve Doroski): Good Evening. in regard to 69-3-1, 69-3-2, and 69-3-3, you recommended zone changes from Light Industry over to Agricultural Conservation. I would just like to re-familiarize everyone with the definition and purpose of agricultural conservation. The purpose of the agricultural conservation district and the low density residential district is to reasonably control, to the extent possible, and to prevent the unnecessary loss of those currently open lands within the Town containing large and contiguous areas upon agricultural soil which are the basis for a significant portion of the town's economy and those areas with sensitive environmental features. Those three parcels that I just called off contain 2 1/2 acres. We have on that 2 1/2 acres, a barn for the packaging and storage of produce, four residences for labor, a building used for refrigerated storage and an additional building used for machinery storage, a loading dock and driveways to and from the buildings, leaving very little agricultural land on which to grow in an AC district. So, I would certainly request that the Board consider keeping that light industrial. It's not suitable for farming. The second thing that I would like to address is the other parcel 69-2-3. If I could take three minutes from Mr. Steve Doroski's time, I would like to read this letter to the Board. He couldn't make it personally, he asked me to present this letter to you. "Dear Supervisor and Town Board Members: In 1936 1 rented this parcel of land which extended from what was known as the North Road, at that time, to Soundview Avenue to the north. Then in 1953 1 purchased this land from my mother and father-in-law, Mr. E Mrs. Frank Zaveski. My wife Frances, now deceased, and I farmed this land and started a small roadside farmstand where we sold our farm produce, plants and roses we grew on our farm. In 1967 Suffolk County took 3 acres of my property and divided my farm leaving me with a serious drainage problem, north and south of the highway, making Route 48 eight feet higher than my property. Since my farm property was decreased in size and traffic flow was re-routed off the North Road to Route 48, in 1968 1 built what is now knows as Doroski's Carden Center E Nursery, Inc. At that time my Garden Center was zoned limited business and has operated as such all these years and i have paid Limited Business taxes on this property. My Garden Center faces east on Ackerly Pond Lane and has no entrances or exits onto route 48. 1 have buffered Route 48 and my property with trees and landscaping so as to obscure any unpleasantries. Also on the west side of this property we have planted our nursery stock, which I feel adds to the rural look of Route 48. My family and I try to keep our Garden Center attractive to the passerby and a pleasant place to visit. Today the Southold Town Board wants to change my property to a Residential office. 1 am opposed to this change as I do not see how an office building looking like a home can be made out of a greenhouse. Will my taxes decrease with this change, or will I continue to pay the same tax rate or more? Also at this time, I do not know what the permitted usage will be with the new proposed zone land usage changes. i trust that the elected officials of Southold Town will take the initiative to consider leaving my family's and my Garden Center as well as my other properties as they are presently with their present usages. Sincerely, Steve J. Doroski, Doroski's Nursery, Inc. He encloses a photograph of the drainage problem at County Road (which Mr. Jenkins presented together with the letter to be made a part of the file.) If nobody objects, I would just like to address the issue of the hamlet business and keeping business in the hamlets. I don't care how old you are or how young you are, everyone can remember hanging out in the village at their favorite soda shop or sneaking in and smoking a cigarette illegally, or whatever. I as well as everyone else would like to see a viable commercial center in every hamlet. But rezoning isn't necessarily the answer. Good business practices will save the downtown merchants in the hamlet areas, not zoning. Internet shopping, over the internet, 1 800 shopping, call L.L. Bean, go to B.J's and other wholesale clubs, regional malls, all that hurts much more than the few business properties that are on County Road 48. 1 think that the Town Board might be better spending their time putting together a economic task force. 1 think they did put together one, but I don't know how far it went to help all the businesses that are in town continue to operate and exist as best they can. So, as 1 said, 1 don't know that zoning, or no businesses on the North Road is going to save those businesses that are downtown. They are having a hard enough time, they have an awful lot of empty stores now, and there's very few business on the North Road at this time. That's all I have to say for now. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you, Bob. Anyone else like to address the Town Board? If not we will adjourn, Oh... ROBERT JENKINS: I just have a few letters from us that I would like to turn in. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: They will be put in the file and made a part of the record. Petition Pursuant to Section 265 of the New York Town Law signed by Steve J. Doroski protesting against said change of zone were received for SCTM# 1000-69-2-3 as well as six (6) letters from the following individuals saying that while they are not voting residents of Southold Town, they do shop at Doroski's Garden Center and are opposed to the zone changes for that area: John R. Cramer and Theresa A. Cramer; Guy A. Buonincontro and Barbara Buonincontro; Frank J. Lash; and Patricia Gergyes SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Is there anyone else present who would like to speak at this time? (There was no response.) SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: If, not, we will recess until 8:00 P.M. Time 7:10 P.M. 8:00 P.M. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: At this time I would like to reconvene the County Road 48 hearings. We will be doing Southold 5B and Southold 6. Councilman Bill Moore will read the SCTM #'s and property owners. COUNCILMAN MOORE: The properties involved are #1000-055-5-2.3 Mr. E Mrs. Gary Rempe; 1000-55-5-4 Linda Bertaini E Others; 1000-55-5-5 Audrey Berglund; 1000-P/O 055-2-24.2 Frank Field Corp.; 1000-55-2-23 Madeleine Schlafer; 1000-055-5-10 George Penny IV E Robert Boger; 1000-055-5-11 Joann Rizzo; 1000-055-5-12.2 Mr. E Mrs. Donald Tuthill; 1000-055-5-9.1 Patricia Miloski. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Would anyone like to address the Town Board in relation to any of these properties? Pat? PATRICIA MILOWSKI, WINDSOND COUNTY STORE: Good evening Supervisor Cochran and Members of the Town Board. 1 am not going to repeat my statement from Tuesday which everyone already has a copy of. I just want to summarize basically what I said. I respectfully request that the present "B" zoning be kept as such as it has been for over 30 years. 1 have filed two protest petitions in the Town Clerk's Office regarding Town Law 265. 1 ask that you please re-read my letters to you from August and September regarding my property and my last statement from Tuesday. I have requested that all letters and correspondence regarding the opposition to the zone change be included in this public hearing and also in the hearings to follow. I have explained the uniqueness of my parcel due to the two structures, the setbacks from the road, the lot size and map configuration, the surrounding "B" zone areas including across the street and how the current C.O.'s clearly fit into business zoning only. I have explained how changing my zoning from "B" which it has been for over 30 years will create a non-conforming business on a non-conforming lot and will result in substantial emotional and financial hardship. I have cited several examples of why Mr. Cramer's report appears to have been arbitrary and capricious in his proposal to re-zone my property. I have submitted a letter from a local realtor regarding the dramatic reduction of property value should a zone change occur. Again, every town in Suffolk County is against non-conforming uses and in this case, Mr. Cramer is taking a conforming area and making it non-conforming. I am a woman sole proprietor of an established country store in this hamlet business community. This is my only asset. This business was established with my own hands and finances. A small business has to be allowed to grow within its permitted uses in order to attempt to serve your customers. Economically 1 cannot survive or get my investment back, my retirement, unless you keep my zoning as business. I once again request that the Town Board reject the proposal to re-zone my property and to keep it business zone as it has been zoned for many years. Respectfully submitted, Pat Miloski. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Anyone else like to address the Town Board. Mr. Guarriello? ROBERT GUARRIELLO G E S ELECTRIC: John Bertani and myself, Robert Guarriello purchased the property at 3460 Youngs Avenue ten years ago to have a place to operate our family business from. We have improved the property and use it to store material and equipment necessary for our daily operations. We have our two generations of family and employees that depend on G E S Electric for their livelihood. You simply cannot take this away without compensation. It is something that I cannot believe could happen in this country, not here in Southold. I ask that you put yourself in my position and stop and think. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you, Bob. O.K. would anyone else like to speak? JOANN SANTORO (RIZZO): Joann Santoro, business and property owner on Route 48. 