Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAboutZBA-12/19/1989 HEARING 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 SOUTHOLD TOWN BOARD OF APPEALS MEETING OF DECEMBER 19, 1989 Time: 7:35 p.m. MEMBERS ARE: James Dinizio Joseph H. Sawicki Gerard P. Goehringer, Chairman Charles Grigonis Serge Doyen, Jr. (Absent Doreen Ferwerda, Secretary to Board RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 ! - 2 3 4 5 6 '7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 Ic) 20 21 22 23 24 25 2 MR. GOEHRINGER: We wish you all a very happy holiday season for everybody present in the audience. This is the regular monthly meeting of the Southold Town ZBA. The first hearing on the agenda is on behalf of Matthew Cusumano. It's Appeal ~3870. The Notice reads as follows: "Application #3870, Variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XXIII, Section 100-239d, as disapproved, for permission to construct a deck and other additions, proposed construction will be less than 75 feet from water or wetlands and will have insufficient front and rear yard setbacks. Property location is 435 Briarwood Lane, Cutchogue, County Tax Map No. 1000-136-01-01." I have a copy of the survey from Peconic Surveyors, most recent date is February 22, 1989, indicating the nature of this application which is a proposed deck on the rear of the house, it's actually two front yards involved here, and a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating the surrounding properties in the area. Is there somebody that would like to be heard? MR. CUSUM-ANO: I'm Matthew Cusumano. MR. GOEHRINGER: Could I ask you to use RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., 1516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the mike if you don't mind. MR. CUSUMANO: The proposed addition is the small deck as you see by the drawing indicated. Additionally, I have photographs of the front yard and I think that it's construing that the front yard, really what it is is a dirt path at the waterfront. MR. GOEHRINGER: It's MR. CUSUMANO: That's on Wildwood Lane? correct. The profile of the land is such that the elevation is considerably higher in the rear yard. I would estimate about 20 feet above sea level. And there's no violation of any of the vegetation that would be part of the wetlands and I think it really would not be an encunforance on anyone if the deck was constructed. As a matter of fact, we submitted some photographs; everyone up and down the creek, with the exclusion of our house, has a deck on the rear yard. MR. GOEHRINGER: This is drawn to scale, this deck on the survey, to your knowledge? - MR. CUSUMANO: I believe so. MR. GOEHRINGER: I was just wondering if you were aware of what the actual distance between RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the concrete wall and MR. CUSUMANO: 4 the proposed deck would be? The concrete wall is set back from the mean high water about 10 or 15 and then from the wall to the deck, maybe it is about 25 or 30 feet. that feet I would say MR. GOEHRINGER: I have 28 feet. How does sound? MR. CUSUMANO: Yes. MR. GOEHRINGER: At its closest point. MR. CUSUMANO: Yes, at the closest point. MR. GOEHRINGER: At the farthest point it's about 30 feet? Lane MR. CUSUMANO: It's about that. MR. GOEHRINGER: And then on the Briarwood site, I have it as 23 feet. MR. CUSUMANO: That's about it. MR. GOEHRINGER: Is that about right? MR. CUSUMANO: I would say. MR. GOEHRINGER: This deck is elevated, Mr. Cusumano, to the view of the first floor area of the house? MR. CUSUMANO: That's MR. GOEHRINGER: glass sliding doors. correct. So you'd be coming out of RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,~iverhead~ N.Y., (S16) 727-3168 1 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 MR. CUSUMANO: That's correct. MR. GOEHRINGER: On the first floor? MR. CUSUMANO: On the first floor. MR. GOEHRINGER: And it will remain unroofed? MR. CUSUMANO: Yes. No roof. MR. GOEHRINGER: All right. 5 I thank you for coming down and adding to the Hearing. And I do want to apologize for the time taken on this particular Hearing. MR. CUSUMANO: I understand. MR. GOEHRINGER: For some strange reason, and maybe the reason is my fault for leaving you off at the last Hearing, for that particular reason we very rarely grant these things at the Hearing, we usually work one Hearing behind, but I'll offer a motion to grant this as applied for. MR. SAWICKI: I'll second it. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Have a happy holiday. The next Hearing is on behalf of Nicholas Nickolaus and it's appeal number is 3868. The RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant, again 3868, variance to Zoning Ordinance, Article XXIII, Section 100-239d A, as disapproved for permission to construct addition to existing one-family dwelling and accessory building, proposed construction is less than 100 feet from bluff of Sound in location, this R-80 Zone District. Property 17555 Soundview Avenue, Southold. County Tax Map Number 1000-51-01-02." A copy of the survey from Roderick VanTuyl P.C., February 10, 1981, indicating the two story frame house that's on the property, I believe it's a brick house, and the nature of the application is before us tonight. Suffolk County Tax Map properties in the area. would like to be heard~ MR. FEELEY: Yes. MR. GOEHRINGER: And I have a copy of the indicating the surrounding Is there somebody that Could I just ask you to state your name for the record. · MR. FEELEY: My name is Lawrence Feeley, I'm the architect for Mr. Nickolaus, I'm speaking on his behalf. What we've brought with us is an RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 aerial of the property showing the existing residences to the sides of the residence as it exists. We've also brought, which I believe you have in your possession, this drawing here which sho~the existing residence in the solid line and the proposed additions. It's colored in for you to be able to see. What those additions entail is a master bedroom addition on this end of the house which would afford them the ability to keep all the living space at one level. Being that they're going to use this for a future retirement home, they decided that they would like to have that at that level. This addition over here in the front would be a breakfast area, two modest additions, which would be a window extension to restore some of the architectual character of the house as it once existed and then a small kitchen addition in the back. On this we've also shown all the set backs to the current structures and the proposed structures and one that we would like to point out is the set back which exists by the existing pool structure retaining wall which is 20 feet. We haven't infringed any closer to the top bluff with any of the new construction, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhemd, N.Y., ~516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 any further towards the bluff in any of the existing construction that exists. MR. cabana? MR. GOEHRINGER: What is the use of the FEELEY: The cabana is for the pool. I have a plan of i~ here. It would mainly be for the pool filtration. A small room for pool mechanical and a small space for changing with toilet facilities and a MR. GOEHRINGER: MR. FEELEY: to you if you would MR. GOEHRINGER: FEELEY: The shower. Okay. could describe the additions little more. You can just show them to floor plan here shows the master bedroom addition off to the east end, some interior renovations in the master suite which would become the toilet room, the new breakfast room addition and these two little bay extensions on the front and also the kitchen, a solar extension in the back. That's about it. This ~s just elevation showing the character that we'd like to establish in the house to bring it back. Some additions that were done previous RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 9 to this we felt destroyed some of the architectural character of the house and we want to restore it back without redoing in the front here. MR. Is GOEHRINGER: Okay. We thank you very much. there anybody else who would like to speak in favor of this application? Is there anybody who would like to speak against the application? What about the Board Members? What is your time limit on this; try and build this this winter? MR. FEELEY: I would think that we will be waiting until the springtime. One thing I did fail to mention is that some of the grade in the back we were going to leave as existing and we're not going to build it up. MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. MR. FEELEY: And also that the addition is cumulative of the whole structure. It's 20 percent of the floor area. MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. We may address it tonight, I'm not positive, but we'll see how it goes. If not, it would be in about two weeks that we'll address the decision. We thank you are you going to RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 10 gentlemen very much for coming here. Hearing no further comments, I make a motion to close the Hearing reserving a decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you again. The next appeal is appeal number 3881 on behalf of Warren Augenthaler. The legal Notice reads as follows: "On application the applicant 3881 variance to Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-33, for permission to construct accessory building in front yard area. Property location is 7225 Nassau Point Road, Cutchogue, County Tax Map No. 1000-111-15-12." A copy of a sketch of a survey from R. V. VanTuyl this time, same organization, most recent date February 28, 1981, indicating the nature of this one and a half story frame house which is placed on this property. But more importantly the nature of this application is a shed of eight by twelve placed in the front yard area. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516} 7~7-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Map indicating the surrounding properties in area. Is there heard on behalf 11 the somebody who would like to be of this application? Mark, you're not here for the third Hearing tonight; MR. KNOBLOCH: MR. GOEHRINGER: are you? Kevin. No. Is there anybody who would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? There being no further questions I make a motion to close the Hearing reserving a decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The next appeal is on behalf of Michael and Claire Glew, it is appeal number 3893. The legal Notice reads as follows: "On application the applicants 3893 variance to the Zoning Ordinance, 280-A approval of access right-of-way, Article XXVIII, Section 100-281 B, to construct a one-family dwelling. Property location is 61339 Main Road, Southold, County Tax Map No. 1000-56-01-41." I have a copy of the survey dated January 26, 1989, from Roderick VanTuyl, P. C., RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 12 indicating the 280-A status and the right-of-way to wit: parcel of property of which these applicants are presently on, which is Lot No. 2 of this subdivision which is 94,829 square feet. And the nature of this application is the access to that. Would either one of you like to have something to say? MR. GLEW: No. MR. GOEHRINGER: I know we never met you before, Mike, but I did mention to Claire, with her status in the Town Hall, that you are aware that we had a 280-A approval on this particular right-of-way already and that is the one that Theodore Dowd had. MR. GLEW: Right. MR. GOEHRINGER: What we will do is address the improvements that we were dealing with with him. If we feel that those improvements have to be enhanced in any way, we'll enhance them. If not, we will just keep it status quo and continue with the same improvements for your property as well as his. MR. GLEW: Okay. MR. GOEHRINGER: All right. If you don't RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (SI6} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 $ 9 10 Il 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 have any objection to that, 13 we'll continue on. MR. GLEW: Thank you. MR. GOEHRINGER: Is there anybody who would like to speak in favor of this else application? Anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Okay. Hearing no further questions, I make a motion to close the Hearing reserving decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. BOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much for coming here. The next appeal is appeal number 3873 on behalf of Vinko Naletilic. It's appeal number 3873. The legal Notice reads as follows: "On application the applicant 3873 variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III A, Section 100-30 A.3, for permission to construct a deck addition, construction exceeds permitted lot coverage of location is Street, New Suffolk. 1000-117-07-22." this R-40 Zone District. Property 780 Orchard Street and 1300-2nd County Tax Map No. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 72';-3168 1 2 3 4 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 14 15 16 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 I have appears to be no date on it. 14 a sketch of a survey cutoff. It Gordan K. Ellers. And there's The nature of this application is a one-story frame residence which appears to have a deck addition to the rear of the property, the rear of the dwelling I should say. I'm just trying to read the dimensions. It appears it's 14 feet 4 inches and I think that's 31 feet, but I'll ask the applicant. It looks approximately 40 feet from the rear property line. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. Is there somebody that would like to be heard on behalf of this application? I'm not going to say it's going to be short night tonight because I know what happens when I say that. Is there anybody who would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Hearing no further questions, I'll make a motion to close later. · MR. MR. THE BOARD: the Hearing reserving decision until GRIGONIS: Second. