HomeMy WebLinkAboutNorth Fork Chamber of Commerce NO RTH FORK
QlAMBER OF'COMMERCE
Presentation Guide: 225 Proposed Southold Zoning Update
Prepared by: Eric Dantes, Esq., Board Member, North Fork Chamber of Commerce
Meeting ate: May 19, 2025
Reference:
Chamber Position
• The Chamber does not support the proposed zoning update as currently drafted:
• It is misaligned with the own's comprehensive plan, raises implementation concerns, and
threatens tax increases for residential property owners.
• The zoning update has not been endorsed and comments have not been issued by the Building
Dept., Planning Board, Zoning Board of Appeals,Town Attorney's Office, or NYS Ag and
Markets.
• The original intent of the zoning update was to clean up problems with the existing code, not to
rewrite the code.
Why Zoning Matters
• Zoning defines what types of businesses and uses are permitted and where they are permitted.
• NY State law requires zoning to follow a comprehensive plan.
• The proposed changes contradict Southold's current comprehensive plan and could be subject
to legal challenges.
Context:Then vs. Now
• The current 1980s era Code: Based on a fishing/farming economy.
• Today's Economy: Driven by 2nd homes, tourism, hospitality, marinas, and agritourism.
• Our zoning must reflect modern economic realities, or we risk further decline in:
o Youth retention and workforce development
o Affordable housing options
o Local reinvestment
What Businesses Need
1. Streamlined, user-friendly permitting process (6 months or less).
2. A central intake system (start with Building Dept., refer to other boards).
3. More commercial acreage: increase from 1.8% of town's land acreage to 3.6%.
4. Acknowledgement that we are a tourist economy.
5. Support, not barriers, for business owners and entrepreneurs.
Problems with the Draft Code
1. Increased regulation = higher residential taxes (SEQRA impact analysis missing).
2. Agriourism limitations: Unrealistic income and land use restrictions on farmers.
3. Subjective criteria: e.g.,judging a farmer's"knowledge."
4. Loss of grandfathering rights: for Long established businesses. E.g. Silver Sands, Sophies and
many others.
5. Hotel restrictions: Reduces number of rooms allowed per acre without justification.
6. Overlapping jurisdictions: Redundant reviews by ZBA, Planning Board, and Town Trustees.
7. Unclear process: No coordinated path through permit boards.
8. Impervious surface rules: Overly restrictive for builders and homeowners.
9. Conflict with existing preservation efforts and past approvals.
10.Approved Affordable housing districts are missing, despite years of planning.
11.Special events permits: Vague and punitive language.
12. Imbalance: No clear path to balance economic growth and preservation.
Examples of Real.-World Impact
® Lieb Cellars: Improper denial� lawsuit--> unnecessary legal costs to obtain permitting approval.
® The Old Mill Inn: Bureaucratic delays nearly derailed project.
® Abandoned sites: No incentives for redevelopment of blighted commercial properties.
What the Chamber of Commerce is Asking For
® A zoning code that reflects modern realities.
® Clarity, efficiency, and fairness in permitting.
® Policies that enable small business,tourism, and affordable housing.
® A genuine collaboration between government, business, and the community.
Closing Message
The zoning code must be updated, but not at the cost of our business community, workforce, or tax
base. Let's work toward revisions that are smart, fair, and forward-thinking. Until then, we cannot
support the proposed draft.
Reminder:
Know your rights. If a zoning decision seems improper or SEQRA is bypassed, consult a land use
attorney. Legal remedies are available under Article 78 of NYS Civil Practice Law.
Southold Town Business Forum:
6:30-8:30pm
BUSINESS OWNEPS
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More Info from Southold Town: https://southoldzoningupdate.com/zoning-map-public-review-draft
2025 PROPOSED Zoning Update script for meeting of 5/19/2025
Drafted by Eric Dantes Esq. NFCC board member
Underlying documents: ts
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At this time the Chamber of Commerce does not support the Proposed Zoning
Update. First, the proposed code changes are not beneficial to the business
community. Second, town hall employees will have problems implementing the
proposed code changes. Third, the proposed changes are not in line with the land
use and economic development chapters of Southold Town's comprehensive plan.
Fourth, the proposed code changes and re-zoning of parcels will lead to an increase
in taxes on residential tax payers.