1 would like to go on record as being opposed to the zoning changes that will affect the value of my property. I have owned and conducted a business on this property zoned "B" for twenty years. Being a local business person I have supported many organizations and employed many locals. I am planning retirement within a few years. I am now being asked to limit what I can sell my property as or what a new owner can use it for. This greatly reduces potential life and value of my property. I recently sold a home on Route 48 for $122,000.00 because no one wants to live on Route 48. We are a relatively small group of business owners on Route 48 and yet we are being asked to absorb the cost of ensuring open space for all to enjoy. It comes to mind, that this an unbalanced plan. Thousands of our taxpayers dollars have been spent on studies and more studies and yet nothing suggests that all of north fork property owners, both business and homeowners share the cost of maintaining our rural way of life. Let's give all of Civil Service Employees advancement tests, and when they pass and expect promotions, tell them that the rules have changed. That is what is being proposed as re-zoning, it is not very different. Why? Let's then, make it against the law to clutter our local landscaping with hundreds of unsightly political advertisements. Thank you for your time. ANN MILOSKI, CALVERTON (PAT MILOSKI'S MOTHER): It is very sad to have watch these people come up begging to keep their property as it is. There are only small business owners. Right now, I would like to speak to the Town Board and Supervisor Cochran, i am speaking on behalf of Pat Miloski's business property located on Route 48, # 055-5-9.1. Pat Miloski took on an enormous task to materialize a hope and dream of a unique country store. When she first leased with an option in 1993, it was with a condition that she could do retail sales in this business zoned parcel. She went to the Southold Planning Board and they conferred that the present zoning was commercial business with a current C.O. for such. She was told to go to the Building Department and ask an Inspector to come out to see what she needed to do to obtain a C.O. to retail on the front building. The Building Inspector came out and informed her of what she needed to obtain a retail business C.O. She completed the work and the Building Department Inspector returned and approved it and she received a C.O. for retail business. The rear building C.O. was already in place and in use. She continued her enormous task of restoring this beautiful neglected building and materialized this structure into an upstanding business within the north shore business hamlet area of Southold. A safe investment for her family's future. She restored this eyesore with her own money, no town grants, no tax incentives. Instead of cutting down stately 35 ft. evergreens that blocked visibility, she had them trimmed from the bottom up, therefore, preserving the trees and giving her the visibility she needed. Instead of blacktop, which would have been cheaper and easier to maintain, she searched and found an orange colored dust free flagstone recycled product that was more in character with the nature of the building. In 1995 she exercised her option to buy, but first went back to the Zoning Board to see if everything was in order. They told her the property was business zoned and retail and current uses with C.O.'s in place. They also mentioned that she had done a wonderful job with this property. They further stated that a current Town Board member was part of the Town's Route 48 Master Plan study that kept the zoning on this parcel as business. Now you are telling her that after 30 years of business zoning, you are going to change the zone from business to RO which has none of the permitted uses that she is doing. I would ask that you reject the current proposal and keep her zoning as "B" since this is a developed unique parcel in a business area. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Would anyone else like to address the Town Board? JOHN SATKOSKI: I want to go on record that I am opposed to any zoning changes to my property and all the other properties that are on Route 48. 1 think you rascals better do some looking, deep down. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you , John, what did you call me John, a rascal, you made me feel young again. A little rascal, Thank you, John. Anyone else like to address the Town Board? Mr. Penny... GEORGE L. PENNY, IV: Hi, good evening. Once again, George Penny. I would just like to ask at this time, have we heard from the Town Planning Board and the County Planning Commission? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Not yet, George. Not to my knowledge. MR. PENNY: Not to your knowledge, because I read in last week's paper that the Planning Board had acted on something over a week ago, it was in last Thursday's paper... SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Our Planning Board? MR. PENNY: Yes. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: I didn't see it in the paper, we haven't gotten anything in relation to, it would go through Betty...... MR. PENNY: With regard to my parcel, the one in Southold, George L. Penny IV and Robert Boger and George L. Penny Incorporated in Mattituck, two parcels, have there been any other communications which have normally been part of any public hearing I have participated in. I would like to know if there is a record of any correspondence regarding my properties? TOWN CLERK BETTY NEVILLE: There are approximately 100 proposed changes and many letters received. My office is still in the process of sorting them into the individual file folders according to tax map numbers. COUNCILMAN JOHN ROMANELLI:1 am sure there have. Letters of protest....I have seen so many letters... MR: PENNY: That specifically mention my parcels? COUNCILMAN ROMANELLI: George, I don't know. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: George, I get stacks like this.. both pro and con MR. PENNY: I am asking regarding my parcels? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: George, they get sent over to Betty and she will be making it all a part of the public record and we will have copies, but we don't necessarily..... COUNCILMAN ROMANELLI: There are so many, they are really not sorted out yet. SUPERVISOR: We haven't gone through them all yet. We will get that when we get all of the hearing transcription and everything else. Betty could check..... MR. PENNY: I am only asking out of habit because the 8 years that I was on the Town Board, these were read at the beginning of each hearing and that's why I am asking, for no other reason. I am not trying to put anybody on the spot. COUNCILMAN MOORE: Betty is setting up a separate file for each tax map parcel and make sure that any letters associated get put into the proper file. MR. PENNY: You understand my reason for asking, the eight years that I was on the Town Board these were read at the beginning of each public hearing. That's why 1 am asking, for no other reason, I am not trying to put anybody on the spot. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: What you are saying is when you have a hearing and you read the public notice, usually attached is any correspondence that you receive to that point, O.K. There wasn't really any correspondence to that point, it's All come in after the public notice was printed and as we have gone through this, during these last few days. We have received some every day, we've received a form letter in opposition, a form letter in favor of. Not as many personally written letters, all of that goes over to Betty's office, it is all becoming a part of the public record, it will all be reviewed by the Board. MR. PENNY: Will this be available to the individual property owners, if there are comments made about their property, so that they can address them in the final hearing on the 14th of October? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: It's public information, yes. If that's what you are looking for, yes, we could do that. If there is any letter there that relates to your property or any others, we could certainly see that you can come in and pick it up. MR. PENNY: 1 know that for eight years this is what we did. If somebody wrote something about their property or had comments about anything that was going on, people could respond to it in a public domain. I mean if you were to hand me comments that people made that they found something.... SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: George, nothing has changed. I sat on the Board with you. Nothing has changed. MR. PENNY: Yeah, but we don't have that. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: You will be getting them as soon as she can get them separated into files for each separate land owner. We certainly... It's public information, George, you know that... MR. PENNY: I will have them for the final hearing? SUPERVISOR: You should have it before the hearing. COUNCILWOMAN HUSSIE: Are you asking that the comments for anyone's property be read into the record at that public hearing. MR. PENNY: That is always the way it was. I don't know what has changed. I mean lot has changed since I have been on the Board, it's been 6 or 8 years or whatever it is. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: It's no different. COUNCILMAN ROMANELLI: At the final hearing, I am sure that we will have them all separated out. COUNCILWOMAN: Then we can read each one, in your instance, so that all the comments about your property can be read into the record at time. MR. PENNY: Right, comments that were made, concerning the public hearing I will at least have a chance to have seen what comments were either for or against me, so that I can address them. COUNCILWOMAN: Your point is that you want them in the public record, rather than something that you can just go down and look at. MR. PENNY: I want all of the cards on the table. We always had all of the cards on the table. SUPERVISOR: They still are. Let me say this to you. They are already a part of the public record. They all go to Betty. They are all included in the public record which will be a part of the transcription. If what you are asking that you would like to know ahead of time, if there any letters that relate to you, personally, so that you can answer that before the last hearing date?, we can work this out. MR. PENNY: Absolutely. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: We can work this out. We can give you these copies. But, please give Betty the chance to get through it all. They are still coming in every day. MR. PENNY: I am just trying to find out when they are going to be available? SUPERVISOR: Betty, when do you think? TOWN CLERK BETTY NEVILLE: My office copied them today and they are going to sort them tomorrow. Everyone in my whole office is doing all that they possibly can. MR. PENNY: So, sometime between now and next Thursday, I can stop in the Town Clerk's Office? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: 1 would say yes. MR. PENNY: Thank you very much. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: O.K. anyone else like to talk to the Town Board to share your thoughts with us? ROBERT JENKINS, CUTCHOGUE: Good evening. I am referring to the reason that was given for this study to keep the hamlet businesses viable and in the hamlet. I wonder if the Town Board is able to, or has addressed the fact that probably the single most important thing is to keep the post office in that. I know that Love Lane in Mattituck, the post office is the economic center of Mattituck. They are considering enlarging or moving it and Mattituck is very fearful that they will lose the post office from Love Lane. I know when the post office moved from Main Street in Southold to the back of Traveler Street. The Main Street hamlet center as we knew it, ceased to exist. So, I think that the Town Board might contact the regional postmaster general, or who ever that might be and assure that all of the post offices stay in the hamlet centers. I think this will keep the hamlet center more viable than re-zoning those parcels of business property on County Road 48. That's my first thing. The second one. Instead of re-zoning those businesses on County Road 48. 1 feel that the Town should do more to enforce the zoning codes that we already have in place. God knows, it's tough enough to be in business today. As business must pay Workmens Compensation Liability Insurance, Medicare, FICA, State sales tax, etc., etc. we have a lot of businesses that are operating out of residential zones, out of agricultural zones. Some with agricultural exemptions running more than one business. Legitimate businesses are being told that they should be re-zoned to a lesser use and businesses that shouldn't be operating out of the zone that they are in, are left alone to take cash off the books and operate any way they feel. I think that should be addressed. Thirdly, after 3 days of being at the hearings, I don't see the fervent out cry from the public to re-zone these businesses. I see that there is some very civic minded persons that were here speaking in favor of the plan, overall, of not allowing Route 48 to become like Route 58. 1 think all of us in the Town of Southold 100%, agree with that. But, 1 don't see the general public supporting the Cramer study, as we know it. And last, but not least, I thank you for putting up me for three days. 1 hope you put this in the box and put this down in the infamous cellar, and let it stay there. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: You don't want to give us a copy of your remarks? MR. JENKINS: i don't have them written out. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: O.K. Thanks, Bob. Mr. Meineke? HOWARD MEINEKE, NFEC: 1 just had some thoughts after being here on and off for the duration of the hearings. The hearings of the past 3 days have been long and demanding and actually more interesting than I had expected. Many factors were uncovered during the proceedings and many views were brought forth. That part is worthwhile. But, we cannot let the volume of the testimony of the property owners obscure the real reason we came to the hearings. And that is that the North Fork is at risk, Route 48 is the subject, because it seems to be one relatively straight forward place to join the battle. A short list of what confronts us is the fear of over development and helter skelter development on Route 48, the threat of residential zoning that exists on all of the farmland, declining water quality, every increasing non-stop traffic, and many more items. We come away from these hearings with a few convictions. One, the status quo, everything is fine as it is and there is no problem is not good enough. We recognize the critical need to work on these problems on that list and we should make a positive start on it. Second point, present ownership of the various properties is one situation, but possible acts of owners in the future present another more difficult dimension. Your zoning today and the one on one contact with the owners is much different than what it will be when a new owner moves in at some future time. The Route 48 Study is important because it is in opportunity to take an important positive step toward the oft repeated goals from the 30 or so past studies. After all of those aborted reports mildewing in the basement really do need a start, an actual beginning and not another cop-out. We attach extraordinary importance to success on this endeavor because we firmly believe that the first step is the hardest, and then once we start, we will surprise ourselves and find out that yes, we can do it. We like you did not agree with all the Cramer recommendations, but that is not the prime point. The real point is we have to begin. I think to begin we should pass some part, the best part of the Route 48 legislation and start. This is what we expect of the Town Board. This is a very important overall agenda and this is just a starting point. I think we need the feeling that we are really in the game and we are doing it. As a starter, we again suggest the appointment of a panel, and this had been used elsewhere. Possibly composed of expert in real estate, agriculture, planning, business, the Town Board, and other folks, if necessary to sit and work with all affected property owners at this point those along Route 48 subject to zoning legislation at this time to develop procedures and solutions and to consult with the Board as required. I think constructive thinking can do wonders and through this all we do have to achieve fairness and everybody out here is worried about fairness. I think we can sneak up on fairness if we work on it and that's a method that I would suggest. I would think post haste that we should get involved with that. We applaud the Board for wading into the Route 48 question. It's had it's fits and storms, but 1 think it was a good start. It had to be done and if we now act on what we are learning, we will some day look back and be proud that we started and be proud that we did it. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you. Anyone else like to address? Yes, ma'am.. CONSTANCE CASE: My name is Constance Case. Yes, 1 am a member of the North Fork Environmental Council, but I am also a person who lives in Southold like Bob was talking about and very much in favor of the Cramer report and I urge you to adopt the recommendations. It has been very hard to sit here these three days and listen to the hardships that are expressed by people who have very valid issues with it. And yet, I am urging you, I guess to look to the good of Southold in general and to the future of Southold for us for our children and for generations to come, because what we have now cannot be replaced. It is very hard to put that against the stories that I have heard or problems that I heard that have been addressed by individual people. I guess it is a case, to me, of the good of the whole area in general, versus individual issues and yet, those have to be addressed. So, I do ask you to pass the recommendations of the report. But I also, maybe a possibility, is the one that Howard just recommended. That maybe there is a some kind of arbitration panel to address after the report has been passed, to address the needs of individual people and to look at some of the issues and some of the problems that need to be addressed. But, please continue to focus on the good of the township, in general. That's the courage that is needed here and that's a hard thing. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you very much. Anyone else like to address the Town Board? HENRY SMITH: My name is Henry Smith. I don't have a personal interest in any of these properties we are talking about here tonight. But, these people are my neighbors. They are business people. They are hard working people. And to take away their property rights the way you are doing, I think is totally wrong. I think you are going about this whole thing the wrong way. I mean there are a lot more problems in this town than these little Mom E Pop operations, that we have to take away their property rights. What would happen is we had some kind of blight in the ground that the ground was no longer any good for grapes? We couldn't grow grapes here anymore. Now, the land is useless. We have one grape farmer that has almost 500 acres. There is no farmland preservation rights sold on his property. Now, he can develop it and the other wineries can do the same thing. Now, all of a sudden, what are we going to call the Town, "Wineville". We could have hundreds of hundreds of thousands of homes on these properties. To take away these rights of these people. I don't know, it boggles my mind that this is what you are doing. 1 am just opposed to it and these people are Southold. I see everybody wants Southold to be beautiful and everything. This is Southold, they want it beautiful too. I mean they don't want to see it ruined. They are just trying to make a living. They are hard working business people. I will tell you one thing, it is a lot different when you sign the front of the check then the back of the check all the time. They know what it is to be in business and have to pay bills and try to make a profit. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you. Henry. I am going to take someone who has not yet had the opportunity to speak. Is there anyone else who would like to speak that has not had the opportunity as yet? Your letter I received yesterday has been sent to the Town Clerk's Office to be a part of the record. KATHLEEN GRASECK: I am Kathleen Graseck. 1 just want to say that actually you pretty much have two segments of the Town here. I don't think that you are hearing from all of the voters of the Town, or all of the people who live in the Town of Southold. I think they should be given the opportunity to voice their opinion on this issue. To be very truthful with you, we are not the problem as far as vistas go. We are a very small portion of the acreage. I know in the papers they put it down as square footage. But, you know we are really a very small part of the Town. To have this study pinpoint us, you know, the property owners, and try to gauge them is just so completely unfair. So, I really feel that we need more public input on this whole thing. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you. Anyone else like to address the Town Board that has not spoken yet? Mr. Huntington. RAY HUNTINGTON, CUTCHOGUE: I just like to stand up to thank the Town Board for raising this public discussion. I don't really believe that we are trying to indict anybody or to take rights away from anybody. We are trying as a community to look within ourselves and find out what is the right thing to do, for the future, and for the near future as well. So, my thanks to all for bringing forth this discussion, listening to all of these hours and continuing with your efforts until the 14th, I guess it is. It's not an easy job, it's probably one of the toughest ones we have had. But, the idea that we are at doing it is very good for Southold. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Anyone else? Before those get a second chance? ANN MILOSKI: I would just like to address some of the things that the North Fork Environmental Council has said. I have always supported the NFEC and I have also gone out and supported many of the things that they have done and I am a member of it. But, I think when you ask for arbitration after you ask to have something passed, is wrong. Arbitration should have been before. The people should have been asked to participate in this before. You don't ask for arbitration after you ask for zoning. If this it the way the NFEC is going to do things, I am the first one that is going to cancel my membership. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Anyone else like to address the Town Board? JOANN SANTORA: 1 hadn't planned to do this again. But, I'm a little confused on one thing. Things like the Cox Lane industrial park? Does the environmentalists think that is nice? I don't understand it. How come that was allowed? 1 mean, 1 think that is an eyesore in our quaint little rural Town. I also think that the two strip malls right down the road from me, I think they are unsightly. How come that was allowed? The environmentalists didn't mind that, they thought it looked good. 1 don't understand what is happening now. Maybe it could be explained better to me, but these are allowed. But business that have been in the same little houses for many years are being changed? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Joann, please. I don't want anyone to go home with a burning feeling or an unanswered opportunity to say what is in their heart. So, we thank you for standing up and sharing your thoughts with us. Is there anyone else who would like to address the Town Board? GEORGE PENNY: This is regarding Penny Lumber in Mattituck. As I understand, now, we are up to three goals. One is the visual quality of people that drive through Southold Town and I am sure that includes the 1,500 to 2000 people that go both ways to the ferries in Orient and back, that don't affect our life in any way except create havoc and hardship and the need for sometime in the very near future, a traffic light at every crossroad. But, I understand that is important that we improve things for these people also. But, visual quality is what we are addressing here. Traffic, and preserving the hamlets. Well, Penny Lumber can't be seen from Route 48. My small little carpet store can, and we generate maybe 10 cars in and out of there every day. As far as preserving the hamlets go, Penny Lumber cannot operate in a hamlet atmosphere. We are a light industrial business that cannot move into a hamlet. So, there is no competition between me and anybody from the hamlet centers regarding a lumberyard. So, let's address the carpet center. I am probably the one carpet center anywhere that does not have a warehouse directly behind it. And I mean directly because to run a carpet center requires warehouse space. I don't believe that if Gerry Gralton from Southold Floor Covering, or myself, or someone like Southold Quarry who requires warehouse space were forced that there is anywhere that could occupy us. The warehouse space that we require is much too much. I mean when you rent a store in Town, you get 1,000-1,500 square feet where you can put a couple of offices in and a restroom, that's about all you are going to get in a hamlet center. So, the nature of the business is what designates where we are and why we are there. To expect that we are going to move out of these, or somebody else Is going to take out place and we are going to complete with somebody In the hamlet center, is impossible. Because they can't get that kind of space, there Is not that kind of room in the hamlets for the nature of our business. We have trucks which we have to load and unload. The carpet business particularly have 15 ft. rolls which have to be unloaded with a forklift. Those rolls have to be stored. There is padding that has to be stored that has to be manhandled. Luckily for me, I don't have the warehouse directly behind Penny Center only because of the Lumberyard which is behind it. Some 200 or 300 feet behind it, out of sight, where the trucks come in off of Sound Avenue, not off of County Route 48 and are unloaded by the men with my heavy equipment. If I was to take and sell Penny Flooring Center to someone else, their immediate needs would be to put up a warehouse directly behind that part of the property. But it's not going that way. There is no need for it to go that way. I mean, if it's not broke, let's not try to fix it. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Anyone else like to address the Town Board? If not, we will.. Yes, O.K., come on Bob. ROBERT JENKINS, CUTCHOGUE: Just a few quick remarks. Regarding the overall corridor of Route 48. 