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? Aye. RAM Court Reporting Service Court St.,Rlverhemd, N.Y., [516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 Ail right. MR. GOEHRINGER: is on behalf of Charles Malone, 3879. Notice reads as follows: "Again, appeal 3879, variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XXIII, Section 100-230C (1), 100-231 A., for permission to construct a 6 foot fence in front yard area, fence exceeds 4 feet in height. Property location is 358 North Sea Drive, Southold. County Tax Map No. 1000-54-05-19." I have a pen sketch of the property and 15 The next appeal The legal the nature of this application which is a 6 foot high fence on the west side of this particular piece of property. It appears that Mrs. Malone is not in the audience tonight; is that correct? I'll make a motion at the outset of this to recess this Hearing without a date until I out when they can come. i'll there anybody that would like this Hearing either pro or against? Seeing no hands, I'll make a motion recessing the Hearing with no date. · MR. DINIZIO: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. find speak to her. Is to speak concerning RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y. (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. GOEHRINGER: We have about four minutes until the next Hearing. 16 three or I'll make a motion, gentlemen, approving the minutes of the following meeting, November 2, 1989, and December 2, 1989. MR. DINIZIO: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: All right. I guess we're ~ ready to begin. The next Hearing is on behalf of Robert Staples. It is appeal number 3886. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant 3886, variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XXIII, Section 100-239d (C), for permission to construct a new dwelling adjacent to freshwater wetlands in this R-40 Zone District, proposed dwelling will be closer than 75 feet from freshwater wetland. Property location is 785 Wilmarth Avenue, Greenport. County Tax Map. No. t000-4~-01-07." I have a copy of a survey by Roderick VanTuyl, P.C., September 28, 1987. It proposed RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., (~16J 727-3168 1 2 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 17 a house of approximately 28 by 36 placed approximately a little closer to the west side of the property which is the nature of this application and distance thereof to the remaining freshwater wetland to the rear and a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating the surrounding properties. Is there somebody that would like to be heard on behalf of this application? MR. STAPLES: Good evening. My name is Robert Staples. I was born in Southold Town. I have three children who were born here. I'd like to do anything that I can to see that they stay here. It is my intent to build this house to provide low income housing so that my children may also remain in the community. My father bought this property in '47 with the adjacent property so that he could build a house for me. It's my intention now to continue this legacy and build a house for my children. I started this when my daughter announced her engagement in '87. Now, and I'm still bureaucracy. she's presented me a grandaughter here before this Southold Town I would appreciate this Board RAM Court Reporting Sel*vice 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 ? 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 18 19 2O 21 22 23 25 asking on Thank you. MR. this matter as soon as possible. 18 GOEHRINGER: Thank you, Mr. Staples. Is there anybody else who would like to speak in favor of this application? Would anybody like to speak against the application? Board Members? MR. DINIZIO: MR. STAPLES: the titles are separate. MR. DINIZIO: MRS. STAPLES: MR. STAPLES: purchased. MR. DINIZIO: Questions from Just were they held single? They're in separate names, They have been? Since we bought it. Since they were originally That's all I have. MR. GOEHRINGER: It would be unkind of me to have you leave this Hearing without my telling you what my feelings are after viewing this property and that is that I feel that some sort of separation from this freshwater lot have to be made. · MR. STAPLES: I'm sorry, you haven't done your homework. included in that form that's area and the sir, apparently I have a letter from the Board of RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 19 Trustees of Southold Town and they so specified a 5 foot separation bordering the wetland that would be left in a natural state whs~ natural vegetation would be encouraged. Is that sufficient~ MR. GOEHRINGER: No. I'm proposing that there be some sort of permanent barrier between the two, be it either a retaining wall or something of that nature. MR. STAPLES: I'm sorry, sir, I was born and raised on these wetlands. You want me to put a fence between me and the wetlands? I cannot agree to that under any circumstances. MR. GOEHRINGER: I'm just telling you what my opinion is, sir. I'm only one of five people on this Board. One of them is sick tonight. That's my particular opinion in looking at this. I'm telling you because if it ended up that way I would want you to know where I came from. MR. STAPLES: I've lived there for 30 years on this specific site. MR. GOEHRINGER: I will be back down again to look at the site before I make a decision on this. I looked at it once already and I'll be down again to take some more measurements. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516J 727-3168 1 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. or a wall? MR. STAPLES: You're GOEHRINGER: 20 talking about a fence Some sort of wall. That's what I'm proposing. But I'm just looking at it. I don't know if that will happen or whatever the situation will be. But that's what I'm looking at. Any other questions? Hearing no further questions, I make a motion to close the Hearing and reserving a decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. M~. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much for coming in. The next appeal is in behalf of Joseph and Lawrence Pearlstein. The legal Notice is 3984 and it reads as follows: "Variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article XXIV, Section 100-244B, for permission to to construct deck addition with insufficient front yard setback. Property location is 2225 North Sea Drive, Southold. County Tax Map No. 1000-~4-04-23." I have a copy of a survey from R. VanTuyl, P.C. Most recent date is January 28, 1982, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 21 indicating a one-story frame home somewhat elevated on North Sea Drive in Southold. The nature of this application is a 12 by 32 foot deck I believe. As the Pearlsteins are not here tonight, it is my understanding that it is an open deck and we would go with that interpretation unless we hear something different. Is there anybody that would like to speak in favor of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Hearing no further questions, I make a motion to close the Hearing reserving decision until later. SAWICKI: Second. All in favor? MR. MR. GOEHRINGER: THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The behalf of Anthony Bolletino, 3892. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant, 3892, variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-33, for permission to construct an accessory shed and gazebo in front yard area. Property location is 16705 Main Road, Route 25, next appeal is on it is appeal number RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhemd, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 22 East Marion. County Tax Map No. 1000-23-01-14.6." I have a copy of a sketch of a survey, it's cut off on the name, the most recent date is April 21st, it appears it's 1988. And the nature of this application is a shed and a gazebo to be placed on this particular piece of property which I believe is presently in its location. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in Kevin, would you like to be heard? the area. MR. KNOBLOCH: Yes. Just for the record I'm Kevin Knobloch. When my client applied for his variance for the pool and tennis court back in January of 1988, they did not realize that they were going to put a shed and a gazebo on the property around the pool and the shed for the tennis balls and the tennis machine and so forth. So that's why we're back for a variance, so we can be granted for a gazebo and a shed. MR. GOEHRINGER: I haven't spoken to you about this since prior to your filing the application and I think that that is probably sometime back in September; wasn't it, that we had this discussion? RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 23 MR. KNOBLOCH: Correct. MR. GOEHRINGER: On a Saturday morning over the telephone, telling me you were going to bring this before us. Could you just give me some indication, you don't have to do it tonight, on the actual distance that te gazebo is from the property line on the east side and the distance that the line? As I said, you can give it to us MR. KNOBLOCH: gazebo is 65 feet. center. MR. pool? shed is from the west property if you don't have it right here later. The shed is 36 feet and the That's approximately the GOEHRINGER: In front of the swimming MR. KNOBLOCH: Adjacent to it. MR. GOEHRINGER: I'm sorry. I'm looking at it differently. How big is the gazebo? MR. KNOBLOCH: It's 12 foot in diameter. MR. GOEHRINGER: And how big is the shed? MR. KNOBLOCH: the shed is 8 by 10. · MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. We thank you very much for coming. MR. KNOBLOCH: Thank you. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverh~ad, N.Y., [~16} 727-3168 1 3 4 5 ? 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 1'7 18 19 2O 21 22 24 24 MR. GOEHRINGER: Is there anybody else that would like to speak in favor of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Hearing no further questions, I make a motion closing the Hearing reserving decision until later. MR. DINIZIO: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: We have two more minutes before the Tarmin Hearing. We'll take a two minute recess. All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. (Recess taken GOEHRINGER: SAWICKI: GOEHRINGER: from 8:14 to 8:18) I need a motion to So moved. All in favor? MR. reconvene. MR. MR. The next appeal is again THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: on behalf of Ernest Tarmin. It is appeal number 3888. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant, again 3888, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (5X6) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 25 variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-33, for permission to construct accessories; pool, tennis court and shed in front yard area. Property Right-of-way off Main Road, Map No. 1000-14-02-1.10." Copy of a survey from Young location is 29833 Orient. County Tax & Young, most be 60 by 120, property line or northeast, recent date is October 15, 1987. I have a penned in area showing a tennis court which appears to approximately 48 feet from the west and 48 from the east property line, and I have a shed of approximately 20 by 20 which is approximately 53 feet from the west property line. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. We'll have to get the placement, actual placement, of the pool which is 20 by 40. Is there somebody that would like to be heard on behalf of this application? There's no one here representing Tarmin; is that correct? Is there anybody that would like to speak in behalf of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? The only question I RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 have is where swimming pool. 26 the approximate placement of the He showed me where it was on the property but I don't know the actual dimensions so we'll have to give him a call. I'll offer a motion to close the Hearing pending receipt of the actual placement of the swimming pool in the front yard of the house which is, by the way, a 5 foot .755 acre parcel on the Long Island Sound. MR. GRIGONIS: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The next appeal is on behal~ of Mark and Ellie Gordon, appeal number 3887. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application of the applicant, again, 3887, variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-33, for permission to construct a tennis court in front yard area. Property lcoation is 1019 Private Road #7 Fords Road, Southold, which is a private right-of-way off of South ,Harbor Road. Suffolk County Tax Map parcel 1000-87-01-18.4." I have a copy of a sketch of a survey with RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Siverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 $ 9 I0 II 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 27 no name on it indicating the nature of this regularly shaped piece of property which the nature of this application is a 60 by 120 proposed tennis court in the front yard area, size of the property is approxiamtely 4.236 acres. This tennis court is in the front yard, as I said, and adjacent to the driveway after making the turn into the largest part of the property. And it is well before the main part of the house. I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. Would you like to be heard? MR. STOUTENBERG: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Peter Stoutenberg. Mr. Chairman and Members of the Board, I'm here for the most part to answer any questions that you might have. I assume you've been to the site and seen how it is staked. Mark and Ellie Gordon spent some time looking over their property just what particular area was available for a tennis court and included DEC considerations for their rear yard. It was the only site that we could come up with that was either level or that, again, with DEC consideration~ we could build on. They do own one of the piece of RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 28 property to the north of that which is a single buildable lot and they had hoped not to, since that seemed to be centered more amongst an established community, they hoped not to have to put the tennis court on that area. Again, if there are any questions. MR. GOEHRINGER: What is the approximate distance, Peter, from the Dimara property? MR. STOUTENBERG: The stakes that are set there right now are 25 foot off of that right at the edge of the right-of-way. problem, I'm sure that a that would be acceptable If that is a 5 foot setback from for the Gordons. more than that and they're losing their established drive on the eastern side. Any 10 MR. GOEHRINGER: feet? MR. STOUTENBERG: What about fence height, Ten foot on the north and south and 4 foot on the east and west. MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. What about lighting? MR. STOUTENBERG: There are no plans for it at ~east in the proposal that I've seen, but I can't say that's not something they would like to consider, particularly at a time of the year RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St,,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516} 7~7-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 29 that there is foilage property. MR. GOEHRINGER: any idea of screening? and its unseen from that What about screening, MR. STOUTENBERG: They could do anything. I mean there are no plans for it again because it's in the middle of a wood lot and at this time of year you can see a couple of shadows of houses in there. I did get a response, I think I sent through to you people from the one neighbor that it would most affect, and he didn't seem to have any objections at all. We discussed it with him. that,s in your file. laws our set up, I really see no I sent a little letter I think It is in the front yard as our but as far as affecting people, one who overlooks it or should be affected in any way. But if there are questions or any considerations from people in the audience, I'd be more than willing to address them. MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. Thank you very much. like to speak in favor My name is Alan Horn, and the right-of-way adjacent to the proposed Is there anybody who would of this application? MR. HORN: Yes. I use RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24- 25 30 lot and the stakes are kind of right -- I have to avoid them when I'm riding down the road. So I was wondering if that was a little too close or the right-of-way had to be moved or what the story was with that. my eye on the sticks, without any problem. Unless I'm really keeping I could side swipe them I think if there's a fence there, I think there's going to be a problem bringing vehicles down there. MR. GOEHRINGER: Is there anybody else who would like to speak either before or against this application? You said 5 feet was not a problem? MR. STOUTENBERG: The road when it was put in, as many are, was without a survey right to the edge of that 25 foot right-of-way. When we walked over the site, they're going to be more than acceptable to a 5 foot perimeter from that which I'm sure would be well off the established road so it would be a 30 foot setback from that property. MR. GOEHRINGER: We'll go back and remeasure it and see if we're happy with something like that. MR. STOUTENBERG: Even keeping the tennis RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 Ic) 20 21 22 23 24 25 court that's laid out now is for exterior dimension, interior dimension would be 5 31 foot less in width. accommodate that. MR. GOEHRINGER: from Board Members: MR. DINIZIO: So we'd be more than happy to Thank you. Any questions I just have a question. I don't see any fence indicated on here, on mine. I was wondering how high the fence would be. MR. STOUTENBERG: The fence would be at the dimensions that are indicated on there provided you have the same survey. I think you have, The height that they are looking for is the standard 10 foot on the two narrow ends which is traditional and then dropping down to a 4 foot height at that point. It projects 15 foot of either side. I can send through some more updates if that's necessary. DINIZIO: No. It just wasn't So I'm clear on this. You're willing MR. indicated. to go 5 feet to the east of that? MR. fencing at a 30 line. MR. STOUTENBERG: We're willing to hold a foot setback of that westerly DINIZIO: Which would be 5 feet from RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 where MR. on that. 32 that stake is? STOUTENBERG: Yes. When we originally went down there we Right now it is set assumed that the right-of-way was only ten or twelve foot wide which was in the center of the right-of-way. When it was staked out, we found out that the road, of course, wandered to the east and was right on the ed§e~ of that. We did not go back and restake that. And having discussed this with the owners they said, if that was a consideration, they surely weren't opposed to moving the road to the center of the right-of-way and they'd be willing to move the tennis court another 5 feet. That still gets everybody to the edge of their drive on the other side. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Does that answer your question? MR. DINIZIO: Yes, it does. MR. GOEHRINGER: If there are no further questions, I make a motion closing the Hearing reserving a decision to later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: 33 Thank you very much for coming in. Elizabeth Johnston, appeal number Notice reads as follows: The next appeal is on behalf of 3891. The legal "Variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III, Section 100-32.4 (A), for permission to construct a lap pool, accessory pools not permitted in front yard area. Property location is right- of-way off of Oregon Road, Cutchogue. County Tax Map No. 1000-073-02-01." A copy of a survey, the most recent date frcm Roderick VanTuyl, P. C., is November 7, 1956, which I believe the right-of-way was the nature of a prior application before this Board. it is shown on this survey as a penned in area of a regularly shaped swimming pool approximately 12 by 45 in the front yard area. Is there anybody here to represent the applicant? MR. CHICANOWITZ: Mr. Chicanowitz from Briarcliff Landscape. What we're trying to create there-is basically a very naturalistic lap pool for them in front of the yard which is a very small piece of property, and we're trying to RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 34 situate it as close -- since there's no backyard by the Sound, we're putting it in the front yard which is in their approach area. And we've narrowed the piece of property only because she really wants to be a lap pool swimmer and basically keep it very naturalistic. And there is natural buffer there now, from hedges and other material, what have you, and basically want to try to keep it that way during the construction and after the construction. MR. GOEHRINGER: Frank, when I was up there I was alone so I did not have someone, and the ground was frozen, so I didn't have anybody to hold up a tape for me. But can you give me some idea, and you don't have to do send it to us or give us from the east property the right-of-way. MR. CHICANOWITZ: east property line east property line. south property line. it tonight, you could a call, of the distance line and the distance from The distance from the is about 10 feet off of the It's 27 feet off of the We're trying to give ourselves enough area. There are cesspools in there which we're trying to avoid as well, so we're RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverh~ad, N.Y., ($16} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 trying to keep it to the south side without digging up the cesspools. tank that's got to be dug over in order to put this 35 There is a propane up and removed and moved thing in there. And it's the only possible area within the property line to do it. And that's why we're trying to sneak it in there. MR. coming in. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much for I appreciate it. Is there anybody else who would like to speak in behalf of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Hearing no further questions, I make a motion closing the Hearing and reserving decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The next appeal is on behalf of Dickinson and Thompson. The legal Notice reads as follows: · "Upon application the applicants, 3884, Article I, Section 106-20, for approval of insufficient area in this pending division of land RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., (516! 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 and bulk and parking regulations. of the property is County Tax Map No. 36 The location Main Bayview Road, Southold. 1000-078-09-30." I have before me a survey from Roderick VanTuyl, P. C., most recent date is August 17, 1989, indicating two houses almost equally separated on the corner of Main Bayview Road and Cedar Lane in Southold. House number one which is the house on Cedar Lane has a property square foot area of 22,910 square feet and the property which is equally also but not on Cedar Lane on Main Bayview Road is 22,898 square feet. And, the copy of a letter from the Southold Town Planning Board indicating that the Planning Board is in favor of this setoff. I also have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating the fence surrounding properties in the area. Is there anybody that would like to be heard on behalf of the application? Mr. Brewer? MR. BREWER: Yes, please. Main Road, Southold on behalf of Mr. Chairman, and Members of the Rudolph Brewer, the applicants. Board, this is an area variance that's being requested here. It's a piece of property as you've seen from the RAM Court Rel~orting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhemd, N.Y., (~16} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 survey of which there are two homes. has been in this family, its brother 37 The property and sister, since I think 1906. It passed on from there on up until 1956, it was passed from the grandmother to them directly subject to a life estate in the father. In 1960 the father passed away and secure. attorney, the children created a deed wherein they conveyed a life estate that they thought was a life estate in the property to the mother to make her feel In 1977 with the assistance of an they put the property, since the father had passed away and the property was to be to them equally, they divided the property by way of a deed and since that time have been receiving separate tax bills. They've been treated by the assessor, the Town, the State, as separate pieces of property. The dwellings that are on the property, one was built in 17 something and the other one was built in the 30's and moved to the property around 1940. So both of these structures have been where they are since the 1940'3 well before the Zoning. As you can see, Zoning wasn't there, there is a definite practical difficulty that has arisen here. There are two RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 families, premises, 38 Wesley Dickinson is living on the his sister in the future might take up residence there. I'm not sure but does the Board have a copy of the single separate search? MR. GOEHRINGER: No, we don't. MR. BREWER: I have one here I can submit. MR. GOEHRINGER: More importantly I'm concerned with pre-CO's on the house. Has there ever been any requested or do you have it? MR. BREWER: Well, on the piece that is not on Cedar, it has received two building permits over the years. Everybody thinking that it was a separate lot including the applicants here, as a matter of fact, they determined, or we determined, that it wasn't on the death of the mother in figuring out the appraisals for the estate tax purposes. It was determined at that point, which they were very surprised when I told them and we had a lengthy argument about it, there was no CO's required since these structures existed prior to the requirement of a CO. It is not the intent of the parties at this time or in the future at this moment to my knowledge to sell off the property. It's their intent to keep it RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 39 and keep it in the family which is why we don't have any evidence before the Board here dealing with a financial hardship in that there is no financial hardship and nobody said they had to move out of it, although I think that as a practical matter the building inspector could raise some problems with respect to the occupancy since he's denied a CO for the pre-existing CO for the homes based upon which precipitated this appeal. I also have here the consent of two of the neighbors, in your file, I would like to submit if it's not it tonight. MR. GOEHRINGER: Are you going to give us a copy of the single and separate search? MR. BREWER: I definitely will. it right now. I'm also looking for the of the neighbors, I have them here. have I'll do consent MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. Thank you. MR. BREWER: If the Board would like, I the Will wherein the property was in 1965 bequeathed to the two applicants, if that would help. -Actually, it's an abstract of it. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. MR. BREWER: The Imogene Dickinson there RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 ! 3 4 5 ? 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 17 18 19 2O 21 23 24 the Imogene Thompson here, the applicant. 