Hi, my name is Eric Dantes I am a board member of the North Fork Chamber of
Commerce. I am a practicing attorney focusing on Real Estate and Zoning. I am also
a home builder with 17 year's experience developing residential real estate in
Southampton. I served on Southold Town's Zoning Board of appeals for 11 years. I
also served on Southold Town's Housing Advisory Commission. Public service is an
honor and privilege. When I served on the zoning board of appeals the job was
always about helping people, working efficiently, and providing great service.
We're here to talk about Southold Town Hall, the proposed zoning update and
how it will affect our local businesses. Yes, we all work to make money, but there is
a lot more to a business than just making money. Running a profitable business will
lead to future investments in our community. Investments will create jobs, provide
employment, and feed families. If we lose our local business community, we will
lose our local population here in Southold. The discussion on zoning and business is
very much a discussion on local people being able to live and work in Southold Town.
When the Rotary clubs, the fire departments, the Lion's clubs, this chamber, and
other charitable organizations are fundraising we all strongly solicit donations from
the business community. I am proud to say that we have a local business community
that generously gives back to the people.
What is Zoning and why is it important to businesses? Zoning regulations
articulate the permitted uses allowed on a piece of real property and the permit
process to legalize those uses. If you want to start a business the zoning code needs
to articulate that your business use is permitted. New York's zoning enabling
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statutes (the state statutes which give cities, towns, and villages the power to enact
local zoning laws require that zoning laws be adopted in accordance with a
comprehensive plan. The comprehensive plan should provide the backbone for the
local zoning law. The land use chapter in Southold's current comprehensive plan was
drafted over ten years ago. The overarching goal of zoning regulation is the
preservation of the greater good through the careful planning and governance of
land development and use. Zoning ordinances essentially carve a municipality into
sections. Each section or area is intended for a specific purpose to maximize the
benefits and reduce the risks for those who live and work in each zone. Any zoning
regulation that is adopted that contradicts the comprehensive plan is technically
illegal and subject to challenge in the courts.
Further, SEQURA (State Environmental Quality Review)(Needs to be completed
before the zoning code is changed)(citation) , , p...:„r„y ,r g, u„I, ,q,ry p, ,rr „i, , „-
is ,r�, , , „qJ. SEQR requires all local, regional, and state government agencies to
equally examine the environmental impacts along with the social and economic
considerations for a certain project, or action.
The current zoning code and zoning map is based on a comprehensive plan
drafted in the 1980's back when seasonal homes were unheated beach shacks,
hotels were opened seasonally, and farming and commercial fishing dominated
Southold's Economy. In the 80's many of the stores and services that were available
on the North Fork catered to those industries.
Today things are a lot different. In Southold we as a community have invested
money and volunteerism into land preservation. We have protected wetlands,
purchased development rights from farmers, created parkland, and used the sub-
division process to create preserves that our children and grandchildren will enjoy.
However, we're no longer a farming and fishing economy. Today our economy is
based on tourism, boating, and seasonal homes. The hotels are high end, the boats
are expensive, and the unheated beach shacks are being torn down and replaced
with the largest, nicest homes that will fit on the property. The farms that remain
largely depend on agricultural tourism. The preservation movement and
environmental protections has benefited our local business community. The
movement led to the rise of many of the water dependent and and agricultural
tourism businesses that are growing on the North Fork today. Our agricultural
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industry, with the wineries, barnyard adventures, sod farms, and ornamental tree
farms is geared to servicing tourists and 2nd home owners.
Southold has become a very expensive place to live. We have school districts
with declining enrollment. We have a young local population that wants to live here
and is desperately looking for opportunities to work here and make a wage that will
allow them to purchase a home and raise a family. I do not foresee prices coming
down so the only chance we have is for a growing business community to encourage
our young people to start the businesses that will be the future of locally owned
businesses in Southold Town.
The current code needs updating. The definitions and permitted uses on the
parcels need to be updated, the permit process is defunct, and the length of time
from permit application to permit approval is far too long. I and my former collogues
on the Zoning Board have been wanting the town to do a zoning update for years
and when we first heard about it we were optimistic. The Stated original intent of
zoning update was to streamline the code, make it easier to use, and to modernize it
for the 211t century. After reviewing the first and second drafts of the proposed
zoning changes I find this proposed code is not modernized nor is it easier to use.