1 believe that every citizen of the organizations, every business person should realize that 92 or 93% of the Route 48 Corridor is agriculture or agriculture conservation or low density housing. It is not business, light business, industrial, or residential office. A very small part, minuscule part of the County Route 48 Corridor are those 4 different zones. Therefore, everyone should be very very happy to know that over 90% of the Town of the Route 48 Corridor has the potential of being preserved through the program the Town, County, and the State has in place and it is a voluntary one. So, I think that Town Board should keep in mind that comments made earlier that other people made earlier about the hamlet business being viable to good business practices, and the post offices I mentioned earlier. Thank you. COUNCILMAN ROMANELLI: The total acreage studied under the plan is 272 acres. 272.74 to be exact. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Mr. Huntington? MR. HUNTINGTON: 25% of the parcels along the North Road proper in the section that we are talking about are in the study and up for recommendation. 75% are not, so if we are talking about businesses might be established, I think that's an interesting fact. COUNCILWOMAN HUSSIE: You know, while we are all talking about numbers, I think I have to do something about numbers, Bob. Of those 272, 13 are being suggested to go to AC which is our most benign and can't do anything but farm on it. ROBERT JENKINS: Very quickly, of all the parcels that was just mentioned, we are talking parcels, we are not talking acreage. I have four parcels, one is a half acre, one, is an acre, and the third is two and a half acres. So, we can't mention parcels, we have to go overall corridor acreage, the vista, the overall effect. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you, Bob. Would anyone else like to address the Town Board? TYLER CORNELL: Representing the Cornelis and Ruth Enterprises, and actually for this one, kind. of everybody. I would like to say that 1 appreciate the time that the Board has given. Three days straight. I have been here as much as possible and you guys really have been attentive and listened to everything that most everybody said. It seems like most of us are calming down a lot. At least getting it off our chests and being able to talk to you directly. My one concern, or in essence, a question for you, out of ignorance to politics and the way the Town works, is having grown up with most of the people that are here, or gone through here. I have seen them on the good sides, I have seen them when they are really upset. How do you budget the money for the lawsuits that may come out of this? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: How do we budget it? We put money every year in the budget, actually the Town Attorney puts money in his budget, for legal expenses, it would probably be there. MR. CORNELL: Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: I would also like to thank everyone that has attended these hearings. They have been conducted in a very mature and giving fashion. No one really became very angry, so it made our job a little easier to be able to have your input, so that as we go through the rest of the process, we know your feelings from all directions. So, on behalf of the Board, I also thank you.Anyone else like to address the Board, if not we will recess, we will.... Yes, Sir.... EDWARD KOSTER: My name is Ed Koster. I have a machine shop. I have been a machinist all my life, and now you want to make a farmer out of me. I'm still puzzled, Bill, I'm still puzzled. Can County Route 48 can be saved without compromising the value of the established businesses. I think we should all compromise some how. I think everybody would be happy. We all want to save Southold and Route 48. 1 think it's pretty nice now. It's not perfect, it's not 100%. If it were it would be like driving through Kansas, everybody would go to sleep. I mean have a little blemish here and a little blemish there. Thank you. SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Thank you very much. It's a good way to end this. Would anyone else like to speak to the Town Board? If, not, we will recess. As you know, the hearing continues until the 14th, if you have anything written. George, Betty will try to get through those files tomorrow, so they will be available to you. All of this information is public information. Thank you very much for joining us. Henry would you like to speak? HENRY SMITH: I just have one question? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: We are recessed, but all right go ahead. HENRY SMITH: Why were some of the business picked out and some of them were not. Like the strip mall, why weren't they included in this also? Did they miss the dart, when it was thrown or what? SUPERVISOR COCHRAN: Probably Henry. I don't know, Henry. COUNCILMAN ROMANELLI: On the final hearing, Cramer will be here and you can ask him that question directly. SUPERVISOR: No, we will be meeting with Mr. Cramer as soon as possible, as a Board, to discuss the findings and everything else, so that date will be set and the public cannot take part, but you are certainly invited to come listen to the Town Board do their work. This hearing was recessed at 8:45 P.M., to be continued at 9:00 A.M. on October 14, 1999. 0 Elizabeth Nevill Southold Town Clerk