1956. to MR. GOEHRINGER: bequeathed? MR. BREWER: 40 MR. GOEHRINGER: Fine. MR. BREWER: And you will note that it is And I have the prior history going back 1906 if the Board wishes. Which house was she The total property went to wells, other. both of them. the total property always was in one unit either going pasing by Will or deed over the years. MR. GOEHRINGER: So the purpose of this Hearing really is to divide the property so that pre-CO's could exist on both parcels? MR. BREWER: That's correct. I would like to point out that I've been assured by the applicants who are here that the properties have their own separate sanitarium wells, systems and separate from each other, it's not on the MR. GOEHRINGER: I thank you so much, Mr. Brewer. Have a happy holiday. Is there anybody else who would like to speak before the Board addressing this particular application of RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhemd~ N.Y., (516} 727-316~ 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 41 Dickinson and Thompson, appeal number 3884? Anybody that would like to speak against it? Hearing no further comments, I make a motion closing the Hearing reserving the decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The next appeal is 3889 in behalf of Timothy and George Wells. Is Mr. Wells here? MR. the Wells. MR. follows: "On application the applicants, 3889, variance to the Zoning Ordinance, Article III A, Section 100-30 A.3, bulk and parking regulations, for approval of insufficient area in this pending division of land. Property location is South Harbor Road, Southold. County Tax Map No. 1000-075-07-1.3, 1.4, 1.5." I have a copy of the survey produced by Roderick VanTuyl, P. C., most recent date is CALLGROVE: No. I'm here on behalf of GOEHRINGER: The legal Notice reads as RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (S16) 727-3168 1 2 3 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 property. MR. 42 April 28, 1989. It appears to be a three lot subdivision, lot number one is 64,788 square feet, lot number two is 202,552 square feet, lot number three is 22.516 acres. The application before us, of course, is the undersized lot which is lot number one. I have a copy of a Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. I have a letter from the Southold Town Planning Board indicating this particular Would you like to be heard, sir? CALLGROVE: Thank you. My name is Peter Callgrove and I'm with the law firm Paine, Wood & LittleJohn. We're the attorneys for Timothy Wells and the Estate of George Wells. Also here tonight is Dorothy Tobell, she is the trust officer with NorStar Trust Company, one of the Executors of the Estate of George Wells. As you know, this variance application is made in conjunction with the applications of the Planning Board for a three lot subdivision and the prperty is located on the western side of South-Harbor Road. We did submit a Tax Map and I made some copies here just to orientate the Board there so you can get an idea of the three RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., {516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 lots here, application. MR. GOEHRINGER: quick question, sir? MR. CALLGROVE: MR. GOEHRINGER: indicated in the white here the nature of this Estate? MR. CALLGROVE: MR. GOEHRINGER: that? MR. parcel up which are the subject of the Could I 43 just ask you a Yes. Did the lot which is as 1.2, was that ever Yes. You're going to address CALLGROVE: Yes. Parcel one, the in the northeast corner, is owned by Timothy Wells which is 64,788 square feet. Parcel two is 202,522 square feet and that's owned by the Estate of George Wells. And parcel three which encompasses 22.56 acres is now owned by Christopher Zelby. Hallockville, Inc., is no longer the owner of that. The history of this property is that George Wells owned the entire parcel at one time, it encompasses about 30 acres-including this out parcel here. And in 1984 he received approval from the Planning Board for a setoff application at which point this lot was RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 setoff and the property, secured. Thereafter it was An interesting point of the 44 after approval, was sold to Robert Pettit. record there for the application of the setoff is that apparently the first map, I've never seen it before, but it's in the Planning Board record, this lot was moved up a little further so that the frontage for this area here was only 166 feet and the Planning Board said to preserve this should make it 175 feet, so that created the 175 as a building lot you so they moved it down foot frontage there. So this lot was conveyed to Robert Pettit in 1984. And in December of '86, George Wells made a gift of this parcel here, the 22 acre parcel, parcel three, to Hallockville. It was a gift. And the problem here was that no Planning Board approval was secured. Whether there was a mix up or whether he thought the setup was for the whole subdivision, an application for the property into four lots, it's unclear. We don't know what happened. We do know that Hallockville then conve~ed the development rights for this parcel to the Town of Southold. And our thoughts are since the negotiating process was going on, and I RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riv~rh~ad~ N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 45 talked to Bob Pike who was the attorney for Hallockville, he told me that the intent was that the gift would be to Hallockville with the understanding that Hallockville would then sell the development rights to the Town. So there was never really any intent that this would be developed. But again, it was without Planning Board approval. And by deeding this property out to Hallockville it created these two lots. And this lot is fine, it's over 200,000 square feet. But the problem is that this lot here is substandard, it does not meet the requirement of the 80,000 square foot MR. GOEHRINGER: the development rights of property? MR. CALLGROVE: MR. GOEHRINGER: MR. CALLGROVE: Yes. tonight is for a variance to Zoning District. Did the Town then take to this particular piece Yes, they have. Okay. They have them? So, the relief sought allow this undersized lot so that we can continue with the Planning Board 'and hopefully get that subdivision approval right now. The impracticality here of getting that land for this lot is that one of the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Cou~ St.,Riverh~ad, N.Y., (~16) 727-31~ 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 I1 12 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 46 conditions in the deed from Hallockville to the Town for the development rights is this lot can never be subdivided again, so it's in the deed and I think you would need a Town Referendum to approve that to get a subdivision. And even if that was approved, it would be impractical because the line would then come out a 100 feet or so and Mr. Macille is a farmer and so his rows of corn or whatever he was going to plant would go up like this and that and that would cut into his planting property. And the idea, those are impracticalities of curing that, because this is going to be held as farm land, the intent of the Ordinance is to keep open space and two acre Zoning and not have over density and light and noise protecting the neighbors to the north and so forth would be protected because again they'll be no building back here. So the Ordinance is not being followed unfortunately but the spirit of it really is because you know that's not going to result in any greater density. And the net effect of all this is that there will be one other house, it's one other house in the total 28 acres. And the Board requests that a RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., {~16! 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 variance be granted MR. GOEHRINGER: appreciate it. We'll for this undersized lot. Thank you, sir. We see what else develops 47 throughout the Hearing. MR. CALLGROVE: Thank you. MR. GOEHRINGER: Does that sufficiently answer your question? MR. DINIZIO: Only one thing. Lot number one, the one that's the subject of this, is that the lot that has a house on it right now? MR. CALLGROVE: No. That's the lot here. Robert Pettit. That lot is vacant right now. MR. DINIZIO: Robert Pettit is building a new house. MR. CALLGROVE: Is he? I know there's one here. (Indicating.) MR. DINIZIO: Because when I went down there and I drove down there today, I saw that there's a new house and a new foundation on a lot that I thought was his. MR. CALLGROVE: I think there is a lot up here. (Indicating.) I know the Town used to own a lot up here on the Tax Map, you can see it up there, it says the Town of Southold. Mr. Wells RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., ($16) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 1! 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 told me that was being built on. correct, I'm not sure. MR. DINIZIO: But there's that particular small lot? MR. CALLGROVE: No. This That's the 48 Whether that's no house on is vacant. proposed house that is required by the subdivision application. There's a house here and the old homestead here has the old barn and so forth. MR. GOEHRINGER: Who owns the old homestead? MR. CALLGROVE: The Estate owns they're looking as part of the Estate, to close the Estate and they would like to They're negotiating now with a buyer. that and they want sell it. MR. GOEHRINGER: Okay. MR. CALLGROVE: And it's all held up now because we're trying to cure something that was done improperly a couple of years ago. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much. Is there anybody else who would like to speak in favor'of this application? MS. BAKER: I'm Madeline Baker and I'm a neighbor of this property and I received a notice RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 49 from the Board about the setoff and I have no objection at all to this because there are other properties in the area of the same size or smaller and I don't think it would be a detriment to the neighborhood. Incidentally, the house that you were talking about that is being built there is affordable housing. MR. GOEHRINGER: On that lot that would be indicated as Southold Town, I assume? MS. BAKER: Yes. Well, Southold Town had bought a lot north of this property and that was affordable housing that is being put on that small house that you saw, the new one. MR. DINIZIO: I just thought it was rather odd that they were asking for something and they were building a house on it already. MS. BAKER: No. That is one of the affordable housings of Southold Town. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much, ~s. Baker for coming here. Mr. Pettit? MR. PETTIT: My name is Robert Pettit, I own the property adjacent to the property in question. I just want to say that I have no objection to this at all. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rive~head, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. Anybody Anybody GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much. else that would like to speak in favor? that would like to speak against? Hearing no further comments, c2csing la~er. I make a motion the Hearing reserving decision until MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail THE BOARD: Aye. GOEHRINGER: in favor? MR. coming in. The next appeal is Glasser, it is appeal number 3890. Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant Thank you very much for in behalf of Walter The legal 3890, special exception to the Zoning Ordinance, Article IX, Section 100-91, for permission for change of use from place of worship to office/ apartment. Property location is 475 Beckwith Avenue, Southold. County Tax Map No. 1000-061-01-25." · I have a copy of the survey, most recent dane, Roderick VanTuyl, P. C., is June 30, 1989, indicating the former Grange Hall and subsequent RAM Court Reporting Service ~16 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 51 to that it was a church group, Church of the Open Door, who, I assume, are still the present owners of the property. And I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. And I have a copy of the overall site plan indicatinq the nature of this application. Who would like to be heard in behalf of this? MS. STEELMAN: My name is Nancy Steelman, I'm with Samuel & Steelman Architects. I'm representing the owner who is Mr. Glasser. It's no longer the Church of the Open Door. We're basically at this Hearing tonight seeking a special exception primarily for the apartment. We are planning approximately a 600 square foot apartment on the upper floor in the front of the building and it will have its own separate entrance down to the street. We're planning also approximately 1600 square feet of office space on the lower level. We have gone through several studies with Mr. Glasser in trying to determine the be~t possible use for this piece of property. It's in an unusual location, it's along Travellers Street, there's a lot of traffic RAM Court Reporting Service ~I6 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 52 there, it's along Beckwith also which is sort of a mixed use, residential/office type district. The uses that we've proposed we feel are compatible with the neighborhood and we feel it would be suitable for the building. General renovations to the building would be primarily along the street side on Beckwith with some facade improvements, the owner willing to do some upgrading to the building architectually to make it work in this area. I think this is a good opportunity to show that the Town is willing to put in some apartments for affordable housing. This would be a year round use and I think it's a good location for it. GOEHRINGER: MR. parking? MS. Is there any on site STEELMAN: Parking has As you can see from the site plan, section behind the building, it's approximately maybe 30 feet from the back of the building to the rear property line. We've done several been a problem. thre is a rear studies on that trying to locate parking. Our max we could get in there is two spaces. What required is upwards, I believe, it's 19 spaces RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 53 total for this piece of property. What we're doing with the Planning Board is seeking a waiver because we are within 300 feet of a municipal lot which is behind the auto store in Mr. Camonetti's building and we've discussed that with him and they understand our problem, and they're hopefully going to get us a waiver on that because of our hardship. MR. GOEHRINGER: Just so I understand it, you an provide two off-street parking spaces? MS. STEELM3~N: Yes. But what the problem was in doing that is.that you have to back out onto Travellers Street. In talking with Valerie Scopaz and some of the Board Members, they felt that that was a very dangerous situation along Travellers. MR. GOEHRINGER: There's no area on the south side of the building that can be used for ingress and egress? MS. STEELM-AN: survey the property, I or so between the edge property line. jogs into that No. You can see on the think it's about 10 feet of the building and the And then there's a section that space and that runs right to the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 edge of the property line, can get access into there. 