The attorneys, builders, architects, and town hall's employees are going to find
that parts of this proposed code are vague and unworkable. As of today we have yet
to meet the consultants who drafted the zoning update. The building department,
which is the organization that will have to implement and use the new code, has not
endorsed or commented on the proposed zoning update, the Planning Board
members have not endorsed or commented on the proposed zoning update, the
Zoning Board of Appeals has not endorsed the proposed zoning update, and the
Town attorney's office has not offered any advice on what the legal ramifications of
the proposed zoning update are. As the town board moves forward with the zoning
update process, we want see written comments from involved agencies which have
so far been silent.
Today the local business community is facing challenges. Under this proposed
code some of Southold's great local businesses including Harbes Family Farm,
Sophie's Rest, Drossos, Soundview Inn, Mullin Motors, and North Fork Welding
cannot be built. The picture currently on SoutholclZoningupdate.com is a picture of
Love Lane's Street scape. Love Lane cannot be developed under this proposed
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zoning code. Moreover, there are many prominent abandoned commercial buildings
in town. North Fork Bank's Crystal Palace, North Fork Bank on Love Lane, and the
Old Oyster Factory in East Marion have all been abandoned for years. We would like
to see the town through this zoning update prioritize Commercial Redevelopment of
these structures to create businesses and economic opportunity. As a chamber we
are asking the Town government to:
a. Create user friendly government (i.e. service with a smile)
b. A town attorney's office and land use department that helps
entrepreneurs navigate the permitting process.
c. A commitment to shortening the permit site plan and overall permit
review process to six months or less.
d. Integrate the Suffolk County Health department septic approvals with the
Southold Town building permit application process.
e. Expand the acreage of commercial zoning districts in Southold Town. This
idea was proposed in the initial Zoning update Request for Proposals that
the town board approved. Currently about 1.8 percent of acreage in
town is dedicated to commercial zoning. Keep in mind current zoning
was designed in an time when Southold Town consisted of farming and
fishing businesses. To service the businesses of tomorrow expanding
mixed use zoning and commercial zoning to 3.6 percent of acreage in
Southold town is reasonable. Our next generation of business owners
need to have room to grow. In the land use chapter of the
comprehensive plan the planning department already has the framework
laid out for this rezoning in the district boundaries of hamlet centers and
HALO zones.
f. A recognition from town hall that Southold Town is a tourist community
and that hotels, bed and breakfasts, yacht yards, marinas, sport fishing,
agrotourism, and wineries are vital to the future of Southold Town.
What are we hearing from the business community? (3 examples):
The April 29t" 2025 issue of the Suffolk times had a great article on the opening of
the re-created Old Mill Inn. In the article the Inn's owner stated "Most people think
it was the lifting of the building [that was difficult], but that was quite
straightforward after the bureaucratic maze, with ever-changing goal posts, that is
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Southold Town Hall." In a Suffolk Times Editorial on December 11, 2016 current
town Councilman Greg Doroski stated that a panning board member "'feels that
"we're prostituting ourselves to save open land with alcohol," illustrates a clear bias
against alcohol production in our town. More dangerous still, it suggests a
fundamental misunderstanding of the role of government, and its associated
bureaucracy, as a tool to advance personnel agendas at the expense of a level
playing field with clearly defined rules. The code should define the rules of the
game. Common sense, not personnel preferences should guide our understanding
and interpretation of the code. In Southold town I fear we are at risk of allowing the
code to be employed as a tool for government to pick winners and losers."
(12.11.2016 featured story Suffolk Times). Mr. Doroski goes on to say "Just as town
code should be updated to reflect current reality, we should take a hard look at the
site plan process, and the role of the planning board and planning department".
Lieb Cellars:
1) In fall of 2024 the winery Lieb Cellars (AKA Oregon Road Estates LLC) in Zoning
Board of Appeals Application # 7941 made an application for an interior
alteration of an existing tasting room. Legally, Zoning Board's of Appeals
typically have jurisdiction of building locations and building sizes which are not
permitted by code. Zoning Boards do not regulate interior renovations.
a. Yet, based on an old application from 2011 and an old interpretation of
the code the town denied the application. The denial was a violation of
Lieb Cellars' rights.
b. Lieb Cellars filed a lawsuit against the town for violating its rights.
c. Lawsuits cost money that could be better invested elsewhere.
