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HomeMy WebLinkAboutTB-06/07/2022 PH 1 COUNTY OF SUFFOLK : STATE OF NEW YORK TOWN OF SOUTHOLD -------------------------------------------------- TOWN OF SOUTHOLD REGULAR TOWN BOARD MEETING -------------------------------------------------- Southold, New York June 7 , 2022 7 : 00 P . M . B E F 0 R E : SCOTT A . RUSSELL, SUPERVISOR LOUISA P . EVANS , JUSTICE JILL DOHERTY, COUNCILWOMAN BRIAN 0 . MEALY, COUNCILMAN GREG DOROSKI , COUNCILMAN SARAH E . NAPPA, COUNCILWOMAN 2 LOCAL LAW COZ 38-7-7 . 1 SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : I would like to invite anybody who would like to address the Town Board on this particular Local Law? MR . HOWARD WISLER : Good evening, Ladies and Gentlemen . My name is Howard Wisler . President of the Cleaves Condominium. On behalf of Cleaves Community, we want to express our thanks to you and the Planning Department for your tireless efforts to redevelop the zoning for the 2835 Shipyard property, Marine II to split zone of R-80 and RR . We certainly appreciate the Town ' s consideration for the surrounding area . Especially Cleaves Point when it was considering the zoning change . We at Cleaves Point find the R-80 Zoning portion to permit a small number of small family homes a positive result of the zoning change . While we do not object to the RR zone that could house a small hotel , it ' s not our first choice for the property; however, we understand the Town ' s sensitivity and economic value of the 3 property that they have to take into account of the rezoning . That said, we ask both the Town Board and the Planning Department to both consider the following in your future plan . That there be a significant buffer between the property and the surrounding properties . And that they require on all sides , except the south side . That serious consideration should be allowed for entry into the property from both Shipyard Lane and Gillette Drive . As neither road is large enough, sufficiently stable to handle potentially private and commercial traffic . In addition, both roads are on commercial roads . And furthermore, would benefit if emergency vehicles would have access to the property from both roads . The intensity of any project, we hope, should be kept to a minimum. And we hope that any project will have concern for the surrounding areas , including potential adverse environmental consequences . We do not have any objection to non-commercial boat and docking facilities that may be used by single-family homeowners or hotel guests . We do not ; 4 however, support any of the following uses for the property . Affordable or workforce housing . Wind turbines , wineries , a free standing restaurant, conference facilities or a tourist camp . For these reasons , we urge the Town Board to vote in favor zoning the property as stated in its resolution in March 2022 to keep the foregoing considerations in mind . We ask that the Town Board ensure that the present property owner maintain and at least secure the property as it is in disrepair and an attractive nuisance for many years . Thank you for giving us the opportunity to submit out comments . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Thank you very much . MS . ELLEN ZIMMERMAN : My name is Ellen Zimmerman . I am the President of the East Marion Community Association . On behalf of the residents of East Marion, I would like to thank the Board for taking steps to change the zoning, reduce the potential develop density of the overall factory property at the end of Shipyard 5 Lane . This is a necessary step to ensure the preservation of the neighborhood and surrounding people and of East Marion in general . It was a misconceived proposal to construct a grandiose ( inaudible ) on this site that included 114 room transit hotel . 72 seat restaurant . A 99 seat cafeteria and bar that spurred the East Marion Community Association in 2007 . We will continue to fight to protect East Marion ' s character and agricultural heritage and enhance the community life as a hamlet . We thank you for paying attention to our needs and we support the rezoning of the property . MS . CANDY HARPER : My name is Candy Harper and I live a few houses away from the property on the bay in East Marion, to the east . I applaud the work that is going into the zoning, but when I read what the ( inaudible ) says , it ' s very, very amorphous . It really, really worries me . It seems that only two things that are really -- that is a winery or a music that could be heard over the ( inaudible ) property . And I also appreciate that in the zoning it says that 6 we have to take into consideration the community and the environment . But there is so little guidance in the zoning about what RR can be and what kind of mitigating measures there are, that I wonder if this zoning is setting us up for enough time, when it just took years and the project didn ' t get built . And that is my biggest concern . It ' s really hard to parse the language, RR . Thanks . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Ma ' am, let me clarify . For the code, RR is fairly restrictive . In order to determine the calculation on how ( inaudible ) there is actually called a bulk scheduling there . So it would require 4 , 000 square feet of land for every one room or 6, 000 square feet of land for every room you want, if you want to do a sewer system and ( inaudible ) water . Under the zoning that is proposed and under the buildable proposal , don ' t forget a lot of that proposal isn ' t buildable . You can ' t count that towards a building yield . MS . CANDY HARPER : So it ' s only buildable -- 7 SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : When you look at that proposal , for the RR Zoning, when you look at that six, you have to remove all the land that is not buildable . So you ' re taking that six acres and you ' re reducing it pretty substantially . By our calculations , if you have public sewer and public water, you would have to build up to 44 rooms , but it ' s a max room size of 600 square feet or without heat or public water or sewer, you can only build 29 rooms . Again, maxxed out at 600 square feet . In order to reach that max, you can ' t build a restaurant or anything . Who else would like to address the Town Board on this particular Public Hearing? MR . JOHN COSTELLO : My name is John A. Costello . I know over the years and probably the last 40 , 50 , 60 years , all my life, everybody is looking to maintain a working waterfront . Docks on the water . If you ' re going to, my suggestion, go slow . It ' s only a few parcels of land in the entire Town of Southold that you can promote 8 and develop a working waterfront . Claming and the oyster business , they ' re being chased out of Greenport . Big condominium units . A lot of cars . And all the jobs gone . Shipyard, gone . They are all gone . We don ' t even have the fishing boats in Greenport . Some of the people that are employed at Northfork Welding, make -- need more space . They need to bring fishing boats back into port . They can ' t . No place to go . Greenport Railroad Dock, gone . There used to be a couple of spots . There used to be a gravel business . The Corrazines (phonetic) , paving roads into the town . Gone . And it will probably remain gone . That is the oil companies . We know we ' re going to try to get rid of as many as possible . Where would the Town Board -- where, would they replace some of this disappearing areas of working waterfront? I think that is an important planning tool and seems to be missing here . Where would you put it? I am just asking . And the number of jobs developed . That would be important . I am in the business of waterfront business 9 and I will tell you, I am being chased a little bits . Can ' t find spots . I am not the only marine contractor . I take it that these are people and part of the Constitution . Southold . And I think we ought to try to think about it . Thank you . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Ma ' am, we will go to you next . MS . JEN HARTNEGAL : Good evening, Supervisor and Members of the Town Board . My name is Jen Hartnegal and I am speaking on behalf of the group for the east end . Thank you for reviewing the zoning on the property and for proactively trying to create something that is more suitable then the M II Zoning Category . And we appreciate the Town Board fulfilling one of the objectives of the Comp Plan by doing so . This type of action is exactly what is needed to ultimately create and solidify the publics vision for the Town as outlined in the Comp Plan . As you know, one of the previous speaks had just mentioned, the zoning category can result in some pretty disastrous development applications . And we 10 have seen them come before you . The density and the intensity of uses , it would be completely inappropriate for this piece of property . Therefore, we support the need for reduction in intensity for the density of these locations . However, we too are very concerned about the front portion that is slated for RR . Concerned that whatever reduction that we ' re taking away from the back is not enough to mitigate or negate what could take place on that portion . Again, as you just noted Supervisor, you could have 40 something units in a hotel there . It could be a mini enclave east and the site is very constrained . It ' s surrounded by the residential uses . Narrow street . And it leads down into 25A. It ' s a serious traffic issue there . So when you look at the uses permitted in the RR versus the M II , some of the more intensive uses , like that hotel are still there . And to John ' s point, he just mentioned, some of the maritime uses working waterfront are not permitted in the RR . So I know there is a give and take here, but are you really 11 gaining anything with the RR Zoning? I don ' t know, but I think you should be really hesitant with the Zoning . I guess the ultimate point that I am trying to make, it seems like the RR was maybe chosen as a default because there was nothing compatible with the code . And the Comp Plan does call out the possibility of creating new zoning that would create a better solution for this parcel and other parcels throughout the Town . So at this point, we would like you to consider -- again, our main concern that you could really have a significant development proposal there that would create community character and environmental impacts . So you know, I think we would like you to consider that and pause for a moment and reach back out to the community and see if there is anything that could be addressed here . Thank you . I appreciate the opportunity for commenting tonight . Thanks . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : I just have to say something . I promise ( inaudible ) get out of my habits to responding to people . I was going to 12 respond to John, but I bit my tongue . The idea that it ' s going to be equated to the enclaves is , I find, is a little disingenuous . A scare tactic . The enclaves , the Hamlet Business Zone, it allows for a lot of uses and is a much bigger property . It can only maximize the 44 unit scenario -- first of all , you need access to public sewer, that is a big if . Good luck finding it . Secondly, if you ' re going to maximize the 44 , you have given up all other uses because you have consumed all of the bulk schedule which -- and you know how that works . You have to substantially restrict that hotel size if you want to get any of those uses . It ' s no where near what would be permitted at the enclaves . No retail . None of those things . MS . JEN HARTNEGAL : Okay . I appreciate that . I don ' t want to be combative or out of line . This is not a scare tactic . I mean, it ' s still a hotel . Residential street that is going to lead to 25A and cause traffic problems . There is a sewer system there too with a huge hotel . A 13 septic that can go right into the bay there . So again, that intensity, it still concerns US . If it ' s , 20 , 30 , 40 units . I understand your point . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Compared to the 115 rooms? MS . JEN HARTNEGAL : If you adopt the RR Zoning . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : The current versus the 115 and the marina, the ( inaudible ) . MS . JEN HARTNEGAL : I am not saying that the RR is worse than the R-80 . I am saying that the RR might not be the best that you could create for this site . That is my point . Please be aware that this can be problematic . That is our point . Thank you . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Thank you . Sir? MR . EDWARD BUTT : Good evening, Supervisor Russell and the Members of the Board of the Town of Southold . Thank you for the opportunity this evening for me to speak . My name is Edward Butt . I am the 14 Architect for the Developer of this property, Co-owner of this property, FTS Holdings . Just to wanted to take the opportunity for a second because we have taken some time looking at the Zoning for this piece of property as well as , the proposed layout of the property that is there . To give you a little history, I was actually the architect back in 2003 when this project first started . I am a little older . A little gray haired and probably more hair fell out of my head, but I am still here . My client is gone but the current developer approached me because of my long experience with the amount of the effort that went into the environmental impact statements and all of the studies that were done prior to this for many, many years . Knowing what I know about the property and its history, we are concerned as a group to create a residential development at this location . We are trying to create a communication between ourselves and some of the community boards . Specifically East Marion Association . And 15 actually had a tentative meeting with the east end -- with the east end people, a Mr . Bob DeLuca . And that was about a week and a half ago . And really got a sense of what some of the immediate and pre-concerns are about this property . We looked at this and we have -- still in the process of analyzing the zoning that is being proposed at this point . But would like to have the opportunity -- we have been speaking with our attorneys , Mr . Losquadro and we have -- would like to have the opportunity to sit with this Board in a work session what we ' re proposing as well as communicate that with the local community people as well . To try and achieve a development here that makes sense for everyone involved, including the Town of Southold . I think it ' s our desire not to come in and pretend that we ' re steam rolling or trying to create something that was previously proposed . The fact that we ' re trying to create a residential development here with a marina . And with actually public access at least for the beach that is there . And with some other 16 potential public access on the Shipyard Lane side . Other than that, we would really appreciate the Board would consider creating some form of a worksession that we could present our application to you so that you understand what we are and where we ' re looking to go, and hopefully create a dialog with the local residents as well . So that we can achieve something that maybe everyone is happy with . And maybe we could knock this giant behemoth down and have a nicely developed piece of property for all to enjoy and see . So that is really our presentation that we would like to really do with the Board and the community . And ( inaudible ) community . A lot of time and effort was put into what we have gotten to this point . And I think with all the efforts that have been put forth by this Board over the years , to get to this point, I think it would be fair for all to hear us out, what we have to say and offer to this application . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : I am actually a member of the East Marion Association . There was a group that had met 17 with you? MR . EDWARD BUTT : It was a on Zoom yesterday actually . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : How was their response? I mean, I haven ' t really gotten any input from -- MR . EDWARD BUTT : Well , again, I sort of explained a similar situation to what we have -- which we ' re looking to create some sort of public integration into the beach front . We ' re looking to not make this a public arena . A private marina . So that it mitigates a lot of the boat traffic . We would have some boat taxi available le for the residents themselves . So again, making some of the on-road traffic problems a consideration or a concern . So that if people wanted to go into Greenport, they could have an access way from a private boat to take there or maybe anywhere else, maybe even Sheltar Island . So we ' re looking at different ways to cut down on traffic . To keep the area private and quiet, which I think is the benefit of the community and also as far as the usage of public utility . 18 So that is really where we are right now . We have more, but I would like to formally present the rest of this application to the Board themselves . Again, thank you for your time . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Thank you . Who else would like to address the Town Board on this particular proposal? MR . PATRICK BRENNAN : Good evening, Supervisor Russell and members . My name is Patrick Brennan . I live in Greenport . I would just like the Board to be cautious about producing opportunities for marine land use opportunities . I understand that the Southold may need housing . I would suggest that we don ' t need more R-80 and Resort Residential properties . What we do need is diversity of industry, employment opportunities . Not just agriculture and tourism. Marine is an important part of Southold . We need to maintain and preserve our own recreational and marine industry . Waterfront properties , I would suggest are just as important as agriculture, farm, open spaces . So please consider my comments and 19 just move cautiously . This is a big step and I think it ' s -- some of them we may look back and regret in the future . Thank you . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Thank you . Who else would like to address the Town Board on this particular proposal? (No Response ) . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Motion to close? COUNCILWOMAN JILL DOHERTY : I make a motion to close the Public Hearing held open subject to written . COUNCILMAN GREG DOROSKI : I will second that . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : All in favor? COUNCILMAN GREG DOROSKI : Aye . COUNCILWOMAN JILL DOHERTY : Aye . COUNCILMAN BRIAN MEALY : Aye . JUSTICE LOUISA EVANS : Aye . COUNCILWOMAN SARAH NAPPA: Aye . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Aye . What we did, we closed the Public Hearing for public comment and held it open for written comment . Anything you want to 20 submit, please feel free to do that . AUDIENCE MEMBER : How long? SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Two weeks . AUDIENCE MEMBER : And you will be voting in two weeks? SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : It ' s up to the Board if they want to take action in two weeks but certainly we could . We always wait two weeks before we vote on anything that is pretty substantial . Particularly if we get public input . It depends on all sorts of factors . We will do that . ( Public Hearing Concluded . ) SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : I am going to ask that if anybody would like to address the Town Board on any issue, to please feel free? MR . RICHARD JORDAN : Richard Jordan . I live in Cutchogue, and I wanted to bring officially to the Town Board ' s attention a situation that developed last Fall as a result of action taken by Cutchogue New Suffolk Park District . Specifically they eliminated all parking in the Dave Ellison Park and they removed the driveway into the 21 parking and have locked the gate since a week or the second week after Labor Day . There was never any notice to the public that such was going to occur . The Park District never distributed minutes of any of its meeting of last year or year before . Never created access for them this year . There have been three meetings with the Park District so far this year . So far, many upset people expressed how they were affected . Disabled people cannot get into the park now . Had been a handicapped parking spot, at least for the last 25 years . I have lived across the street from the Park since ' 85 . There has always been parking in that park . There is a ramp down to the beach . It ' s not handicapped accessible . So what has happened over a number of years , had called the Commissioner ' s because I had seen people in their wheelchair and they couldn ' t look out into the Bay and then they would have someone trim some of the stuff so they could enjoy looking out into the water . After the pandemic, they don ' t even have that any 22 more . I know that the Park District is a separate entity . They don ' t ( inaudible ) to adjust this . At the last meeting that was last week, the Commissioner said he