54 so there's no way we MR. GOEHRINGER: Would you be filling the property if you provided those two parking space? MS. STEELMAN: Yes. There's sort of a natural drainage that runs through there, we would have to bring that in level and fill that up Travellers and put a fairly major retaining wall up to 4 to 6 feet along that edge, that's another reason we've decided not to do that. MR. GOEHRINGER: We thank you very much. It's always firm. MS. STEELMAN: MR. GOEHRINGER: other partner was. would like to speak MR. CAMONETTI: Mr. the Board, Paul Camonetti, New York. nice to see the other partner in the Thank you. I often wondered who the Is there anybody else who in favor of this application? Chairman, Members of Main Street, Southold, I'm an attorney, but I'm not representing Mr. Glasser as an attorney in Nancy-Steelman is representing him on this particular addition. Mr. Glasser when he this. Although I have represented acquired the building from the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 55 church, and he purchased that two years ago, or as an accommodation to the church. They tried very unsuccessfully to sell that building for several years and as a member of the church he purchased the building. But now he's faced with the dilemna as to what to do with it. He's lost many sales and just from an economic point of view very frankly, he's having a difficult time in trying to figure out what he can do with it. The only feasible thing really is to have a small accesssory apartment because the building now is of non-conforming use. And as an office space, it would comply with Zoning. So the only thing he really needs is this special exception now for the apartment. So at least that would make it feasible business and the with the parking, for a purchaser to have a small apartment. And as far as I know he's willing to fill in that because as Ms. Steelman said, and they deferred with the Department of Highways, and it would create a hazardous condition to back on to Travellers Street, although it is feasbile to put the parking in, it would present a hazard. So from that point of view I think that they are going RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 56 to waive the parking requirement completely because of the availability of parking down on the municipal parking lot. I just want to go on record as being formerly associated with the church as Waiter's personal attorney to urge the Board to approve his application because I don't believe this is an economic hardship application, it's strictly a special exception. But it is presenting a very difficult time for him to do anything wiht the building. questions you'd 2ike to ask, answer. MR. MR. MR. If there are any I'd be happy to DINIZ20: I have a question. GOEHR2NGER: Go ahead. DINIZiO: You said you were associated with the church, also? MR. C~~.iONETTI: Well, church when they were going I represented the through the construction phases in building the new church on Bayview when we appeared before this Board for a special exception at that time, yes. -MR. DINIZ20: Did they use this building? What did they use it for? MR. C~MONETTI: It was actually a house of RAM Cou~t Reporting Service 216 Cour~ St. Rlverhead, N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 worship. MR. DINIZIO: week at all? MR. CAMONETTI: 57 Did they use it during the Oh, yes. There was a school there and a nursery school and grade school, K-4 school, and it was used on a daily basis. MR. DINIZIO: A site plan wasn't required for that use? I'm wondering how could it be used as a church and not require any parking and suddenly an office? MR. CAMONETTI: building believe, Formerly it was a Grange and that had a maximum capacity, I of a 150 people. At that time, I believe, it was probably one parking spot for each five members which would have been 30 parking spots, but it was non-conforming so they didn't have provide the parking. for change of use, I the church at that time, it was a change of use from a meeting hall to a house of worship. It was the same 150 parishioners and I believe it was the same 30 parking spaces that were required but because it was non-conforming, they did not to When the church applied think Mr. Brewer represented RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516J 727-3168 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 58 have to comply. Now what we're really doing is reducing the density because what Nancy has in mind would only require 19 parking spaces, so you're actually reducing the required space that the church had down to 19. So we're improving the situation rather than worsening it. MR. DINIZIO: Thank you. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Is there anybody who would like to speak in favor of this application? Is there anybody that would like to speak against the application? Questions from Board Members? Any other further questions I should say? Hearing no further questions, I'll make a motion to close the Hearing and reserve decision until later. MR. GRIGONIS: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you very much for coming in. The next appeal is in behalf of Bidwell Wineries, it's appeal number 3882. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant 3882, special exception to the Zoning Ordinance, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, NoY., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Article III, consumer Property County Tax Map No. 1000-96-04-4.3." A copy of a sketched in site plan. 59 Section 100-30, for approval of tasting and retail sales from the Winery. location is Route 48, Cutchogue. I have a copy of a Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this Winery as being approximately 15 acres. Is there somebody who would like to be heard for Bidwell? No one is here from Bidwell? Well, we want to ask Bidwell some questions, so what we'll do is recess this with a date being the next regularly scheduled meeting and ask them to make sure that they're here. Is there anybody that would like to comment on this application before we recess it? Seeing no hands, I'll make a motion to recess it to the next regularly scheduled meeting. MR. DINIZIO: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: The next appeal is in behalf of Jerry Gambone and others. It's appeal number-3896. The legal Notice reads as follows: "Upon application the applicant 3896 special exception to the Zoning Ordinance, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 60 Article IX, Section 100-91, for permission to have office/retail business on first floor and residential rental apartment on second floor. Property location is 55415 Main Road, Southold. County Tax Map No. 1000-62-01-12." A copy of a site Plan produced by Reggie Heile, Architect, dated May of 1988, indicating a rather stately two-story frame house on the Main Road in Southold. And the nature of this application is an accesssory apartment on the second floor. I have a copy of the Suffolk County Tax Map indicating this and surrounding properties in the area. Is there somebody that would like to be heard on behalf of this application? MR. GAMBONE: Yes. I'm Jerry Gambone. My partner is here as well, but this is sort of my project. I have never been to one of these meetings before. MR. GOEHRINGER: MR. GAMBONE: know ~s if you have what to history It's very relaxed. I guess what I would like to any questions, then I know tell you. I could sort of tell you the of what's happened with why I'm here RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 1! 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 61 tonight, but I don't know if that's relevant. MR. GOEHRINGER: Quickly, if you want to give it to us, sure. MR. GAMBONE: Well, I saw the building in August of 1985, and before purchasing I talked to Mr. LeSard and Mr. Hinderman at the Building Department. I wanted to, down the road several years from purchasing it, use the first floor probably to run an antique business and the building seemed appropriate for that use. It's not the business I'm in now. But I went to them saying I want to buy the building, what can I do with it so I can make it economically viable. And the suggestion was what I'm here for now which is to put offices on the first floor and an apartment upstairs. I wanted to make it a totally professional building but because of the way they were interpreting the handicapped law, to mean it would have been prohibitive to make the second floor offices. So, I bought the building based on wanting to do that. I rented the building as a house for two and a half years, and the people, the tenants that were there, had pretty much damaged the house sufficiently RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y.,(516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 62 that I couldn't just paint it up and rerent it. I went to Mr. LeSard and said, "I want to put on an addition." And he was telling me all I have to do is apply for a site plan to change the usage of the building, which I find out now is incorrect, that I have to be here at the Zoning Board. So we went ahead and did the addition. I'm renting the building out again and I want to get permission to keep offices on the first floor. And I'll be going through the Planning Board for a site plan approval. MR. GOEHRINGER: How large is the apartment on the second floor? MR. GAMBONE: The liveable square footage is a little over 700 square feet. MR. GOEHRINGER: So there'd be a portion story which will not be used for of the second the accessory apartment? MR. GAMBONE: Right. MR. GOEHRINGER: the front or the rear? 'MR. hallways. MR. What portion would that be, GAMBONE: The stairwell and the GOEHRINGER: In the existing second RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court Sto, Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 story area? MR. GAMBONE: MR. GOEHRINGER: toward basically what Right. And again I'm looking that would be at now, when I'm talking to you, it basically appears that most of the apartment is toward the west side and the rear of the MR. GAMBONE: second floor, yes. structure? Right. It's mainly the 63 MR. GOEHRINGER: The whole second floor? MR. GAMBONE: Right. Minus the stairwell and hallway. MR. GOEHRINGER: And you'll be utilizing the existing stairwell rather than placing a new stairwell on the exterior of the dwelling? MR. GAMBONE: The existing stairwell, yes. There's no plan to build an exterior stairwell. The building was done with LeSard's approval in terms of fire code, so I have no doubt that that's going to pass. it. · MR. GOEHRINGER: They've already inspected We thank you very much. don't have any other questions. We'll see if anybody else has any. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. SAWICKI: upstairs? MR. GAMBONE: MR. SAWICKI: MR. GAMBONE: MR. GOEHRINGER: There's somebody living Yes. And the bottom is empty? The bottom is empty. Thank you very much. 64 Is there anybody else who would like to speak either in favor of this application or against? MR. BIDNOWSKI: My name is Wes Bidnowski~ I'm the landowner to the immediate north of Jerry and Kes' property. I just want to say that I have no objection to their project. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Is there anybody else who would like to speak against the application? Hearing no further comments, I make a motion closing the Hearing reserving decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. G©EHRINGER: At the last meeting we close~ the recess Compass Transports Hearing which is 3872 so that we might have time to discuss the file with the town attorney. We have since RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 done so and I'll ask Mr. Pachman if he has he would like to add. MR. PACHMAN: Mr. Chairman, Members of the Board, good evening. One of the things that we 65 anything did discuss last time and you wanted certified was the various areas that existed and I have prepared for the Members of the Board as per your request, and you will note that one of the positions that we took was that there's no definition of floor space in the Ordinance and the only thing they talk about is floor area so by definition, the floor space that we claim to be utilized for this seating capacity of the seats for the restaurant or dining area is designated on the area as being, if you look on the right there's a code there, that's A, 491 square feet, well under 500 feet. So the five spaces that we have we believe as our hardship situation exists. We have discounted obviously the counter space, the kitchen and personnel space, the restrooms and cooler, all the areas that are not public areas which come off th~ square foot area. Therefore, we feel without going through the application again because your list was long and hard last time and I don't RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 67 want to belabor it, that we have hardship, and we have practical difficulties here and respectfully request that the application as submitted be granted. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. Is there anybody else who would like to speak in favor of this application? MR. MARKAKIS: Andreais Markakis. Mr. Chairman, Members of the Board, I've gone through a lot for the last five years and hardly managed to keep family in the building closed and unable to work. I will not elaborate on the reasons and the agony I went through. I have in the file police reports, threats of life, all kinds of discriminating things which should not happen in any part of the country. We see so much going outside, so much going on for freedom out of expression. And in this period, although I'm here on the merits of the case I would like to ask you to approve the application. Thank you. · MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you, sir. Is there anybody else who would like to speak in favor of the application? Anybody that would like to RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 68 speak against the application? Yes, Wes. MR. BERDNOWSKI: Wes Berdnowski. As per the Board's request, a copy of the survey. I don't want to belabor a point either, I think what the whole problem here is not for space or for anything like that, it's parking. Parking on site is inadequate for five cars. If he has to have five cars, five cars will not fit on there. We have a traffic flow problem on Beisseau Avenue and we have a parking problem. As I stated last time, nine driveways within several hundred feet, there's also a fire hydrant, there's also on street parking which is pretty damn nil plus the two corners. The problem is the parking. But I don't want to belabor the point. MR. GOEHRINGER: Any rebuttal? MR. PACHMAN: I didn't see the survey. I would appreciate looking at the survey. I don't see the encroachment. The issue last time was that we were encroaching on his property. I don't have it on my survey. It doesn't show it on that survey. MR. BERDNOWSKI: It shows it very plainly. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.¥.,(516)727-3168 1 2 3 4 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18~ 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. PACHMAN: Do you want to MR. BERDNOWSKI: Certainly. 69 show it to me? There's a retaining wall and a chain link fence that's on our property line here from approximately here all the way. MR. MR. line. PACHMAN: It doesn't show that at all. BERDNOWSKI: It certainly does. MR. PACHMAN: It shows it's right on the If it encroaches, it indicates it where it encroaches. You're correctly. MR. BERDNOWSKt: You can have property and not reading the survey I want encroaching. You haven't shown me. MR. BERDNOWSKI: MR. GOEHRINGER: I certainly am. a legally blind man go down that see that it is encroaching. MR..PACHMAN: Forget a legally blind man, someone that can see and show me that it is It's on the survey, sir. Is there anybody else who would like to speak with regard to the nature of this application? · MR. MARKAKIS: Mr. Chairman, issue seems to be the traffic. We asking anything more than the place is the critical are not entitled, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 70 that is the five parking spots. Regarding the observations and remarks of the traffic, I would like these gentlemen to tell us where they were when four years ago I stood before the Town Board regarding the critical issues of traffic, and I have a correspondence exchanged. I'm not going to elaborate because we're only asking for what the place is entitled to get corresponding to the five parking spots. Thank you. MR. GOEHRINGER: Hearing no further comments I'll make a motion closing the Hearing reserving decision until later. MR. SAWICKI: MR. GOEHRINGER: THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: coming in. The nature an application for the Second. Ail those in favor? Thank you very much for of appeal number 3770 is construction of a storage building on the property better known as the Port of Egypt. I'm asking the Board to re-open this Hearing so that we mi'ght place at least'one piece of evidence from a member of the community and so that we might ask the applicant for one other thing from him concerning this RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1 2 3 4 5 6 71 before we close the Hearing. I would admit to you that the reason for the opening of this Hearing is only for those two reasons and, therefore, gentlemen, I'll make a motion to re-open the Hearing. MR. GRIGONIS: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: All in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you for coming down Mr. Lieblein and I know that this is a closed Hearing from the prior meeting, we very rarely open the Hearings again but in a discussion with the town attorney he has requested us to secure from you a single and separate search on the marina property indicating that. And this has nothing to do with the motel. And that's basically what he's requesting. He's also asking for a total acreage figure exclusive of the basin, which I think we have. Okay? But if you could give us an approximate acreage figure of the basin so that we could have that for ou~ files. We are not looing in any way to continue the lengthinessof this particular Hearing. As you can see the width of it as to date RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (5169 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 I0 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 20 21 22 23 24 25 72 is quite large. We know that this is a burden upon you and I am truly sorry for it. If I had been aware of the fact that this is what he wanted prior to this, I certainly would have asked for it. MR. LIEBLEIN: Would you define what you mean by a single search? GOEHRINGER: A single and separate MR. search? MR. MR. LIEBLEIN: Yes. GOEHRINGER: That's basically where you go to the County Clerk's Office and you ask for a single and separate search and what they do is they search the history of the parcels around your parcel indicating that your parcel was in no way or in some way or might have been in some way a part of and token of your particular parcel. MR. LIEBLEIN: I'm sure that I Mr. Shondenbare and he'll give us explanation of what he wants. · MR. GOEHRINGER: Well, what my opinion is.. MR. LIE~LEIN: can go to a legal that's basically But I'm not an attorney. I'm just curious. Is this RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 ! 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 an expensive thing or you just go to and they do it? 73 the County MR. GOEHRINGER: Well, I don't think it has to be certified. I would say that the title search from the County Clerk's Office to my knowledge costs $50. I have no idea. There are at least two conti'§uous pieces on each side so they'll have to search either one of those, one, of course, belongs to the Southold Corporation or whatever the name of the industrial corporation is. MR. LIEBLEIN: MR. GOEHRINGER: to Almondo Cappa. two searches. C & L Realty. And the other one belongs So you might have to get MR. LIEBLEIN: Okay. MR. GOEHRINGER: And that's basically the situation. And then they usually search your parcel, also. And, of course, you've given us a deed to one particular area. But that's the best of my ability of what we're requesting at this particular time. And again, I apologize to you for the inconvenience because as you know it's not normally a situation that we re-open the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 74 Hearing. MR. LIEBLEIN: The acreage that you were given was, of course, the acreage of the land which was calculated by VanTuyl and we'd be happy to go to VanTuyl and have him calculate the acreage of the water for the basin. MR. GOEHRINGER: At the last Hearing I asked you and it was either you or Merri!l~ I don't remember, but I asked you if you felt that you had rights and actually owned the underwater land at that time. I'm not answering for you, but you said that the property was exhumed by a member of the family and you did dig a canal so there is a very good possibility that you own the underwater land. MR. LIEBLEIN: We hope so. MR. GOEHRINGER: So that's basically the situation. And we thank you very much. If anything else develops throughout this, stop me. Mr. Flynn, we don't know the nature of why you were not here at the last Hearing when we closed this Hearing. We were in no way or are in no way trying to restrict you from your opinions concerning this Hearing. I just want you to be RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24. 25 in some detail ~you have made. 75 aware of the fact that the reason why we could not accept your letter was because the Hearing was closed. I don't feel that there was anything done other than the fact that we closed the Hearing and you were not here. We did advertise it and that's basically the situation. We are giving you the opportunity at this particular time to submit those papers. It doesn't have to be done tonight. What we are very simply going to do is to recess this until the next regularly scheduled Hearing. Hopefully at that time we will have the single and separate search. MR. FLYNN: F. M. Flynn, Southold. The reason perhaps I was not at that last Hearing was because I was hospitalized at Stony Brook and really wasn't aware of the circumstances. MR. GOEHRINGER: I see. MR. FLYNN: However, if I read the public notice here correctly, this meeting is open to all comments upon this matter and I would like to speak initially concerning the remarks It appears that at the last meeting the owner or the applicant has revised his ownership or his claim to ownership of Upland RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 76 land as contracted with his previous submissions to the Board to various other agencies including the DEC and in effect if he has done so, he has negated his entire application process and has to go back to square one. There is a question about ownership and it's always a question of actual ownership and beneficial ownership. That is a legal question to be decided. But by the way, it doesn't improve his situation one bit. I would like to address this Board in some detail along this matter. To date there's been so much confusion that it reminds me somewhat of the story of the drunk grasping a lamppost. He grasps it for support but not for illumination. In my own simple way I'd like to cast a little light on this matter and I ask your leave to address this matter in some detail because you have been discussing this matter for a matter of years with the applicant where we, the public, have very scant opportunity to address the Board. So by your leave I would like to take up a few mintues of your time and inform you as to some of the details of this matter about which you may not be informed. May I proceed? RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516! 727-3168 ! 3 4 ? 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 MR. GOEHRINGER: Yes. MR. FLYNN: I'm going to 77 read my comments. There's some question of detail matter and this is also a question that I want the accurate record to be retained. Now, as I say, I intend to read my remarks so that there is no question of the accuracy of the transcription of my statements as they appear in the record of this proceeding. I submit that a vote on whether to reopen the Hearing on this matter is begging the question and not in the public interest. This Board, if it recognizes it or not, is confronted by a Hobson's Choice. For any unfamiliar with the expression, it means no choice at all. Under the law, you have no alternative but to deny this application summarily. To do otherwise cast doubts in my mind on the competence or integrity of the Board of Appeals and of the Town Board of which it is a creature. The same may be said of the Planning Board which reviewed a plan which is in direct conflict with the provisions of Southold's Zoning Code.' Unbelievably, this same Planning Board issued a Negative Declaration for a plan which, if RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 approved, would have a devastating effect on environment. 78 the The only real question is why the Board of Appeals has temporized so long. Even a cursory examination of the subject application should have resulted in its peremptory rejection. We stand on the verge of entering the last decade of the twentieth century. longer a fiefdom where variances like lollipops to a favored few. Southold is no can be given Southold, unless I am mistaken, is located in the State of New York and subject to its laws. Case law on zoning, and more particularly on variances, has become well established over the years. This is as well might be since the New York State Enabling Act for Town Zoning admonishes that the power to grant variances is to be "sparingly used in rare circumstances." This admonition has been ignored conspiculously in the Town of Southold. In the subject instance, it is all the more pertinent in view of the recently adopted Zoning Code. Further, an applicant must submit convincing proof seeking variances of hardship or RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 79 business more frofitably." This alone negates the obvious thrust of the applicant's argument. As for practical difficulties or unique circumstances, they do not exist except as a fancied impediment to a plan to exceed the building coverage permitted by the Zoning Code or to maximizing the applicant's profits. The powers of the Board of Appeals are circumscribed in the Town Code. It is permitted to var.y the "strict letter of these regulations", i.e., the Zoning code. I submit that to approve the subject application would entail the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., ($26] 727-3168 practical difficulties. These are terms with legal meanings and are not matters for subjective interpretation. The subject applicant has submitted no such proof, nor could he. The courts have held that hardship means financial hardship and that "dollars and cents" proof thereof must be submitted. As long as a property has utility and value there is no hardhsip under the law. Case law specifically states: "Hardship is not established by proof that a variance will enable the applicant to operate an existing 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8O abandonment of the entire alphabet. The duties of this Board also include the preservation of the public safety and welfare. These considerations, alone, provide obvious grounds for denying the subject application. Nation-wide studies of zoning decisions reveal that the most egregious acts of Boards of Appeal involve their violation, as unelected officials, of legislative enactments. The scope and magnitude of the variances sought in the subject application are such as to make a mockery of the Town's newly minted Zoning Code. To grant them goes far beyond the Board's purview. address the substance of this Now to application. to circumvent It represents a flagrant attempt and flout the Zoning Code. It can best be described, in simple, attempt to cram ten pounds of sugar into a pound bag. There is no question that the direct terms as an five applicant has enough upland to comply with the Code. The extent of the variances sought necessitates the