We will be here all night if we go through all of the line items in this proposed zoning
update. Some of the items that are harmful to the businesses are as follows.
1) The tax base. Limiting and overregulating business uses will lead to tax
increases on residential tax payers. The SEQURA process requires the town to
articulate the estimated amount of the tax increase and the method of
calculation.
2) Agricultural business criteria is unworkable and un-enforceable. For example:
Agritourism Activities (page 78) "Income from agritourism activities shall be
subordinate to income from sales of agricultural products including processed
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products". Is the town going to start auditing the farmers books for
compliance?
Also in this proposed code is the criteria that Land area used for agritourism
activities...shall consists of no more than 10% of the parcel...." This reg would
deny small farmers and most working class farmers the ability to have an
agricultural tourist use. I'm not sure that some existing agricultural tourist
venues would be able to comply with this criteria.
3) Parts of the Proposed code are too subjective for the building department to
use. For example, on page 79 under the criteria for starting a farm the code
state: "The lot owner/farmer possesses the necessary agricultural
knowledge to bring the farm into active agricultural production'. It is
improper for zoning officials to determine if someone knows farming. This
code provision puts a town employee in a position that he or she is not
qualified to be in.
4) Conservation sub-divisions and sale of development rights has been designed
around the current zoning code. Changes to the code could discriminate
against previously designed and town approved agricultural establishments.
5) Grandfathering rights: prior versions of the town honored grandfathering
rights. The current version of town hall does not. Section 280-2(A)(8) "land
use goals... [are] the gradual elimination of nonconforming uses." There are
some protections listed for pre-existing business but ultimately the town wants
to eliminate them. All successful business models need flexibility to change
over time. The chamber supports pre-existing non-conforming businesses and
is in favor of a draft code that provides room for them to modernize over time.
6) Hotels: hotel uses are severely restricted. The proposed code allows less hotel
rooms per acre than are currently allowed. No reason or scientific evidence
has been given for further restricting the permitted number of hotel rooms
allowed in a hotel. The current hotel room density is based on Suffolk County
department of health sanitary code and if the town uses a different calculation,
it makes the code very confusing.
7) Town Trustees: this document does not address or streamline any of the
duplicate regulations between zoning code, planning code, and trustees code.
For instance? Why do both the Zoning Board of Appeals and Town Trustees
need to review building that is within 100 feet of the top of a bluff? Let the
Town Trustees handle that review on their own. If an application falls into
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trustees jurisdiction and requires site plan review then the planning board
should do both the environmental review and the site plan?
8) Document does not articulate a process for an applicant to navigate land use
approvals. Currently all four boards operate independently, and it is driving
applicants and board members nuts. One idea would be to give one of the
boards jurisdictions to handle all the reviews in instances of concurrent
jurisdiction. This will streamline the permit process.
9) Affordable Housing: Affordable Housing (CHO) zoning districts are not shown
on the proposed map. No business owner will be able to build affordable
housing until the permit process is shortened to six months or less. The AHD
overlay district has existed for close to 10 years and not one AHD housing unit
has been built.
10) Special Events Permit (chapter 205 of Town Code)
a. Special Events: not addressed or listed in this proposed version of the
zoning code.
b. Special events application requires "Signature of Property Owner on the
application authorizing Code Enforcement Personnel of the Town of
Southold to enter the subject premises during the hours of the event to
ensure compliance with any and all special event permit conditions". Our
great local businesses should not be treated like criminals?
11) Balance: One of the talking points that has been raised through the
zoning update process is the idea of balancing economic prosperity and
protecting the environment and local people. The balance will come
through increased protection of development rights in future CPF
purchases and future sub-divisions. The balance will come from giving
working people a place to live and giving working people a place to work in
Southold town.
In conclusion the town code needs to be revised and updated. But it needs to
be revised in a way that supports business and helps our young people
succeed. We look forward to future revisions of this update. What helps the
business community helps everyone in Southold town.
Remember: Know Your rights as a business owner/property owner: CONSULT AN
EXPIENCED LAND USE ATTORNEY: If an agency has made an improper decision or
does not follow SEQRA, members of the public may take legal action against the
deciding agency under Article 78 of the New York State Civil Practice Law and Rules.
The NYS court system has a long history of ruling in favor of SEAR compliance and
may cancel governmental decisions.
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