was responsible for the decision . That they wanted it to be more grasslike . And that he had left several messages on the phone for an engineer who is supposedly ADA Awareness . He ' s going to wait to hear from that person . The summer is hear . I know a number of people that live nearby who are in their late 70 ' s . Upper 80 ' s , who can ' t . There is only two walkways into the park . One is at the end of Pequash and its got it going over roots and rocks . No one there could get up to go through that . The other one is quite bit a distance . I shared with the Park Commission the specific language of ADA and the Guidelines that the Justice Department issued following the 2000 ADA amendments . And it specifically refers to any amendments of "vehicular way . " A 20 foot driveway is a vehicular way . It was removed . Taking an action they have to consider if they adversely affected disabled access . It goes 23 without saying they did . I have talked to the US Justice Department . I talked to two other disability legal groups . I didn ' t ask them to initiate any action . I asked them the US Justice Department and the ADA, and I said I am not filing a complaint yet . I am a retired lawyer . At one time in my life, I used to defend corporation cases on discrimination . And I ( inaudible ) this , just based on my own personal experience, you can get a government and put it on the shelf or you can get some young attorney and they want to make a name for them self and turn this into far more than what we want . There is liability for violating ADA . $75 , 000 for the first violation . $ 150 , 000 for subsequent . Is the subsequent continuing day by day? Who knows . The commissioners are all unpaid elected volunteers . They don ' t want the fines . They want to drive the taxes up . They just to restore what existed before . I spoke to Heather Lanza after the first meeting . At the end of February I spoke to her . Because one of the commissioner ' s alleged that they 24 had spoke to her . And it sounded puzzling to me . Heather -- I know from Heather from years ago from another situation . And Heather told me there is no ( inaudible ) for them to pave over -- there used to be parking . Put some grassy . That simply they could unlock the gate and let people park where they used to park . No additional cost . That was raised at last weeks meeting and the commissioners refused . What I am requesting is that the Town consider, have the Town Attorney advise you on what the legal options you have versus the Park District . Can the Town sue the Park District to reverse -- SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : You and I have talked a lot . And you know the Park District is created by New York State and not by Southold Town . The ultimate authority would be New York State . So I would caution . I appreciate what the Director of Planning had said to you and its true on a basis of creating parking, but with regard to ADA compliance, you would probably -- probably best be talking to an 25 attorney or yourself researching . Because on the ADA, I have talked to Michael Collins about and he had said if you ' re looking for ADA access , you might have to do some adding there . Down by the water . MR . RICHARD JORDAN : That would be to bring a wheelchair in . In the 2010 amendments they eliminated the vehicular way . And individuals can bring their own lawsuits . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Yep . MR . RICHARD JORDAN : I would suggest that the Town ' s counsel may fit that . The Town of Southold could initiate something against the Park District, but I am not certain . So I am just asking that be considered . That the Town Attorney advise . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : I did find that schematic that they were going to put parking by the gate . I couldn ' t find him the other day -- that ' s a 50/50 shot of finding anything on that . So their original design was to put parking right outside there . I don ' t know what happened . I don ' t live in the District anymore . So I don ' t 26 want to speculate . MR . RICHARD JORDAN : Thank you so much . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Thanks . Anyone else like to address the Town Board on any issue? (No Response ) . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Motion to adjourn? COUNCILWOMAN JILL DOHERTY : I will make a motion to adjourn . COUNCILMAN GREG DOROSKI : Second . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : All in favor? COUNCILMAN GREG DOROSKI : Aye . COUNCILWOMAN JILL DOHERTY : Aye . COUNCILMAN BRIAN MEALY : Aye . JUSTICE LOUISA EVANS : Aye . COUNCILWOMAN SARAH NAPPA: Aye . SUPERVISOR SCOTT RUSSELL : Aye . (Meeting Concluded at 8 : 08 P .M . ) 27 C E R T I F I C A T I O N I , JESSICA DILALLO, a Court Reporter and Notary Public, for and within the State of New York, do hereby certify : THAT the above and foregoing contains a true and correct transcription of the Meeting held on June 7 , 2022 , via videoconference, and were transcribed by me . I further certify that I am not related to any of the parties to this action by blood or by marriage and that I am in no way interested in the outcome of this matter . IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this 7th day of June, 2022 . Jessica DiLallo