use of the old Gaelic term, chutzpah, to do justice to the effort. First, under the Town's Zoning Code, the RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 81 applicant has, upland available for marina operations. Zoning Code permits 30 percent coverage, 31,476 square feet of buildings. Existing marina at most 104,920 square feet of The or structures total 46,185 square feet. Thus, the existing structures exceed the coverage permitted by the Code by 14,709 square feet. The existing coverage is 147 percent of that permitted by the Code. Approximately 49,030 additional square feet would be required to accommodate the existing structures in conformance with the Code. Even the existing coverage is non- conforming. A stated objective of the Town Code is the gradual elimination of non-conforming properties, not their proliferation. To a density which already exeeds the maximum permitted, it is proposed to add 31,490 square feet of improvements. Even adjusted for proposed demolition, the total of 74,275 square feet of buildings would be more than double the coverage permitted by the Code. The proposed comple~ would require, at 30 percent building coverage alone, 247,583 square feet of upland, or 142,663 square feet more than is available for RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 marina operations. represent 236 percent of Code. Second, the reduced the Code's 82 Proposed coverage would that permitted by the applicant has arbitarily requirements for docked boats by one-half, and by three-quarters for boats in rack storage. Such a change in parking requirement: is no mere variance, but requires a legislative change in the Town Code with the attendant public hearings. Code requirements for the project dictate at least 386 parking spaces, or 135,100 square feet. The applicant proposes to provide 145 spaces. The resultant shortage is 241 parking places, or 84,350 square feet. This shortage for parking alone is 1.94 acres net. And by way of explanation, I mean net of side yards, front yards, planting areas, etc. This entire parking issue is a smoke screen, or red herring. It represents an attempt by the applicant to divert attention from the fact that such an amendment of the Zoning Code would permit him, and other marina operators, to launch as many as four times the number of boats into the already RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhemd~ N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 ? 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 1'7 18 20 21 23 24 25 83 imperiled Peconic Bay as is currently permitted. Third, no provision has been made for the 20 percent landscaping required by the Zoning Code. Fourth, my analysis indicates that to conform to Code requirements, this project would require approximately 3.6 additional acres of upland. To put into perspective the outrageous nature of the variances sought, the applicant seeks the additional utility of one and one-half times the acreage that he actually has available for marina operations under the provisions of the Zoning Code. Fifth, front and side yard variances are sought purely to increase the profitability of the owner's operations. The specious reasoning behind the front yard variance sought is because his other main structure is non-conforming. The basis for the side yard variance has even less validity. Sixth, consideration of the public's health, safety and welfare are, or should be, paramount in the Board's considerations. It is proposed to erect a monolithic structure 45 feet RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., (516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 84 high housing 160 or more fuel laden boats within five feet of an abutting property line and in close proximity to a State highway. What would happen if the neighboring property owner sought a similar variance for which you have set a precedent? Or suppose the neighboring property owner merely exercised his vested right to build a similar structure within 30 feet of the one proposed? What would be the problem of accessibility for emergency equipment in the event of a conflagration? By what the operators apparently interpret as a God-given right, it is certainly not a right granted by the State of New York, they have incorporated State Route 25 as part of their operations by freely transporting boats and equipment across the highway by truck, fork lift and travel lift. It has also been suggested that additional marina parking be located on the north side of the highway creating additional vehicular and pedestrian traffic. This along an already heavily traveled highway lacking traffic controls, curbs, curb cuts, sidewalks, pedestrian crossings, etc. Granting this application would set a RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 ;~. 2: 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 85 precedent for similarly increased traffic throughout the Town with devastating effects, particularly on residential areas. To summarize to this point, approving this application would constitute the Board's making the applicant a gift of the utility of, and hence, the value of approximately 3.5 acres of commercially zoned waterfront upland. its pernicious influence would be felt throughout the Town. The character of the Town would be permanently altered for the worse by making provision for launching several thousand more boats with increased traffic hazards, demands on our limited utility, etc. It is a travesty that the applicant has, by his letter of November 8, 1989, to the Board, claimed an area of upland ownership reduced from that previously stated to the Board and other governmental agencies. I repeat, that by so doing he has invalidated his entire application process. Further, even if such a claim were true, the s~me principles and similar calculations would obtain. In short, the entire application represents an outrageous attempt to rezone his In addition, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverheod, N.Y., {516} 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 property via variances; with zoning law. 86 an obvious direct conflict Now, as a point of personal privilege, I would like to disabuse the Board of any impressions it may have garnered regarding me and my analysis from Mr. Lieblein's letter of November 8th. Regardless of Mr. Lieblein's impression that I consider him and all marina operators to be sly, sneaky and devious, I would like to state that I have had a personal interest in marina operations, and I prefer not to think of myself in those terms. As in all fields, there are good and bad operators. This is really a subjective matter for the public to decide. Such a poll would produce some interesting results and I'm sure at least some of the operators would match Mr. Lieblein's rather florid characterization. I'm sure all businessmen, myself included, are profit oriented. The issue here is the question of increased profitability as the basis for gr~ntingvariances. The law is perfectly clear in its dismissal of such grounds. As for the ownership of the motel property, RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., ($16) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 87 Mr. Leiblein includes it in the description of the property owned or controllad by the Port of Egypt in his submissions to the Board and other agencies. I might add that he has personally listed the property for sale with various real estate brokers. I state again, to deny ownership now is to negate his application. My comments regarding the tax exempt status of the motel property hardly constitutes a Were you to consult Southold's Tax indicated that the property is tax Parenthetically, some of Mr. Leiblein's zoned M II is carried on this Roll as vacant residentially zoned land. In any event, the motel property's tax exempt status was confirmed by my inquiries of the Suffolk County Industrial Development Agency. Mr. Lieblein, perhaps inadvertently, confirms this by referring to a payment in lieu of taxes. His payment represents a partial payment of total taxes and reflects the exemption of taxes on the value added'by funds advanced by the IDA. An interesting question arises from this state of affairs. If the IDA were to advance the funds "zinger". Roll it is exempt. property RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 for the proposed new construction, be, in its entirety, tax exempt? 88 would it not My reference to "demonstrable demand" was abstracted from the Marina Criteria subscribed to by New York's Department of State in connection with its Coastal Management Program. Mr. Lieblein concedes some vacancies. The same is true of other marinas in the Town. Demonstrable demand must be considered on a Town-wide basis. Surely, the Board is aware of marina expansion and new construction in the Greenport area. Certainly this has bearing on the question of foreseeable demand. Mr. Lieblein has conceded that only 25 percent of marina capacity in the Town is occupied by Town residents. This means that 75 perecent of the Town's current marina capacity is occupied by non-residents. Even at the projected full development of the Town's population, 50 percent of the current marina capacity would still be available to non-residents. This brings up the inevitable question of how much are we, as a Town, expected to contribute to the further degradation of the Peconic Bay Estuarine System? Further, how much of the Town's quality of life, and the health RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516~ 727-3168 ! 4~ 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 89 safety and welfare of its people, are to be sacrificed for non-residents? Mr. Lieblein insults the intelligence of the Board when he states that only 300 square feet of ground area is needed to block and store a 30 foot boat. Boats are not stored like coins in a wrapper. In the first place, few modern 30 foot boats have a beam of only 10 feet. Regardless of this fact, it has to be conceded that space has to be provided on both sides of the boat and at its stern. If we allow a boat two and one half feet of clearance on each of these sides, we have a net ground area of 488 square feet occupied by the boat alone. This is, obviously, the equivalent of almost one and one-half parking spaces. Overlooked in Mr. Lieblein's calculation is the requirement for maneuvering area between the boats for requirement to place the stored boats~ In the case of the proposed new storage building, approximately 80 feet has been allowed for this purpose. Allowing half of this width per boat results in a requirement of an additional 500 square feet of ground ar~a per boat. Thus the total RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead~ N.7., ~516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 90 is 988 square feet per boat, or 2.8 parking spaces. My mental calculation was not far off the mark, particularly if boats in excess of 30 feet in length are to be stored. As proof of my contention in the matter of Young's Marina, with which the Board is familiar, the owner concedes an upland area of 4 acres is required for 138 boats. This translates to 1,263 square feet per boat. Mr. Lieblein advances the argument that additional boats can be stored, presumably in the aisles. This raises the question of accessibility, particularly in the event of an emergency. Also, unaddressed is the question of the additional parking required for the additional boats. And so on ad infinitum. Mr. Lieblein also states he can store boats four high in the proposed building. He has also stated he can store boats in the center aisle of the building. How many boats does he really intend to launch into an already overcrowded Budd's Pond? Would-not the other neighboring marina operators petition for similar variances? The number of parking spaces constitutes RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 91 the only effective control the Town has over the number of boats to be launched from a given site. In Mr. Lieblein's case, he proposes to accommodate a minimum of 362 boats on a 2.4 acre site, or 151 boats per acre. This in a Town that professes a desire to restrict development by zoning residential lots to two acres. With further respect to parking, the requirements of the Code are clear. Variances of the magnitude sought are beyond the purview of the Board of Appeals. Even a reapplication with a change in the parking plan by including parking on the north side of Route 25 would not obviate the shortfall in parking spaces. It would, however, precipitate the safety and welfare problems previously discussed. Further, the parking issue has no effect to the question of the maximum building coverage permitted by the Zoning Code. Unbelievably, Mr. Lieblein has based his arbitrary parking plan on surveys conducted in Australia and on Puget Sound. I would suggest the Board investigate the requirements of neighboring communities which share the Peconic Bay as a common RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhemd, N.Y., t516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 92 resource. More particularly, the Board should investigate the problems with parking for rack storage in the Village of Freeport. I am heartened that Mr. Lieblein concedes that he was unsuccessful in analyzing my calculations. They are really quite straightforward. Perhaps he meant he was unsuccessful in countering them. Mr. Lieblein introduces some area calculations made by Mr. VanTuyl into his argument. Mr. VanTuyl is a reputable and competent surveyor. However, in this, as in similar instances he serves as a technician. He makes the calculations he is instructed to make. It is obvious he has excluded Lot 3.4, the motel site, from his calculations of net upland area in the ownership/control of the Port of Egypt. This is clearly in conflict with previous submissions by the applicant. Even if one were to disregard this obvious flaw, the applicant has not materially altered confrontation by the basic questions of coverage and parking. Mr. VanTuyl's land area calculations for Lots 4 and 6.1 coincide rather closely with mine. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., [516~ 727-3168 1 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 93 Mr. Lieblein makes reference to the basin. Actually there are two basins. Perhaps it is coincidental, but if the area of the second basin is deducted, within as my area claculations are 120 square feet of Mr. VanTuyl's. In claiming an area of 215,058 square feet available for marina operations, Mr. Leiblein disregards the Code requirement of 80,000 square feet for the restaurant. I would also point out to the Board that the area covered by Mr. Lieblein's lease to the restaurant has no bearing on zoning requirements. As for the calculations of building area, I don't know what buildings Mr. VanTuyl was asked to calculate. Obviously, his calculations of building areas and percentage of coverage differ from mine. I can only state that my calculations were made, in large part from Mr. VanTuyl's survey of the subject property. The rest were made from Peconic Associates' Plot Plan. Now, Mr. Lieblein poses the question as to why I considered the concrete washing pads as a building. Perhaps this accounts for part of the discrepancy in building and lot coverage RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead~ N.Y., ~516~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 94 calculations. The basis for my including the washing pads is obvious to anyone familiar with the Southold Zoning Code, Section 100-13 defines "Building", in part, as, and I quote: "...also any combination of materials forming any construction except when entirely underground so as to permit the use of the ground above the same as if not building was present." It should also be noted that the elimination of these pads would be contrary to DEC requirements. Finally, with respect to Mr. Lieblein's letter, he refers to the proposed lease of 9,240 square feet of State land. Having served as a consultant to the Attorney General for many years, I doubt that the State requires anyone to lease its land. Nevertheless, any lease does not confer title and is of a transient nature. Thus, as a basis for increased building it cannot serve coverage. It appears I have come full circle. I believe I have proved that it is possible for an applicant to use calculations for support, but, not necessarily, for enlightenment. Perhaps the ultimate irony inherent in this RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., [516] 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 application is the grandiose economic benefit to the Town. destruction of its quality of 95 promise of In exchange for the the Town's natural environment and life, Mr. Lieblein is on record that his project would provide exactly two extra jobs. In conclusion, the actions of Town agencies, in this matter, gives rise to the suspicion that we, the ordinary residents, are confronted by a done deal. I must express my resentment, as a private citizen, that I have had to prepare the type of detailed analysis that it is the Board of Appeals' duty to perform. The law is clear. The calculations are simple. The conflicts with the Zoning Code are self-evident. If the Board is unable, or unwilling, to perform its duties in a professional, unbiased manner, I would suggest it resign. Such an action on its part would allow the new Town Board to appoint a Board both willing and able to act on behalf-of the public at large. And I'll provide you with a clean copy of this and I'll also provide you with a copy (indicating.). RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., {516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 96 MR. GOEHRINGER: Mr. Flynn, I've only one question to ask you and that is, I don't want to get invovled with the controversy but how do you determime that this was a done deal? First of all, sir, I'm extremely upset with your letters to this Board. All you had to do was have yourself or your wife call this Board when you were in the hospital and we would have very simply left this Hearing open for you to submit all the testimony that was required. That's number one. Number two, I am tired of receiving information from you which clearly states that we are doing something illegal. We are doing nothing illegal. We advertised this last Hearing, we closed this last Hearing in good faith, and we have no opened this Hearing strictly for you to submit your information tonight. MR. FLYNN: Now may I answer? MR. GOEHRINGER: Yes, you may answer. MR. FLYNN: Why do I think it's a done deal? I didn't say a done deal, I said I'm suspicious it's a done deal. And the reason I'm suspicious is the entire history of this. How this ever got passed the Planning Board so obviously at variance RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 97 with the requirements of the Zoning Code. Secondly, how it was presented to you and no questions were raised at the time of presentation. These lead me to believe, and even the method by which you offered such solicitious questions of the applicant this evening, indicated to me that this Board leans towards applicants in many instances. And if you would like me to recite some of the instances, I have investigated some of the things the Board has said, and that's not at apropo of this particular Hearing. But if you get insulted by anything I have to say, you are being insulted by the truth. And, therefore, MR. GOEHRINGER: That is incorrect. MR. FLYNN: -- you as a public official have no reason to take umbrage You can counter anything that I say as not being factual but that is the extent of what you can do. MR. GOEHRINGER: Sir, I will personally counter what you are stating as not factual in our decision when it comes to that particular point.and only at that particular time. I am not here to chastise anybody. I'm telling you, sir, that when you write to this Board or when you talk RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516} 727-3~68 1 2 3 4 5 7 8 10 11 12 13 14 15 17 18 19 2O 21 22 23 24 25 98 to this Board, you are talking to this Board as an individual of the Town and do not ever say that we're doing something illegal because we're not doing anything illegal. MR. FLYNN: I am saying you are on the verge of doing something illegal and I've said that very clearly. You are on the verge of doing something illegal if you approve this application. MR. GOEHRINGER: I am not. MR. FLYNN: That's been the thrust of all my statements to you. And incidentally, you saw fit to return one of my letters unread. MR. GOEHRINGER: I told you why we returned it, because the Hearing was closed. MR. FLYNN: Because Mr. Lieblein submitted a letter as of November 8th and you closed the Hearing as of November 8th. I don't consider that giving the general public an opportunity to counter those remarks. MR. GOEHRINGER: I told you, sir, that all you had to do was inform us that you were unable to at~end that particular Hearing and we would have left the Hearing open for you to voice your remarks, which you so did tonight. Okay? RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court Sto, Rlverhead~ N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. FLYNN: Yes. me the opporunity. MR. GOEHRINGER: 99 I appreciate your giving And I appreciate it that when you write to this Board that you don't clearly state to this Board, and that's what you did in your letter, which I don't have any more -- MR. FLYNN: Oh, I'll give you a copy. MR. GOEHRINGER: Fine. MR. FLYNN: I'll give you a copy right now. I did not state you were doing anything illegal. I said you were on the verge of doing something illegal if you approve this application. And if you will consult the town attorney, I'm sure you'll get the same answer from him. There has been no proof submitted, none of the required proof has been submitted in this matter. MR. GOEHRINGER: on this? MR. FLYNN: I say Have we made a decision I told you all along in the form of a warning that were you to do that, because of your obvious reaction to the submission of this application, had anybody on this Board done their job and examined this application from day one, you would have known it was faulty. RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 And if you were prepared when this was publicly submitted some questions for the recall, you did not. MR. GOEHRINGER: Mr. Wickham, to see you. How are you tonight? MR. WICKHAM: Good evening. Wickham from Cutchogue. I came here few words something that means quite 100 application to you, you would have had applicant which, as you it's so nice I'm John to say in very a good deal to me. I remember very distinctly that the former Supervisor Albert Martoccia said the Board must say no 90 percent of the time. And to remind you, you said no to me the last time when I came before you. I am concerned primarily about the total picture, and I'm not going into any of the details, but I think there is something emerged which we haven't faced up to and it's having or will have a very significant effect on some parts of our water based economy, and that is rack storage. In my opinion, rack storage is and will have a very definite effect upon all marina operations. I can't feel that it's totally to blame for the I will say collapse of the bayfront ship yards and so forth in Greenport and much closer to me in RAM Court Reporting Service 216 Court St.,Rlverhead, N.Y., ~$16~ 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 101 New Suffolk but if rack storages are allowed to proliferate, there will be a very very real collapse of water based -- oh, the word I want to use escapes me, but anyway the use of the water as recreational in other areas aside from those few who are granted rack storage. And for this reason I feel in this particular case that there is really no hardship because here there is already rack storage and he has gotten ahead of the competition, most of the competition, and I happen to believe in that sort of thing. But it's been clearly explained to me that to become before your Board you must have hardship and in this particular case where he's ahead of everyone else in that area, I can't see any hardship. And I again feel that in looking at the long term effects of rack storage in the Town of Southold you've got to be very very careful. The decision is yours, thank goodness. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you, Mr. Wickham. MS. NORTHAM: Good evening. My name is Johanna Northam. I'm a member of the North Fork Enviornmental Council. The North Fork Environmental Council requests that the Zoning RAM Court Rel~orting Service 216 Court St.,Rlv~rh~ad, N.Y., ($16) 727-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 102 Board of Appeals reviewing application number 3770, Port of Egypt project, take into consideratio~ the following issues prior to granting an application for said project: Compliance of 30 percent lot coverage as outlined in Marine 11 code, compliance with parking code limitation of one car per parking space, projected impact on Hashamomuck Pond and increased septic leachate Thank you for your attention to this problems. matter. MR. GOEHRINGER: Go ahead. MS. KREMIS: I'm Ann Kremis and I'm a Director of Southold 2000 and I just want to say that we support Mr. Flynn's position that the variance with the Port of Egypt be reopened for public hearing been changed. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you. anybody else that would like to speak? hands, no further hands, we will -- you're since the original application has That's about it. Is there Seeing no MR. MR. MR. going to have the rehearing? LIEBLEIN: One second. GOEHRINGER: Pardon me. LIEBLEIN: Can you tell me roughly when Is it next RAM Court Reportin8 SeFvlee 216 Court 8t.,Riverhead, N.Y., (il6) 727.3168 1 .2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 103 month? I would like to point out that the boat show opens on the llth and closes on the 21st so if you could have a hearing just prior or preferably after the boat show -- MR. GOEHRINGER: Around the 27th? MR. LIEBLEIN: That will be fine. I'm not sure what this question of ownership is all about. MR. LIEBLEIN: My brother-in-law and I, and my wife and his wife, own the corporation and bought the Southold Motel under the auspices coverage of IDA. We are presently trying to sell it and haven't been successful in doing that. At one point we applied to build a motel project the was going to have motel units on that property and the other, and if that had been granted we would have put everything under one roof. That was not granted. I assume that is what the question is. I assume that since all this information has been presented, I can have the opportunity to review all the information that has been put in; I certainly did not make any attempt to respond at this point to the lengthy -- in most cases it was a repetition -- but regardless, in the last instance I believe it took three weeks to get a RAM Court Reporting Serviee 216 Court St.,Riverhead, N.Y., (S16) ~27-3168 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 copy of the submitted a of having a copy of 104 transcript, at the last Hearing I letter which eliminated the problem to wait so Mr. Flynn was able to get that, which I have no problem with, and I would assume that the same courtesy would be extended to us. That tomorrow or the next day we could pick up a copy so that we could attempt to answer questions raised. MR. MR. MR. comments, to the next regularly scheduled meeting. GOEHRINGER: LIEBLEIN: GOEHRINGER: I make a motion Certainly. I thank you for your time. Hearing no further to recess the Hearing MR. SAWICKI: Second. MR. GOEHRINGER: Ail in favor? THE BOARD: Aye. MR. GOEHRINGER: Thank you all for (TIME NOTED: 10:25 P.M.) coming. RAM Court Reporting Serviee 216 Court St.,Riverheod, N.Y., (516) 727-3168 105 CERTIFICATION 10 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 I, DONNA PALMER a Notary Public in and for the State of New York, do hereby certify: THAT the foregoing is a true and accurate transcript of my stenographic notes. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this day of January 19~07. DONNA PALMER FILED BY ~ ~90IY/~HOLD TO~r~l CI.F. RK . ~ ':n .C3.efk, Town of Southold ,espectfully submitted, Board of Appeals RAM COURT REPORTING SERVICE (516) 727-3168